What to use as antioxidants?

[Rune]

Have you checked the norwegian netstore sunvita? If you buy there, you don't have to worry about customs.

Tusen takk I am looking at that store just now. And they have a lot of different things. Not very cheap, but considered the potential very high customs fee by ordering abroad, and that one really should support Norwegian businesses, it's maybe better to buy from Sunvita than from abroad.

 

[Rune]

I don't mean to burst your soap bubble or anything , but just be aware that the natural colors from juices are not pH stable enough to last very long in lye-based soap without having a little 'help' from pH-stable colorants such as micas or oxides or ultramarines. I've made several batches of carrot soap and also cucumber soap (I juice the peel and all to get that lovely emerald green), and the colors do morph over time. The lovely orange morphs to a muddy color and the cucumber to a khaki-like color. But if I add a little orange mica and TD to the carrot juice or a little chromium hydroxide green and TD to the cucumber juice, the colors stay true.

Also- the antioxidant levels in juices are not concentrated enough to be able to do the job demanded of soap such as ROE or BHT would do.


IrishLass

Thank you Who wants brownish, muddy and dull colours, so yes, that was a very useful tip to add some pigments or micas. I am also concerned about the scent, if that will morph into something unpleasant? Like rotten smell or anything.

 

[Zany_in_CO]

My mama always said, "If ya can't fight 'em, join 'em!" So I'm joining in on the HIJACK to colorants! YAY! Hopefully I won't raise too much of a fuss...

When I first started soaping, since I couldn't afford fancy colorants, I used CRAYOLA crayons to color CP/HP soap. They not only add color, but seem to add hardness and lather as well (that part could be just my imagination. LOL) Cerulean Blue is gorgeous and my personal favorite! They create awesome jewel tones in transparent soap.

- Use a whole (3”) Crayola in 3 lb batch; or 1” ppo.
- Toss in at trace in CP or at the end of the cook in HP.
- Melts easily. Let set a minute before stirring in.
- Some colors work better than others. See Miller’s site for details. Scroll down the page about 2/3 of the way.

http://millersoap.com/soapingred.html

MORE INFO

1) I use only CRAYOLA Crayons. According to Smith-Binney, the manufacturer, Crayolas are certified non-toxic to assure the products contain no known toxic or harmful substances in sufficient quantities to be harmful to the human body, even if ingested. To my mind, and with all due respect to those who would disagree, this is just me -- if they’re safe enough for toddlers to chew on, they’re safe enough to soap with.

2) The best time to buy them is the month or so before school starts. I get the 16-count box of the Original colors. I picked up a dozen boxes for 25¢ each at an Office Depot BACK-TO-SCHOOL SALE one year.

3) Label Ingredients: Paraffin wax, stearic acid and powder color pigment.
Each of those ingredients is GRAS (Generally Regarded As Safe) and they are found in any number of B & B (Bath & Beauty) products.

4) Usage Rate: 1” per pound of oils. Be sure to peel off the wrapper! LOL

5) Grate really fine to mix colors.

6) How to Use - (Do this before you start the recipe.) For 1 pound of soap: Pour 2 teaspoons of olive oil in a small microwave safe dish. Add 1” of Crayola (whole, pieces, or grated). Nuke on high in the microwave for 20 seconds. Let sit for a few seconds, then mix thoroughly. Warm again if necessary. Add at trace (CP) or after cook (HP).

NOTE: If you only need a teaspoon or so for a small batch, the rest solidifies, keeps well, and easily melts again for another time. (I like to do this with White Crayola for my Wannabe White soaps).

 

[SunRiseArts]

Thank you Who wants brownish, muddy and dull colours, so yes, that was a very useful tip to add some pigments or micas. I am also concerned about the scent, if that will morph into something unpleasant? Like rotten smell or anything.

There is no smell whatsoever in the end product. I also have made beer soap, and there is no beer smell, or perhaps way to subtle in it. Same with the carrot puree. I normally use a FO that will complement what I believe the vegetables or fruits are.

Also I wanted to ask more experience people here. I was thinking about this thread and the fact that the antioxidants do not carry to the end product, but if that is so, then how come safflower, or avocado oil that are rich in vitamin E for example, does become part of the soap after saponification? Nothing of the fruits survive? Nor even its nutritional value?

Please forgive my ignorance, hopefully is not a silly question. Chemistry was never my thing ....:think:

 

[SoapSap]

What is BHT?

 

[cmzaha]

What is BHT?

You can find the info here http://www.makingcosmetics.com/BHT_p_52.html

 

[WeaversPort]

When I first started soaping, since I couldn't afford fancy colorants, I used CRAYOLA crayons to color CP/HP soap. They not only add color, but seem to add hardness and lather as well (that part could be just my imagination. LOL) Cerulean Blue is gorgeous and my personal favorite! They create awesome jewel tones in transparent soap.

- Use a whole (3”) Crayola in 3 lb batch; or 1” ppo.
- Toss in at trace in CP or at the end of the cook in HP.
- Melts easily. Let set a minute before stirring in.
- Some colors work better than others. See Miller’s site for details. Scroll down the page about 2/3 of the way.

http://millersoap.com/soapingred.html

CRAYOLA!! I feel like an angel choir just sang out in the back of my head.. This is awesome news for the newbie here!!

 

[shunt2011]

I would never ever use crayons. Just because you can doesn't mean you should. Just my opinion. Yes, they are non toxic, but, they are not made for skin use.

 

[Rune]

So much to think about and so many new ideas! Crayola, that is a new one, but wow how genius! If it is only pigments and waxes, so why not?

Astaxanthin is very expensive as a supplement or anti-aging. But, guess what, it is also sold as fish food for aquarium gold fish and such. And that is not expensive. I found one, I can't remember where, and it was said to be pure astaxanthin.

 

[Rune]

I found it! http://www.yourfishstuff.com/natural-astaxanthin-powder

 

[Rune]

Oops, forget it. I thought it was pure astaxanthin, but it's not. When I pressed "ingredients", it is only 21 grams astaxanthin per kilo. And the rest of the ingredients are maybe fishy. So, not a good idea at all.

 

[Rune]

I don't think I understand how oils get rancid. I mean, I understand it if it's a pure oil, but what if that oil is mixed with something else? Lets say you mix hemp oil with fractionated coconut oil. Will the fractionated coconut protect the hemp oil so that it will have a prolonged shelf life? Or, will the hemp portion in the mixture go rancid just as fast while the coconut stay fresh? Are the oils in a mixture to be seen as separate oils or do they form a unity that has it's own shelf life. Like if you mix something that go rancid tomorrow and something that go rancid in 10 years. Will the shelf life be like 5 years?

The oils that don't go rancid fast, there is a reason for that, depending on what oil it is and how it has been treated. So will that thing that protects them from rancidity migrate over to other oils? Let's say cold pressed virgin coconut oil that has infinite life time. That is because of a high amount of antioxidants. While refined coconut will go rancid (unless it's fractionated). So those antioxidants should migrate over, I think. That makes sense. But I'm as far from beeing an expert as anyone can be.

So what about pine tar, that has also infinite shelf life, I think. Will some pine tar added to let's say olive oil protect the olive oil from going rancid too fast? Hmm...? What'ya think?

 

[Susie]

Fractionated coconut oil is not the coconut oil commonly used in CP soapmaking. The "76 degree" version is what most of us use. And if you mix a high linoleic fatty acid oil into a soap batter, and it goes rancid, the whole batch goes rancid and you get DOS. Best to avoid using too much high linoleic fatty acid oils in CP, I think the conventional wisdom on that is 15%, but if I am incorrect, please feel free to correct me.

 

[SaltedFig]

I don't think I understand how oils get rancid. I mean, I understand it if it's a pure oil, but what if that oil is mixed with something else? ..."

Hi Rune!

This article might be of some help to you: http://www.gcca.org/wp-content/uploads/2012/09/RancidityAntioxidants.pdf

There are a few ways oils can go rancid. Rancidity is the oil structure breaking down. Some oils (as you have noted) break down slower than others.

The reasons oils break down can be from exposure to oxygen, or by being contaminated by bacteria, or when water is added (water acts as a catalyst for a lot of different reactions, but makes the breaking down of the oil "easier").

Exposure to heat and sunlight can hasten rancidity as well.

"Delicate" oils are oils that become rancid, or break down, quickly or more easily than other oils.

Sometimes mixing oils can help (I believe this works by dilution), but only if it is before rancidity has occurred.

Once an oil has broken down, I don't believe that it can be put back together again

 

[Rune]

Fractionated coconut was just an example, not the best example, but I know that is not what is used. Aha, okey, I did not know that about linoleic fatty acids. Thank you I have now found out that olive oil has 12% linoleic acid. So if a wax is added, that has 0% linoleic, the total will luckily go down to well under the safety limit.

I must really try to whip up a batch of soap soon. I have not done anything at all, because my job was killing me. So I don't had any energy to soap. And I have not yet placed and order for supplies. That should have been done weeks ago. But I took a bar of the soap I have on curing. And it does feel drying. Even if it is a 100% olive oil soap, if I remember right. It does lather very well also. Something is fishy around here, hmm, but what?

So I want to try hot process next. I came across a genius method, almost magical, and perfect since I don't have a crockpot (and don't want to buy one either). It is the high temperature hot process method, where the soap cooks by itself in a hurry. I want to try hot process, because then I can add acids to get the PH down, and I can cure it for a shorter time, hopefully, so that I can test it quicker and see if it is okey or not. I don't really want to whip up a bunch of cold processed soaps, wait for months for then to find out that all of them is more or less a failure in one or another way. But in the end, I really want to do cold process more than hot process because of the design possibilities. But maybe I will like hot process a lot, I don't know. I will try anyway. I finally have a stick blender, and I have bought some nice paper cupcake molds from the grocery store, and I have some essential oils. So I can make something without further supplies. For colorants, I can just use turmeric and rosehip tea, for example. I want to use rosehip tea in the recipe anyway, because it is so acidic, and I want the PH down to see if I can tolerate the soap better. I have very sensitive skin on my hands, but not elsewhere on the body, and in this winther months, the air and cold dries out the hands. But it must be added after the cook, though.

 

[cherrycoke216]

Rune, the 100% olive oil soap lathers well... Probably because most of olive oil brands have been adulterated( mix other cheaper oil and sell it as higher priced olive oil or extra virgin olive oil)
And adding citric acid won't bring the PH down. It will be more superfat. At one point, you add too much citric acid, the soap will become oily mess and not a soap anymore. Whether you add it before or after cook.

And you cure hot process soap longer because you need it to be fluid enough to not become a dry paste. (The soap forms crystal structure during cure, lose water, and ph goes down,too. )

 

[Zany_in_CO]

I found it! http://www.yourfishstuff.com/natural-astaxanthin-powder

COOL! As it happens, I have some 4mg capsules here... they are indeed deep red!
Hmmm :think:

 

[DeeAnna]

"...I must really try to whip up a batch of soap soon. I have not done anything at all, because my job was killing me. So I don't had any energy to soap...."

I've been reading your posts, but I've chosen to not participate. I think it's now time to say something.

It seems to me that you don't have energy because you are spending it asking many questions that lead you down non-productive side tracks. Once someone responds to one of your questions, then you're off running down the next side track. First it was antioxidants, next it was crayons and astaxanthin and such, now it's preventing rancidity with waxes and using high temp hot process with the expectation of a fast cure. It's like watching a high-energy toddler running wild around the house after a good nap.

If you really want to make soap, then FOCUS and make soap.

 

[cmzaha]

If you are buying the armour brand lard, it has BHT added.

My lard contains BHT but was not quite enough to keep it from going dossy. Ask anyone here who I sent samples to when I was testing 100% different brands of lard. So I chose to use a pinch (by measuring spoon) in my soap, which contains 60 oz oils

 

[cmzaha]

Here is a list of things with very high antioxidant levels:

https://www.superfoodly.com/orac-values/

Dragon's blood, that should do the trick. But I imagine that it is very, very expensive, and it will not dissolve in oil easily. Astaxanthin powder is maybe easier to use.

Dragon's Blood Resin is extremely red so you would have to watch how much you use. I have crushed and infused it in oil by using a mini crock pot, to use as a red coloring in my Dragon's Blood soap. It has does not have much scent so does not remotely compare to DB fragrance oil.