Wonderful pine tar soaps!

[Dennis]

Here's the response received after asking Horse Health of the difference in theirs and pharmaceutical pine tar.

Dear Mr. xxx,

Thank you for your email. We always appreciate hearing from our customers.

Our pine tar is 100% pine tar. There are no fillers, no additional chemicals, it is just 100% pine tar. I can not compare to other companies products, but our is not a prescription.

If you have further questions, please contact us back.

Gretchen
Pine Tar Consumer & Professional Support

I guess any rat hairs or roach feet are not purposely added. Good enough.

 

[krunt]

Hi Dennis,

My understanding of the difference between "ordinary" pine tar and "kiln burned" pine tar:
Ordinary pine tar is a byproduct of the burning of pine wood for the production of charcoal.
Kiln burned pine tar is produced through the burning of the stumps of a particular species of pine, for the sole purpose of creating a quality pine tar of high purity.

From all I have read, the kiln burned is what's recommended for use in body care products. Obviously you are free to use whatever pine tar you want, but I just thought I would provide that information since the horse health person didn't actually answer your question

 

[Twiggy]

I've just purchased birch tar - cosmetic grade. Is not possible to get here pine tar different than hoof care product. So I will see how it goes The birch tar has very close properties as pine tar from what I could read.

 

[AnnaO]

I have been unable to find a UK supplier of the Bickmore and Farnam brands, perhaps they are not available over here?

The problem is, as Saponista noted, that the pine tar products here in the UK do not have the ingredients listed on the packaging
So I have been busy doing a little homework which I hope will eventually prove helpful for us UK soapers

The Swedish company from your links, 'Auson', have two UK suppliers listed on their website, one of which stocks their pine tar; they are called Timbersave and are located in Warrington:
http://www.timbersave.co.uk/index.p...ch&filter_name=pine tar&filter_category_id=64
I have emailed them asking them to please confirm which of their Auson brand pine tars is 100% pure.

Apart from the Auson products from that one supplier I've not as yet been able to find any other 'Pine Tar' available in the UK, apart from the 'Stockholm Tar' used for hoof treatment. Here's a list:
http://www.nextag.co.uk/stockholm-tar/compare-html#!

So the brands of 'Stockholm Tar' available in the UK are:
Battles,
Carr, Day & Martin (- they make Vanner & Prest Stockholm Hoof Tar),
Equimims,
Gold Label (- make 'thick' and also 'liquid' versions), and
Lincoln.
(This may not be a complete list but they are what I have found up to now).

I have emailed the manufacturers of the first four asking them if their Stockhom Tar is 100% pure or does it contain added ingredients.
I could not locate the manufacturer's contact details for the last one (Lincoln), so I have emailed a major supplier and asked them instead.

I'll update this thread as and when I get any replies.

OK I'll post the replies I have received to date... I had told each that I was looking for a pure unadulterated pine tar for use in soap making...

 

[AnnaO]

EMAIL RECEIVED FROM EQUIMIMS:

From Equimims Ltd:

Hi xxxx,
It is pure thick pine tar.
Regards
David

 

[AnnaO]

EMAIL RECEIVED FROM GOLD LABEL:

Hi xxxx

No, our Stockholm Tar has other additives. We can provide pure Pine Tar. Need to know how much, then will give you a price.

Kind Regards

R P Newsholme

Roland Newsholme
General Manager
Gold Label UK
Stockcare Ltd
83 West Street
Leven
Beverley
East Yorks
HU17 5LR
Registered in England 1726981

...........................................
I have emailed Mr Newsholme back asking whether he is referring to the Thick Tar or the Liquid or both, and what the additives are, since I and other soapers on this forum have used these tars in their soaps. I'm awaiting his reply.

 

[AnnaO]

EMAIL RECEIVED FROM CARR DAY MARTIN (VANNER & PREST)

from Laura-Anne Rossell at CarrDayMartin:

Dear xxxx

Thank you for your recent email regarding Pine Tar. I can inform you that our product is in fact a compound, and is therefore unlikely to be suitable for your use.

Kind regards

Laura Rossell,

Technical Advisor

 

[AnnaO]

EMAIL FROM LINCOLN

Phill Evans (from Lincoln)
To: xxxx

Hi,
I cannot recommend the use of this grade of tar in soap products.
Regards,

Phill Evans

 

[AnnaO]

EMAILS FROM TIMBERSAVE IN WARRINGTON, STOCKIST OF AUSON PINE TAR PRODUCTS;

Good morning xxxx

Thank you for your enquiry and about Auson pine tar products and for
your application I would recommend our Kiln Burned Pine Tar. I have
attached a Product Information Sheet for your attention. Please note
that where it says not to apply directly to skin this refers to the
product in it's raw state before it is used to produce shampoos, soaps,
ointments etc.
I hope that this information is helpful but if you need anything else do
not hesitate to contact me.

Best regards

Stephen Chatterley



WAIT THERE'S MORE...

Good morning xxxx,

Thank you for your interest in our Kiln Burned Pine Tar and the price
for 1 Litre is £7.76 excluding vat. Carriage on that item would be
£7.50 excluding vat. You would be more than welcome to collect the item
as I keep a small amount in my office. If you decide to come over to
Warrington contact me ( 0xxxxx xxxxxx ) and I will make certain that I am
here. I would also be glad of the oppurtunity to talk to you about soap
making with Kiln Burned Pine Tar as I have had several similar requests
recently.

Hope to see you soon

Stephen Chatterley
Director
SLC (UK) Limited

LINK TO THEIR WEBSITE:
http://www.timbersave.co.uk/index.php?route=product/product&path=64&product_id=98

 

[AnnaO]

So there you go.
I've not heard back from Battles yet.
I'm also wondering about the soap I made using the Gold Label stuff - although the word 'unadulterated' was on the label on the tin of the thick tar that I used - so I'll wait and see what I'm told when they get back to me.
I think in future I will use the Auson kiln burned stuff. The price is not bad at all, they are not far from me, and the chap sounds like he's getting the tea and biscuits out already!
Anna x

 

[Saponista]

Thanks for all the info Anna, really useful

 

[AnnaO]

It's been a pleasure, you're welcome

 

[AnnaO]

Oh I also did a search for a supplier of pharmaceutical grade - 'BP' - pine tar, and found this UK supplier:
http://www.toocle.com/United_KingdomSuppliers/612885/Thick-Pine-Tar-BP-3002710.html

I have contacted them describing myself as a small hobby soaper and queried the availability and price of small quantities (~1 kg) and carriage costs etc.
I daresay I'd likely not use them myself at this stage as I would expect the cost of Pine Tar BP to be beyond my meagre soaping budget, and besides I like the sound of the Auson stuff.
But some of us Brits who might move on at some stage to eventually sell our soaps may find the information useful.
I'll post their response when I receive it

 

[The Efficacious Gentleman]

That's very interesting indeed! Thanks, Anna. Looks like I will need to get my PT from a better supplier when I come to sell. I'll still use up the last of the Gold Label, though. Not sure what they'd put in to it that can survive a saponification

 

[AnnaO]

That's very interesting indeed! Thanks, Anna. Looks like I will need to get my PT from a better supplier when I come to sell. I'll still use up the last of the Gold Label, though. Not sure what they'd put in to it that can survive a saponification

Yes I wonder too!
I did find a link to a Materials Safety Data Sheet for the Gold Label Stockholm Tar.

It's from Aus though (I couldn't find an UK one), the product numbers don't match the UK numbers, so it may not be of much use, although it may offer some clues.


Edit: sorry the original link didn't work. I'll link to an image instead.

 

[AnnaO]

OK here's a clipped portion of the MSDS for Gold Label Stockholm Tar which shows the composition/information of ingredients:

The product may not be the same though as it is from Aus, and so like I said it may be of no use!
I'm going to sign off now, I think I may start dreaming of pine tar soon if I'm not careful.
I'll post what the Gold Label chap says about additives etc as soon as I hear from him.



EDIT: I've removed the link, as it was not for the UK Gold Label brand. I'm starting to go cross eyed with my pine tar obsession... sorry!

 

[Twiggy]

Oh I also did a search for a supplier of pharmaceutical grade - 'BP' - pine tar, and found this UK supplier:
http://www.toocle.com/United_KingdomSuppliers/612885/Thick-Pine-Tar-BP-3002710.html

I have contacted them describing myself as a small hobby soaper and queried the availability and price of small quantities (~1 kg) and carriage costs etc.
I daresay I'd likely not use them myself at this stage as I would expect the cost of Pine Tar BP to be beyond my meagre soaping budget, and besides I like the sound of the Auson stuff.
But some of us Brits who might move on at some stage to eventually sell our soaps may find the information useful.
I'll post their response when I receive it

I actually contacted today a drug company and ask about their pine tar, and the pharmaceutical grade cost, be ready... 13 euro per 50 ml in Poland (what I'm trying to point out in Poland such stuff is inexpensive). So I've said "No, thank you". Besides, we don't need a pharmaceutical grade, we are not selling drugs with it, I assume for soap cosmetic grade is enough.

 

[AnnaO]

This is just a quick update on my previous posts, but sadly I have no new information to share

Oh I also did a search for a supplier of pharmaceutical grade - 'BP' - pine tar, and found this UK supplier:
http://www.toocle.com/United_KingdomSuppliers/612885/Thick-Pine-Tar-BP-3002710.html

I have contacted them describing myself as a small hobby soaper and queried the availability and price of small quantities (~1 kg) and carriage costs etc.
I daresay I'd likely not use them myself at this stage as I would expect the cost of Pine Tar BP to be beyond my meagre soaping budget, and besides I like the sound of the Auson stuff.
But some of us Brits who might move on at some stage to eventually sell our soaps may find the information useful.
I'll post their response when I receive it

^^^^
Well these people have not responded.

EMAIL RECEIVED FROM GOLD LABEL:

Hi xxxx

No, our Stockholm Tar has other additives. We can provide pure Pine Tar. Need to know how much, then will give you a price.

Kind Regards

R P Newsholme

Roland Newsholme
General Manager
Gold Label UK
Stockcare Ltd
83 West Street
Leven
Beverley
East Yorks
HU17 5LR
Registered in England 1726981

...........................................
I have emailed Mr Newsholme back asking whether he is referring to the Thick Tar or the Liquid or both, and what the additives are, since I and other soapers on this forum have used these tars in their soaps. I'm awaiting his reply.

And neither did Mr N.
Boo.
Never mind.
I'm tempted to assume though that my 'Thick Formula' Gold Label Stockholm Tar is likely unadulterated, since it says 'unadulterated' on the tin. (Although I do wonder about the meaning of the word 'formula' here..)
While Gent.'s Gold Label 'Liquid' may perhaps be thinned with some kind of dilutant or solvent added, so as to make it pourable?

 

[The Efficacious Gentleman]

Yikes! Thanks for the InfO, AnnaO.

 

[Dennis]

I thought I would join in the fun with the MSDS for Horse Health pine tar. Hazard rating is 1, all others zero. Still 9 bucks and change for a quart.. For what it's worth, here tis:

View attachment PineTarMSDS.pdf