marketing your soap- Please help

[thefarmerdaughter]

Soaptrotter, your enthusiasm for soaping and your possible business are wonderful, I wish you the best of luck for your business in the future
No matter how harsh advice may seem it would be best for you to take it not ignore it/write it off, as you have been.
have a slice of humble pie,my dear. Im afarid you arent any better than the rest of us newbies. and newbies shouldnt be sellin soap

 

[lsg]

If you are considering the sale of soap in the near future, why not try melt & pour? That will give you time to perfect a CP or HP recipe. Most of us have dreams of selling a great product, but unless you have some experience in formulating it is not feasible. You will also have to work on developing a market for your product. I suggest research and experimenting before trying to sell. Also, the recent attempt to legislate production and reporting of bath and body products has many of us worried, so keep current with that.

http://www.bellaonline.com/articles/art52891.asp

 

[soaptrotter]

Thanks cerelife for your advice, I agree I have a lot to learn. I know I have jumped ahead in my excitement, and eagerness. My family at home is very encouraging and excited and telling me 'go, go, go' and the soapers on the forum are saying, 'slow, slow, slow'. I get that I need to slow down and have expressed this to my family. My 83 year old father is building me a mould as I type on here, and he has my son helping him. I told my dad I already ordered a mould, but he still wants to make one.....I think he just likes spending time with his grandson, teaching him how to do woodwork. My dad will be eager for me to fill that mould! .....nothing like pressure ..... I will love and cherish what ever they make me. I let my significant other read the responses on here. One of them he thought was beyond hash and rather abusive, but I just take everything in, I read everything and digest, I am truly not ignoring anyone's advice, I consider what everyone everyone has to say, as I know everyone has had their own experiences.

cerelife, Thank You for saying what you did in such a kind way...my husband is already a fan of yours!!!

That sounds awesome you are developing your own recipe's! it must be exciting seeing your results!!!
Hopefully one day I will learn how to as well. For now Im just planning to use a few of my sisters recipe's. I know there's a strong and most likely possibility of my soaps are not up to standards for selling, then I also will just give them away, I still plan to put labels on them regardless of how it turns out, I personally only buy things with labels due to an allergy with my oldest.

Im still deciding whether to list...Lye, or Saponified oils of....I recently read a post exactly about that topic. Both have good reasoning behind them, so for me that one is still up for debate.

Good Luck with your new recipes cerelife......cant wait to read and see pics!!!!

 

[soaptrotter]

Thank you for the input thefarmerdaughter !

 

[soaptrotter]

Thanks lsg:
m&p is exactly what my hubby thinks I should make :wink: , as he concerned with the Lye. My father on the other hand likes the cp, its the kind of soap he remembers. I do want to make a good product, and have taken a step back to decide, and plan to do more research as you mentioned. Thank you for the Bella.com link, its got great information and has a great forum. It was an interesting read applying to FDA/USA, Im in Canada, but I find alot of times legislation in the US, make their way to Canada as well. I liked your comment "Most have dreams of selling a great product" and I want that too, I have to rein in my overflowing excitement, my dreams, my ambitions....slow.

Do you remember when you first decided to make soap? I would love to hear about your experiences. Were you ever so passionately excited, you actually dream about it at night?, yet naive all at the same time with your expectations? I would love to hear any positive anecdotes you have to share....even failures can be positive because you learn.

That is why this forum is so awesome, there are very experienced soapers and very new soapers, but everyone is always learning.

 

[lsg]

Yes, I well remember my first attempts and my first posts on some forums. I didn't realize that all recipes on the Internet and in books are not correct in figuring lye content. One of the first lessons I learned was to use a good lye calculator such as SoapCalc and to run every recipe through a lye calculator and to double check ingredients and amounts before making soap. I felt kind of crushed when my newbie enthusiasm was not shared by veteran soapmakers. I now realize that they were being kind in pointing out certain details,( safety in handling lye solutions for one.) I felt like they were criticizing me, which wasn't the case at all. I am now so grateful that they were honest in their replies. I suggest starting out making one pound batches using readily available ingredients from the supermarket. Don't use expensive butters and e.o.s for your first attempts, that way you haven't lost a lot of money if a batch fails. Above all, research and practice.

 

[soaptrotter]

Wow, thanks for sharing your experiences lsg :!: "Research and Practice" is my new mantra, love it!

 

[Maythorn]

Thank you Maythorn for the information!

Am so sorry! It seems it entered quoting and then nothing so I did it again.

Does anyone know about font sizes? I heard that below a certain size, doesn't suffice.

 

[Genny]

Does anyone know about font sizes? I heard that below a certain size, doesn't suffice.

This is directly from the FDA's site http://www.fda.gov/Cosmetics/CosmeticLa ... 4.htm#clgg

"Ingredient Declaration: Generally, in letters not less than 1/16" in height [21 CFR 701.3(b)]. If surface area available to bear label (excludes surfaces with decorative relief, sculptured surfaces) is less than 12 square inches, letter height may be not less than 1/32" [21 CFR 701.3(p)]."

 

[Lindy]

Hello Soaptrotter,

First let me say welcome to a wonderful addiction. Next let me share some facts with you for being in business in Canada as a soapmaker/cosmetic maker. Here in Canada we are governed by Health Canada and each recipe you plan on selling must be submitted to Health Canada using the Cosmetic Notification Form (http://www.hc-sc.gc.ca/cps-spc/cosmet-p ... cf-eng.php). Next you need to review and understand what the requirements are (http://www.hc-sc.gc.ca/cps-spc/cosmet-p ... ex-eng.php) as well as how your labels must appear (http://www.hc-sc.gc.ca/cps-spc/cosmet-p ... ng.php#lcp). You need to review and understand the List of Prohibited Ingredients - aka The Hot List (http://www.hc-sc.gc.ca/cps-spc/cosmet-p ... ex-eng.php). Once you go through that you will need to get insurance since if your home insurance were to find out that you are making and selling these products you would nullify your home insurance due to the liability risks inherent in what we do. You can get that through The Soap Guild as they are now offering insurance to Canadian Members (http://www.soapguild.org).

I understand that you want to go into make soap to create a business and good on you for working on a business plan. Now let's look at this logically. Is soap making rocket science? No but it is chemistry. If you were to want to change careers would you need to take the time to train in that area? Yes and it is the same with soapmaking. Do not plan on selling your 1st or even your 10th soap. You need to slow down, learn what makes a good bar of soap and then find out how it reacts over time. Just because it's good in 6 weeks doesn't mean it won't go bad within 6 months. Another reason it's important that you take the time to really learn what it is you are doing is that bar of soap represents you and your business. I have customers who still have new bars of soap from last Christmas, because I know how my soap behaves I know those soaps are just fine and it is the reason people continue to buy from me. That is called smart business and when you are going into business you need to be a smart business person, not someone out for a quick buck.

Slow down, learn what you are doing, especially in Canada because you have a lot more regulations to deal with than the US, although I would give the same advice to an American as I do a Canadian. You will do yourself a HUGE service by learning the craft.

If you have questions on how to do this in Canada I am always happy to help. Just remember I am going to strongly encourage doing this the right way and believe me there is a right way.

Cheers

 

[Maythorn]

Does anyone know about font sizes? I heard that below a certain size, doesn't suffice.

This is directly from the FDA's site http://www.fda.gov/Cosmetics/CosmeticLa ... 4.htm#clgg

"Ingredient Declaration: Generally, in letters not less than 1/16" in height [21 CFR 701.3(b)]. If surface area available to bear label (excludes surfaces with decorative relief, sculptured surfaces) is less than 12 square inches, letter height may be not less than 1/32" [21 CFR 701.3(p)]."

My eyesight isn't the best but 1/32" on a label that is 2 and 3/8 by 3" would work with Times New Roman font size 6. It doesn't have to be that font for sure, though. Thank you Genny!

 

[cerelife]

You're very welcome soaptrotter.
I completely understand your excitement, this is some fun stuff!
But please understand that folks like me (who just check out the forum from time to time) aren't really the best source of advice. I can only offer my personal experience as a fellow newbie.
The moderators like Hazel and others are the ones who monitor ALL the posts, instead of just the ones that interest them...those guys are the REAL deal and have tons of useful information! I've had my feelings hurt on this forum (not by Hazel) in the past, but I tried to keep in mind that the've most likely read about a million similar posts from newbies like me thinking of selling soap...and I'm glad I folllowed their advice. Even the soap I made a year ago isn't as good as what I made 8 weeks ago. And the soap I make tomorrow may be even better! When I feel like I can't top myself, that's when I'll start selling
Very cool that your dad is making a log mold for you with your son! My husband makes all my log molds and they are wonderful.
Enjoy the journey/addiction! Nothing puts a smile on my face like a family member or friend asking for more of my soap because it just feels sooo good on their skin!!! That's good enough for me right now

 

[new12soap]

We have all been exactly where you are, enthusiastic and ambitious and excited and inexperienced and naive. Let me put it to you another way. If you needed to have surgery, would you go to a doctor that has performed successful procedures? Or would you go to someone that has a sister that used to do a little surgery a few years ago and has read some books and looked up how to do it on the internet? How about if you needed an electrician? Or any other professional?

THERE IS NO SUBSTITUTE FOR EXPERIENCE

As everyone else has pointed out, all the market research and enthusiasm in the world will not tell you how your soaps will perform in 6 months or a year or more, only time will do that. There are NO shortcuts, no matter how much you like the feel of CP soap. There is a REASON that all of the most experieced and successful soapers and sellers on this and other forums have said "we are here to help but you are not ready" to not just you but to all newbies that are trying to run before they have even learned to crawl. Don't take it personally, as I said I think we have all been there to some extent and we all wanted to believe that we could just hit the ground running, and that is just quite simply not the way it works.

 

[soaptrotter]

Thanks new12soap,
I really enjoyed reading your post and I was nodding my head as I did.
I get it now and hope I can learn to crawl so that one day I can learn to walk, then run.

 

[ClaraSuds]

I'm a newbie soaper (4 batches total), but I'm also an experienced skin care formulator of 5 yrs. despite having an intmate knowledge of soaping ingreients from making personalised skin care, my soap is still basic and its nowhere near saleable. My formulating experience did help me create my own recipes from batch #2 and I believe it does help me learn faster than otherwise but I still have to learn soap which is a skill unto itself.

On top of that it's only now after 5yrs of making and using my own skin care that I have a true sense of how to formulate according to skin needs, feel of the product and absorption rates. I could not have gained this knowledge by reading a few books, I had to make and use the products over a long period of time constantly tweaking along the way to know how to manipulate my ingredients properly.

As a newbie it's natural to whip up a first cream or a first batch of soap and be utterly delighted with what you've created. That doesn't mean a paying customer will also be delighted. Over the years I've purchased handcrafted body products from both amateurs and professionals. I've rarely repurchased an amateur product. While I'd be happy to be gifted it from a well meaning friend I am not happy to pay for something that falls so far below my expectations of performance. Amateur products which are clearly straight out of the pages of a popular crafting book give handcrafted products a poor name. While they are fine as gifts and personal use items they aren't up to par with the expectations of a professional product and the marketplace has high expectations.

A survey asking, 'would you like to buy a handcrafted soap from me?' is useless if you haven't also provided them with a sample of your product. They have one thing in their mind but your actual product may not live up to it. They are saying yes to your concept, not your actual product and they are expecting a shop quality product with a shelf life of possibly 2 yrs. Saying soap is soap, it's all the same, you make it and sell it is incorrect. Formulation is everything. Real market research involves people who aren't your family or friends using your product and saying 'yes I would buy this for $x, please tell me where I can purchase it'.

 

[judymoody]

I love your enthusiasm, but....

It is early October and you haven't made your first batch. You want to launch in December. That is less than 2 months away. Your soap should cure for a minimum of 4-6 weeks. So this means that you will start selling your first or very early batches. Personally, I think that this is very unwise. What if the base recipe you choose is not to your liking? Perhaps it might be drying. You might not like how it lathers. What if the fragrances that you use morph into something unpleasant or fade entirely? What if your soap is not stable and begins to oxidize after a few months. Many customers don't use their soap right away. Imagine their dismay if they pull out a bar after four or six months and it is covered with orange spots and smells rancid?

I would hate for my soapmaking skills to be judged by my earliest efforts. If you are serious about starting a business, a little patience on your part will yield benefits in the long run. Six months of experimentation AT A MINIMUM would be wise; a year would be better still.

This thread may be of interest to you.

http://www.soapmakingforum.com/viewtopi ... 17&t=17621

ETA: While it's not required by law in the US to list my ingredients, I provide a full list including lye and all additives. I wouldn't buy soap that didn't include that information. I see that Lindy has already chimed in about what's required in Canada.

 

[soaptrotter]

Thanks ClaraSuds, for your input, it is very much appreciated.

I think that is fabulous you have the background you do, I'm sure it will greatly help you in determining whether your soap meets your standards to sell. You seem to have a good plan and I wish you all the luck, when you decide to sell your soaps. Thanks for sharing that, it helps to know what other people do, and how long they test before they sell.

 

[soaptrotter]

Thanks you judymoody, for the response and the link.
I have had to rethink things as I have had a lot of input as to why my original plan would be unwise. Like you mentioned, I do not want anything bad to get out there, and the longer I wait, the more experienced I will become. I have decided to make a few M&P batches first as 'Genny" suggested, and then move onto CP and as my plans change, I now plan to give myself a good long learning curve.

 

[Lindy]

Soaptrtotter - good for you. Once you're truly ready I can help you figure out the Canadian requirements to get you legal in Canada.

 

[AndreaMakesSoap]

I think listing all ingredients is the responsible thing to do. My recipe generally stays about the same, with small variances in the batches. I print my labels on my printer at home, so I just copy and paste the ingredient list and modify it according to the differences in the batches. It's not really that difficult.