Using Butter in soap

[SoapSap]

Has any of you ever used real dairy butter in your soap formulas? I am curious to know this. Other butters are used so frequently that I cannot help but wonder if this is possible. If some soap makers actually use breast milk, using butter does not sound all that odd to me.

 

[IrishLass]

Yes- you can soap dairy butter, but according to all the folks I know of that have done so, you will end up with a soap that smells like vomit from the very high butyric acid present in dairy butter. :sick:


IrishLass

 

[dixiedragon]

Have you made a dairy milk soap? Try that first. I can always pick up the sour milk / baby vomit smell from dairy milk soaps. Some people don't notice it.

 

[BattleGnome]

I think the reason most people don't use dairy butter is a much higher chance of DOS or some sort of smell.

I will note that I cannot verify this. Butter tastes good and I've never really had a thought to use it outside of cooking. I've never really checked it out.

 

[DeeAnna]

I've made soap with full-fat milk and I've made soap with about 17% of the fat coming from cow's butter. I don't pick up any odor from the milk soap, but there is a distinctive odor from the butter-based soap. A soap made from high fat cream could also have this odor, depending on the amount used.

I think "vomit" is a little strong, but it ~is~ an unusual cheesy, yeasty kind of odor. It fades with time to a faint tang, but doesn't entirely disappear. If you soap with a high % of butterfat, you'll want to scent the soap accordingly. I think I'd go with spicy or woodsy scents. The mint EO I used was ... okay. Florals would probably be a bust.

The other issue with a high % of butterfat in soap is that soap high in butter may be as or more more irritating to the skin than the same % of coconut oil in a soap. This irritation factor is due to the short-chain fatty acids in butterfat -- specifically the 4-carbon butyric acid that Irish Lass mentioned as well as a dab of 6-carbon caproic acid.

Soapcalc does not consider fatty acids shorter than 12-carbon lauric acid, so it won't give you any indication about this issue. For that matter, since coconut oil, palm kernel, and babassu all contain 8-carbon caprylic and 10-carbon capric acids that are also known to cause skin irritation, Soapcalc doesn't tell you the full story on these fats either. The shorter the fatty acid, the greater the tendency to cause irritation. The main culprits for irritation are 12-carbon lauric acid and the shorter fatty acids.

Be sure to calculate the recipe based on the actual butterfat content of the butter. Butter isn't 100% fat.

I don't think there is any particular issue with rancidity. I made a batch of the 17% butterfat soap without EDTA, and the bar I kept in my stash for several years never had any issues.

 

[cmzaha]

A friend and I tried making soaps with different brands of butter. She agreed with me that they all endeded up smelling bad, even if the initial bar does not smell it would leave my hands smelling like spoiled nasty butter. Even with lavender I could smell it linger on my hands. I would save the butter for toast and not waste the ingredients. I had a feeling it was the Butyric Acid in the butter

 

[SoapSap]

I appreciate all the information. I certainly do not want smelly soap.

Have you made a dairy milk soap? Try that first. I can always pick up the sour milk / baby vomit smell from dairy milk soaps. Some people don't notice it.

Does this mean no yogurt either?

 

[DeeAnna]

It's the butyric acid in the the dairy fat that we're saying is the cause of the odor, so if your recipe contains little or no butterfat then it should have little or no butyric smell. If you have a super smeller nose, you might want to stick with non-fat dairy. And, yes, that would be non-fat yogurt as well as non-fat milk.

As always, YMMV. I have a ordinary nose, and I don't smell any odor when I use full fat dairy milk or yogurt. Just milk (or yogurt) contains a LOT less butterfat compared to cream or butter. But if in doubt, non-fat is safest.

 

[SoapSap]

Have you made a dairy milk soap? Try that first. I can always pick up the sour milk / baby vomit smell from dairy milk soaps. Some people don't notice it.

Does this mean no yogurt either?

 

[cmzaha]

Does this mean no yogurt either?

I do use low fat yogurt with no problems. I do not use cow's milk unless I am rebatching and want to use a small amount for the liquid to help it get started melting.

 

[Zany_in_CO]

Yes- you can soap dairy butter, but according to all the folks I know of that have done so, you will end up with a soap that smells like vomit from the very high butyric acid present in dairy butter. :sick:

I can vouch for that! The smell of butter soap is totally nauseating! I can't remember what i ever did with that batch. I've never thrown a failed batch out... there's always a "fix"... just hafta find it.

 

[cherrycoke216]

Does this mean no yogurt either?

Does this mean no yogurt either?

Does this mean no yogurt either?

I think your phone pocket post several times. I had a same problem twice. Is it set screen locked automatically? Or the tapatalk app is just being weird?

 

[madison]

How about the soap that is made of ghee?
Someone was posting that he makes soap using ghee, shea butter and stearic acid, I think he sells it, what do you think guys about his soap?
He didn't give percentage.

 

[Susie]

Butter (and ghee) make soap that smells like baby vomit. Butyric acid is the culprit.

http://www.wisegeek.org/what-is-butyric-acid

 

[madison]

Butter (and ghee) make soap that smells like baby vomit. Butyric acid is the culprit.

http://www.wisegeek.org/what-is-butyric-acid

so what do you think about his soap regardless the smell? btw I just remembered that he mentioned using rosin, maybe to remove the smell.

 

[LunaSkye]

This post brought back memories. I made butter soap before and I learned that butter is best for baking (in my opinion). Milk and yogurt are nice, especially goat milk. I just wish my goat milk soap wasn't as soft as it is. The pieces I still have are still somewhat soft and I had them for years. No DOS though.

 

[Susie]

so what do you think about his soap regardless the smell? btw I just remembered that he mentioned using rosin, maybe to remove the smell.

I don't know who you are referring to, but understand that NOTHING will cover that smell for me. I can smell it at 100 paces. (I am a nurse, so it is a trained thing.)

 

[Arimara]

so what do you think about his soap regardless the smell? btw I just remembered that he mentioned using rosin, maybe to remove the smell.

Some people have sensitive sniffers. I'm fine with milk soaps, I'm not offended by them but I also don't have any milk bars save one that I could try and see if I could smell it. As it stands I only know what a castile with no or a negative superfat smells like.

 

[Susie]

Milk soaps (as long as they are made using the split method rather than full milk) are fine once you add a fragrance. Any fragrance will do, just something.

Butter smell, even clarified butter, OTOH, is not able to be covered as far as I can tell. I have tried as little as 1 ounce in a 3 lb batch of soap, and I could still smell it. I thought it would be an easier way to get that milk fat into soap without fooling with freezing milk.

 

[madison]

I don't know who you are referring to, but understand that NOTHING will cover that smell for me. I can smell it at 100 paces. (I am a nurse, so it is a trained thing.)

Susie, read post 15 please

This post brought back memories. I made butter soap before and I learned that butter is best for baking (in my opinion). Milk and yogurt are nice, especially goat milk. I just wish my goat milk soap wasn't as soft as it is. The pieces I still have are still somewhat soft and I had them for years. No DOS though.

This is interesting to me, soft soap for long time with no dos? Do you mind repost this in a new post so we know why, please?