Beginner's Question

[Michael Faulds]

What are the advantages of the different oils used in CP soap making? For example what is the difference between using a higher volume of Coconut Oil as opposed to using more Palm Oil, or going completely one way or the other?

I have also been using Vegetable Shortening, does this have benefits one way or the other? Everything I'm doing has been working but I would like to know more about the different core ingredients and what they do. I have also been using shea or cocoa butter and castor oil.

Thanks for any help in advance

 

[Candybee]

Each soap oil and butter has its benefits or conditioning values such as creamy lather, sudsy lather, cleansing, hardness, iodine, etc. To learn more start off reading up on your soap oils at places like soapcalc. If you play around with soapcalc you can see how the arrangement of oils and the amount used in recipes effects the conditioning values of the finished soap.

Also, places like Brambleberry, MMS (Mountain Magestic Sage), Summer Bee Meadow all have soap calculators you can play with and info on the different oils and butters. This should get you started.

 

[bodhi]

IMO coconut is good for bubbles, among other things and palm is bad for orangutans. The possible combinations of oils are so very endless that your best bet is to start googling any ingredient you want to use, learn as much as you can about it and then start experimenting.

There are a few sites that go into properties of some oils as well as some calculators but researching them all for yourself is probably what you want to do, especially since you are considering marketing an organic product. This forum has a good search function too.

 

[bodhi]

Each soap oil and butter has its benefits or conditioning values such as creamy lather, sudsy lather, cleansing, hardness, iodine, etc. To learn more start off reading up on your soap oils at places like soapcalc. If you play around with soapcalc you can see how the arrangement of oils and the amount used in recipes effects the conditioning values of the finished soap.

I agree, but sometimes despite the numbers calculators lie. :shock:

Edit: corrected

 

[AngelMomma]

https://summerbeemeadow.com/content/properties-soapmaking-oils

I really enjoyed this info when I first started soaping......and sometimes I read through things like this again as a refresher.

 

[Kay]

I found a couple of helpful websites that give info in each oil and their properties. I'll share them with you.

http://www.chagrinvalleysoapandsalve.com/ingredients/baseoils.aspx

http://www.aromagregory.com/blog/carrier-oils/

Here is what the later says about Vegetable Shortening:

"Vegetable shortening is normally made out of soybean oil. It is cheap, readily available and produces a mild, stable lather. Use it in combination with other exotic or moisturizing oils. Use this as half of your fats to keep costs down. It is a good filler. It makes a very hard white bar when used alone or when mixed with other oils. Use vegetable shortening as a base oil or combine it with other, harder oils for better results. Recommend use as base up to 50% of total oils."

 

[Kay]

I see you are a shea & cocoa kind of person also. From what I've read both of those can leave a greasy feeling. Mango or Kokum Butter are two alternatives to those that absorb into the skin more readily.

 

[Candybee]

I agree, but sometimes despite the numbers sometimes lie. :shock:

True. But I think of them as good indicators of what I want in my soap and for most of the time they are effective.

In any event you still want to use a reliable calculator like soapcalc for figuring lye and liquid.

Plus, I think a good soaper should be able to calculate on their own how much lye and liquid they need to make a batch of soap. Computors can crash and if you have to do it on your own can you? If you answered "NO" you should learn how.

 

[AngelMomma]

I would never use canola oil in a soap recipe at a higher % than 10%-15% to help prevent DOS. And I love the hardness that Shea and Cocoa butter add to a recipe, but never find those soaps to be greasy unless the SF is higher than necessary. Sorry to disagree but that is my experience.

soapcalc.net is awesome by the way......along with other soap calculators out there it is a great way to be sure that your recipe is on point. If you print out the recipe you can make notes along the way and improve as you go.

 

[AngelMomma]

There is nothing worse than going to get soap out of storage and finding it with orange icky DOS spots. I want my soap to last, last and last! So use fresh oils in a combination that won't go bad over time in storage.

 

[chicklet]

The summerbee site has a lot of good info. The others probably do too - there are several sites that discuss properties of oils. When I first started soaping I printed off info from a site and put it in my soap notebook to refer to until I had experimented more.

The following statements are just my opinion - everybody's got one, ya know. I like a small percentage of shea in soap - like 10% or less - and have never found it to be greasy feeling. I've not used cocoa butter in soap but I imagine it works pretty much the same as shea. Shea butter adds to the conditioning factor. I'm sure some of the other butters are nice but they're just too expensive for me to use in a wash off product. I avoid sunflower oil because it can go rancid quickly and cause DOS if used in high amounts. I used either 17% or 19% (been a while, I forget exactly) in soap once and got DOS - my only case. High oleic sunflower oil is supposed to be better and not go rancid as fast so I may try that someday. I am not opposed to animal products and I get great results from both tallow and lard - they make very conditioning and hard bars of soap. I put castor oil in every batch for the lather. I keep it under 10% in bath soap but have gone as high as 24% in shampoo bars and have never had soft or sticky bars as some have reported. The lather in those shampoo bars is awesome. Coconut oil in soap can strip the oils from your skin (high cleansing, some would call it drying) in higher amounts so if I use a lot of coconut oil I increase the SF %. I make salt soap that is 100% coconut oil so I SF it at 20%. In bath soap I keep the coconut oil around 20% of the recipe. Coconut oil also increases lather.

Soap calculators are your friend. Don't just use them to see how much lye you should use - if you read about the properties you will learn a lot.

 

[DeeAnna]

It is easy at first to confuse the properties of the OIL with the properties of the SOAP made from that oil. They can be two quite different things. Coconut OIL is very good for skin and hair. Too much coconut oil SOAP in a bar can be harsh and drying. AngelMomma's suggestions are worth heeding.

 

[Kay]

The following statements are just my opinion - everybody's got one, ya know. I like a small percentage of shea in soap - like 10% or less - and have never found it to be greasy feeling. I've not used cocoa butter in soap but I imagine it works pretty much the same as shea.

From everything I've ever googled, everyone seems to think they are greasy. Is it because you are using them in a soap that leaves them NOT feeling greasy? Or is it the fact that you are using organic shea? I'd like more info on this please.:?:

 

[shunt2011]

I use shea in almost all my soap and have never had it feel greasy. However if you use it in body butters it is a bit greasy but my skin loves it.

 

[kazmi]

Everyone has preferences so the best thing to do is read up at the links provided. Pick one or two oils/butters based on what you are looking for in your soap and give them a try. You'll never know for sure of whether you'll like it until you try it for yourself. You can always plug them into one of the calculators and post the results here. Everyone would be happy to review it.

 

[Hazel]

. I'm sure some of the other butters are nice but they're just too expensive for me to use in a wash off product.

I agree with chicklet. I have a couple of recipes in which I use 5% shea which are very nice. However, I still prefer butters for leave on products. This is just my preference.

. I avoid sunflower oil because it can go rancid quickly and cause DOS if used in high amounts. I used either 17% or 19% (been a while, I forget exactly) in soap once and got DOS - my only case. High oleic sunflower oil is supposed to be better and not go rancid as fast so I may try that someday.

I have used regular sunflower oil and didn't have DOS but I only used it at 10%. I love high oleic sunflower oil and I use it between 10% to 15% to replace some of the olive oil and at 20% in salt bars. It's more stable than regular sunflower and helps boost conditioning. It's cheaper than olive and even the organic HOSO is cheaper than olive. I buy it from Columbus Foods - soaperschoice.com

 

[Ann Marie]

would coconut (30%) be good for a face soap for people with oily skin? And for those of you who have soaped for a long time how do you feel about vegatable oil in soap (crisco) since I rarely see it in igredients from many of the soapers? thanks!

 

[Hazel]

My first thought was 30% wouldn't be good for oily skin because it would be too stripping and only cause the sebaceous glands to produce more oil to return the skin to "normal". However, it could be one of those things you might have to experiment with to see what percentage works for people. Some people might love 30% CO and others might find it too drying.

I used to use Crisco when I first started making CP. I didn't want to buy a lot of oils and then find out I didn't like making soap. It works fine in soap and it's very conditioning. Crisco was originally created for soapmaking but I don't know how they realized it would work as shortening. I think people who sell their soap don't use it because of how it looks as an ingredient. I don't use it now but that doesn't mean I won't use it again in the future.

 

[Ann Marie]

Thank you, Hazel, that is so helpful. I had bought some grapeseed oil a while back but then came across a comment that it can spoil quickly in soap. Just wondering if that is so, and if it is even worth using?

 

[tryanything]

As someone mentioned, the oil properties themselves are different from how they act in soap. However, it's still good info. On Swift's blog there are lists of carrier and exotic oil properties in the right hand column under free download PDFs. You have to scroll down a bit. You can also check your library for soaping books. I have the Soapmaker's Companion and Soap Naturally and both books list what the different oils bring to soap.

http://swiftcraftymonkey.blogspot.com/