Actually, there are quite a few of us that make CP LS. I made a batch just yesterday, matter of fact.
goat milk liquid soap questions
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Actually, there are quite a few of us that make CP LS. I made a batch just yesterday, matter of fact.
"...I'm one of the few soapers I know that still uses the CP method occasionally to make LS..."
Really? That's interesting. I always use a CP method to make my liquid soap and I guarantee I didn't learn from you nor the folks on the Yahoo group. Maybe you need to check IL's and Susie's tutorials on making liquid soap with a CP method, Zany. Maybe you'd learn a few tricks from them. They're very good at what they do.
Really? That's interesting. I always use a CP method to make my liquid soap and I guarantee I didn't learn from you nor the folks on the Yahoo group. Maybe you need to check IL's and Susie's tutorials on making liquid soap with a CP method, Zany. Maybe you'd learn a few tricks from them. They're very good at what they do.
Zany- I'm very familiar with Carrie's video. It (and the very loooooong glycerin LS thread over at the Dish forum) is actually what got me into making my own liquid soap back in 2012, and it is the video I point to as my inspiration in my cold processed LS tutorials I have posted here at SMF. Anyway- while I love her video, her method of using phenolphthalein is a very faulty way of using phenolphthalein that will in turn give faulty results. It is as Ngian said: Phenolphthalein is a pH indicator and pH is only available in aqueous solutions.
I'm not a scientist either, (and I'm not trying to be argumentative either- I just want to make sure I'm presenting the proper info, especially for those who are new), but I do take to heart the posts written by those soapers who are scientists or who at least have a scientific or lab background, and from what I've learned from them is that while you can definitely get 'a reading' with phenolphthalein the way Carrie uses it in her video, it won't be the reliable, trustworthy reading that one is counting on as being true, because in order for phenolphthalein to give one a true reading of the pH range, the substance being tested must be dissolved in water first. The way to do that is to make a 1% aqueous solution out of 1 gram of soap paste dissolved in 99 grams distilled water.
And just to repeat, using the phenolphthalein in the manner that Carrie mistakenly does in her video (and as so many others do who have mistakenly followed her or someone else's unfortunate, faulty lead), will not tell you if there is unreacted lye present in the soap, most especially since it is not even able to indicate the true pH range when used in that way. You'll definitely get a 'reading' alright, but it won't be a true reading.
The proper way to use phenolphthalein at home in detecting the presence unreacted lye is to follow the protocol/procedure precisely spelled out in the 'alkalinity test' in Dr. Dunn's book, using a precise amount of soap dissolved in a neutralized ethalonic solution made up of ethanol and a certain amount of a 1% phenolphthalein solution, and then titrating it with a certain amount of a precise % of citric acid solution. And the correct way to use phenolphthalein in order to give one a true pH range, a 1% aqueous solution made of 1 gram of soap dissolved 99 grams of distilled water must be used.
Phenolphthalein is a wonderful tool, but only if used within the parameters for which it was designed to be used for giving capable readings.
IrishLass
I'm not a scientist either, (and I'm not trying to be argumentative either- I just want to make sure I'm presenting the proper info, especially for those who are new), but I do take to heart the posts written by those soapers who are scientists or who at least have a scientific or lab background, and from what I've learned from them is that while you can definitely get 'a reading' with phenolphthalein the way Carrie uses it in her video, it won't be the reliable, trustworthy reading that one is counting on as being true, because in order for phenolphthalein to give one a true reading of the pH range, the substance being tested must be dissolved in water first. The way to do that is to make a 1% aqueous solution out of 1 gram of soap paste dissolved in 99 grams distilled water.
And just to repeat, using the phenolphthalein in the manner that Carrie mistakenly does in her video (and as so many others do who have mistakenly followed her or someone else's unfortunate, faulty lead), will not tell you if there is unreacted lye present in the soap, most especially since it is not even able to indicate the true pH range when used in that way. You'll definitely get a 'reading' alright, but it won't be a true reading.
The proper way to use phenolphthalein at home in detecting the presence unreacted lye is to follow the protocol/procedure precisely spelled out in the 'alkalinity test' in Dr. Dunn's book, using a precise amount of soap dissolved in a neutralized ethalonic solution made up of ethanol and a certain amount of a 1% phenolphthalein solution, and then titrating it with a certain amount of a precise % of citric acid solution. And the correct way to use phenolphthalein in order to give one a true pH range, a 1% aqueous solution made of 1 gram of soap dissolved 99 grams of distilled water must be used.
Phenolphthalein is a wonderful tool, but only if used within the parameters for which it was designed to be used for giving capable readings.
IrishLass
Here's a pic of my CPLS made yesterday. No lye heavy then neutralize. No cure time. Fully diluted for the foamer. Colored green with MP colorant (works well for liquid soap!), scented with CC Cucumber Melon. Sorry it does not have goat's milk.
This is all super helpful! Thanks you deeana
What kind of preservative do you use and how do u use them?
If I ever get brave enough to try this i will take your advice and preserve, self test and send to a lab as well.
If any of you have suggestions of self home test kits that would be helpful!
Thank you! I plan to read up on the link you added! I 'll at least hopeful that there are some options out there! You mentioned you don't use milk in any if your. In your experience would that seem the EDTA ineffective in the way you mentioned? if i ever get brave enough to do this I will be using a preservative as well, as you noted doing!I don't use any preservatives in mine, but I do use EDTA. EDTA is a not a preservative, by the way- it does not kill nasties on contact- but it sequesters the nutrients needed by the yuckies to survive, so that they in effect starve.
Anyway, I started adding EDTA to my liquid soaps after reading this very interesting discussion over at the Dish (start at post #997 by silverdoctor): http://www.thedishforum.com/forum/in...age-40?hl=edta Silverdoctor's posts are really interesting and informative. He's a retired doctor whose experiences in the medical field in regards to soap and bacteria helped to shed light on the subject for me. What he brought to the discussion, and his explanation of oligodynamic action served to help me to decide on the preservative issue for my own liquid soap. My plan of action against yuckies (based on his advice) is using the EDTA in my dilutions and also making sure to follow strict sanitary protocols, such as making sure that not only are my bottles sanitized, but the nozzles and pumps as well before filling or refilling my bottles, and having a quick turnaround time (i.e. I make small 1 lb batches and dilute only enough paste to make about 16 oz. of liquid soap, which fulfills my immediate household needs for a month or two). The rest of my paste is stored in ZipLoc bags in my fridge until needed.
For what it's worth, I should mention that I do not sell, but if I did sell, I would use a preservative because there's no way I could be sure that my customers would be as fastidious with my liquid soap as I am.
IrishLass
Thank you for all of this! That was actually the same tutorial I followed to make the first batch I did of LS. I followed it all except for sunflower oil. It turned out pretty well! I HP it (later discovered the CP method of LS and prefer it when using milks!). So it was an amber color. I did a terrible job during the solution process so most of what I made I had to pitch. But i did end up with 1 couple of nice bottlesI highly recommend Alaiyna B's tutorial on making GM soap. Here's the link:
http://alaiynab.blogspot.com/2014/04/tutorial-how-to-create-liquid-goats.html
I've been making liquid soap since 2004 and most of what I learned, I gleaned from the pioneers of making LS on the Liquid Soapers Yahoo Group. I'm one of the few soapers I know that still uses the CP method occasionally to make LS, so if you need help with that, feel free to PM me and we'll take it from there.
No. "Fully saponified soap requires no preservative", Catherine Failor. There are several members on the LS Yahoo Group that sell commercially who will tell you they never use preservative. Well known, commercial, all natural liquid soap, such as Dr. Bronner's and Vermont Soap, contains no preservative, altho Vermont soap uses antioxidant ROE, if I remember correctly. However, many LS'ers do use preservative as a matter of personal preference, in spite of the fact that there is no preservative specifically formulated for use in LS (as far as I know) due to the fact that nasties don't thrive in an alkaline environment, i.e., LS is typically pH 9-11.
I'm not sure. Indefinite maybe? I found a flaxseed & rosin shampoo I made 4 years ago recently when cleaning out my soaping cupboard. I'm using it now... good as the day it was made -- actually, better! XD. TIP: Rosin not only boosts the lather but has preservative qualities as well.
pH testing isn't necessary at all unless you need to diagnose a problem with your soap. More importantly, pH testing isn't going to tell you if there's unsaponified lye in the batch, that's what the soap-in-water, phenolphthalein or the zap test is for. (Note: Personally, I don't zap test, nor do I know many soapers who do that any more, other than here on SMF. I prefer to use the pheno and spare my precious taste buds for other goodies like licking butter pecan ice cream. :mrgreen
Faith (Alaiyna B) has other tutorials for making LS. You might try a few batches using 12-16 oz. oils to get the hang of it before attempting the goat milk batch. 12.5 oz. oils/fats makes 16 oz paste that you can then divide into four 4-oz portions to test different levels of dilution, fragrance, and any other additives that you have in mind.
HTH :bunny: and HAPPY SOAPING!
ETA: Here's a link to another site, Snow Drift Farm (defunct; now archived), that covers the basics and then goes on to discuss using goat milk in LS. It looks like the GM is not used to make the lye solution but rather added during trace at a rate of 20% (if my math is correct) of the total liquid amount. Worth a read?:
http://web.archive.org/web/20060520222037/http://www.snowdriftfarm.com/form_liquidsoap.html
they out weren't quite as emolient/ soft on the hands as I am going for. So, that's why I'm still working towards another recipe that I like. I will read up on the link you sent though! Thanks!
Oooh that's so pretty!!!
IrishLass, where do u purchase your EDTA?I don't use any preservatives in mine, but I do use EDTA. EDTA is a not a preservative, by the way- it does not kill nasties on contact- but it sequesters the nutrients needed by the yuckies to survive, so that they in effect starve.
Anyway, I started adding EDTA to my liquid soaps after reading this very interesting discussion over at the Dish (start at post #997 by silverdoctor): http://www.thedishforum.com/forum/in...age-40?hl=edta Silverdoctor's posts are really interesting and informative. He's a retired doctor whose experiences in the medical field in regards to soap and bacteria helped to shed light on the subject for me. What he brought to the discussion, and his explanation of oligodynamic action served to help me to decide on the preservative issue for my own liquid soap. My plan of action against yuckies (based on his advice) is using the EDTA in my dilutions and also making sure to follow strict sanitary protocols, such as making sure that not only are my bottles sanitized, but the nozzles and pumps as well before filling or refilling my bottles, and having a quick turnaround time (i.e. I make small 1 lb batches and dilute only enough paste to make about 16 oz. of liquid soap, which fulfills my immediate household needs for a month or two). The rest of my paste is stored in ZipLoc bags in my fridge until needed.
For what it's worth, I should mention that I do not sell, but if I did sell, I would use a preservative because there's no way I could be sure that my customers would be as fastidious with my liquid soap as I am.
IrishLass
Not IL, but lotioncrafter and saveOnCitric both sell EDTA. Be sure to get TETRAsodium EDTA, not DIsodium.
If you have an Amazon account with free shipping, that's another place to get it. https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00IV211RK/?tag=skimlinks_replacement-20
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