SMF Soap Making Challenge: September Discoloring FO

[Saponista]

I bought cadburys mini eggs in the U.S. As I was over there at Easter. They were so disappointing I nearly cried. (I like my chocolate!) they were not even close to being the same thing.

 

[not_ally]

It is true, Saponista, I think Cadbury's made for the American market is not the same formula. I usually stick to Cadbury's flake and fruit and nut bars that I buy at an import place. It is just as well I do not have access to them every day! I love most things American, but chocolate, not so much.

 

[galaxyMLP]

The reason chocolate formulas changed when they came to the US has to do with the fact that US climate is overall much warmer than the EU. This causes all the chocolates in the US to be made with ingredients that melt at a higher temperature. that makes the chocolate less creamy!

 

[not_ally]

I am not sure what it is Galaxy, they are definitely less creamy, also kind of waxier, less rich and sweeter. I thought maybe it was just a preference thing, b/c Americans are used to eating one kind of chocolate and Europeans chocolate is so different. The ones made in Asia are not v. nice, either.

 

[gigisiguenza]

So I unmolded my challenge soap last night and I have to say it was rather anticlimactic LOL. I had hoped to see more color morphing in the mold, but I guess it will need more time and more exposure to air for the DFOs to completely turn. The indigo is slowly turning, so that's good.

In addition to that, I am less than impressed with the way the pour turned out. I was too enthusiastic in my SBing, so it reached trace too quickly. Sigh..... I've got to learn to be less aggressive in my blending. I always overdo it because I'm worried I've got false trace when I'm aiming for emulsion stage.

I think I'm gonna do another batch, just to be sure I have one for the challenge And maybe I'll make this one a gel batch. I've never gelled before. Any advice before I tackle this later tonight?

G

 

[Saponista]

I watched a TV show about it and I'm not making this up, American chocolate has elements of flavour profile similar to vomit. They taste tested British and American and Belgian chocolate on people of different nationalities and each nationality could pick out and recognise their own chocolate and preferred the flavour profile.


It is so easy to over stick blend Gigi, especially when you are trying to make sure your colours etc. are blended properly. It becomes easier with practice, but there is always the temptation to use that stick blender 'just one more burst'.

I gel my soap by just wrapping in a towel, it works fine in my centrally heated house where the temperature is fairly constant.

 

[gigisiguenza]

I watched a TV show about it and I'm not making this up, American chocolate has elements of flavour profile similar to vomit. They taste tested British and American and Belgian chocolate on people of different nationalities and each nationality could pick out and recognise their own chocolate and preferred the flavour profile.

Vomit? No wonder I don't like 99% of the chocolate on the market LOL... it's all either too sweet or too soft... Only chocolate Ive found that I like is Ghirardelli midnight dark type like the 86% cocoa. I love love love dark chocolate and the Ghirardelli doesn't taste like I'll pass out in a sugar coma twenty minutes after eating it

 

[not_ally]

I am not surprised at all. I think my chocolate tastes were formed from living in England as a kid. I admit, I will eat any kind of chocolate in a pinch, but I still prefer English chocolate (even to the Belgian stuff.) Now, if anyone could replicate the creamy ice cream cone from days gone by - the ones that look kind of like this, but were made with real ingredients, and heavy duty butterfat - I would be so happy. I keep ordering them, but keep getting a mouthful of plasticy sweetness instead of the heavenly stuff banked in my memory.

 

[gigisiguenza]

It is so easy to over stick blend Gigi, especially when you are trying to make sure your colours etc. are blended properly. It becomes easier with practice, but there is always the temptation to use that stick blender 'just one more burst'.

I gel my soap by just wrapping in a towel, it works fine in my centrally heated house where the temperature is fairly constant.

Yep it's that one or two more bursts that get me LOL.

As to gelling - I now have a small silicone loaf mold and plan on using that for today's soap. My apartment is air conditioned (welcome to Texas summer lol) but it's an even 74* all the time. Will wrapping in a towel be enough to ensure gelling all the way to the edges?

Tyvm for the help btw

 

[not_ally]

I've always CPOP'd just to make sure of gel. The lowest my little convection oven (what I use to do it b/c my regular one is higher and iffier on temps) will go is 150, so I put it in for an hour (checking at intervals to make sure there is no craziness going on) take it out and leave it as it is unless it seems like it is overheating.

 

[galaxyMLP]

My apartment is at 76 most of the time and since I soap around 100, sometimes I don't get 100% gel if I just wrap it. Plus, with a pretty top, its almost impossible to wrap well for gelling. I also CPOP my soaps if I want to ensure gel. However, my oven goes to 170 as the lowest so I can not have it on for a full hour. I put it on for 20 minutes and check at 5-10 minute intervals. Once I see the top is no longer glossy but turns mate/no longer reflects any light in the middle of the loaf, I turn the oven off. Hope that helps!

 

[gigisiguenza]

I've always CPOP'd just to make sure of gel. The lowest my little convection oven (what I use to do it b/c my regular one is higher and iffier on temps) will go is 150, so I put it in for an hour (checking at intervals to make sure there is no craziness going on) take it out and leave it as it is unless it seems like it is overheating.

Ally - if I turned my oven on its lowest setting, waited for it to reach temp, then turned it off to let it come down to 150ish while I made the soap, think that I would work? I'm game to try it, as long as I don't get volcanoes of soap spewing like Vesuvius all over my kitchen Hahahahaha.

 

[gigisiguenza]

My apartment is at 76 most of the time and since I soap around 100, sometimes I don't get 100% gel if I just wrap it. Plus, with a pretty top, its almost impossible to wrap well for gelling. I also CPOP my soaps if I want to ensure gel. However, my oven goes to 170 as the lowest so I can not have it on for a full hour. I put it on for 20 minutes and check at 5-10 minute intervals. Once I see the top is no longer glossy but turns mate/no longer reflects any light in the middle of the loaf, I turn the oven off. Hope that helps!

Ok taking notes ... check for matte finish on top and check ever 5-10 minutes

Ty

 

[galaxyMLP]

Oh, and I leave it in there alll night/day with the oven off when I've made a batch (at least 6 hours) without peeking too. The soap will continue to gel for at least some time. I just don't want to mess it up so I'm pretty patient with it.

Someone whos tested it at shorter intervals can chime in here and say when its OK to take it out. I just know I've taking it out a little soon before. Can't really remember when that was... But, it happened!

 

[gigisiguenza]

Oh, and I leave it in there alll night/day with the oven off when I've made a batch (at least 6 hours) without peeking too. The soap will continue to gel for at least some time. I just don't want to mess it up so I'm pretty patient with it.

Someone whos tested it at shorter intervals can chime in here and say when its OK to take it out. I just know I've taking it out a little soon before. Can't really remember when that was... But, it happened!

More notes

 

[not_ally]

Gigi, I'm not sure b/c I have always done it in my own little weird oven. But there are various ways, I have read of people who CPOP their soaps in the oven at 170 for a short period of time, then turn the oven off and leave the soap in the oven (like Galaxy does), people who turn the oven on at 170, turn it off immediately and leave the soap in overnight, and then the lucky ones whose ovens go down to 120, they tend to leave the oven on and keep the soaps in for longer b/c they can. I have never had a volcano, but I think in part that is b/c of my slow heating mix (tons of lard, tad bits of CO/OO/Castor). The only times I have ever had overheating when CPOPing is when I pushed it w/overheating ingredients like honey, maybe combined with, eg, a speedy FO.

I would start conservatively - heat to 170, turn it off and put the soap in, see if it is seems to be gelling - here it might be easier b/c you should see a color change pretty fast, w/in 15-20 ms or so assuming you have an FO w/a good amt. of vanilla. If no change, turn the oven on for a little while. I realize this seems a bit ad hoc, but this exercise is a good one in which to try it b/c your DFO will give you a lot of information about whether the soap is gelling or not. Also, are you using a slow tracing/slow heating mix? That will be easier to control, as well.

 

[not_ally]

I am in the yucky part of soap making, I want to use a slab mold w/dividers, so have lined the mold (a wooden one I already had) and am trying to make cardboard dividers that fit. But they are so wobbly right now, I imagine they will fall over immediately when I try to pour soap in. And if you tape them in to hold them in place securely, how on earth do you get them out quickly - and not make a mess - when it is time to do that?

I have only used dividers w/log molds before, and just bought the ones that were offered with whatever log/loaf mold it was. They were expensive, but in view of this experiment, worth every penny

 

[gigisiguenza]

Gigi, I'm not sure b/c I have always done it in my own little weird oven. But there are various ways, I have read of people who CPOP their soaps in the oven at 170 for a short period of time, then turn the oven off and leave the soap in the oven (like Galaxy does), people who turn the oven on at 170, turn it off immediately and leave the soap in overnight, and then the lucky ones whose ovens go down to 120, they tend to leave the oven on and keep the soaps in for longer b/c they can. I have never had a volcano, but I think in part that is b/c of my slow heating mix (tons of lard, tad bits of CO/OO/Castor). The only times I have ever had overheating when CPOPing is when I pushed it w/overheating ingredients like honey, maybe combined with, eg, a speedy FO.

I would start conservatively - heat to 170, turn it off and put the soap in, see if it is seems to be gelling - here it might be easier b/c you should see a color change pretty fast, w/in 15-20 ms or so assuming you have an FO w/a good amt. of vanilla. If no change, turn the oven on for a little while. I realize this seems a bit ad hoc, but this exercise is a good one in which to try it b/c your DFO will give you a lot of information about whether the soap is gelling or not. Also, are you using a slow tracing/slow heating mix? That will be easier to control, as well.

Yes it is a slow heating slow tracing mix. I've not had it once go to gel, even when I forgot t fridge it and left it on the table. It will get mildly warm, but not hot. Only time it went very warm on me was when my lye solution and my oils were higher temp (more like 110-115), and as soon as I felt the warmth of the mold, I put it in the fridge to prevent gel.

So, I could soap a little warmer, to ensure it goes to gel, but SB barely to emulsion, to give me time to play. Then pop it in an oven that's been pre warmed to about 150? (correct me on the temp if it's too high please) and leave it alone for a little bit. Check for color morphing, and remove it once I see the color morphing has occurred. Do I wrap it once I remove it, or do I just let it sit and do its thing?

 

[galaxyMLP]

The reason I put the oven on for a little bit of time is because I've tried turning it on, preheating it, putting my soap in a turning it off and that just isn't enough heat. I did leave it on for about an hour once and got overheating/separation. But... That was like 2 years ago when I made a 100% CO soap (and I know now that was a bad idea to try my first CPOP with since CO is a heater! Lol, the things you learn on your own w/o the forum to teach you first...)

I leave my soap in there but, once it's finished gelling, you could technically take it out of the oven. For me though, its hard/next to impossible to tell when gel is actually done. That's why I personally leave it in the oven. I think everyone does CPOP a little different b/c everyone's ovens and climates are different.

 

[not_ally]

God, I hope someone else chips in here and corrects me if I am wrong, I do not want to give you bad advice. I don't have much experience with DFO's or CPOPing in any way other than my (singular) own. I wouldn't soap hotter, I would stay cool/whisk, whatever what was required to get my design right. Then put it in a hot oven. If your oven goes as low as 120 and holds there, I would keep it there (with the heat on) for 15 ms or so and see what happens.) If it only goes as low as 170, like most people's, I would get it to that point, put the soap in, turn the heat off, check it at 15 ms and then turn on/off/jigger from there.

If the color has changed to a good degree, you know gelling has started and is probably well underway. A significant color change, at least for me, would indicate that it has probably gelled enough, I would turn the heat off, leave it in there, and wait to see what happens. If it seems to be overheating (top gets dried out and tight looking or bubbly), I would take it out.

I have never wrapped soaps after CPOPing, the residual heat from being in the oven has always been enough to carry it the rest of the way. If anything, it has been the opposite, if it seems too hot I will stick the soap in the freezer or fridge to cool it down.

ETA: I don't think I have ever had partial gel when CPOP'ing, the danger is always the other way, ie; overheating.