Recipe

[Liorasol]

Forgive me if this is in the wrong category. Moved

My last recipe, I found that my bar “melted” quite quickly due to the hardness being 39 and my longevity being 25.

What is the “typical” hardness and longevity that you all like to soap at?

Does adding salt water help increase longevity and hardness? Could possibly do 1:1:1 (saltwater: water: lye) if that would even make a difference?

My new updated recipe is as follows (keeping in mind I don’t like a cleansing rate of higher than 13):

Oil	%
Shea Butter	10
Coconut Oil, 76 deg	15
Olive Oil	15
Sunflower Oil	15
Castor Oil	5
Tallow Beef	30
Mango Seed Butter	10

Property	%
Bubbly Lather	17
Cleansing	12
Condition	54
Hardness	44
Longevity	32
Creamy Lather	37
Iodine	64
Ins	140

There’s also the possibility of ignoring the sunflower oil:

Oil	%
Olive Oil #	30
Shea Butter #	30
Tallow Beef #	25
Coconut Oil, 76 deg	10
Castor Oil #	5

Property	%
Bubbly Lather	14
Cleansing	9
Condition	57
Hardness	42
Longevity	33
Creamy Lather	38
lodine	60
Ins	135

Any suggestions are more than welcome!!

 

[KiwiMoose]

I'd probably go for the second one - mango butter is very expensive is it not? Maybe a little more tallow and a little less Shea for the same reason? But it won't change the numbers much.

My recipe has hardess of around 51% and longevity around 37%. I get that by sticking to liquid oils that also (alongside the hard oils) have high palmitic numbers - RBO, OO and Avocado.

Another idea is reducing the amount of liquid and also reducing the superfat.

 

[akseattle]

@Liorasol , Maybe try a longer cure?

If you haven't read @DeeAnna 's article on Classic Bells about hardness and longevity, since you're wondering about this issue, I'd recommend it at the link below.
https://classicbells.com/soap/soapCalcNumbers.asp#refLo

I think the hardness in your original recipe looked pretty good, admittedly, your two proposed new recipes are even better.
Even though your longevity of 25 in your original recipe isn't great, in a survey done by Kenna of Modern Soapmaking (a survey to which DeeAnna refers in her article - I've read Kenny's article a couple times in the past but couldn't find offhand or I would have put that link below), the mean for longevity on soapmaker's favorite recipes is in the low 20's! So, the average soapmaker is okay with their soap melting away

 

[Liorasol]

I'd probably go for the second one - mango butter is very expensive is it not? Maybe a little more tallow and a little less Shea for the same reason? But it won't change the numbers much.

My recipe has hardess of around 51% and longevity around 37%. I get that by sticking to liquid oils that also (alongside the hard oils) have high palmitic numbers - RBO, OO and Avocado.

Another idea is reducing the amount of liquid and also reducing the superfat.

Mango butter is so expensive! I only added it to “harden” the sunflower oil addition, which I really want to add (I found it’s cheaper than OO).

The above recipes are based on a 6% super fat and 2:1 water lye solution

 

[justsomeguy]

Mango butter is so expensive! I only added it to “harden” the sunflower oil addition, which I really want to add (I found it’s cheaper than OO).

The above recipes are based on a 6% super fat and 2:1 water lye solution

You can try subbing in kokum butter for the mango butter...

 

[Liorasol]

@Liorasol , Maybe try a longer cure?

If you haven't read @DeeAnna 's article on Classic Bells about hardness and longevity, since you're wondering about this issue, I'd recommend it at the link below.
https://classicbells.com/soap/soapCalcNumbers.asp#refLo

I think the hardness in your original recipe looked pretty good, admittedly, your two proposed new recipes are even better.
Even though your longevity of 25 in your original recipe isn't great, in a survey done by Kenna of Modern Soapmaking (a survey to which DeeAnna refers in her article - I've read Kenny's article a couple times in the past but couldn't find offhand or I would have put that link below), the mean for longevity on soapmaker's favorite recipes is in the low 20's! So, the average soapmaker is okay with their soap melting away

Thank you!

You can try subbing in kokum butter for the mango butter...

Substituted mango for kokum and adjusted the numbers a tad, this is what I got!

Oil	%
Castor Oil	5
Coconut Oil, 76 deg	13
Tallow Beef	30
Shea Butter	10
Sunflower Oil	16
Olive Oil	16
Kokum Butter	10
Total	100

Property	%
Bubbly Lather	16
Cleansing	11
Condition	54
Hardness	43
Longevity	33
Creamy Lather	38
Iodine	64
Ins	138

 

[AliOop]

the mean for longevity on soapmaker's favorite recipes is in the low 20's! So, the average soapmaker is okay with their soap melting away

Of course we are! Because then we get to make more soap, more often!

 

[KiwiMoose]

@Liorasol - that looks much better. In my neck of the woods, kokum butter is even more expensive than mango so it would not be an option. My oil of choice to replace OO is Rice Bran Oil. It is SUPER cheap here and has palmitic in it. Sunflower has nothing to contribute to the soap's hardness or longevity at all. Can you get avocado oil? It more expensive than OO here, but brings something to the table if you can afford it.