2nd soap and I guess it was false trace

[hanesha]

Hello @ all!

So I have been influenced by so many soap makers via YouTube and thought I give cp soap a try as I only did melt and pour before.

As I am a scientist I thought what could possibly go wrong (lol) and studied many mistakes (gel phase, soda ash, dos, glycerin rivers and so on) before I tried it myself.
My first batch (oo and 5% co) was awesome, had a thick trace but I don't mind and for the first try it was totally okay.

I was really proud of myself so I gave a triple butter soap recipe a try, yeah I know I got a bit too self conscious
When I poured the lye solution (90F) into my melted liquid oil mix (110F) it began instantly to emulsify. The surface looked very grainy after the soap set for some time.

13oz water
4.3oz lye

8oz olive oil, pomace
8oz coconut oil
5oz mango butter
5oz Shea Butter
4.5oz cocoa butter
1.5oz castor oil

0.6oz Patchouli EO
0.6oz Lavender EO

3 Things I had in mind.
1. Is it safe to use or should I rebatch it and melt in the oven at 200F? I am a bit scared of cutting it.
2. EO were purchased at Amazon it was not listed as CP proof EO. I guess it did not help with building up a trace right?
What if I don't put any EO in it? Does it smell rancy after curing or is the smell totally "acceptable"?
3. I did CPOP to force the gel phase but I guess it was too hot (around 70C), should I try not to do it? I wanted to prevent soda ash

I really don't want to waste this batch (the mango butter was quite expensive ) but if I have to and the soap is not safe for use I will do it of course.

What do you think?

 

[artemis]

What do you think?

Well, since you asked...

I think it looks like tiny bubbles came to the surface. I don't think 70C is too hot, but you are supposed to turn the oven off when you put the soap in. I suppose it's possible that it got a little bubbly if you left the oven on. I think you should cut it, cure it, and then zap test it.

Depending on the manufacturer of the EOs, it could be that you didn't get the real deal from Amazon. Which brand did you purchase?

I'm not sure I understand this question: "What if I don't put any EO in it? Does it smell rancy after curing or is the smell totally 'acceptable'?"

If you're asking if plain unscented soap smells rancid, that would only happen if you used rancid oils or if the soap develops DOS. To know if you like unscented soap, you'd have to make a small batch to see for yourself.

I like to make 450 g batches, which gives me about 5 bars. That way, I don't feel like I've invested so much in a recipe that is new to me.

 

[hanesha]

I think it looks like tiny bubbles came to the surface

I guess so too, but I did not unmold it yet, it is too soft after 24hrs. Perhaps its a combination of too hot (I left it in the oven for 1h at 70°C without turning it off, I noticed it too late ) and false trace? Or does false trace not even saponify at all?

Which brand did you purchase?

Aromatika, their EO is only advertised for aromatherapy so perhaps Patchouli is not suitable for soap making (while lavender was okay in my first batch)
I guess one can't see it, but the surface feels quite oily, I just put a tissue on it to remove the excess oil. That's not a good sign, is it?

If you're asking if plain unscented soap smells rancid, that would only happen if you used rancid oils or if the soap develops DOS. To know if you like unscented soap, you'd have to make a small batch to see for yourself.

Yeah exactly that was my concern, that the saponified oils smell rancid after curing and therefore many soap makers use EO or FO, but I guess I will just try unscented soaps, thank you for your advice!

 

[KiwiMoose]

I don't see any reason why the soap would be unsafe to use - it just might not be as pretty as you like is all. Did you put your recipe into a soap calculator? Have you got a screen grab of that you could share? I don't understand imperial measurements or amounts like that - it's better with percentages.

 

[Ephemerella]

To the issue of the little bubbles, is it possible you didn't "burp" your stick blender and inadvertently incorporated air?

Rule #1 with soap making: Don't panic.
Rule #2: Soap gonna do what soap gonna do
Rule #3: See rule #1
Rule #4: Wait 30 days before committing a batch to the trash, a) it's amazing what time and patience can do to soap, b) even if you think your soap is ugly, I guarantee someone else (friend, family) will love it.

 

[hanesha]

Did you put your recipe into a soap calculator? Have you got a screen grab of that you could share? I don't understand imperial measurements or amounts like that - it's better with percentages.

Yes I have, this was the recipe:

 

[hanesha]

To the issue of the little bubbles, is it possible you didn't "burp" your stick blender and inadvertently incorporated air?

Rule #1 with soap making: Don't panic.
Rule #2: Soap gonna do what soap gonna do
Rule #3: See rule #1
Rule #4: Wait 30 days before committing a batch to the trash, a) it's amazing what time and patience can do to soap, b) even if you think your soap is ugly, I guarantee someone else (friend, family) will love it.

You are right, I know you learn from mistakes and perhaps i'm just too influenced by beautiful looking bars of perfect soap from long-time soap makers
Well it didnt look totally bubbly when I poured it into the mold, but I guess that means nothing, right?
so I guess I'll have to wait impatiently and drink some tea

 

[artemis]

... and false trace? Or does false trace not even saponify at all?...

I have never had false trace, but when I have seen it, the result seems to be a completely separated soap.

Aromatika, their EO is only advertised for aromatherapy so perhaps Patchouli is not suitable for soap making (while lavender was okay in my first batch)

I have never heard of them. I have used Now Essential Oil (lemon grass, orange, lemon, lavender) with no issues. I can't stand patch, so I can't speak to that. You do have to be careful of any EO/FO/mica you get from Amazon, even if they say they are for soap-- often they are actually just for MP soap, not CP.

I guess one can't see it, but the surface feels quite oily, I just put a tissue on it to remove the excess oil. That's not a good sign, is it?

Also something I haven't experienced, but we see a lot on the forum. Seems often to be due to the fragrance. It also seems to reabsorb over time.

Yeah exactly that was my concern, that the saponified oils smell rancid after curing and therefore many soap makers use EO or FO, but I guess I will just try unscented soaps, thank you for your advice!

I think it depends on the oils used. The palm recipe I've used has a nice, gentle, "natural" smell to it. Some people say lard soaps can smell "piggy" if you over heat the lard when you melt it. Cocoa butter keeps a little of its scent, but not for long. And so on.

Most people use fragrance in their soap because it's fun, not to hide the scent of the soap itself. And, of you ever get to the point of selling, most customers want a choice of fragrances.

 

[KiwiMoose]

I notice you have a lye concentration of only 25% - you should ideally change that to about 33 as a new soaper. It won't have affected the problem you have cited above however.

 

[artemis]

You are right, I know you learn from mistakes and perhaps i'm just too influenced by beautiful looking bars of perfect soap from long-time soap makers
Well it didnt look totally bubbly when I poured it into the mold, but I guess that means nothing, right?
so I guess I'll have to wait impatiently and drink some tea

How'd that soap turn out? Bubbles throughout? Did the oil reabsorb into the soap?

 

[Lynn Miglets]

Yes. I would also like to know how it turned out. I have a batch that looks just like this and is a little oily on top too.