planning recipe for coffee goats milk -questions

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kpduty51

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Hello friendly soap making folks.
I am getting ready to make a new kind of soap. This will be my fourth batch.
I am hoping this recipe sounds reasonable to those of you with more experience. It is a coffee goats milk soap.
I ran it through the lye calculator to get the lye amount, but am very inexperienced and unsure about this. I have a few questions.

1. I have Turkish Mocha fragrance oil and vanilla fragrance oil from Brambleberry. I think I will add only the mocha, but do not know how to calculate that amount. by smell? Or, if you think that oil is a bad idea...

2. I really want to try coffee butter and guessed at the amount to add... I don't know how to figure out the ratios at all and am reading about the characteristics. Does this amount seem too high or too low? bad idea?

3. I love the goats milk soap and plan to mushy freeze the goats milk and the coffee... is that a good idea, or should I just have the coffee at room temp?

I know I am asking a lot of questions. Sorry. I used the calculator on Bramble berry. Here is my recipe:

Oil(s) Selected Amount %
Coconut Oil (76 Degrees) 17.00oz 36.96%
Coffee Butter 4.00oz 8.70%
Olive Oil 17.00oz 36.96%
Palm Oil 8.00oz 17.39%
0% Lye Amount 6.984oz
Ounces of liquid recommended 15.18oz
Yields 68.16oz
Current Batch (total oil weight):46.00oz

I plan to use half coffee and half goats milk.

thank you!
 
Looks like a great recipe to me! If I were making it I would mix and freeze the coffee and goats milk together until solid. Then bust it up some before slowly mixing in the lye. When I used to freeze my goats milk just a little the soap still got dark and had that slight burnt smell to it but when I freeze it solid and keep it cool while mixing in the lye it stays a light creamy tan color.
 
I think Turkish Mocha or blending it with Vanilla sounds wonderful. Just remember if you want to use both, you have to split the difference in weight. You can use BB's fragrance calculator to determine the amount of FO to use. http://www.brambleberry.com/pages/Fragrance-Calculator.aspx (I see while I was typing you already got an answer for the FO calculator and GM/coffee.)

I've never used coffee butter so I can't tell if it's a good amount or not. However, I don't recommend a 0% superfat. You can too easily end up with a lye heavy batch. Even if it wasn't lye heavy, it still would be drying from the almost 37% of coconut oil. I'd suggest lowering the CO and using higher amounts of olive and palm but this is just my opinion.

You can do the coffee and goat milk either way. You could also mix the lye in the coffee (will smell nasty but fades) and just add the goat milk in without freezing it. You've selected FOs which will discolor to brown so I wouldn't even worry about trying to keep the GM & coffee cool. It won't stay a light color.

BTW, when I add buttermilk or cream, I weigh it out and leave it on the counter while I weigh everything else out. That's so it's not cold when I pour it in after adding the lye solution. I've noticed a cold dairy product seems to clump up a bit when I add it after I've blended in the lye solution. It actually was never a problem but I just found room temp dairy blended in more easily.

eta: I checked out coffee butter and it stated on BB that it's coffee seed oil and fully hydrogenated oil. It doesn't say what oil is used for manufacturing this butter so I'd suggest you ask BB what was used. If it was fully hydrogenated soybean oil, it's not going to add any benefits other than hardness as far as I can tell. I'd use a little less if this is the case.

Maybe try something like -

11.5 oz coconut oil
2.3 oz coffee butter
20.7 oz olive oil
11.5 oz palm oil

I'd suggest not using more than 6.5 oz of lye. This will give a 5% SF and the bar will have a lower cleansing value and a little higher conditioning value. It does drop the hardness by quite a bit but it still will produce a nice hard bar.
 
Last edited:
I am listening to comments. This is very helpful. One reason I like freezing the liquid is that it keeps the temps lower. the lye is so freaky hot...
Here is another version of the recipe adding in the super fat and lowering the coconut oil as recommended. Will this be too soft?
Another newbie question"
when the calculator says 4% lye amount, what does that mean?
is the lye amount lower than otherwise because I am superfatting the soap? Very ignorant, I have read a lot of books, and posts, but still am unclear about that verbiage.


Oil(s) Selected Amount %
Apricot Kernel Oil 2.00oz 4.00%
Coconut Oil (76 Degrees) 10.00oz 20.00%
Coffee Butter 4.00oz 8.00% this could also be cocoa butter
Olive Oil 17.00oz 34.00%
Palm Oil 17.00oz 34.00%
4% Lye Amount 7.012oz
Ounces of liquid recommended16.50oz will add half coffee and half goats milk
Yields 73.51oz
Current Batch
(total oil weight): 50.00oz

will also add Turkish mocha and vanilla FO.... per calculator.

thanks to every kind soul that takes an interest!
 
When the calculator says 4% that means it's giving you a lye amount that is 4% less than what is needed to fully saponify all the oils. It's also referred to as superfat. It's nice to have that wiggle room just in case your scale isn't very accurate. You don't want to end up with a lye heavy batch.

I really like the look of the new recipe with either cocoa butter or coffee butter. I think you should try it. :grin:

kpduty51 said:
Hazel, I LOVE your icon!
Click to expand...

Thanks! I found it here ---> http://www.glittergraphicsite.com/
 
One way I prevent the burning of milk is to mix my lye with a small potion of water and use the rest as milk. Once ithe waater and lye is disovled I will do all my oils and then mix in the lye water if everything is close in temps. Once I have all that mixed a little I will add the rest of the milk and bring to trace. This seems to help alot with the burning of the milk. I soap at about 100 in temp.
 
I can see there are many ways to prevent milk over heating. I like your suggestions. Thank you.
I am grateful for all of the advice.
 
One thing that you want to make sure is that whenever you have a fragrance, check with the manufacturer to find out what their safe usage rate is. I didn't know that when I first started soaping, and I used twice the recommended amount in a soap and could have really harmed someone if the FO had burned them.
 
made my coffee goat milk soap yesterday!

Hello Soap makers,
We finally made my coffee goat milk soap yesterday and it seems to have worked well. My fourth batch of soap! Thank you for all of your advice.

I tweaked the recipe many times, used the lye calculators on soapcalc and Brambleberry and ended up with below measurements/combinations.
Because I read palm should not be more than 30% so I lowered it & added castor oil.
Other tweaks--I made the coffee 4X strength, cooled it to room temp and added the lye to that (stinky!). After that mix cooled to 150 degrees I added slushy frozen goat milk. Almost immediately the oils and lye mix were at the same temp of 108 degrees. So we made the soap. It came to thin trace right away. Added the apricot oil and fragrance and it went right to a thick trace. We poured/plopped it into the mold just in time. Quick, quick.
I put the mold in the porch (Wisconsin cold) for half an hour and it started to set right away. I think I will be able to cut it late this afternoon.

The smell of the soap was somewhat harsh at first (used Turkish Mocha from Brambleberry), but seems to be mellowing. Is the harsh smell because of coffee/lye interaction? I used the fragrance calculator and made it medium strength. I decided not to add coffee grounds. It is a caramel color right now, but I wonder if it will darken.

Trying to decide what to call the soap as Coffee Goats milk doesn't roll off the tongue.
Cafe au lait? caramel latte, caffe latte?
Any suggestions?
Thanks for the help.

my recipe:
Oil(s) Selected Amount %
Apricot Kernel Oil 2.00oz 4.00%
Coconut Oil 10.00oz 20.00%
Coffee Butter 4.00oz 8.00%
Olive Oil 17.00oz 34.00%
Palm Oil 10.00oz 20.00%
Castor Oil 7.00oz 14.00%
Lye Amount 6.881oz
liquid 16.50oz (8.25 room temp coffee/8.25 frozen goats milk)
Yields 73.42oz
Current Batch
(total oil weight): 50.00oz
 
I think the recipe looks great! I'd like to hear your opinion of it after it cures.

As to the harsh smell, I'm leaning towards the coffee and lye producing the harsh scent but it could also be the combo of coffee/GM/lye. On the other hand, I've never smelled Turkish Mocha but some FOs have a harsh scent in the beginning. Whatever it is, it should mellow through the curing time. I looked at Turkish Mocha on BB's site and it does say it will discolor to a "milky dark brown".

I'm not good with naming soap but some ideas:

Cabra Leche Café
Café Mocha
Loca Mocha
Mocha Capra Latte

eta: How about going simple and calling it Crazy Goat Mocha?
 
You're welcome! Now that I think about it, I do like the name Crazy Goat Mocha and I think it's weird enough to appeal to people's sense of humor. But I have a twisted sense of humor so I'm not the best person to offer suggestions.
 
The eleven year olds in the house today have voted for crazy goat latte,insisting that mocha doesn't apply in this case. No chocolate. Huh? In any case I like the crazy goat part and so will let them prevail and thanks to you for the name.
I also considered buzzy goat latte--has a nice bounce. Either way. I wish I had added a cocoa swirl, but I am trying not to get too complex since soaping is new to me and I want to be successful. Thanks again. You have a great sense of humor.
 
I like Crazy Goat Latte and thinks it's very appropriate. I think it works since latte is made from espresso and milk so it covers both the addition of coffee and goat milk. It's probably good you didn't do the cocoa swirl since you probably wouldn't have been able to see it after the soap discolors.

This is just a suggestion but next time you make it, you might consider taking out a small amount of soap before you add the FO. Lightly texture the top, pour it on top to create patches of "froth" and sprinkle a little white or iridescent cosmetic glitter on it for a slight sheen. I think it would make a great look.

Cappriato is a good suggestion, too.
 
WEll, now that I think about it, Turkish Mocha is the name of the fragrance. So I think you have naming rights and it should be called Crazy Goat Mocha. Very good name. The crazy part is perfect.
I like your suggestion for fancy frothing. I have several soaps I want to try before I revisit the coffee soap, and I have to pace myself--job, other hobbies, laundry and what not. So, I'll keep a note on that suggestion.
The fragrance is now wonderful. Bitter note seems gone. Whew.
Thank you Hazel.
I don't know what a macchiato is, but I want to try it. I like the name Cappriato, too. I wish we could have goats here. We have backyard chickens, but goats are not allowed. Can't think of much soap related that the chickens could contribute to, but they have other positive qualities.Thanks so much.
 

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