Goat milk and lavender bad smell :-/

[Vicki C]

Hey all, I decided to dip a toe into goat milk soap making. I bought goat milk and froze it then mixed the lye with the frozen goat milk. Mixed it in an ice bath to keep it cool. I used a 40% lavandin 60% lavender EO mix. Refrigerated after pouring to prevent overheating. All this to say I don’t think I scorched the goat milk but I’m new to goat milk so I’m not sure. After it came out of the mold it smelled TERRIBLE. Like rotten camphor. I kept sniffing it to see if I was imagining things but I wasn’t.
This was the fourth batch I’ve made - I made an unscented batch, a lemongrass batch, and an oat / maple (fragrance) batch. All the others smell fine. Where did I go wrong? This isn’t typical, is it? Did I scorch it without realizing? TIA

 

[Marsi]

For soaping, the fridge is not always able to stop a soap from heating up, so the milk may have heated anyway.
Colour is a good indicator of a milk soap that has heated. Generally, the hotter the milk, the darker the soap.

The smell does reduce as the soap ages (quickly at first, then continually for a long time), but for a sensitive nose (I think you have one ... picking up the camphorous smell is unusual), there may be a hint (that most people would not notice).

You might like this (it gives a good description of the scents of the various components of goats milk)
https://www.fortunejournals.com/art...t-milk-based-on-their-odor-active-values.html Concentration in milk (µg/L)

camphor 9.78 ± 3.17 (campherous)*
octanoic acid 493.65 ± 76.09 (fatty, rancid)*
(*figures in article referred to as being taken from original source Buttery RG, Guadagni DG, Ling LC. Volatile aroma components of cooked artichoke. Journal of Agricultural and Food Chemistry 26 (1978): 791-793.)

 

[Vicki C]

For soaping, the fridge is not always able to stop a soap from heating up, so the milk may have heated anyway.
Colour is a good indicator of a milk soap that has heated. Generally, the hotter the milk, the darker the soap.

The smell does reduce as the soap ages (quickly at first, then continually for a long time), but for a sensitive nose (I think you have one ... picking up the camphorous smell is unusual), there may be a hint (that most people would not notice).

You might like this (it gives a good description of the scents of the various components of goats milk)
https://www.fortunejournals.com/art...t-milk-based-on-their-odor-active-values.html Concentration in milk (µg/L)

camphor 9.78 ± 3.17 (campherous)*
octanoic acid 493.65 ± 76.09 (fatty, rancid)*
(*figures in article referred to as being taken from original source Buttery RG, Guadagni DG, Ling LC. Volatile aroma components of cooked artichoke. Journal of Agricultural and Food Chemistry 26 (1978): 791-793.)

Thank you, so helpful, I will read! You know I think you’re right, it did heat up anyway, it looks like there was a partial gel, not to mention it probably strained the refrigerator motor trying to get the temp down. Maybe I’ll wait until winter so I can put it in my porch after pouring. (It gets cold here.) The lavender soap actually smelled less bad the next day. Fingers crossed it will keep mellowing.

 

[Zany_in_CO]

I used a 40% lavandin 60% lavender EO mix.

Lovely.

it smelled TERRIBLE. Like rotten camphor.

GM soap smells bad right out of the mold.

This isn’t typical, is it?

Yes, it is. The "typical" smell is more like ammonia to my nose. Not to worry. The off-smell will dissipate as the soap cures.

 

[Vicki C]

Lovely.

GM soap smells bad right out of the mold.

Yes, it is. The "typical" smell is more like ammonia to my nose. Not to worry. The off-smell will dissipate as the soap cures.

Thank you, that’s helpful to know. I’m on the steep part of the learning curve with GM! Yes I smell ammonia too.

 

[TheGecko]

It's ammonia that you are smelling and it goes away.

 

[user 56151]

Hey all, I decided to dip a toe into goat milk soap making. I bought goat milk and froze it then mixed the lye with the frozen goat milk. Mixed it in an ice bath to keep it cool. I used a 40% lavandin 60% lavender EO mix. Refrigerated after pouring to prevent overheating. All this to say I don’t think I scorched the goat milk but I’m new to goat milk so I’m not sure. After it came out of the mold it smelled TERRIBLE. Like rotten camphor. I kept sniffing it to see if I was imagining things but I wasn’t.
This was the fourth batch I’ve made - I made an unscented batch, a lemongrass batch, and an oat / maple (fragrance) batch. All the others smell fine. Where did I go wrong? This isn’t typical, is it? Did I scorch it without realizing? TIA

I make all of my soaps with some kind of milk. The goats milk ones smell disgusting when first cut, that smell soon disappears and the fragrance comes through. I CPOP my soaps, they get very hot. I don’t think that scorches the milk but can cause them to crack on top. I scorched my milk when adding the lye once, I didn’t freeze the milk, but soap turned out well.

 

[Vicki C]

I make all of my soaps with some kind of milk. The goats milk ones smell disgusting when first cut, that smell soon disappears and the fragrance comes through. I CPOP my soaps, they get very hot. I don’t think that scorches the milk but can cause them to crack on top. I scorched my milk when adding the lye once, I didn’t freeze the milk, but soap turned out well.

Thank you - the lavender / lavandin GM soap I made smells much better now. I’m going to try powdered GM into the oils too.

 

[AliOop]

I couldn’t tell the difference between soaps made with whole GM and those made with GM powder. Of course, if I had a reasonably-priced source of whole GM, and room to freeze it, and I needed label appeal for sales, I might use fresh instead.

I have read here that some folks still label it as GM, and not GMP, because the GMP when reconstituted arguably becomes GM at that point. People might differ about their thoughts on that, but no matter what, I think you’d have to be honest if customers ask about the source.

And I don’t doubt that you @Vicki C would do that - I’m just putting it out there for other readers to know that I am not suggesting that one lie about it if asked.

 

[Zany_in_CO]

GMP when reconstituted arguably becomes GM

True.

I think you’d have to be honest if customers ask about the source.

In all my 10 years of making GM soap for a wholesale customer who sold only GM soap it just never came up. It truly never was "an issue". No worries.

 

[Mobjack Bay]

Not too long ago I came across a variation on a theme way to make GM soap by Lovely Greens. She adds frozen cubes of goat milk to a lye solution made with water, but waits until after the lye is completely dissolved and the solution has cooled down to 100F. Apparently that temp is warm enough to melt the frozen cubes without overheating the GM. Her soap is impressively white, which is what caught my attention in the first place.

 

[Quilter99755]

Not too long ago I finally bought a can of powdered goats milk. I've been looking at fresh and old threads to get info on what and how to do it. Does adding the powder to the oils produce the smell? or is it just the fresh milk that is producing it? It will definitely make a difference to when and where I make the soap! Might have to be in the garage after it gets a heck of a lot colder in this area! LOL

 

[Zany_in_CO]

Does adding the powder to the oils produce the smell?

Ya know, now that you mention it, I don't think it does. My memory of the ammonia stink is from when I first made it with fresh GM from the Vitamin Cottage. That was a few years before I started making GM soaps for my wholesale customer.

 

[Quilter99755]

Ya know, now that you mention it, I don't think it does. My memory of the ammonia stink is from when I first made it with fresh GM from the Vitamin Cottage. That was a few years before I started making GM soaps for my wholesale customer.

Thanks so much for the quick reply!

 

[Vicki C]

I couldn’t tell the difference between soaps made with whole GM and those made with GM powder. Of course, if I had a reasonably-priced source of whole GM, and room to freeze it, and I needed label appeal for sales, I might use fresh instead.

I have read here that some folks still label it as GM, and not GMP, because the GMP when reconstituted arguably becomes GM at that point. People might differ about their thoughts on that, but no matter what, I think you’d have to be honest if customers ask about the source.

And I don’t doubt that you @Vicki C would do that - I’m just putting it out there for other readers to know that I am not suggesting that one lie about it if asked.

That’s a good point I wouldn’t have even thought of labeling it as goat milk powder soap.

 

[AliOop]

Not too long ago I finally bought a can of powdered goats milk. I've been looking at fresh and old threads to get info on what and how to do it. Does adding the powder to the oils produce the smell? or is it just the fresh milk that is producing it? It will definitely make a difference to when and where I make the soap! Might have to be in the garage after it gets a heck of a lot colder in this area! LOL

I never have any ammonia smell in my GM powder soaps. I do blend the powder into the oils very, very well to avoid streaks.

@Mobjack Bay great tip on adding the cubes to a warm lye solution - thanks!

 

[Zany_in_CO]

I do blend the powder into the oils very, very well to avoid streaks.

That's the way I do it too.

 

[Quilter99755]

I never have any ammonia smell in my GM powder soaps. I do blend the powder into the oils very, very well to avoid streaks.

Well, between you and @Zany_in_CO it looks like I might be making goats milk soap this weekend instead of quilting! I'm sort of stuck on a design problem anyway!

 

[Zany_in_CO]

@Quilter99755 Well, we are nothing if not enablers!
Maybe you'll discover a soap batter quilt design.

 

[Quilter99755]

Ummm! That gives me a few ideas! Just what I need...enablers! LOL