Substitution for Polysorbate 80

[hmlove1218]

I have found a bubble bar frosting recipe I want to try and it uses polysorbate 80 as an optional ingredient. I want to include it as I don't like oil rings in the tub. Problem is, I only have polysorbate 20 and the traditional and the soft and silky emulsifying waxes from WSP.. Is there a way I can substitute one of these for the polysorbate 80? The recipe calls for 1 ounce of polysorbate 80, so how much of one of the others should I use? Thanks!

 

[snappyllama]

I've kept this bookmarked: http://swiftcraftymonkey.blogspot.com/2010/05/question-polysorbate-20-vs-polysorbate.html

I haven't tried out the substitution myself, but I think you should be able to use your poly 20 in the recipe. You might need to use a bit more to get the same result in the tub though. I'd be wary of using the wax since it might change the consistency of those bubble bars too much to work with them like a normal bubble bar recipe.

ETA: what's the ratio of oils to poly 80 in your original recipe?

 

[hmlove1218]

Awesome thanks! Didn't find that link when I did a Google search.

It was 7 ounces of oil to 1 ounce of PS80

 

[DeeAnna]

I agree that you will need to use quite a bit more PS 20 than PS 80 -- at least that's been my experience. This is especially true since you're trying to solubilize a heavier carrier oil, not a lighter essential oil.

I don't have any experience with bubble bars or soap frostings, so I can't advise about using e-wax, but it may work fine. E-wax (either type) is a solid at room temp while the polysorbates 20 and 80 are liquids, so I'd think e-wax would change the texture enough to need some other tweaking. But if you have to add 2 to 3 to maybe 4 times more PS 20 than PS 80, that's going to affect the texture too.

One of those "d*mned if you do, d*mned if you don't" kind of things.

 

[snappyllama]

Hrmn... I was thinking about this... your recipe is for frosting so consistency is a really important attribute. Poly 20 is thinner than poly 80. So you don't want to use as much poly 20 since it's going to make a less stiff mixture. Conversely, you need more poly 20 emulsify the carrier oils into your tub. So you want to use more poly 20 to get the same result. Dilemma.

I'd experiment with smaller test batches.

Make small batch of original recipe using the 7:1 oil/poly ratio (maybe it will be perfectly fine - the consistency isn't *that* different)

If you aren't happy with it, start tweaking (I'd do this anyway since I cannot leave well enough alone for any recipe):

Too soft frosting/oil amount of oil on tub walls is fine: reduce oil in recipe, reduce poly 20
Frosting consistency good, tub walls oily: reduce oil, up poly
Rise/repeat

I'm on recipe trial #toomany of my bath bombs and finally have them where I what them for a normal bomb. But mine are sinkers and I want to make the fun color changing spinners and shooters, so I'm back to square one on recipes for those... tweaking never ends...