Tocopherols (T-50)vs. Rosemary oleoresin

[Donna]

Does anyone have an opinion on the usage of T-50 or RO?

I've been soaping for about 12 years and have only had a couple of experiences with DOS. (knock on wood).
I started using T-50 and haven't had a problem since. Perhaps it has nothing to do with the T-50, but I'm superstitious.
I read that RO is better,so I purchased it. Using it at .1%, I've had a bit of a problem with it turning the soap a "rusty color".

I'm thinking of going back to the T-50 as an antioxidant, but would like to know if the RO is truly better.
Would appreciate any opinions!

Thanks

 

[green soap]

T-50 will not survive saponification, but RO does survive, at least enough of it to be effective. I have confirmed that it is effective against DOS.

T-50 is a good ingredient to use for lotions, balms, massage oils, and other products that will not require NaOH. It is also good to add to your oils to keep them fresh longer, but not so effective to ward against DOS. Unfortunately.

 

[Donna]

Green Soap,

Thank you...that gives me what I needed to know. I will try backing off
to.05% (just let it tip toe) in my oils.

You have brought up another question though.
How much RO do you add to your oils to keep them fresh longer, and will the oils effect the color of your soap?

 

[green soap]

1/2 to 1 gram per Kilogram of oils is what the manufacturer recommends. This works out to 1/2 an ounce in my 35 lbs bottles of oil.

 

[paillo]

i'm math challenged -- so don't understand this: 1/2 oz in 35 lb bottles of oil. can you clarify for us?

 

[Steve Ballmer]

T-50 will not survive saponification, but RO does survive, at least enough of it to be effective. I have confirmed that it is effective against DOS.

I have seen this dotted around the net, but is there any science to back it up?

 

[green soap]

I have seen this dotted around the net, but is there any science to back it up?

I am sure there is science to back it up. I have not looked at the chemistry of it though.

What I said was from my own experimentation. Identical batches of soap, the ones where I used RO are fine, the others had DOS. This was confirmed in several soap batches. So yes, I am sure RO works. Similarly, I can confirm that vitamin E (t-50 mixed tocopherols) does not.

However, doing your own experimentation is always a good idea. If you find any chemical explanation I would love to see it myself.

 

[green soap]

i'm math challenged -- so don't understand this: 1/2 oz in 35 lb bottles of oil. can you clarify for us?

the recommended use is 0.05 to 0.1%. So multiply your oil weight by 0.0005 or 0.001.

so 35 (lbs in my bottle) x 16 (ounces in a lb) x 0.001 = 0.56 oz of RO

This is the upper limit, you can use half of that as your lower limit.

 

[paillo]

Thanks green soap! I've had some on hand and have not yet tried it -- in it goes into tonight's batch

 

[Donna]

Hi Steve,

I know this isn't the "scientific" explanation, but from what I've read,
oxidation of oils is what caused rancidity, hence DOS.
ROE inhibits the oxidation of oils.

I realize this is pretty basic. Perhaps a little research would produce
a more in depth explanation.

 

[Steve Ballmer]

Hi Steve,

I know this isn't the "scientific" explanation, but from what I've read,
oxidation of oils is what caused rancidity, hence DOS.
ROE inhibits the oxidation of oils.

I realize this is pretty basic. Perhaps a little research would produce
a more in depth explanation.

Hi Donna, cheers for answering. Your explanation fits, but I was asking more about the interaction between the vitamin E and lye? If anyone could point me to a good book or resource that could help me understand such complicated "science" stuff, I'd be all kinds of happy :razz:

 

[Steve Ballmer]

I am sure there is science to back it up. I have not looked at the chemistry of it though.

What I said was from my own experimentation. Identical batches of soap, the ones where I used RO are fine, the others had DOS. This was confirmed in several soap batches. So yes, I am sure RO works. Similarly, I can confirm that vitamin E (t-50 mixed tocopherols) does not.

However, doing your own experimentation is always a good idea. If you find any chemical explanation I would love to see it myself.

Cool, I'll do some testing soon and let you all how it goes