traderbren
Well-Known Member
Would polysorbate 20 be acceptable to sub for the PS 80 here?
My Creamy Cocoa/Shea GLS Tutorial
- Thread starter IrishLass
- Start date
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Misschief- did you also add the EDTA solution and SL solution to the paste? If not, then you'll have to tweak (increase) the dilution water % as I explained here: http://www.soapmakingforum.com/showpost.php?p=569947&postcount=13
IrishLass
Ah right! I forgot about that part. Thanks IL! I'm really trying to understand this whole process and, to that end, I have one more question. I think it will be the last one.
If I understand correctly, it's the stearic acid that gives the soap its creamy colour, right? To get a clear soap, could I simply leave it out? In reading the thread over at the Dish (I'm 15 pages in, second time around), I realize that the oils can affect the finished soap as far as opacity goes; clear oils, clear soap?
By the way, I've just finished diluting the last of the soap paste. I did it in two parts, one half on the weekend, the other half last night. I have a 4 oz. bottle in my bathroom and gave my daughter another 4 oz. bottle for testing. I love mine! I don't have meadowfoam oil (yet... it's on its way) and used macadamia nut oil and no scent. In the second half, I'm thinking of using jojoba and adding a bit of scent, not sure what yet. I'll think about that while at work today.
I'm adding my thank you to those ahead of me. This is an amazing tutorial and I'm so grateful you took the time to put it all together.
I'm glad you mentioned that again, though, Misschief. I just edited the body of my dilution directions to add in a note about that. Whether you realize it or not, your questions are helping me to improve my tutorial.
Yes- the added stearic is what gives the soap it's lovely creamy/opaque pearliness, and also the rich and scrumptiously creamy, and I daresay almost lotion-y feel. I've left the stearic out before, but the finished soap pales in comparison. Without it, the finished soap is meh- the color comes out a dinghy/murky amber color, and the feel is just not anywhere near as scrumptiously creamy. You can certainly leave it out if you wish, but it definitely will not have the same level of loveliness, if you ask me.
Macadamia nut as the extra superfat sounds quite lovely!
I'm so glad to hear that you like the outcome!
IrishLass
I just edited the body of my dilution directions to add in a note about that. Whether you realize it or not, your questions are helping me to improve my tutorial.
More than happy to help in any way I can. :mrgreen:
I've decided on scent, with the help of my daughter... at least, for part of this batch. I've added sweet orange and lemongrass to her pump bottle of LS. I tend to be conservative when adding so I'm not sure I've added enough. We'll see how she likes it.
Incidentally, I took one bottle with me to work today to try out on my guinea pigs, uh, co-workers. The consensus was that the soap is wonderful but it needs scent.
You are a wonderful human being Irish Lass!
I've only made simple LS without any additives other than PS80 and FO. I have been taking notes on your recipe since you posted it on the glycerine LS thread... trying to create the step by step in my notebook. I never got up the courage to try it before now.
Thank you for sharing your wisdom and taking the time to write such a detailed tutorial.
I've only made simple LS without any additives other than PS80 and FO. I have been taking notes on your recipe since you posted it on the glycerine LS thread... trying to create the step by step in my notebook. I never got up the courage to try it before now.
Thank you for sharing your wisdom and taking the time to write such a detailed tutorial.
My pleasure, JayJay. Once you make it, you'll wonder why it ever took you so long! The directions might seem long, but once you're actually in the middle of doing it, it's so easy.....and the results are incredibly lovely (even if I do say so myself)!
IrishLass
Once you make it, you'll wonder why it ever took you so long! The directions might seem long, but once you're actually in the middle of doing it, it's so easy.....and the results are incredibly lovely (even if I do say so myself)!IrishLass
Congratulations Mandymaz- very lovely soap! Prepare to be addicted now. lol
IrishLass
I don't know how to tag you so I did it this way.
I've read and calculated, would you look it over and see if I have it?
(and thanks for all the info) small batch to check if I did it right.
Coconut 2.1 0z
Castor 1.8
Cocoa 1.2
Olive. 6
Shea 3
3%superfat
Glycerin 3.9 oz
KoH 1.3 0z
Dilution rate is 1 part paste to 41% (.41) water with 3% of water weight of SL.
When I have a finished paste I will add (and this is where it gets murky):
2% superfat (oil weight)
2% stearic acid (diluted soap/SL solution weight) mixed with PS80 to emulsify.
Add scent as I put in pump with equal parts PS80.
Where I think I am not clear is the PS80 stearic acid addition. I understand it as adding it to finished Liquid soap with PS80.
How much PS80 with stearic acid do I use?
I have pages of notes in front of me and I don't "think" I've missed anything. Whew, you made it look the easiest, but there is still a learning curve
I have the stir, heating and blending in my notes, I got that part thanks to your excellent instructions.
Not exactly, but certainly oils without stearic acid tend to make clear soap.
Saponista
Well-Known Member
I have only just come across this tutorial. Thank you so much it's fantastic!
Hi Lisa!
Uh-oh....looks like we have a big problem. Brace yourself. If you're trying to make my Creamy Cocoa/Shea formula, the amounts that you came up with in order to make your smaller batch are going to give you a completely different kind of soap.... one of which I can't guarantee the outcome.
In totaling up your oil amounts, it looks like you are shooting for a 14.1 oz. batch? If that's your intent, in order to make a 14.1 oz. batch of my Creamy Cocoa Shea soap, you'll need to use these amounts instead:
Coconut oil 4.94 oz. (35%)
Castor oil 4.23 oz. (30%)
Cocoa butter 2.82 oz. (20%)
Olive oil 1.41 oz. (10%)
Shea butter .7 oz. (5%)
KOH @ 3% super-fat 3.06 oz.
Glycerin 9.17 oz.
In contrast to my formula's stated percentages above, the oil amounts you posted actually give the following percentages listed below instead, which unfortunately won't produce the same outcome as my Creamy Cocoa Shea formula as spelled out in this tutorial:
Coconut oil 14.89%
Castor oil 12.77%
Cocoa butter 8.51%
Olive oil 42.55%
Shea butter 21.28%
Not anywhere close...
Also, the KOH and glycerin amounts you listed for your oil amounts are much different from what I would use if I were going to use those same oil amounts. SummerBee Meadow's Advanced Calculator for liquid soap-making (which I always use for liquid soap-making) gives me the following amounts of KOH and glycerin to use for your posted oil amounts: KOH @ 3% s/f: 2.88 oz.; and Glycerin: 8.65 oz. (instead of the 1.3 oz. KOH and 3.9 oz. glycerin that you posted)
If you are intent on making your slightly smaller 14.1 oz. batch, use the amounts written in red above.
No, not quite, and yes. Bear with me. lol I'm very glad you posted. Hopefully I can clear some of the murkiness up....especially if you happen to be going by my brief, cursory/incomplete post on this formula on page 2 over in the Soaping101 thread that I wrote a couple of years ago. I've slightly tweaked a few things since then, which is one of the reasons why I wrote this here tutorial. I should go edit my post in the other thread to post a link leading here. Anyway.......
RE: The 2% superfat: Nope. This is actually not added until after dilution when I have a finished liquid soap. You will want to weigh the finished liquid soap and then add your super-fatting oil @ 2% as per the finished soap's weight, along with PS80 at 3% of the super-fatting oil's weight to solubize the superfat into the soap (so that it doesn't separate out). (This is all explained in the beginning pages of this thread, which should help clear things up.)
RE: 2% stearic acid as per diluted soap/sodium lactate: Not quite (anymore). Nowadays, I base my stearic % on my paste's weight @ 3%, and it is added to my canning jar along with the paste at dilution time (i.e., not into the finished liquid soap)....along with .15% PS80 as per the weight of my paste. Also added to my canning jar at dilution time with the 3% stearic and .15% PS80 is the 41.3 % distilled water as per my paste's weight, 3% sodium lactate in 60% solution as per the paste's weight, and 1.96% Tetrasodium EDTA in 39% solution as per the paste's weight. All of this is explained in the beginning pages of this thread.
RE: the part about adding scent: Yes.
I hope that made sense. It's almost 3:30 AM here, so I must admit that I may not be at my sharpest. lol If you need further clarification, please don't hesitate to ask.
IrishLass
thanks for response, I just made up numbers for using the Meadow bees calc. I had to skim your response quickly, drats I have to get ready for work. I will read tonight. Lol, thought I had it. I can tell I am going to love making it. Thanks!
I was thinking that might be the case (that you might be going off the older one from the other thread).
I went ahead and added a link to that particular post to lead people over here. IrishLass
I was thinking that might be the case (that you might be going off the older one from the other thread).
IrishLass
Thanks so much for your time and patience! I had to laugh at the uho! :-?
baylee
Active Member
If one was to use a crock pot, could you mix your glycerin and lye, and then just add to your melted oils already in the crock pot? In other words, it is okay to not heat the glycerin/lye mixture before adding to the oils in the crock pot?
If you're using all glycerin as the liquid to make the soap paste as per IL's tutorial earlier in this thread ... no, you can't do what you propose. You have to heat the KOH and glycerin mixture quite hot to get the KOH flakes to dissolve. A crock pot won't get the KOH-glycerin hot enough.
Ditto what DeeAnna said. You need to bring the glycerin/KOH to a boil in order for the KOH to dissolve- otherwise the KOH will just remain in flake form.
However, you can dissolve the KOH in an appropriate amount of room temp water (which takes less than a minute), and then add your full complement of glycerin to it before pouring into your oils in the crockpot. It will change the time it takes to become paste and will also change your dilution rate, but it works that way, too.
IrishLass
However, you can dissolve the KOH in an appropriate amount of room temp water (which takes less than a minute), and then add your full complement of glycerin to it before pouring into your oils in the crockpot. It will change the time it takes to become paste and will also change your dilution rate, but it works that way, too.
IrishLass
baylee
Active Member
Thank you DeeAnna and Irish Lass!
baylee
Active Member
IrishLass, if I wanted to use just distilled water and stearic acid in my dilution, would I still only use 3% of the total weight of the paste?
Saponomancer
Professional Geek
So I was looking at this recipe! as I've most the ingredients for it, and I've experimented with LS before, I'd be using sodium acitate and sodium citrate in the place of what I dont have and seeing how that went
My question is if I dont superfat but I do want to use EO would I still need the PS80? I'm willing to get it but I cant for the life of me figure out what the usage rates of it are, poking around on google and in here, one blog suggests as much PS80 as EO but a lot of other recipes seem to use a lot less than that and there's nothing definitive that I can seem to locate.
My question is if I dont superfat but I do want to use EO would I still need the PS80? I'm willing to get it but I cant for the life of me figure out what the usage rates of it are, poking around on google and in here, one blog suggests as much PS80 as EO but a lot of other recipes seem to use a lot less than that and there's nothing definitive that I can seem to locate.
