Soaping 101 liquid soapmaking video?

[CookbookChef]

If you do not want to have to neutralize your soap for the excess lye with borax or other additives, then try to formulate with a small superfat from the beginning and make sure you are measuring very carefully (in grams is best). If your soap paste ends up with a lye excess, adding oils will help because you are giving that lye something to saponify and use up, but you no longer have control over any excess superfat you may end up with which could bring you additional problems down the line with that excess oil floating to the top of your finished soap.

All in all, this sounds like it has been great learning experience for you - the best way to learn.

I always convert to Grams...and I always do a superfat of 3%. So...saying that....is it TRUE I can just keep slowly adding oil, a teaspoon at a time FOREVER until is not zappy anymore? The term FOREVER simply means, as many half hour increments as needed...be it a couple of hours...be it all day...be it a few days....Ya, I guess I am asking if I follow thru, would it of come to neutral FOR SURE without using the Borax...ya, I will totally do everything to avoid being high on the Zappy ever again, saying that....I just want to know a back up before I get to it. I NEVER want to NEED to add Borax ever again. I want to avoid adding that and anything. Thank you So Much!!!

 

[CookbookChef]

I can't see the pic, but your description is great, so I don't really need to see the pic. I have a few questions so that I know exactly what is going on before we go any further. I would rather ask than assume anything.

I know that you posted a recipe in post #223, and asked about frac. CO later. Is that the recipe you used, and did you make any other additions/changes? What method did you use, and any other additions?

Your soap should not be zappy if you used that recipe, and your scale is good(you check it, so I know it is correct). So, we have to start looking at the beginning and go from there.

hey Good Point Susie!!!Do you think its possible my Scale could of been going bad?? The reason I now ask is you got me thinking...about the Scale. The reason I bring this up is if my memory serves me right, I remember that I had one of those small Glycerin bottles, I bought from Walmart. Well, it stated it was 6 Ounces on the side of the Bottle. But when I would POUR all the glycerin into my pan, I noticed it saying on the Scale that I had 7.50 Ounces, instead of 6 ounces printed on the label. And what is weird, I did NOT notice any other measurements being off...just the Glycerin, so I did not THINK I had any problems. WELL, now I am reconsidering this....hhhmmmm, cause if my Scale is off, that would mean if its measuring an extra 1 1/2 Ounces of Glycerin, I COULD off ended up adding an extra 1 1/2 Ounces of Extra KOH!! OH NO.....hhmmm. My Husband said that HE THINKS that when a battery will start to go out, it can do weird things to a scale, like make the scale to start weigh false amounts. Shucks....just to be sure, I don't think I will do even one more batch of ANYTHING before I go replace the battery's with some fresh NEW ones...just to be sure!!

 

[FGOriold]

When I run your recipe through the Summerbee Meadow Calc with a 0% superfat, I get 3.47 KOH and you used 3.55. This is the only calc I use and from that perspective it looks like your formulated with a lye excess of about 3%.

 

[FGOriold]

hey Good Point Susie!!!Do you think its possible my Scale could of been going bad?? The reason I now ask is you got me thinking...about the Scale. The reason I bring this up is if my memory serves me right, I remember that I had one of those small Glycerin bottles, I bought from Walmart. Well, it stated it was 6 Ounces on the side of the Bottle. But when I would POUR all the glycerin into my pan, I noticed it saying on the Scale that I had 7.50 Ounces, instead of 6 ounces printed on the label. And what is weird, I did NOT notice any other measurements being off...just the Glycerin, so I did not THINK I had any problems. WELL, now I am reconsidering this....hhhmmmm, cause if my Scale is off, that would mean if its measuring an extra 1 1/2 Ounces of Glycerin, I COULD off ended up adding an extra 1 1/2 Ounces of Extra KOH!! OH NO.....hhmmm. My Husband said that HE THINKS that when a battery will start to go out, it can do weird things to a scale, like make the scale to start weigh false amounts. Shucks....just to be sure, I don't think I will do even one more batch of ANYTHING before I go replace the battery's with some fresh NEW ones...just to be sure!!

You have to remember that liquids contents are stated by volume not weight. So your glycerin was correct in that it was 6 ounces by volume, but can easily weigh more or less than that.

 

[IrishLass]

Ipstephy- is it firm underneath the white bubbles?


IrishLass

 

[lpstephy85]

Ipstephy- is it firm underneath the white bubbles?


IrishLass

It's a firm, thick taffy consistency.

 

[IrishLass]

I use soap calc lye calculator. Keep liquid at 38% and superfat 1% as my lye is only 85% pure..
For the first two times i used whole liquid part as glycerin,the next two times i used half water half glycerin.
I use pomace as it is much lower in cost than virgin olive oil.
Now,what i do is-
- melt my oils in crockpot.
-mix lye and glycerin/water together.bring it to boil while continuously mixing and it gets completely clear.
- pour it in the oils and mix everything with whisk.
- after around 20 mins of mixing and going through different textures and colors it turns to a thick,white paste..
- now,i got this each time. First time i kept the crockpot on during the whole process.so it turned to a transparent paste in an hour.
Second and third time i turned the crockpot off as soon as i added the lye sol,and mixed it with crockpot off..but it again stopped at the same white paste stage..i thought leave it on its own..but nothing changed till next day,it even got harder..so i cooked it till vaseline like the next day.
For the fourth time, i did not use crockpot at all. I melted my oils in a stainless steel pot,then added lye to it,whisked it..but again it turned to a white thick paste turning harder..so i dumped in crockpot and again cooked it till Vaseline like stage.. hmmmm..
Thats it.
And yes,then i added water multiplying by 0.75 of paste weight..let it sit whole night..mix it up next day,my paste gets very thick again after mixing,so i add more water...then add essential oils to it..and bottle it..and then i get honey colored thin liquid.

Hi Shaan! Thanks for clarifying. That helps tremendously. :smile:

Well, when all is said and done after having re-calculated everything out a few times to take into account your 85% lye purity on both SoapCalc and Summerbee and also taking into account their different, individual default purity settings, it turns out your 117g KOH amount for your recipe is spot on with a 3% superfat according to Summerbee, but your total up-front water amount still turns out to be too low- 40g too low according to Summerbee. Next time, I would use 340g total liquid instead of 300g. I can't stress enough how important one's total up-front liquid amount is. That's one of the reasons why I don't like using SoapCalc for my liquid soap batches. Summerbee gives me a higher (and better) water amount, which makes things proceed quite nice for my liquid soap.

Now, onto your method.....

I've never tried dissolving my KOH in a boiling mixture of glycerin and water before. I normally mix my KOH in 100% glycerin only and then boil it until dissolved, except for that one recent time that I dissolved the KOH in an equal amount of room temp water first before adding my usual full amount glycerin to it (all at room temp- no boiling it). That is probably the reason why you are getting a white colored paste instead of a transparent-looking paste, because that's what happened to me when I dissolved my KOH in an equal amount of water first- I ended up with white/opaque paste instead of my usual transparent paste with this formula, but don't let the white/opaque color of the paste worry you one little bit. It's still all perfectly good and normal, and will turn clear when diluted. :smile:

Once the soap has become paste (even though the paste is white/opaque), you don't need to cook it further to make it go transparent. In other words, having clear/transparent paste is not a magical goal to be attained or anything like that. The important thing is to end up with a paste-like consistency, no matter what color it might be. If your paste zaps, you can apply heat to it to speed up the saponification process to zapless-ness if you desire, but it's not necessary. Given enough time at room temp, it'll eventually become tongue-neutral if all was weighed correctly up front. Once you have paste and it does not zap, then you can dilute, and it will dilute out clear.

Since you used less water up front to make the paste than I would have used for your size batch and 85% lye purity,etc.. this will throw things off a bit, and the dilution rate of .75 water to paste that I like to use will more than likely not give you the same results that I normally get, which means that you will have to play around and make adjustments to the dilution rate. If you find that your finished soap is too thin, you can always warm it up a little with the cover off to evaporate off some of the excess liquid before bottling.

HTH!
IrishLass

 

[IrishLass]

It's a firm, thick taffy consistency.


View attachment 11430

Perfect- I would call that success!

IrishLass

 

[lpstephy85]

When I run your recipe through the Summerbee Meadow Calc with a 0% superfat, I get 3.47 KOH and you used 3.55. This is the only calc I use and from that perspective it looks like your formulated with a lye excess of about 3%.

I guess I need to get used to SBM calc then! Do I need to enter in all of the info or can I just enter in the ounces of my oils, select that I am doing LS and then calculate?

I melted down my paste and added an ounce of OO so we will see if that helps.

 

[IrishLass]

Ipstephy- on Summerbee's Advanced Calculator, these are the only things you need to click:

First, click that you will be making liquid soap.
Next, type in that you will be using 100% Potassium Hydroxide
Then skip over everything on down to the Superfat box and enter in your superfat.
Then skip over everything until you get to the place you enter in your recipe, and enter in your oils/fats.
Then click on the grey box off to the right that says "Click Here When Done'

That's all you need to do. A page will then pop up with all your recipe amounts. If it works for you like it does for me, you will have to scroll up to see the recipe amounts.

I take the water amount it gives me and sub it one for one with glycerin.

HTH
IrishLass

 

[lpstephy85]

Thank you Irishlass! It was a little too intimidating so I stuck with SoapCalc. Hopefully adding some OO will take up that excess lye.

 

[fuzz-juzz]

Does anyone know why is there always a slight discrepancy between KOH amount I'm getting from Summer Bee Meadows gives and SoapCalc.
I know first one is recommended, but I tried to plug in same recipe into SoapCalc and seem to always get bigger KOH amount and it's around 4%. For example, first one will give me 219gr and SoapCalc 228gr? I am pretty sure I plug in 90% KOH both times. I've put in 0% SF as well.
As I can see few soapers might have had the similar issue, some of their batchers ended up lye heavy using SoapCalc lye calculator.
And I have one more question. Has anyone used rice bran oil in liquid soap? Google search says it will possibly make clear soap?
I really like it in CP and use it in almost all recipes.

 

[FGOriold]

Does anyone know why is there always a slight discrepancy between KOH amount I'm getting from Summer Bee Meadows gives and SoapCalc.
I know first one is recommended, but I tried to plug in same recipe into SoapCalc and seem to always get bigger KOH amount and it's around 4%. For example, first one will give me 219gr and SoapCalc 228gr? I am pretty sure I plug in 90% KOH both times. I've put in 0% SF as well.
As I can see few soapers might have had the similar issue, some of their batchers ended up lye heavy using SoapCalc lye calculator.
And I have one more question. Has anyone used rice bran oil in liquid soap? Google search says it will possibly make clear soap?
I really like it in CP and use it in almost all recipes.

1. They use different SAP values for the oils which can cause differences
2. Summerbee calculates with a small lye excess for liquid soap

My suggestion is to find a calculator that works for you consistently and stick with it. No matter what the calc says for lye amounts, it will never be exact since your oils may not have the exact same SAP values nor will your KOH purity be exactly 90% or 100%. Just know what to do if you end up with an unintended superfat or an unintended lye excess.

 

[Susie]

SBM does not calculate with a lye excess. You enter the superfat just like on SoapCalc. And please note that SBM actually calls for less KOH than SoapCalc.

 

[Susie]

You have to remember that liquids contents are stated by volume not weight. So your glycerin was correct in that it was 6 ounces by volume, but can easily weigh more or less than that.

Huh? Everything I have read and seen shows water and glycerin being weighed, not measured.

 

[FGOriold]

Huh? Everything I have read and seen shows water and glycerin being weighed, not measured.

When we measure ingredients to use for soap making we weigh them. Liquids packaged for purchase are packaged via volume not weight. So my point is if you purchase a container of glycerin that's states 8 fluid ounces it does not mean it weighs 8 ounces but has a volume of 8 ounces.

 

[FGOriold]

SBM does not calculate with a lye excess. You enter the superfat just like on SoapCalc. And please note that SBM actually calls for less KOH than SoapCalc.

Yes, it is calibrated for a small lye excess - I will see if I can find the post on their website where the owner spells it out.

Here you go:
http://summerbeemeadow.com/content/sbm-liquid-soap-calculator-neutralization-needed

 

[shaan]

Thanx so much Irishlass for your help..keeping everything in mind,i will give it one more try,then report back!

 

[shaan]

And I have one more question. Has anyone used rice bran oil in liquid soap? Google search says it will possibly make clear soap?
I really like it in CP and use it in almost all recipes.

Yes i have used rice bran oil at 10% with sunflower oil,canol oil,castor,olive and coconut oil.. yes,lots of oil..just to save on other oils .. it turned out very nice and clear till i added essential oils.

 

[shaan]

Yes i have used rice bran oil at 10% with sunflower oil,canol oil,castor,olive and coconut oil.. yes,lots of oil..just to save on other oils .. it turned out very nice and clear till i added essential oils