First batch just finished!

[QuietWorker]

Hello all. I made a thread a couple weeks ago (here) and decided to try something out.

Sooo I decided to kinda of ignore all the suggestions and do my own thing. I probably messed something up... but I just wanted to experiment (not so smart for my first time making soap though, eh?).

I calculated all of the amounts on my own in a spreadsheet you can see pictured here (I basically took @Zany_in_CO 's Castile alternative oil percentages and ignored all of the other instructions. I did not make the faux salt water, I just used regular distilled water and lye.):

I did double check with online calculators (I'm not crazy) and the numbers seemed to match up pretty well. I think I mixed the two liquids together when they were both about 115°F. I used an immersion blender and it seemed like it went to trace very quickly... almost too quickly? It is a rather small amount, but I only had the blender on for a total of about... 3.5 mins or so? I'm hoping it wasn't a false trace (), but it was getting pretty thick so I poured it into the mold. I sprayed the top with 99% isopropyl alcohol and then covered with plastic wrap.

I probably did a ton of things wrong, but at least it was interesting lol.
@Ekuzo , @A-Polly , @ScentimentallyYours and @AliOop , I thought you might want to see the results.

Also, how do I proceed from here? When do I take the plastic off the top and when do I get to unmold them?

 

[Ekuzo]

Looks great, congratulations! I'm glad you decided to go all the way and try for yourself, you will be pleased with the result, for sure!

So, you made a bastile soap following Zany's recipe? Did you add salt and baking soda (I can't see from the spreadsheet?)

There's no rush, you can keep it covered and in the mold for a couple of days - even 3, 4... Remove the wrap the moment you take the bars out - to minimize the chance for soda ash. The water amount is kind of high for a bastile - if the high OO batter didn't have any additives, it may stay soft for a while. In case you find it soft when you unmold it, just keep it there some more. And yet, if it's hard enough to be taken out without breaking and smudged edges (even after a day, it depends on the recipe and the additives), go for it - you can feel by touch.

You probably reached trace fast because of the relatively high temperature - also, did you stick blend non stop for 3 and a half minutes, or did you just 'pulse' the blender? The former is not usually recommended, but you'll get used to it. Keep us updated!

 

[QuietWorker]

Looks great, congratulations! I'm glad you decided to go all the way and try for yourself, you will be pleased with the result, for sure!

So, you made a bastile soap following Zany's recipe? Did you add salt and baking soda (I can't see from the spreadsheet?)

There's no rush, you can keep it covered and in the mold for a couple of days - even 3, 4... Remove the wrap the moment you take the bars out - to minimize the chance for soda ash. The water amount is kind of high for a bastile - if the high OO batter didn't have any additives, it may stay soft for a while. In case you find it soft when you unmold it, just keep it there some more. And yet, if it's hard enough to be taken out without breaking and smudged edges (even after a day, it depends on the recipe and the additives), go for it - you can feel by touch.

You probably reached trace fast because of the relatively high temperature - also, did you stick blend non stop for 3 and a half minutes, or did you just 'pulse' the blender? The former is not usually recommended, but you'll get used to it. Keep us updated!

I apologize for not specifying; I did not use the faux seawater with the salt and baking soda. Just plain distilled water. I also forgot to mention that the main unit of measurement in the spreadsheet is grams (unless otherwise stated).

And thank you for the information!!! I greatly appreciate it. You've been so incredibly helpful so far.

What water amount would you use for this recipe and how would you reach that measurement? I was going to try for a smaller batch, but the measurements are already so tiny. I'm not super familiar with conceptualizing grams, so when I measured the water I was like "this is so little" lol. I was thinking I might need more!

I couldn't remember what the temperature range was and I couldn't easily check. I thought it was somewhere around 115, but you're right that it was a bit high. Besides, it takes forrreevvver for the lye water to cool down!!!

Regarding the blending, I was kind of scared so I (by chance) did it mainly in pulses of no more than like 6 seconds?

Also, for some reason it smells like... biscotti?

Thanks again for all your help!!!

 

[dmcgee5034]

I agree - leave the plastic on while they are in the mold. I leave my individual cavity mold soaps in the mold for a few days. Then I’d cover them up for almost a week once they are out of the mold. By then, you should have beaten the soap ash away.
Congrats on your soap - they look great!

 

[Ekuzo]

I apologize for not specifying; I did not use the faux seawater with the salt and baking soda. Just plain distilled water. I also forgot to mention that the main unit of measurement in the spreadsheet is grams (unless otherwise stated).

And thank you for the information!!! I greatly appreciate it. You've been so incredibly helpful so far.

What water amount would you use for this recipe and how would you reach that measurement? I was going to try for a smaller batch, but the measurements are already so tiny. I'm not super familiar with conceptualizing grams, so when I measured the water I was like "this is so little" lol. I was thinking I might need more!

I couldn't remember what the temperature range was and I couldn't easily check. I thought it was somewhere around 115, but you're right that it was a bit high. Besides, it takes forrreevvver for the lye water to cool down!!!

Regarding the blending, I was kind of scared so I (by chance) did it mainly in pulses of no more than like 6 seconds?

Also, for some reason it smells like... biscotti?

Thanks again for all your help!!!

The pleasure is mine!

With no additives and that % of water, it will definitely take some days to set up properly. You will probably be able to get it out in 2 days if you are in a rush, but it won't be that clean of an unmolding, the edges and the sides won't be that sharp looking, maybe even some of the batter will be left stuck to the mold - but again, it depends on many factors and in the end you just need to tell by touch and decide if it's ready.

520 g is perfect for starters, I've made small test batches that are even 350 g (but that way your error margins are really tiny, most people won't recommend it). I use grams all the time, I hate ounces tbh.

As for the water - I would suggest using lye concentration of 40% for this recipe, or 1:1.5 lye to water ratio - you just set it up in the calculator, or once the calculator gives you the lye needed, you can calculate the water yourself. But why bother, the online tool does everything for you once you tell it what you want. Also, I would make this recipe with lye discount of about 3-4 % usually, to add a little bit to the hardness, but since it's your first batch and it's a small one, 5% is okay.

If you don't have a thermometer you can use to check the temp, you can again rely on your touch - if you want to soap cool, the batter just needs to be warm to the touch, or around 100 Fahrenheit (36.6 or something similar in Celsius). But you don't need to be that strict here, the higher temperature will help with the soda ash and you don't need to worry about overheating that much when you use single cavity molds. Even if you soap at higher temp, it's fine, no biggie.

Yes, lye does heat up quite a bit - but that means your caustic soda is good! To make sure you don't need to wait for it to cool down that long, you can prepare it before anything else and also use a bowl or something with a little water in it, and put the pitcher inside while you make the lye solution, to help with the cooling. Some people even use ice, but I think that's overdoing it.

Oh, 6 seconds is a huge pulse! We usually pulse for less than a second, in consequential bursts. I give it 4-5 quick bursts like that, then stir with the blender, then repeat the same - until it's ready to pour. That way it may take longer to reach trace, but you'll have more control over it. But don't worry, even if you pour at medium or thick trace it's not bad, it helps a little bit with soda ash again. As long as you are able to pour, it's fine. Plus you don't have to worry about colors and swirls in this case, with a plain batch. I think for a first ever that's pretty good! I remember when I made my first batch - I soaped hot and blended like crazy, got to thick trace really quickly lol

Definitely keep us updated on the result you have once you try it. A recipe like this would need a cure of AT LEAST 3 months (or even more, because there are barely any hard fats in it) to show the qood qualities it has. And I'm sure you'll feel the slime in it. But there's nothing wrong with taking a bar after a month and testing it. As time goes by, it will only get better.

Welcome to the family - now officially!

Edit: no idea about the biscotti smell, you got me there... could it be something similar to baker's ammonia?

 

[bookworm42]

Regarding the blending, I was kind of scared so I (by chance) did it mainly in pulses of no more than like 6 seconds?

Trying to figure out trace was and still is the hardest thing for me.
I tend to soap at high temps (120F). Combo of using soy wax in my soaps and impatience waiting for the lye to cool (thanks @Ekuzo I'll have to try putting it in a bowl of water to help it cool faster). I blend in 1-5 sec pulses for maybe max of a min. That tends to get me a thin/medium trace.

 

[Ekuzo]

Trying to figure out trace was and still is the hardest thing for me.
I tend to soap at high temps (120F). Combo of using soy wax in my soaps and impatients waiting for the lye to cool (thanks @Ekuzo I'll have to try putting it in a bowl of water to help it cool faster). I blend in pulses for maybe max of a min. That tends to get me a thin/medium trace.

Yes, with waxes high temperature is a must. I use soy wax as well and then soap at around the same temperature as you, give or take - I fear that if I go lower, it will start to solidify. I also pour at mostly thin, to sometimes medium trace (as long as I don't use something that gives me bad acceleration, like a naughty fragrance oil). If that's the case, you can get to very thick trace really fast. It still works, but the soap doesn't look that pretty and you can't use single cavity molds with images, because they won't leave an impression in the thick batter.

For everyone that may find it useful, here's an article with detailed explanation about the different stages of trace, with pictures:

http://www.soapqueen.com/bath-and-body-tutorials/tips-and-tricks/trace/

 

[QuietWorker]

@Ekuzo thanks again for your helpful comments!

I'm only about 18 hours after pouring it into the mold and they are pretty dang hard already. I can leave an imprint if I press hard, but they seem pretty solid, actually. At least the tops.

Thanks for the info about the water amount. How do you know to make the lye concentration 40%? Just experience?

Luckily I have one of those laser thermometer things that seems accurate enough! Useful for cooking, too!

That's actually a great idea with the water bath!!! So smart! And I was thinking next time I might just make a batch and store it in a glass mason jar. Would that be okay? I've heard different things about using all of the ingredients (lye water and oil) at room temperature. But if it's possible and appropriate, I think that's what I'd want to do next time. I've also heard people make the solution at 50%--I guess so that they can dilute it to their desired needs when making the recipe?

Ahhh, okay!!! I was going crazy with the pulses then, hahaha. Well noted, and thank you for correcting me! Also, looking at your pictures from below, I think I was only between a light and medium trace. So not too bad! Furthermore, is soda ash just a cosmetic thing that people try to avoid? Or is it an actual problem?

I'll be sure to keep you updated and I am excited to see how it turns out. Maybe I'll like the slime, haha. I was hoping it would be sooner than three months, though!!! . Do you have a similar recipe that will harden sooner? I guess I could try the faux seawater recipe and see how that goes. The problem is that I didn't want to use too much coconut oil because of my sensitive skin. Maybe I could try using Lard or something? I know someone suggested that in the other thread. I'm just impatient and want to use it now!!!

Also, it definitely didn't have an ammonia smell. I don't know what it was either, but I noticed it as soon as I started blending the oil and lye water together. It was a sweet and cookie-like aroma.

 

[bookworm42]

How do you know to make the lye concentration 40%?

Most people have different preferences/experiences for this. I use 33%. All just depends on what you like and how fast you want trace. Lower concentrations trace slower.

I was thinking next time I might just make a batch and store it in a glass mason jar.

Be careful with glass as after awhile the lye slowly eats away at it and causes the glass to explode. Recommended is plastic. I use glass (plan to get plastic but don't have it yet, newbie myself) but when mixing I put it in the kitchen sink just in case.

I've also heard people make the solution at 50%--I guess so that they can dilute it to their desired needs when making the recipe?

Yes but also some people soap that concentration.

soda ash just a cosmetic thing that people try to avoid? Or is it an actual problem?

Purely cosmetic.

You can try the soap at 3-4 weeks if you want (The waiting is always the hard bit, it kills me). Just know that the longer the cure the better the soap.

 

[Servant4Christ]

I can never wait until full cure before trying my soaps, so I usually try out an end piece with gloves on just to see the lather and this is enough to appease me.

 

[AliOop]

I was thinking next time I might just make a batch and store it in a glass mason jar. Would that be okay?

PLEASE DON'T DO THIS! I am sorry for shouting, but lye solution should never be stored in an easily-breakable container. Glass is particularly dangerous because, as @bookworm42 noted, the lye solution will etch the glass so that it will eventually crack, or shatter, or both.

Question: What's worse than a caustic lye spill?

Answer: A caustic lye spill with glass shards throughout!

You may see some YouTube soapers using glass Pyrex measuring cups for mixing their lye solution, or their soap batter, but please be aware that doing so directly contradicts the safety recommendations from the manufacturer. There are so many other options for safe storage of premade lye solutions, including recycled laundry detergent containers, and #5 plastic containers with tight lids that can be purchased from the Dollar Store, or a thrift store.

 

[QuietWorker]

PLEASE DON'T DO THIS! I am sorry for shouting, but lye solution should never be stored in an easily-breakable container. Glass is particularly dangerous because, as @bookworm42 noted, the lye solution will etch the glass so that it will eventually crack, or shatter, or both.

Question: What's worse than a caustic lye spill?

Answer: A caustic lye spill with glass shards throughout!

You may see some YouTube soapers using glass Pyrex measuring cups for mixing their lye solution, or their soap batter, but please be aware that doing so directly contradicts the safety recommendations from the manufacturer. There are so many other options for safe storage of premade lye solutions, including recycled laundry detergent containers, and #5 plastic containers with tight lids that can be purchased from the Dollar Store, or a thrift store.

Noted, and thank you! I just assumed glass was non-reactive with everything lol. I think borosilicate and quartz glass is better, but I'll just avoid glass altogether. I think I have like a #2 (HDPE) bottle I can store it in instead (not make it in, just store, because I think #5 is better for heat, right?)!

 

[AliOop]

Noted, and thank you! I just assumed glass was non-reactive with everything lol. I think borosilicate and quartz glass is better, but I'll just avoid glass altogether. I think I have like a #2 (HDPE) bottle I can store it in instead (not make it in, just store, because I think #5 is better for heat, right?)!

Yes, borosilicate glass is better than "regular" glass, but it can still shatter if knocked over, dropped, etc. Labs that use borosilicate glass containers with hot caustic liquids (e.g. fresh lye solution) still replace them frequently because that does weaken them over time. Stainless steel is great for mixing and storing.

 

[Relle]

Stainless steel is great for mixing and storing.

Don't forget there are different grades of SS. I first used a bamix stick blender and it went black, then bought a cheap one and it was fine. So not all are the same.

 

[QuietWorker]

Don't forget there are different grades of SS. I first used a bamix stick blender and it went black, then bought a cheap one and it was fine. So not all are the same.

Wow, good thing to look out for!!!

Yes, borosilicate glass is better than "regular" glass, but it can still shatter if knocked over, dropped, etc. Labs that use borosilicate glass containers with hot caustic liquids (e.g. fresh lye solution) still replace them frequently because that does weaken them over time. Stainless steel is great for mixing and storing.

Thanks again for the info! Also, I saw you made some of Zany's no-slime soap. I was wondering: would I be able to pre-make the lye and faux seawater? Meaning, can I react the faux seawater and the lye and then let it cool down and then store it for at least a few days before I use it?

 

[AliOop]

Wow, good thing to look out for!!!


Thanks again for the info! Also, I saw you made some of Zany's no-slime soap. I was wondering: would I be able to pre-make the lye and faux seawater? Meaning, can I react the faux seawater and the lye and then let it cool down and then store it for at least a few days before I use it?

You could, but I found it easier to dissolve the two ingredients (baking soda and sea salt) in a bit of additional water. I worked out the percentages for that over on this thread.

 

[Servant4Christ]

You could, but I found it easier to dissolve the two ingredients (baking soda and sea salt) in a bit of additional water. I worked out the percentages for that over on this thread.

I use your percentages every time I make ZNSC now because of the aloe gel I add. I literally calculate how much of the salt and soda to add based on the total liquid and dissolve in the water portion only before tossing in my frozen aloe cubes that make up the rest of the total liquid before adding my lye. Works like a charm.

 

[AliOop]

I use your percentages every time I make ZNSC now because of the aloe gel I add. I literally calculate how much of the salt and soda to add based on the total liquid and dissolve in the water portion only before tossing in my frozen aloe cubes that make up the rest of the total liquid before adding my lye. Works like a charm.

That's awesome, so glad it works for you!

 

[QuietWorker]

You could, but I found it easier to dissolve the two ingredients (baking soda and sea salt) in a bit of additional water. I worked out the percentages for that over on this thread.

Interesting calculation, thank you for sharing. I wish everyone would just use a single weight measurement (preferably grams) for everything. I did my own calculations are found that per 100g of water you add ~1.56g of both sea salt and baking soda. But I realize those things are all different densities so your idea might be better. I also assumed one quart of water is equal to 946.35g, not your 907g. I'm probably missing something lol.

 

[Ekuzo]

@Ekuzo thanks again for your helpful comments!

I'm only about 18 hours after pouring it into the mold and they are pretty dang hard already. I can leave an imprint if I press hard, but they seem pretty solid, actually. At least the tops.

Thanks for the info about the water amount. How do you know to make the lye concentration 40%? Just experience?

Luckily I have one of those laser thermometer things that seems accurate enough! Useful for cooking, too!

That's actually a great idea with the water bath!!! So smart! And I was thinking next time I might just make a batch and store it in a glass mason jar. Would that be okay? I've heard different things about using all of the ingredients (lye water and oil) at room temperature. But if it's possible and appropriate, I think that's what I'd want to do next time. I've also heard people make the solution at 50%--I guess so that they can dilute it to their desired needs when making the recipe?

Ahhh, okay!!! I was going crazy with the pulses then, hahaha. Well noted, and thank you for correcting me! Also, looking at your pictures from below, I think I was only between a light and medium trace. So not too bad! Furthermore, is soda ash just a cosmetic thing that people try to avoid? Or is it an actual problem?

I'll be sure to keep you updated and I am excited to see how it turns out. Maybe I'll like the slime, haha. I was hoping it would be sooner than three months, though!!! . Do you have a similar recipe that will harden sooner? I guess I could try the faux seawater recipe and see how that goes. The problem is that I didn't want to use too much coconut oil because of my sensitive skin. Maybe I could try using Lard or something? I know someone suggested that in the other thread. I'm just impatient and want to use it now!!!

Also, it definitely didn't have an ammonia smell. I don't know what it was either, but I noticed it as soon as I started blending the oil and lye water together. It was a sweet and cookie-like aroma.

If the bars feel hard enough, it's your call whether or not to get them out now or wait longer. You can try unmolding 1 bar and if you're not satisfied with the result, you can wait for the rest some more. If you decide to unmold now, you can do so with gloves (as it can still be caustic and it's not okay for your recovering skin). Did the flakes on your fingers heal already btw?

The good thing here is that even if you decide to wait longer, that won't be a problem. Even if you decide to unmold after a week for some reason, the bars will pop right out with no issue and you would only miss a couple of days worth of curing. Now, if that was a loaf mold and you had to cut it ‐ it's a way different story.

About the lye concentration - I make all my recipes with 40%. But the reason I suggested it is because that concentration is usually used for recipes high in liquid oils, like castile/bastile, to compensate for the liquid content. It's a common water discount and people rarely go above that.

Oooh you'll see how useful the laser thermometer is - not that you can't go without it, but it's a plus, especially in the beginning of your soaping adventure.

There's nothing wrong with soaping at room temperature, as long as you have the right conditions. As long as it's hot and all fats are liquid, it's all good.

Soda ash is just cosmetic, like bookworm42 said. Some people pull their hair out thinking of ways to avoid or fix it, but if you don't care much, you'll soon stop noticing it. Depending on the color of the soap it may or may not be that visible, on white soap it doesn't look bad at all.

About the sweet scent ‐ did you notice if that was only coming from the mixed batter, or can you smell it from one of the separate oils? Can you check them and say if any of them smell like what you experienced when you made the soap?

About a recipe that gets harder sooner ‐ you have options, as many as you want ‐ but here are 3 of them:

‐You can follow the recipe as it is, with the salt and baking soda, the 0% SF and everything ‐ as I mentioned in the other thread, I haven't tried it, but people say it works really well

‐If you don't want to add so many things and you are afraid of going 0% SF, you can make a 70% OO and 30% CO and that will give you some great and balanced soap ‐ and it's possible that with so much OO you won't even notice the 30% coconut ‐ it that was the reason for your skin problem in the first place ‐ any soap high in OO can be good for sensitive skin if properly made

-If you still have doubts about using that much CO, split the 30% hard fats in the recipe between 15% CO and 15% lard or palm oil, and you'll have another great soap.

No matter what you decide to try, don't hesitate to ask for advice, there are plenty of us (myself included) willing to help, as you can see