Quick and easy HP soap.

[TeresaT]

Sephera, for what it is worth, when you are plugging your oils and fats into your chosen soap calculator look at the "cleansing" number and the "conditioning" number. You want the cleansing number to be LOW. The calculators I've seen have a recommendation between 12 - 29. For my skin, that is far too high. "Cleansing" is another name for "stripping." A cleansing number of zero will get you clean. It is soap. That is what it is meant to do. I keep my cleansing number at around 10. I SF at 5% now that I am comfortable with the soap making process and don't worry about making lye-heavy soaps. When I first started, I did an 8% SF for extra "insurance" against mistakes.

While you are aiming for a low cleansing number, you should aim for a high conditioning number. Anything in the higher range is going to give you creamy, rich feeling lather, but it doesn't have many bubbles. There is a lotion-type feel to the lather (and my preferred lather type). I have no problems rinsing fully and the soaps I've made make my skin feel normal instead of dry, tight, painful and itchy. That's a beautiful feeling when you've spent 15 years feeling like you're walking around in a suit two sizes too small and cannot get one that fits correctly.

The numbers aren't exact; however, they'll give you an idea of how the soap will perform. If I put a formula together and the cleansing number is an 18, it's an automatic NO for me. I absolutely will not waste my time and resources on something that will have a high probability of making my skin feel two sizes too small. I have gone as high as 15 in the cleansing number, and have noticed I need to add lotion or body butter afterwards. My friends have loved those soaps with no one having issues. I just won't make them anymore unless specifically asked to, because I don't want to make soap that I cannot use myself.

 

[TeresaT]

I'm vegetarian so I won't use any animal fats, but even if I weren't, I can't imagine why anyone would want to rub bacon grease all over themselves. I just think lard and tallow soaps are gross. There's my unsolicited two cents worth of opinion

Some of us are kinky, that's why.

I don't disrespect your lifestyle, so please don't disrespect mine.

 

[mx5inpenn]

I'm vegetarian so I won't use any animal fats, but even if I weren't, I can't imagine why anyone would want to rub bacon grease all over themselves. I just think lard and tallow soaps are gross. There's my unsolicited two cents worth of opinion

Why would you want to rub lye all over yourself?

Oh, you don't. Because it isn't lye anymore. And lard isn't lard, let alone bacon grease, which it never was in the first place.

A person is entitled to their personal preference, but not to be condescending about others'.

Lard does make excellent soap. That pig didn't die to make lard. It is a bi-product and using as much of it as possible is respectful to the animal and the environment. But I grew up in a family that farmed and hunted for food, not trophies. We treated plants with the same respect.

 

[sephera]

Thanks for all the advice. Is there anyway to up the shelf life for 2 years plus of the soap.

 

[The Efficacious Gentleman]

How long do yours last for? Also, what are you expecting from the soap after more than two years? Long cures are good, but you could just make 6 months worth every once in a while rather than so much to last so long

 

[Susie]

Some of us are kinky, that's why.

I don't disrespect your lifestyle, so please don't disrespect mine.

Why would you want to rub lye all over yourself?

Oh, you don't. Because it isn't lye anymore. And lard isn't lard, let alone bacon grease, which it never was in the first place.

A person is entitled to their personal preference, but not to be condescending about others'.

Lard does make excellent soap. That pig didn't die to make lard. It is a bi-product and using as much of it as possible is respectful to the animal and the environment. But I grew up in a family that farmed and hunted for food, not trophies. We treated plants with the same respect.

^^^This!

I absolutely had to shut down this forum last night and get away from the computer to not get ugly in responding to that post. These replies pretty much cover what I was going to say this morning.

This forum has many people with many different lifestyles and opinions. The key for everyone getting along is respect. I will respect your choices, and still try to help you (if I can), or I can tell you that I can't help you, and maybe someone else has an answer, or I can just avoid answering. No matter what, though, I respect your choices for your life. I expect the same from you.

 

[TeresaT]

Why would you want to rub lye all over yourself?

Oh, you don't. Because it isn't lye anymore. And lard isn't lard, let alone bacon grease, which it never was in the first place.

A person is entitled to their personal preference, but not to be condescending about others'.

Lard does make excellent soap. That pig didn't die to make lard. It is a bi-product and using as much of it as possible is respectful to the animal and the environment. But I grew up in a family that farmed and hunted for food, not trophies. We treated plants with the same respect.

^^^This!

I absolutely had to shut down this forum last night and get away from the computer to not get ugly in responding to that post. These replies pretty much cover what I was going to say this morning.

This forum has many people with many different lifestyles and opinions. The key for everyone getting along is respect. I will respect your choices, and still try to help you (if I can), or I can tell you that I can't help you, and maybe someone else has an answer, or I can just avoid answering. No matter what, though, I respect your choices for your life. I expect the same from you.

Exactly. Everyone has to make choices for themselves in their lives and not be expected to explain or defend those choices to anyone else. I think peep toe boots are the dumbest thing on earth; however, they seem to be very popular. You wouldn't catch me dead in them, but a lady in my building has several pairs. I don't tell her that her shoes are ugly or ask why she wears them. Personal choices and respect for others.

 

[joy.]

I really wasn't trying to offend anyone, but clearly I did. I'm sorry to those of you who feel disrespected. Sometimes things just don't translate the same way in print that they do in real life.

My niece rubs tallow all over herself as a moisturizer. I tell her it's gross. She laughs and flings a chunk at me. I scream. No one feels disrespected. We still love each other.

Some of us are kinky, that's why.

I don't disrespect your lifestyle, so please don't disrespect mine.

I was just offering my opinion, and perhaps a different perspective. Someone on here once said they thought milk soaps are gross. That's all I make. I wasn't offended and didn't feel disrespected. We're all entitled to our own opinions.

Why would you want to rub lye all over yourself?

Oh, you don't. Because it isn't lye anymore. And lard isn't lard, let alone bacon grease, which it never was in the first place.

A person is entitled to their personal preference, but not to be condescending about others'.

There is no lye left in soap. The point of superfat is to leave extra fats free in the soap. So you really are rubbing whatever oils/fats that go into the recipe all over yourself. Something to think about, which is why I offered my opinion.

I thought lard was pig fat, which is what bacon grease is, so if it's not the same thing, I'm sorry for the error.

I absolutely had to shut down this forum last night and get away from the computer to not get ugly in responding to that post. These replies pretty much cover what I was going to say this morning.

This forum has many people with many different lifestyles and opinions. The key for everyone getting along is respect. I will respect your choices, and still try to help you (if I can), or I can tell you that I can't help you, and maybe someone else has an answer, or I can just avoid answering. No matter what, though, I respect your choices for your life. I expect the same from you.

Again, I wasn't trying to be disrespectful. Just offering my opinion. I might add, telling me I'm wrong in my personal convictions because of the way dictionary.com defines vegetarian is a bit disrespectful.

I'm not sure why this topic makes people so angry. Maybe it's because a lot of vegans push their agenda and it's irritating, or maybe it's just because people are intolerant when it comes to anything different from the norm, or maybe people are just addicted to meat. I don't know. I'd love to have a polite philosophical discussion about it, and why I'm a (mostly vegan) vegetarian, and humane meat vs grocery store meat (and tallow, and lard). But that's a topic for another thread. I'll start one in the general chat, and you all can yell at me over there.

 

[artemis]

I'm not sure why this topic makes people so angry. Maybe it's because a lot of vegans push their agenda and it's irritating, or maybe it's just because people are intolerant when it comes to anything different from the norm, or maybe people are just addicted to meat. I don't know. I'd love to have a polite philosophical discussion about it, and why I'm a (mostly vegan) vegetarian, and humane meat vs grocery store meat (and tallow, and lard). But that's a topic for another thread. I'll start one in the general chat, and you all can yell at me over there.

I don't think it was the topic so much as the tone. As you said, sometimes it's hard to communicate a tone of voice through print.

 

[Obsidian]

I'm not sure why this topic makes people so angry. Maybe it's because a lot of vegans push their agenda and it's irritating,

Because the tone of your post made it feel like you were pushing your agenda. If some one is vegetarian and doesn't want to use lard, then thats all they need to say.
There was absolutely no need for the rubbing lard on your body comment, it sounded rude and disrespectful. Almost like you were trying to shame lard users.
I personally don't believe this forum is the place for hashing out meat eater vs vegetarians. I don't care why you choose not to eat meat, I don't care if you are ok with humane raised meat animals. I really just don't care.

Say you don't use animal products because you are vegan and I won't bring it up again to you. Preach to me about how your beliefs are better then mine because I choose to eat meat and there will be a problem.

 

[IrishLass]

To get things back to the subject of soap.....

The point of superfat is to leave extra fats free in the soap. So you really are rubbing whatever oils/fats that go into the recipe all over yourself.

Actually, it's not quite as simple as that. Others such as our DeeAnna can explain it so much better than I can (and can also correct me if I am on the wrong track), but if what I currently understand about superfat in soap is correct, we are not actually rubbing whole, intact oils on our skin when we use a superfatted soap, but instead the certain left-over fatty acids that make up the different oils/fats in our soap that the lye was not able to react with before being spent (which may or may not all be from the same fat if we happened to have made a soap with a combination of fats).

I thought lard was pig fat, which is what bacon grease is, so if it's not the same thing, I'm sorry for the error.

Yes, lard is indeed pig fat, but not all lard is necessarily from bacon fat. The best lard comes from the fat located internally around the kidney's- i.e., leaf lard (which makes wonderfully flakey pie crusts).


IrishLass

 

[Susie]

Again, I wasn't trying to be disrespectful. Just offering my opinion. I might add, telling me I'm wrong in my personal convictions because of the way dictionary.com defines vegetarian is a bit disrespectful.

I'm not sure why this topic makes people so angry. Maybe it's because a lot of vegans push their agenda and it's irritating, or maybe it's just because people are intolerant when it comes to anything different from the norm, or maybe people are just addicted to meat. I don't know. I'd love to have a polite philosophical discussion about it, and why I'm a (mostly vegan) vegetarian, and humane meat vs grocery store meat (and tallow, and lard).

No, telling you what the definition of vegetarian (as opposed to vegan) was meant to point out that you do not eat soap. Vegetarian is a DIETARY choice. Vegan is a lifestyle choice that eliminates animal products in all of your life. There is more than a semantic difference. And no disrespect intended. There is nothing disrespectful about using the English language properly.

However, when you choose such pejorative terms to refer to us omnivores using soaps that contain animal fats, you can expect some hot tempered responses. Next time, if you don't want such responses, you could maybe choose better wording.

 

[cherrycoke216]

No, telling you what the definition of vegetarian (as opposed to vegan) was meant to point out that you do not eat soap. Vegetarian is a DIETARY choice. Vegan is a lifestyle choice that eliminates animal products in all of your life. There is more than a semantic difference. And no disrespect intended. There is nothing disrespectful about using the English language .

Mmm... I saw a vegetarian Soaper's blog explain why she uses animal fat.
Here it is.
www.humblebeeandme.com/why-i-use-lard-or-tallow-in-my-soap-and-why-you-should-too/
I think she tell it the way politically correct. ( to me at least )

I used to the same thinking of original poster Joy is. And now I'm a lardinator trying experiment with tallow.
It's just a fatty acid composition actually. If you look at it on a different scope. And you could possibly been rubbing bacon grease / beef fat all over on yourself before you start reading ingredient labels. Many of U.S. Leading brand soap do use tallow. It reads sodium tallowate in INCI list. And also lipstick & shaving foam has stearic acid in it. Stearic acid could be Palm derived or tallow source. Do you start to scream now? Haha! Kidding! Just want to analyze it to you. Many vegan / vegetarian did not notice this their whole life. It's an omnivore's scheme to contaminate all the other side. Of course I'm kidding again!

And as a bystander, I don't think they're YELLING at you. It's a sort of humor blended with slightly sarcasm maybe. Let's respect each other and keep some no so nice words to ourselves. Or did I just start it all over again and letting others enjoy the show with popcorn in mouth? Hahaha!

ETA: there is a thing called carmine used in food and cosmetic industry. It is a BUG really!!! Did you have your strawberry ice cream today? I'm not sarcastic but just thought you should know there is lots of things make me wanna scream too!!! But I eat it still anyway!

 

[Susie]

There are several vegetarians that use animal fats in soap for the very reason that humblebeeandme does. I even know Jewish folks who have no problem using lard based soap. Even a rabbi friend of mine back in Louisiana. Because the dietary restrictions are about what goes in their mouths. Not in their soap.

I am not judging anyone who makes choices other than what I choose. Just let me know what you will or will not use, and we go on from there. No judgment, no recrimination, no problem.

 

[cmzaha]

Vegan /Vegetarian soaps are not the nicest in my opinion, especially when one throws no palm in the mix of un-acceptable fats. There just has to be animal fat or palm for a quality soap, because butters, as nice as they are and add hardness, kill lather.

 

[cherrycoke216]

Yes, that's the problem.



I also let the silk soak in a tiny bit of distilled water, then add a tiny bit of the lye to that, and smash the silk with a hard spoon to dissolve while it's hot. I let that cool, pour it over my frozen milk, then add the rest of the lye as usual.



Don't breathe near the fumes while the silk is dissolving. I do it outside.

I hope I sound as polite as can be. Not trying to be mean or anything. But I think maybe it's a Asia thing to let you keep some silkworm and watch their whole life span then written down observation as a biology class assignment at elementary school. Maybe America don't teach about silkworm in school.

In order to get longer thread of silk, the larvae / caterpillar in the cocoon is killed to get the silk.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bombyx_mori

So there is another soaping material you cannot use.

 

[sephera]

I am open to trying Tallow but is there anyway to duplicate the properties of animal fats using Vegetarian products like adding beewax and butters.

 

[cherrycoke216]

I am open to trying Tallow but is there anyway to duplicate the properties of animal fats using Vegetarian products like adding beewax and butters.

Palm is a tallow substitute. ( palm kernel oil / flakes is NOT. ) and using exotic butter at a high percentage to get a hard soap will kill lather and sort of like rubbing a plastic in hands.
You will need to cure it longer for its best.

Beeswax can harden a mostly soft oil recipe. But careful with usage rate. It can be waxy. Others who have experience with Beeswax will chime in soon.
Stearic acid ( Palm derived ; there is a kind which is tallow derived ) will mimic some of tallow's characteristic. Harden a bar, creamy lather and such.

 

[Susie]

I am open to trying Tallow but is there anyway to duplicate the properties of animal fats using Vegetarian products like adding beewax and butters.

Not that I am aware of. I think some people on here have some fairly decent work-arounds, but palm/tallow/lard fill a particular role in soapmaking. Hopefully, some of those folks will chime in soon. Our forum tends to be busier on weekdays than weekends, so it may be Monday or so before they chime in.

 

[The Efficacious Gentleman]

I remember seeing a post about a mix that would have the same fatty acid profile as an animal fat. But as always, the unsaponifiables will play some part. To what extent someone might notice the difference between them might well be very low