What soapy thing have you done today?

[Rune]

They said something very interesting on the TV just now. I had to jump up and listen. Some young people from the northermost of this country made soap, and they used reindeer fat!

Reindeer fat, wow! What a coincidence, just when I'm looking for other fats to replace my vegetable lard. Of course I easily can get reindeer fat here. My neighbour can most probably get it for me, since he occationally work with reindeer farmin (he is one of the sami indigenous people). I have never thought of that fat at all, and I would never had if it wasn't for the TV.

I am about 30% or so of sami origin. So I do like everything from the sami culture. And reindeer is the most sami one can imagine.

And, the farming of reindeer is eco, cruelty-free, they are free-roaming and not medicated in any way. I can't think of anything more sustainable than reindeer farming. They are treated very well. No farmed animals have it better than the reindeers of the sami people, I'm quite sure about that.

The negative is that reindeer fat might have a smell to it. I don't know before I try. So we'll see.

 

[SeattleMartin]

They said something very interesting on the TV just now. I had to jump up and listen. Some young people from the northermost of this country made soap, and they used reindeer fat!

Reindeer fat, wow! What a coincidence, just when I'm looking for other fats to replace my vegetable lard. Of course I easily can get reindeer fat here. My neighbour can most probably get it for me, since he occationally work with reindeer farmin (he is one of the sami indigenous people). I have never thought of that fat at all, and I would never had if it wasn't for the TV.

I am about 30% or so of sami origin. So I do like everything from the sami culture. And reindeer is the most sami one can imagine.

And, the farming of reindeer is eco, cruelty-free, they are free-roaming and not medicated in any way. I can't think of anything more sustainable than reindeer farming. They are treated very well. No farmed animals have it better than the reindeers of the sami people, I'm quite sure about that.

The negative is that reindeer fat might have a smell to it. I don't know before I try. So we'll see.

If I get around to trying the deer tallow I rendered before you get reindeer fat, I will let you know how this stuff works out.

 

[Zany_in_CO]

That’s EXACTLY why I started making soap as well.

Um, I started soaping cuz it keeps me sane and it's cheaper than therapy.

 

[Rune]

Yes, please do @SeattleMartin I just now wrote a message on Facebook to my neighbour, asking for reindeer tallow. Yes, I guess tallow is the right word, and not fat. It is nothing less confusing in norwegian than english, we have smult, ister, spekk, talg and probably even more, and I don't know the difference between them

 

[Marilyn Norgart]

Thats an interesting soap holder, how do you get the soap out?

you pull the rings out before it starts to harden--I watched a video on this and wanna try it

 

[Meena]

Yes, please do @SeattleMartin I just now wrote a message on Facebook to my neighbour, asking for reindeer tallow. Yes, I guess tallow is the right word, and not fat. It is nothing less confusing in norwegian than english, we have smult, ister, spekk, talg and probably even more, and I don't know the difference between them

In English, the fat of all animals except pig/hog/porcine is called tallow, whereas pig fat is called lard.

Reindeer is not listed in SoapCalc, and I could not find an SAP value on line (although I only spent a minute looking). Reindeer are not so common; not many countries are blessed to have these elegant animals. However, I'm "fairly sure" that you could use the SAP value for "plain" deer tallow and be close enough. I don't think you need to wait to hear how Seattle's soap turns out. If it were me, I would go ahead with the deer tallow setting on the lye calculator you use.

As for concerns about any smell, first make sure it has been cleaned very well. This issue comes up with lard, that some can smell it in the cured soap and others cannot. There is a great variety of noses and senses of smell. These smells can be masked with a complementary scent -- something that would combine well with an animal-type odor and overtake it (a cedar or pine, etc., for example) rather than contrast and "sit on top of it" (like a floral, for example) -- but the first line of defense is to start with a very clean tallow. I will tell you that I cannot smell the organic beef tallow that I use, even before my soap has cured. Lastly, this is an issue that is more likely to arise in an 80 - 100% animal soap, so I don't think you will have any smell problem at, say, 40% or less.

Since you do not have the exact SAP value yet, I would superfat between 4 and 5% to allow for any possible difference, which should be plenty enough to ensure your soap is not lye heavy. Conversely, the other possibility is that the final SF will be above the 4-5% you set it to be, but that will not be a problem... A little wasteful, only, but eventually you might be able to find a direct SAP value for reindeer tallow and clear that up.

Zap doesn't so much taste as feel. Have you ever put your tongue on the terminal of a 9V battery? It is a shocky feeling, much like the word zap itself. Those strips are said to not be reliable for soap. If you buy some, there is a specific procedure for using them for lye-testing soap. You could search for it on this forum, as I don't recall all of the steps. Most people say the zap test is preferable to the strips.

I hope this helps!

@Dawni Thank you! I had no idea about that. I will remove the kaolin clay next time, and hopefully the soap behaves a little better.

Just to throw a wrench in the works, Kaolin clay does not have that effect for me. Maybe it depends on the color, though. The green and pink clays (there is another, also) absorb more oil on the skin, which is why I use the white kaolin, and perhaps would have a small effect in the soap batter also. The white is the least oil-absorbing on the skin. However, at the usage rate of the clays in the soap batter, I wouldn't expect it to cause the level of thickening you're experiencing. My theory is that some of your additives are compounding each other by duplicating affects, which is why I suggested scrapping them all and adding back one at a time until you identify your culprit.

I am lazy tonight about looking things up; and short of time, as well. HTH

 

[Rune]

Thank you @Meena for all the great advices. And yes, it helps a lot!

Okey, now I understand, lard from pig and the rest is tallow. Very easy.

I have watched videos on Youtube about rendering lard. To get a non-smelly and snow white color, it had to be rendered at a very low temperature. I guess the same applies for tallow, so that is what I will do. Plus clean it very well, as you say.

I did notice something strange, and that has to be masking vs sit-on-top-of-it scents. I can smell a soapy smell from most of my soaps. But not from one of them. Not at all, only the scent itself. And that scent is very different from the others, it is called Moroccan Escape and is from Eroma in Australia. It was a horrible smell at first, very overpowering and yes, horrible. But it changed dramatically by curing. Now it is just wonderful. The thing is that it has a fresh type of note in there, which was way too strong in the beginning. It is eucalyptus. And that eucalyptus mask the scent of soap.

My other soaps have more mild and not sharp scents, except from a horrible floral scented soap I have. But they do smell strongly of soap. Not masked at all.

I have a big bottle of Moroccan Escape, since I bought it on sale (it was discontinued). Now I have learned that the soap needs a long cure and it will change from upright horrible to really wonderful, and mask things completely. So that is the one I will use if I can detect a smell from the tallow after the soap has cured. So I guess I will have to test first with a sit-on-top scent. I think I have some other masking type of scents. If not I can find a use for my cedarwood essential oil. Mix it in with a fragrance or use it alone.

Okey, then I have not have any zap from my zap tests yet. I have those strips, but they are impossible to use. I have the most simple type. I guess you can buy better ones. I have heard it must be measured in an aquaous solution, 50/50 soap and water. I have not really used them for soap, but only used them when I made sodium citrate from citric acid and baking soda. I could not see if the solution was neutral or not, so my strips are not good at all. To be honest, most of times I have just started to use soap without testing it. Just thought, if it is lye heavy, then I will notice if I get dry hands. Sometimes I have done zap-testing just out of curiousity after I have used the soaps. But no zapping, no.

I can perhaps find the sap value of reindeer tallow somewhere. They do research all sorts of things here all the time. So I might find it from a science report or anything. If not, I will use deer tallow and 4-5% superfat.

Thank you again

Maybe the kaolin clay (i use ordinary white kaolin) kan have different effects in soap all depending on where you add it? If you add it to the oils, the clay will soak oil. Add it to the lye solution, and it will soak caustic water. Add it to the fragrance oil, and it will soak fragrance oil (which I understand is not really oil, like ordinary oil).

The clay can be saturated with 3 different fluids. When it is saturated in one thing, it can't soak anymore. A wet clay can't soak oil. So perhaps kaolin added to lye solution can thicken soap, while it doesn't if added to the oils, or the opposite? Who knows? I definately don't know. But it might have an effect, or not.

 

[Meena]

@Rune, If I recall, I added my white kaolin at trace. When I used Rhassoul clay, I also added at trace. I don't recall noticing any change to the thickness or speed of my batter from either clay, but those batches may all have been HP, which has 38 to 42% water.

Bingo, Rune - Have you tried soaping with a higher water %? The cure will take a bit longer, but it helps fluidity a lot. You can accomplish higher water by setting your lye concentration to be 28 to 30%, no higher. You will have a greater chance of getting gel at that percent range, also.

I'll have to CP with the white kaolin, one of these days.

 

[SeattleMartin]

Yes, please do @SeattleMartin I just now wrote a message on Facebook to my neighbour, asking for reindeer tallow. Yes, I guess tallow is the right word, and not fat. It is nothing less confusing in norwegian than english, we have smult, ister, spekk, talg and probably even more, and I don't know the difference between them

Well it was just fat when I got it, I had to make tallow from it. (Tallow and lard are what is rendered from the fat.) And then you have suet, and,.... You're right, it is confusing and as far as I care you can just say fat and it will always be correct Incidentally, I have friends in Norway, Sweden and Netherlands. We sometimes love to compare notes on how difficult language is
Looks like Meena has some great tips there. I was planning to use some earthy fragrances to help cover the scent of the deer tallow. We cleaned it up as best as possible but it still has a bit of an odor (I actually have a pretty sensitive nose myself) that I can only describe as "gamey." If you're familiar with wild game, you know that smell. I grew up around hunters so I'm somewhat accustomed to it.

As for soapy things today... here is a picture of laundry soap (100% CO, 0.5% SF) that went volcanic. It was a pretty minor eruption, I would say. We made this batch last night, our first time doing it in our 2lb loaf mold. I only made it once before and molded it in small thin cardboard boxes lined with plastic. I think I will use small molds again next time.

 

[Hils67]

When using DB or any other discoloring FO, especially high vanilla fo's, I would not color the base darker. I find it much better to pour of batter for swirling then add the discoloring fo in the main batch of batter. If you color the fo free with bright colors the result can be very pretty. I use a lot of discoloring fo's and that is just my system.

One reason for not making the base batter which contains the darkening fo is it will already be a messy soap and by darkening it more it will really be a messy soap. I am quite interested to see what color you end up with your DB, which is my all time favorite.

I actually left out the FO for the yellow and red, as I thought it might discolour...so next time I thought if I coloured my main batch (with the DB in) brown and left the DB out of the swirling colours then I should end up with the same-ish colour as the first cut and cured bar. Ie work with the brown tinge rather than against it.

This is how it looks right now ...a bit blotchy, still smells gorgeous though

 

[Dawni]

@Rune and @Meena.. I added white kaolin clay at emulsion both times I tried it in CP.

I had other colors and the white (and incidentally also the black) became much thicker than the other colors faster, even when I mixed by hand.

Soapy thing:
Soy wax experiment going on right now!

 

[earlene]

Thats an interesting soap holder, how do you get the soap out?

I am not DWMadison, but here's what you do with that sort of set up:
Pour different colors (or different ITP's or whatever design one chooses) into different sized circles. While the soap is still wet, one carefully removes the circles, doing best not to disrupt the design. Leave the soap to saponify and the result maintains the design. Here is one example of a soap using such a method: https://www.soapqueen.com/bath-and-body-tutorials/cold-process-soap/rainbow-cold-process/

Here's another one by Auntie Clara: https://auntieclaras.com/2014/08/intentional-crop-circles-water-discount-as-a-design-tool/

 

[Rune]

@Meena, I have tried both high and low water. High water and I got glycerin rivers. Low water, well, I did that because it has some advantages. You will minimize the risk of glycerin rivers, and it is said to slow trace, and less water to evaporate later. Some say the opposite, water reductions means rapid thickening and more water means more fluidity. I don't know, I have found that my soap thickened just as bad with lots of water than with like 40% lye solution. Did not slow anything, and did not speed more than it already did in the first place.

Now I will have a new recipe, and I will try both high and low water to see the effect, and also kaolin added both to oils or at trace, to see what happens. I don't want to add it to the lye solution. I really like to add as much as possible to the oils or the water for the lye solution, so that I can prepare almost everything upfront. I'm afraid of forgetting to add this and that if I have to add it at trace. So I normally avoid that.

 

[Kafayat Adebowale oyeniyi]

Did some molding with soap dough today. Tomorrow it will be time for pics of a soap that's fully cured, and then playing with the dough again.

Is it ok.to.use Clay's to colour soap dought.....I ain't a mica fan at allll

 

[Rune]

@SeattleMartin Yes, I know the gamey smell. It is not necessary unpleasant at all. But I'm not so sure if I want too much of it in soap. I think there must be a way to refine and deodorize the tallow. I will investigate and see if I can find something clever. I know from Youtube it must be rendered at a very low temperature to minimize smell. And the best is to grind it up first, then the rendering will go quicker, and I think it will minimize smell as well. I think I will use the crockpot, just because it is easy and low-temp.

I will let you know if I find and easy refining process.

 

[Rune]

@SeattleMartin I found this from @IrishLass :

You can also do a final wet rendering with baking soda. I haven't done it myself, but a soaper on a different forum has done it with her stinky lard with very good results. I wrote her method down in my notes for future reference just in case-

To deodorize 5 lbs of lard or tallow:

Take 5 lbs. lard (or tallow) and put in in a big pot. Pour in enough water to just cover the lard. Pour in 2 to 3 tablespoons of baking soda, making sure to dissolve the soda in the water before heating the pot or you'll have a mess on your hands. Bring to the boil and then turn it down to a low simmer, cooking and stirring it it for about 30 minutes. Take it off the heat and let it sit in the fridge or some place cool overnight. When completely cooled, remove the solidified lard and throw everything else out. Store the lard in the fridge.

IrishLass

 

[SeattleMartin]

@Rune Excellent! Thanks so much

 

[Pat McGlothlin]

Um, I started soaping cuz it keeps me sane and it's cheaper than therapy.

My husband might agree with the "keep(ing) me sane" part but not so much the "cheaper than therapy" part. But it's a whole lot more fun than complaining to a stranger and you've got something tangible to show for your efforts.

 

[katemz]

I apologize for virtually drooling all over your soap!

Thank you [emoji23] I made it a flat cut to show off the swirls.Used crinkle on my happy face soap cocoa soap.

 

[earlene]

Thank you [emoji23] I made it a flat cut to show off the swirls.Used crinkle on my happy face soap cocoa soap.View attachment 38292

They are beautiful, katemz. Just gorgeous looking!