Is it possible that SL just doesn't work for some people? I am only putting 3 t. SL in a 5 lb. batch of soap, soaping at 90 degrees, not covering and my recipe is 50 % oo. I do not discount water. The problem is my soap gets cracks all over the top. I can refrigerate but it is a 36 bar divider mold and I have to clean out the fridge just to fit it in. It's also very heavy! I tried setting it under a ceiling fan but it still cracked. I'm considering going back to no SL unless someone has the secret to fixing this.
Sodium Lactate Problems
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Are you sure SL is the culprit? Is the cracking ONLY happening in batches where you use SL and your other batches are coming out fine? I use it in almost every batch and have never had any problems like that. If you care to post a pic and walk us through your recipe and techniques, we might be able to help you troubleshoot. 
A quick google search revealed you are definitely not the only one: http://www.soap-making-essentials.com/soap-is-cracking-when-using-sodium-lactate.html
I didn't know that SL could speed up saponification and heat, that's interesting. Are you using any other additives that can cause heat? Honey, sugar, milk, beer, higher percentage of coconut oil, etc. Full water can also cause more heat than a water discount.
More on overheating: https://auntieclaras.com/2015/06/overheating-soap/
A quick google search revealed you are definitely not the only one: http://www.soap-making-essentials.com/soap-is-cracking-when-using-sodium-lactate.html
I didn't know that SL could speed up saponification and heat, that's interesting. Are you using any other additives that can cause heat? Honey, sugar, milk, beer, higher percentage of coconut oil, etc. Full water can also cause more heat than a water discount.
More on overheating: https://auntieclaras.com/2015/06/overheating-soap/
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I'm with toxikon, I too use it in every batch and have not had an issue. Sounds like it may be overheating some? Does this happen with the same recipe without SL?
I have used the same recipe for 13 years and never had a cracked soap until I added SL. I know I'm not the only one...I've already been through troubleshooting with the experts but no one has any answers but overheating. I watched a batch closely, taking temperature with infrared thermometer every half hour. The soap never got above 87 degrees. It still cracked. I do add a little sugar so on one batch I eliminated the sugar...it still cracked. Funny thing is my goat milk soap with sugar AND milk didn't crack. The cracks aren't very deep and I can always patch it up the next day with a gloved finger while it's still warm but it's time consuming. Thanks for the links toxikon.
If you are using the SL to harden your soap, maybe try a little salt instead.
As an alternative, you could always try dissolving 1tsp of salt PPO into your liquid before adding your lye for a similar result to SL.
It's hard to say why SL is causing you grief, especially if your temperature is staying fairly low. I have no clue!
It's hard to say why SL is causing you grief, especially if your temperature is staying fairly low. I have no clue!
Yes, I do plan to try salt next time. But I just bought 10 lb. SL! Oh, well. My main reason for trying SL was for easier release because I don't gel.
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Are you using sodium lactate liquid or sodium lactate powder? The powder should be more concentrated than the liquid.
divinegoddessoaps17
Well-Known Member
I use sodium lactate in every batch that I make and so far (knock on wood), have not had a problem. Mine is in liquid form.
Mine is also liquid. So many people seemed surprised at having trouble and use it in every batch.
"... I watched a batch closely, taking temperature with infrared thermometer every half hour. The soap never got above 87 degrees. It still cracked...."
The problem with this idea is that an IR thermometer only reads surface temperature. Unless you put a thermocouple inside the soap to read the internal temperature, you really have no idea what's going on even a quarter inch under the surface, and that is doubly true when talking about temps in the center of the loaf.
Think about it -- if you are outdoors on a bitterly cold day, your cheeks and nose get really cold, right? If someone measured the temp of your facial skin, they would decide you're dead. But you're not. They would have to measure your internal temperature to get the true story. An IR thermometer reads skin temps only. It can provide an idea of internal temps ONLY if you use it on a well mixed fluid (for example, soap batter right after it's been thoroughly stirred).
If you don't believe me, then take your internal body temp with a regular thermometer. And then measure your skin temp with the IR meter. Compare. Even on a warmish summer day, there will be a difference.
Please provide a photo of the cracked soap. If, as you say, your soap is not getting warm enough to even gel, then cracking due to overheating is not the problem. Unless your soap is actually gelling despite what your IR thermometer is telling you. A photo will help (I hope) to clear up what's going on.
The problem with this idea is that an IR thermometer only reads surface temperature. Unless you put a thermocouple inside the soap to read the internal temperature, you really have no idea what's going on even a quarter inch under the surface, and that is doubly true when talking about temps in the center of the loaf.
Think about it -- if you are outdoors on a bitterly cold day, your cheeks and nose get really cold, right? If someone measured the temp of your facial skin, they would decide you're dead. But you're not. They would have to measure your internal temperature to get the true story. An IR thermometer reads skin temps only. It can provide an idea of internal temps ONLY if you use it on a well mixed fluid (for example, soap batter right after it's been thoroughly stirred).
If you don't believe me, then take your internal body temp with a regular thermometer. And then measure your skin temp with the IR meter. Compare. Even on a warmish summer day, there will be a difference.
Please provide a photo of the cracked soap. If, as you say, your soap is not getting warm enough to even gel, then cracking due to overheating is not the problem. Unless your soap is actually gelling despite what your IR thermometer is telling you. A photo will help (I hope) to clear up what's going on.
Yes, I believe you. I can't take a picture now because I haven't made soap this week. I mend the soap the very next morning when it's still soft. It's actually soft for more than one day. But I can tell you it's not gelled unless it can: #1. gel and stay the same color, #2. gel and stay soft for a few days, #3. partial gel without the tell-tale ring in the middle.
Thanks for your thoughts...I will try to post a photo next time I make.
Thanks for your thoughts...I will try to post a photo next time I make.
I'm wondering if there is a superfat percentage that is ideal when using SL. I just remembered I used to do a 10% superfat and now am doing 8%. Doesn't seem to me that should be the problem though.
I use a 3-5% superfat with SL!
I use SL in almost every batch (I use the 60% liquid form). My usage rate is 2% ppo, which is roughly the equivalent of about 2 teaspoons or so per pound of oils. I've been using it for years, and to date, it has never caused overheating or cracks in my soap. For what it's worth, I soap between 110F-120F and I encourage full gel in my oven which I pre-warm to 110F.
Where did you buy your SL from?
Edited to add that my superfats are all over the place- some are 5%, some are 8%, some are 13%, some are 20% (depends on my formula). In any case, my SL works fine with all of my differing superfats. No overheating or cracking issues with it.
IrishLass
Where did you buy your SL from?
Edited to add that my superfats are all over the place- some are 5%, some are 8%, some are 13%, some are 20% (depends on my formula). In any case, my SL works fine with all of my differing superfats. No overheating or cracking issues with it.
IrishLass
That is so amazing. I was told to soap as low as possible to avoid overheating. I use less than 1 t. ppo and never gel. Also put in fridge, not oven! I get my 60% liquid SL from WSP. Their products are always top notch in my mind. I'm beginning to wonder if there's something in one of my oils that is reacting to it. My recipe is 50% oo, 30% co and 20%po.
Does anyone spray tops with 99% alcohol to prevent ash when using SL?
Does anyone spray tops with 99% alcohol to prevent ash when using SL?
Alcohol spritz never worked for me to reduce ash. The only thing that did was to reduce my water. I like 35% water/lye solution. I get it occasionally with certain FO's so I always plan to wash the top of the loaf before I cut.
I also use SL (liquid) in every batch of soap and have never had it cause me any grief.
I have always reduced my water but when it was suggested to me that my soap was overheating I did the full amount, guessing that it might help because if an fo causes seizing adding more water helps but I guess that was a mistake. I use the sage lye calculator and aim for somewhere in the middle of the water suggestion, not low not high. Explain to me your 35% lye solution. Can you believe I've made soap 13 years and don't know that?!
kchaystack
Supporting Member
Using more liquid actually makes it more likely to overheat because it lowers the temperature that your soap gels.
I am betting putting it in the fridge actually makes cracking more likely. The colder top side of your soap is not able to expand as the inside heats up, so it cracks due to the pressure of the expanding soap.
I would reduce your liquids, maybe using a 35% concentration, and then let the soap set out and see if that helps.
You should be able to input your lye solution in % or ratio on any calculator. I haven't looked at The Sage calc so I'm not sure but on Soap Calc you can. Just choose your % or ratio and it'll calculate it for you. Based on Auntie Clara's experiments, higher water equals more heat generated. So that might be part of your cracking problems. I know I had some batches crack early in my soaping journey and they all happened when I used the default water setting which is quite high. Once I reduced my water ratio most of the problems were fixed. Not always but most of the time.
I also let my soaps gel instead of trying to discourage it. If I'm using an accelerating FO/EO I leave it open to room air. If I'm using a well behaved scent I lightly cover. I don't think I've have a cracking problem in the last 2 years.
