Syndet Shampoo Bar Recipe?

[JillGat]

Don't measure the cool-down ingredients into a separate container -- you're right that this introduces far too much error. That will be true even with a smooth container. Measure these ingredients directly into the main container of "dough". Get disposable pipettes if needed so you can add single drops for accuracy.

Okay, that makes sense. I'll have to find a lighter container for the main dough, though, because my scale that measures small amounts only goes up to 100g. Oh, the complications!

 

[DeeAnna]

Another alternative if you don't have a scale with a large enough capacity is to weigh the cool down ingredients into a container large enough for everything and then scrape the "dough" into that container. Although there's some loss, the loss of a bit of the "dough" is less critical than losing some of the cool down ingredients.

 

[JillGat]

Another alternative if you don't have a scale with a large enough capacity is to weigh the cool down ingredients into a container large enough for everything and then scrape the "dough" into that container. Although there's some loss, the loss of a bit of the "dough" is less critical than losing some of the cool down ingredients.

Excellent idea. Thanks.

 

[Dahila]

Actually Cathy was my inspiration too, the instruction are from Susan

I am not sure if it was here, but someone wanted to see my planned )lightly planned syndet each of them is 72 g. They are snow white but the light seemed to make them yellow

 

[DeeAnna]

My syndet shampoo bars look a lot like Dahlia's.

 

[Dahila]

DeeAnna this time I had added 2% of Sodium Lactate, it still need some gentle wash with clothes and it is going to look ok Kokum butter helps a lot

 

[DeeAnna]

Thanks, Dahlia! Did you think the sodium lactate helped with the smoothness? I know it makes soap more fluid, so I'm wondering what it does with syndets.

 

[JillGat]

DeeAnna this time I had added 2% of Sodium Lactate, it still need some gentle wash with clothes and it is going to look ok Kokum butter helps a lot

Wash with clothes?

 

[DeeAnna]

I think Dahlia meant to say this -- the bar needed a gentle polish with a damp cloth.

 

[Dahila]

how come DeeAnna always understand me, or Irishlass or Susie thanks <3

I did so , it was your idea with sodium lactate, I think it was easier to mold and smooth it up. It will evaporate anyway. I almost had not get the air bubbles this time Thank you for fantastic ideas DeeAnna

 

[baylee]

If adding 2% sodium lactate, which ingredient would you subtract that 2%?

 

[DeeAnna]

Sodium lactate is a liquid at least how most of us use it. The solution is about 60% SL and the rest water if my memory is correct. I'd probably subtract the % from the CAPB, which is also a liquid. Uh, I ~think~ CAPB is about 30% surfactant. The rest will be mostly water.

It's important to not get too much water-based stuff in the bars. If you add too much water, the bars will remain somewhat soft even after a long drying period.

 

[baylee]

Thanks, that makes perfect sense.

 

[cherrycoke216]

Have anyone tried coca betaine or liquid surfactant in 8-10%?
I use SLS and Coca betaine because it's what's available in hobby quantity. Haven't ventured into import some SCI yet.

But more powder surfactant and less liquid surfactant is not that gooey sticky. In my opinion, it's easier to work with. But Other powder/ prill/ flake surfactant & liquid surfactant might be another animal...

@JillGat
I use argan oil from my very first batch. Haven't tried use only hard butter yet. I imagine it would be softer than just any butter. ( so in an " more liquid surfactant batch", like 26% it would be very soft. That was my first batch. It's still sticky the next morning,so I added another 3% cetyl alcohol to compensate it.
This is my rustic argan oil shampoo bar.



By the way, I find putting liquid surfactant in the powder surfactant bag and let it soak a night ( or a bit ) before you stir will eliminate some dusty powder in the air.
Even I use a spoon to measure powder surfactant it is so IRRITATING!!! I might just put all the % of liquid surfactant in my powder surfactant bag. And it's all done.


And can anyone tell me a better way to measure panthenol? It's so gooey and moves so slow. And if I use a spoon or mini spatula it sticks on the spoon. So I can't measure it very precisely. Duh...!

 

[Dahila]

You do add oils to your syndet bar?

 

[DeeAnna]

Have anyone tried coca betaine or liquid surfactant in 8-10%?

And can anyone tell me a better way to measure panthenol?

When people say they're using coco betaine (CB) in a syndet cleanser, they actually are using Cocamidopropyl betaine (CAPB). CAPB is a syndet and CB is not.

You'll see statements like these all throughout the internet:
LeafTV: "...Coco betaine is shorthand for the chemical cocamidopropyl betaine...."
Truth in aging: "Coco betain ...A derivative of cocamide and glycine betaine. Its made from coconut oil, and comes in the form of a pale yellow liquid. Also known as cocamidopropyl betaine...."
Ingredients to die for: "...CocoBetaine (Cocamidopropyl Betaine) is used in shampoos, bubble baths and liquid hand soaps...."

Even Susan (swiftcraftymonkey) acknowledged she was confusing CB with CAPB not too long ago. Her comments about the confusion in the names led me into reading more about this issue. The reason why people latch onto the idea of using coco betaine is that it is a more a "natural" ingredient. Problem is, CB is not a surfactant.

More info about the difference between CB and CAPB:
https://realizebeauty.wordpress.com...camidopropyl-betaine-are-different-chemicals/
http://chemistscorner.com/cosmeticsciencetalk/discussion/1748/coco-betaine-vs-cocamidopropyl-betaine

If you go back to my recipe for a syndet shampoo bar earlier in this thread, you'll see I include CAPB at 26% of the formulation.

The panthenol I have is a powder from Lotioncrafter. It is easy to measure and use.

 

[Dahila]

Thanks DeeAnna, like always fantastic post, so CAPB is the one I use, But is always a secondary surfacant, on it's own not to bubbly

 

[cherrycoke216]

Thanks DeeAnna! Always so helpful, insightful!!!

But this makes me wonder, what's the "coco betaine" in some upscale, big brand name, even organic shampoo. Are they using CAPB and list a more natural coco betaine to get away with it?

A link you listed said coco betaine is a surfactant. I'm really confused.

The supplier of mine use terms like " KAO ( Japanese manufacturer) betaine surfactant " , this is what's in my language translated into English. Now I'm gonna call this morning to make sure what I get.

@ dahila
Yes, I use argan oil to replace butters. I use same percentage as butter. Now I wonder what a bar using hard butter & stearic acid as bar hardener will feel like in my subtropical weather. (I use cetyl alcohol as bar hardener )

 

[Dahila]

Cherrycoke I use kokum butter and found it is the best in syndet, it is pricey but worth it, I had not liked cocoa butter in it.

 

[DeeAnna]

"...Are they using CAPB and list a more natural coco betaine to get away with it?..."

Yes, that's what is happening. It may well be an honest mistake, and LOT of people are making this mistake. Coco betaine is not a surfactant despite what people think. CB just plain will not work as a cleanser -- but CAPB will.