Just wondering usage rate for thyme extract in cp soap? I was thinking for a strong scent 2% of oil weight?
Thyme extract use for scent?
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Not sure what you mean by "thyme extract". Do you mean a water- or oil infusion?
If you mean the essential oil -- Thyme EO will absolutely accelerate trace, so keep your design plans simple. I normally add fragrance into my fats before adding lye, but thyme EO is one I add right before pouring the soap into the mold. I also recommend you only hand stir after adding the EO to the soap batter.
Also a little goes a long ways so use it with a light hand if you don't want an overpoweringly medicinal scent. I can't say I'd ever use thyme EO specifically as a fragrance. My purpose for using thyme EO in soap is to include a mild antimicrobial ingredient in my gardener's soap.
As far as dosage goes goes, there are several chemotypes of thyme. Some chemotypes are GRAS (generally recognized as safe) and some are not depending on the main chemical constituents.
Of the ones that are not GRAS, one chemotype has a max recommended dermal use of 1.3%. Source: Essential Oil Safety by Tisserand & Young. Since most people end up with generic EOs, not named chemotypes, I'd be conservative and use no more than 1.3%.
If you mean the essential oil -- Thyme EO will absolutely accelerate trace, so keep your design plans simple. I normally add fragrance into my fats before adding lye, but thyme EO is one I add right before pouring the soap into the mold. I also recommend you only hand stir after adding the EO to the soap batter.
Also a little goes a long ways so use it with a light hand if you don't want an overpoweringly medicinal scent. I can't say I'd ever use thyme EO specifically as a fragrance. My purpose for using thyme EO in soap is to include a mild antimicrobial ingredient in my gardener's soap.
As far as dosage goes goes, there are several chemotypes of thyme. Some chemotypes are GRAS (generally recognized as safe) and some are not depending on the main chemical constituents.
Of the ones that are not GRAS, one chemotype has a max recommended dermal use of 1.3%. Source: Essential Oil Safety by Tisserand & Young. Since most people end up with generic EOs, not named chemotypes, I'd be conservative and use no more than 1.3%.
This is what I’m talking about. It’s also an ingredient in a commercially available soap. I’m assuming it’s used as part of the fragrance profile. Just wondering if anyone has any experience using it.
I looked up that brand, and it is 50% alcohol, which will definitely seize your CP soap, with little to no scent surviving saponification. You could add it post-cook in HP if you want to avoid those issues.
Thanks for the tip. But was going to add after trace anyway. I'll make sure to work fast
Then you will go from trace to soap-on-a-stick in a matter of seconds, lol. When that happens, either throw it into a pot and hot-process it, or wait 10-15 minutes for it to go into gel. At that point, it will loosen enough to stir it quickly and get it into a mold.
I don't know why, but the batter didn't seize! After adding the lye, I actually had a pretty long time to hand stir into a med/thick trace. My batter only had two oils, salt, coconut milk and I masterbatched my lye. The loaf is all one color so I just had to pour it into the mold.
Very interesting! At what point did you add the extract, and how much did you add?I don't know why, but the batter didn't seize! After adding the lye, I actually had a pretty long time to hand stir into a med/thick trace. My batter only had two oils, salt, coconut milk and I masterbatched my lye. The loaf is all one color so I just had to pour it into the mold.
The seizing problems we've been warning about are most likely dependent on the amount of alcohol (and thyme extractives) added to the soap batter. OP may not have added enough of this extract to the batter to cause problems.
That's what I was thinking, and also that if the oils were pretty warm when it was added, then at least some of the alcohol would have evaporated pretty quickly.
I added 7 grams of extract along with 12 grams of FO at emulsion. I tend not to do a huge amount of stick blending.
I don't think it was temp because my lye was at 79 and my oils were at 95 which averages out to 87. Not really hot or is 87 warm enough for the alcohol to evaporate?
Sorry, I should have clarified that I was looking for percentage of extract PPO. Otherwise, it's hard to know whether you used enough for your batch size to cause any reaction. In other words, 7g added to 100g is very different from 7g added to 1000g. Right?
In 7g of that extract, there would be 3.5g of alcohol (since the mix was 50%). That probably was low enough even for a 500g batch that it wouldn't cause too much of a reaction. So if you made a 1000g batch, the percentage would have been really minimal. The temperature would have helped by evaporating off some of the alcohol, but I think it was more that you didn't use enough to cause a problem. Whew.
Are you able to smell any of the thyme scent?
In 7g of that extract, there would be 3.5g of alcohol (since the mix was 50%). That probably was low enough even for a 500g batch that it wouldn't cause too much of a reaction. So if you made a 1000g batch, the percentage would have been really minimal. The temperature would have helped by evaporating off some of the alcohol, but I think it was more that you didn't use enough to cause a problem. Whew.
Are you able to smell any of the thyme scent?
So I made a 500 gram loaf and my fragrance load was 40%. What may have stopped things from seazing up is the fragrance I added was a blend of the thyme and a peppercorn FO. The thyme was less than half of the mixture. The loaf was colored red and I was trying to go with a tomato-herby vibe. I do smell the thyme but very subtlety. It was an expensive experiment though. Need to find some other way to get a herby vibe. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯Sorry, I should have clarified that I was looking for percentage of extract PPO. Otherwise, it's hard to know whether you used enough for your batch size to cause any reaction. In other words, 7g added to 100g is very different from 7g added to 1000g. Right?
In 7g of that extract, there would be 3.5g of alcohol (since the mix was 50%). That probably was low enough even for a 500g batch that it wouldn't cause too much of a reaction. So if you made a 1000g batch, the percentage would have been really minimal. The temperature would have helped by evaporating off some of the alcohol, but I think it was more that you didn't use enough to cause a problem. Whew.
Are you able to smell any of the thyme scent?
Your fragrance was 40% of the total amount of the batch???? Did you mean 4% perhaps?
Oh sorry - yeah...4%
My preference for herby notes is rosemary
Whew!
Same! Not only do I like the smell better, but the skin-safe usage rate is much higher than many if not all of the varieties of thyme EOs.
There are a number of chemotypes for rosemary as well, so if you dislike one rosemary EO from one supplier or brand, you might take a sniff of rosemary from another source. Or find a supplier who sells specific chemotypes rather than the more typical blended EO.
Some rosemary chemotypes are considerably sweeter and softer and others are sharper and more medicinal.
Some rosemary chemotypes are considerably sweeter and softer and others are sharper and more medicinal.
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