Why did my soap make my skin dry?

[HomeBrew]

This has been my problem on and on. Today I showered with lemongrass peppermint soap that had been cured for 4 weeks. I was expecting my skin would be softer and milder after shower but it doesn't. I have Palm Oil for 30%, Oil Oil Pomace 30%, Coconut Oil 25% and Cocoa Butter 15%. The Lye is 71 gr, and water is 190 gr. Weight of oil is 500 gr. I added 10 gr of Lemongrass EO and 10gr of Peppermint EO. It didn't feel smooth afterall. If, let say, I reduce the amount of Coconut Oil, will it help to soften my skin? or do I need longer time to cure? I really want my soap to be very gentle to skin like The Body Shop soaps.. or Lush.. any idea?

Thanks

 

[TJ]

You can try using less coconut oil, or you can try increasing your superfat percentage.

 

[turbo]

add castor oil at 5%.


Mike

 

[Hazel]

This has been my problem on and on. Today I showered with lemongrass peppermint soap that had been cured for 4 weeks. I was expecting my skin would be softer and milder after shower but it doesn't. I have Palm Oil for 30%, Oil Oil Pomace 30%, Coconut Oil 25% and Cocoa Butter 15%. The Lye is 71 gr, and water is 190 gr. Weight of oil is 500 gr. I added 10 gr of Lemongrass EO and 10gr of Peppermint EO. It didn't feel smooth afterall. If, let say, I reduce the amount of Coconut Oil, will it help to soften my skin? or do I need longer time to cure? I really want my soap to be very gentle to skin like The Body Shop soaps.. or Lush.. any idea?

Thanks

Is it possible you're allergic or very sensitive to coconut oil? Some people are and find that CO irritates their skin.

Are you sure the weights of your oils, water and lye are accurate? If the scale you're using isn't calibrated correctly, it can really mess up your batch.

Also, what superfat did you use? Both TJ and turbo gave good suggestions - increase the superfat and add castor. If you have castor, I'd suggest trying the recipe below with a 7% superfat.

45% Olive
25% Palm
20% Coconut
5% Cocoa butter
5% Castor

This will increase the conditioning quality of the soap.

If you don't have castor, you could try this recipe with a 7% SF.

50% Olive
25% Palm
20% Coconut
5% Cocoa butter

BTW, Lush's soaps are really just a melt and pour base with additives.

HTH

 

[HomeBrew]

Thanks for the responses.

I really need to ask this stupid question so please mercy me. About adding superfat. When do you actually adding superfat? is it added at trace? what is superfat? what kind of superfat do you usually have? if you have lye discount let say 7%, will that mean, we need to add more oil for 7% from the whole amount of oil?

Thanks again in advance.

 

[Lindy]

Superfat is adding more oil than what the lye is going to use up in the transformation. With your lye calculator you have the ability to say how much of a superfat you want. You should have a minimum of 5% (5% more oil than needed so it remains free-floating in the soap). If you're not superfatting your soap that would also explain the drying effect. The oils are all added before your lye...

 

[HomeBrew]

from soapcalc, I usually add 5% of superfat without really knowing what it mean, or how to superfat. will that be the same with lye discount then? if I already had 5% lye discount, is that mean, I already had superfat for 5% without needing to add another 5% of oil at trace? CMIIW

thanks

so, Lush is M&P soap? wow....

 

[lovelysuds]

What i did when i began (before i ever even made a batch) is put in some SERIOUS hours of studying. I mean everything from oil properties, to seizing, crayons :shock: , what soaps shouldnt be insulated. Youll feel more comfortable probably. I myself like Lard, OO, 20%CO, Castor. Thats just me though! Youll find what you love and dislike, it just takes time. Maybe try playing on SoapCalc, nothings written in stone but it help build a recipe easier. Good luck!

 

[busymakinsoap!]

from soapcalc, I usually add 5% of superfat without really knowing what it mean, or how to superfat. will that be the same with lye discount then? if I already had 5% lye discount, is that mean, I already had superfat for 5% without needing to add another 5% of oil at trace? CMIIW

thanks

so, Lush is M&P soap? wow....

Superfat is a discounted amount of lye added to your batch. You dont need to add any extra oils. You just change the percentage on soapcalc and it will work out quantity of lye needed to create that percentage of superfat.
Soapcalc will not, however, tell you how this added superfat effects your finished bar.

I have dry skin and find 5% superfatted bars to be too drying. I have upped my superfat to 7% and dont find them drying - but still need to moisturise.

You could also play around with soapcalc until the conditioning properties of the bar are high.

I believe The Body Shop soap is melt and pour also

 

[cp chick]

Most people will recommend that coconut be not more than 25% and palm @ 20%. I've also seen suggested that the combination of the two shouldn't be more than 30%. I made a batch in late April that was 37% PKO and 21% CO with a 6.5% SF, and although it was drying at first, it has gotten much better as it ages. We are currently using it in our shower and I don't need to apply any moisturizer. As hard as it may be to do, put the batch aside and give it another 4 or 5 weeks.

 

[carebear]

Soap is not a moisturizer. At best it would remove no oils (tho at this point it wouldn't be doing it's job), but it's not going to deposit moisturizer on your skin. Some synthetic products, or combination products can, but soaps the way we formulate them cannot.

The recommendation of a max amount of any particular oil isn't based on fact. You can balance oils and the level of superfat (or lye discount). My 75% coconut oil isn't drying.

Technically superfat is adding excess oil, but the way it's generally calculated (with the exception of those who add oils after the cook in HP soaping) is called a "lye discount". This means we add a bit less lye than is necessary to saponify all the oils in the formula - leaving that excess oil in the mix. Either way, the resulting product is less cleansing (and thus less drying) because the soap has oils incorporated in it which "use up" it's ability to bind with oils in your skin and wash them away.

ETA: many find Lush soaps to be drying

 

[Hazel]

Most people will recommend that coconut be not more than 25% and palm @ 20%. I've also seen suggested that the combination of the two shouldn't be more than 30%. I made a batch in late April that was 37% PKO and 21% CO with a 6.5% SF, and although it was drying at first, it has gotten much better as it ages. We are currently using it in our shower and I don't need to apply any moisturizer. As hard as it may be to do, put the batch aside and give it another 4 or 5 weeks.

Did you use PKO or PO in your bar? Because PKO and CO have almost identical properties.

CO
Hardness 79
Cleansing 67
Conditioning 10
Bubbly 67

PKO
Hardness 75
Cleansing 65
Conditioning 18
Bubbly 65

If you did combine PKO and CO together, I'm not surprised it would be drying. However, I made a kitchen bar with a high PKO/CO combination and it was extremely drying at first. After a few months, it mellowed and is very nice. My nephew likes to use it to clean his hands and he said it's better than the commercial cleansers he has used.

 

[savondebilal]

Carebear nailed it on the head!

Too many people have unrealistic expectations from a bar of soap. Most people don't know whats soap is, and what it's purpose is. Moisturizer and soap are literal opposites... one is putting oil on your skin, the other is taking oils off.

If your soap is 'too cleansing' - it will take too many oils off your skin, and leave you feeling uber dry. If your soap is superfatted beyond reasonable means, it wont cleanse enough - leave too many oils on your skin, allowing your pores to become clogged. Being in between the two at a happy medium - is in my opinion, the best!

 

[saltydog]

What i did when i began (before i ever even made a batch) is put in some SERIOUS hours of studying. I mean everything from oil properties, to seizing, crayons :shock: , what soaps shouldnt be insulated. Youll feel more comfortable probably. I myself like Lard, OO, 20%CO, Castor. Thats just me though! Youll find what you love and dislike, it just takes time. Maybe try playing on SoapCalc, nothings written in stone but it help build a recipe easier. Good luck!

Me too! Six months of studying before trying my first batch

 

[Bubbles Galore]

Try making soap without essential oils or fragrance to begin with. Essential oils can be drying or irritating too.

 

[HomeBrew]

Wow, thank you all. I perhaps need to do my homework and read more materials about this matter. The thing is, I like sort of learning by doing. I have studied about this soapmaking before I made my first batch only about a month. I did join a basic soapmaking course for a short day, and I just couldn't wait to make my own batch. surprisingly, my first batch wasn't too bad, because I added shea butter in it. since it is very hard to find shea butter in my country, I changed my recipe and trying to use the one up there. I think I need to play more in the soapcalc and try to reduce my Palm Oil and Coconut Oil and see what's gonna happen. So glad to find this forum with so many experience soapmaker here. I cannot wait for the weekend to make my new batch! I am going to try using CO 15%, PO 20%, OO 30%, Grapeseed Oil 20%, Castor 5% and Cocoa Butter 10% and will not insulate much, and try the FO instead of EO.
wish me luck

 

[Hazel]

Good luck! Please let us know how it turns out.

 

[saltydog]

I don't mean to hijack the thread, but my question is along the same lines..my first two batches, I'm sure I used too much CO & PO's. The first batch for example:

OO 37.5%
CO 31.25
PO 25
Castor 6.25
So the CO + PO = 56.25% (with only a 5% SF)

Should the combined CO&PO # be kept under 50?
And also, if I let these first soaps cure longer, with that help them to be less drying?
Thank you

 

[carebear]

There is no such thing as too much of any particular oil or combination of oils. There IS such a thing as balance.

IMO, your oil level isn't too high but rather your lye discount is too low.

And yes, a longer cure will help, but only to a point.

 

[saltydog]

There is no such thing as too much of any particular oil or combination of oils. There IS such a thing as balance.

IMO, your oil level isn't too high but rather your lye discount is too low.

And yes, a longer cure will help, but only to a point.

Ok, thank you very much for the input, I think I understand about the lye discounting. You're saying this would have been a better balance with a higher percent superfat because of the amounts of CO & PO's?