Need a bit of recipe help. Need more lather

[Ozzietx]

I have been using this recipe, and am pretty satisfied with it. It does seem to lack really great lather. What changes can I make to increase the lather in this soap?
Recipe created by Ozzietx
https://www.soapmakingfriend.com/recipes/81707.gv-shortening

 

[KiwiMoose]

I can't see the recipe - it just takes me to the home page.

 

[artemis]

Says, "you don't have permission..."

 

[Ozzietx]

Maybe I could use some help getting the recipe out of Soapmaking Friend and placing it here. Is there a tutorial for that somewhere?

 

[Mobjack Bay]

If you can take a screen shot, you can post it as a photo attachment. Or attach the recipe as a pdf. or make the recipe public so we can see it.

 

[Ozzietx]

Let’s try this

 

[Firefly24]

Let’s try this

@Ozzietx ~ Add sugar to your recipe. Powdered sugar to your water or use aloe vera juice. It has helped me anyway.

 

[Mobjack Bay]

You've formulated for a bar with high longevity (palmitic + stearic = 34), which I would expect to make a very creamy lather. All of the following options will help the soap dissolve more easily, which will lead to more bubbles:

• increase coconut oil
• decrease the shortening a bit and increase the OO or another liquid oil to bring the oleic fatty acid up to 40% or more; if you add an oil that contributes linoleic, such as RBO, the lather will start to feel a bit silky and some big bubbles will form; keep linoleic below 15%
• use dual lye, which increases the solubility of the soap without other additives
• use an additive, like sugar or sorbitol, which may also help to sustain bubbles once they form

 

[Ozzietx]

I revised the recipe.
Can I get some feedback on the revision?
This looks like it will give me more lather.
I am still very new at this. I really appreciate the feedback.

 

[Firefly24]

@Ozzietx is this your first batch of soap? I am new to soap making also. I have made about 8 batches of soap all using different ingredients and FO's. There is never going to be a perfect batch. You have to experiment and see what you like. I would search on you tube about the different properties that different oils bring to the mix. It is really interesting to learn about all the different ways to create a soap recipe. Warning* It is addictive to research all the fun here, on YT and everywhere.

 

[Mobjack Bay]

@Ozzietx you mentioned in your original post that you are "pretty satisfied" with the recipe you've been using. The new recipe is quite different from the first recipe, and is basically like starting over. If you can tolerate more than 15% coconut, here are two less drastic adjustments to your original recipe:

45% GV shortening
30% olive oil
20% coconut oil
5% castor
1.5 to 2% sugar or sorbitol based on the weight of the fats/oils
and you could drop the superfat to 2-3% which will also help with bubbles
this recipe has a base longevity of 29

or, with 25% coconut oil
40% GV shortening
33% olive oil
25% coconut oil
2% castor (you won't need as much when you have 25% coconut oil)
1.5 to 2% sugar or sorbitol based on the weight of the fats/oils
I would probably leave the SF at 5%
this recipe also has a base longevity of 29

 

[Ozzietx]

@Ozzietx you mentioned in your original post that you are "pretty satisfied" with the recipe you've been using. The new recipe is quite different from the first recipe, and is basically like starting over. If you can tolerate more than 15% coconut, here are two less drastic adjustments to your original recipe:

45% GV shortening
30% olive oil
20% coconut oil
5% castor
1.5 to 2% sugar or sorbitol based on the weight of the fats/oils
and you could drop the superfat to 2-3% which will also help with bubbles
this recipe has a base longevity of 29

or, with 25% coconut oil
40% GV shortening
33% olive oil
25% coconut oil
2% castor (you won't need as much when you have 25% coconut oil)
1.5 to 2% sugar or sorbitol based on the weight of the fats/oils
I would probably leave the SF at 5%
this recipe also has a base longevity of 29

I really am pretty satisfied with the original recipe. I given out about 15 bars of soap using that recipe to friends and family. The feedback has been very positive. The only negative feedback has been a desire for more lather.
I agree with that. I also seem to get a lot of soap scum. Maybe I’ll go with your first recipe suggestion. I used honey once and it traced super fast on me, and discolored the soap a bit. Will I not have that issue with just sugar?

 

[Mobjack Bay]

I've seen people include plain white sugar in lists of sugary things that cause a bit of heating, but I've never had any issues with it. Add it to the water and dissolve thoroughly before you add the NaOH. It may give the lye water a slight yellow tinge but it will not discolor the soap.

 

[KiwiMoose]

Have you tried lowering the superfat to 2%? That will help with soap scum and increased lather.

 

[cmzaha]

Let’s try this

This recipe is very similar in profile to my go-to recipe although I use a tallow/lard combination with 17% CO. I use EDTA/Sodium Gluconate total 1% batch weight as a chelator, with a 2% superfat, dual lye, 1.1% total batch weight of Sorbitol, and a 33% lye concentration. I also age my soaps at least 8 weeks which helps with the lather. I also soap with vinegar but that is another learning curve.

 

[melinda48]

I really am pretty satisfied with the original recipe. I given out about 15 bars of soap using that recipe to friends and family. The feedback has been very positive. The only negative feedback has been a desire for more lather.
I agree with that. I also seem to get a lot of soap scum. Maybe I’ll go with your first recipe suggestion. I used honey once and it traced super fast on me, and discolored the soap a bit. Will I not have that issue with just sugar?

I use 1 tsp PPO of powdered sugar and it works great for bubbles! I like powdered sugar as it incorporates so quickly and completely with my oils.

 

[Ozzietx]

I use 1 tsp PPO of powdered sugar and it works great for bubbles! I like powdered sugar as it incorporates so quickly and completely with my oils.

You are the second person that has recommended powder sugar. All of the powder sugar that I have seen/purchased also has
cornstarch incorporated. Does the cornstarch have any effect on the soap?
BTW, I did a batch yesterday adding 2 tsp of plain white sugar disolved in water per 600g of oil. We will wait and see how that does.

 

[cmzaha]

You are the second person that has recommended powder sugar. All of the powder sugar that I have seen/purchased also has
cornstarch incorporated. Does the cornstarch have any effect on the soap?
BTW, I did a batch yesterday adding 2 tsp of plain white sugar disolved in water per 600g of oil. We will wait and see how that does.

Powdered sugar is white sugar mixed with cornstarch. Side by side test I find Sorbitol helps lather better than sugar. I also found clay in soap tended to suppress lather.

 

[melinda48]

Powdered sugar is white sugar mixed with cornstarch. Side by side test I find Sorbitol helps lather better than sugar. I also found clay in soap tended to suppress lather.

It has no effect whatsoever as far as I can tell. I have been using it for a couple of years now - over 13,000 bars of soap.

 

[cmzaha]

It has no effect whatsoever as far as I can tell. I have been using it for a couple of years now - over 13,000 bars of soap.

What has no effect? If you are talking about Sorbitol it is not just my opinion. I would guess I have made as many soaps as you in all my years of making and selling.