# Lard percentage



## Finner21 (Aug 12, 2021)

For those of you that like to use lard in your soap, what is a good percentage to use if I am already using coconut oil , olive oil and ricebran oil ? Thank you for your feedback


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## dibbles (Aug 12, 2021)

I usually use lard between 30-40%. If I am not including a butter, then I use up to 45%. Above that I can smell a bit of piggy odor.


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## cmzaha (Aug 12, 2021)

My favorite is 27% lard 40% Tallow. You mentioned since you are using Coconut Oil, CO is considered one of the cleansing oils the same as Palm Kernel oil and Babassu oil, it does not lend hardness or longevity to your soap. Lard, Tallow, Palm, Shea, Cocoa Butter, etc which contain higher palmitic and stearic acids to lend hardness/longevity to your soap.

May I ask why you use RBO and OO, since RBO is a good replacement for OO? You really only need one or the other, also if your total percentage of the combination is high a longer than normal cure time is better. I did try RBO a couple of times as an OO replacement but really did not like it any better than OO so I changed to other high Oleic oils such as Canola.


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## Bubble Agent (Aug 12, 2021)

I have used lard for the past 7 years straight, and love it so much. I have tested everything from 25/30/40/50 % lard, but eventually landed on 60% lard and the rest is divided between coconut, olive and castor.

At 60% there is thankfully no piggy smell in my soaps, but I understand that others have experienced some smell if they go that high.
(I have an overly sensitive nose, and hate when things smell off, but I have been lucky so far).

The lard I use is containing BHT and antioxidants, as we are not allowed to use home rendered lard in soaps that are going to the public, per the EU/EØS regs I have to abide by in my CPRS.

I have one of my very first soaps made with lard, at the kitchen sink right now. It is 7 years old and is made from 80/20 lard & coconut, and it has no icky smell and no spots. It is fantastic soap! I have kept another bar, and it will be fun to see how it fares when it reaches 10 years!


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## amd (Aug 12, 2021)

I use 25% - above that and I can smell it. I use it with RBO, CO, shea, cocoa and castor.


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## Babyshoes (Aug 12, 2021)

I've been trying it at different percentages, and so far 40% is my favourite, though 100% is pretty good too!


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## AliOop (Aug 12, 2021)

I like 50% to 80% lard, and have always used home-rendered lard till recently. It never had any piggy smell at all. To my surprise, my first store-bought lard that I got last month, which is preserved with BHT and citric acid, has a definitely piggy smell before using it. I wonder if the preservatives affect the smell somehow? I'd think it would be the opposite but can't explain why my home-rendered lard with zero antioxidants or preservatives has not smell.

Fortunately, I don't smell anything in the curing bars made with the store-bought lard, but so far, all of those are scented. I'll be interested to find out how this store-bought lard smells in an unscented bar.


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## The_Phoenix (Aug 12, 2021)

AliOop said:


> I like 50% to 80% lard, and have always used home-rendered lard till recently. It never had any piggy smell at all. To my surprise, my first store-bought lard that I got last month, which is preserved with BHT and citric acid, has a definitely piggy smell before using it. I wonder if the preservatives affect the smell somehow? I'd think it would be the opposite but can't explain why my home-rendered lard with zero antioxidants or preservatives has not smell.
> 
> Fortunately, I don't smell anything in the curing bars made with the store-bought lard, but so far, all of those are scented. I'll be interested to find out how this store-bought lard smells in an unscented bar.


Did you finally get your hands on the Smart and Final brand? I think I recall your daughter was going to get some for you???

That is what I use and it does have a piggy smell, though it doesn't come through in the finished soap. I have never rendered my own lard. I would like to but I don't know where I'd begin. We don't eat much bacon and any pork we do eat is on the lean side.


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## AliOop (Aug 12, 2021)

The_Phoenix said:


> Did you finally get your hands on the Smart and Final brand? I think I recall your daughter was going to get some for you???


I ended up not wanting to wait for my visit with her, so I bought the Viva brand available locally at the US Chef Store (formerly Cash & Carry, formerly Smart Foods). Hadn't heard of it before but it seems to soap just fine other than the piggy smell before saponification. And I don't have the greatest sense of smell since getting C-19 last Dec, so I know if I can smell it, it smells!


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## cmzaha (Aug 13, 2021)

Restaurant Depots sell lard and it differently has a piggy smell, also some Costco Business Warehouses sell lard and it also has a piggy smell. I do not smell piggy with Smart and Final lard but I do have dos issues with all lards which is why I keep it at 27% or less. As much as I love lard it apparently hates me in high percentages...   Some here will remember my lard experiments a few years ago, it was not pretty.


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## Ladka (Aug 13, 2021)

AliOop said:


> I like 50% to 80% lard, and have always used home-rendered lard till recently. It never had any piggy smell at all. To my surprise, my first store-bought lard that I got last month, which is preserved with BHT and citric acid, has a definitely piggy smell before using it ...


funny, I have the same experience. My home rendered lard is odourless and one store bought lard smelled. It was traditional Slovenian lard for food where the odour is essential. The only additive was salt at 0.5 %. I promptly rendered it using water and salt to get impeccable lard for soaping.


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## LynetteO (Aug 13, 2021)

AliOop said:


> I ended up not wanting to wait for my visit with her, so I bought the Viva brand available locally at the US Chef Store (formerly Cash & Carry, formerly Smart Foods). Hadn't heard of it before but it seems to soap just fine other than the piggy smell before saponification. And I don't have the greatest sense of smell since getting C-19 last Dec, so I know if I can smell it, it smells!


I went looking for my local cash & carry & drove right by in disappointment when I saw it “wasn’t there”. New sign is US Chef & I *assumed* cooking tools. 
I should’ve gone in!!! Thanks for SHARING!!!


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## Susie (Aug 16, 2021)

I routinely use between 45-55%. I agree with the RBO/OO question. They are so similar in fatty acid profile. If you want something that yields a lovely hard bar, tallow is your friend. I love having tallow in my soap. I just need a source of it locally that I don't have to render. The GV Shortening soaps tend to get DOS faster than the ones without it, so I just need some tallow that does not cost a fortune in shipping.


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## Kasha77 (Aug 16, 2021)

Newbie here, can you please explain what DOS is? Thank you!


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## dibbles (Aug 16, 2021)

Kasha77 said:


> Newbie here, can you please explain what DOS is? Thank you!


DOS = dreaded orange spots, caused by rancidity.


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## Finner21 (Aug 17, 2021)

What is the best ingredient for lots of lather and bubbles in CP soap?


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## LynetteO (Aug 17, 2021)

Finner21 said:


> What is the best ingredient for lots of lather and bubbles in CP soap?


I am looking forward to others responses but I use a bit of sugar & powdered coconut milk for added bubbles since all of my recipes for CP soap have  20% or less CO in them.


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## Professor Bernardo (Aug 18, 2021)

Finner21 said:


> What is the best ingredient for lots of lather and bubbles in CP soap?


I would recommend around 15-20% minimum of Coconut Oil and around a 6-9% of Castor Oil.   Castor Oil really helps with the bubbles and "creaminess" of the soap lather plus it really helps to condition the skin, one reason why I use it in my shave soaps. 

Soap properties of Castor Oil From the Soapmaking Friend Calculator: 

Bubbly 90
Cleansing 0
Condition 98
Hardness 0
Longevity 0
Creamy Lather 90

I know that there are many ways to get to where you're wanting with the properties of your soap, but try using a 20% Coconut Oil and a 7% Castor Oil as starting points and see what you think.  I use Palm Oil too, around a 30-35%, plus I like High Oleic Sunflower Oil too, it's similar in some ways to Olive Oil.


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## dibbles (Aug 18, 2021)

In a very small, unscientific test of a few additives most of the people agreed that subbing aloe juice for water was the biggest lather/bubble increase. I still need to write this up and post it. Summer has had me distracted and busy with other amusements. I want to retest my samples now that they are older and take some photos first. But soon.

Other than that, sugar, honey, beer and milks will add bubbles. I use coconut oil and castor both in (nearly) every soap.


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## Finner21 (Aug 18, 2021)

Professor Bernardo said:


> I would recommend around 15-20% minimum of Coconut Oil and around a 6-9% of Castor Oil.   Castor Oil really helps with the bubbles and "creaminess" of the soap lather plus it really helps to condition the skin, one reason why I use it in my shave soaps.
> 
> Soap properties of Castor Oil From the Soapmaking Friend Calculator:
> 
> ...


Thank you soo much for your feedback, I appreciate this


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## lenarenee (Aug 18, 2021)

AliOop said:


> I like 50% to 80% lard, and have always used home-rendered lard till recently. It never had any piggy smell at all. To my surprise, my first store-bought lard that I got last month, which is preserved with BHT and citric acid, has a definitely piggy smell before using it. I wonder if the preservatives affect the smell somehow? I'd think it would be the opposite but can't explain why my home-rendered lard with zero antioxidants or preservatives has not smell.
> 
> Fortunately, I don't smell anything in the curing bars made with the store-bought lard, but so far, all of those are scented. I'll be interested to find out how this store-bought lard smells in an unscented bar.



I've had some really neutral smelling lard (with bht and citric acid, and some that smelled so awfully strong that I threw it out - despite knowing that there was nothing functionally wrong with it.  Fannie and Flo from the famed Etsy lard and tallow store have said that the age, gender and other factors of the animal matter as to the scent.


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## LynetteO (Aug 21, 2021)

For those of you who like a high lard %, do you use a preservative &/or Chelator?

I recently substituted 20% lard for
vegetable shortening & LOVE that soap. Want to go higher% but  read (SMF) that it’s likely high %shortening/lard bars have short shelf life (18mo) without some type of preservative??


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## AliOop (Aug 21, 2021)

LynetteO said:


> For those of you who like a high lard %, do you use a preservative &/or Chelator?
> 
> I recently substituted 20% lard for
> vegetable shortening & LOVE that soap. Want to go higher% but  read (SMF) that it’s likely high %shortening/lard bars have short shelf life (18mo) without some type of preservative??


Remember: antioxidant for fats/oils, preservatives for water-based liquids and products. 

I have some high lard bars that are three years old with no rancidity, and I did not use any antioxidant. But others here, like @cmzaha get DOS when using lard over a certain percentage. Using an antioxidant like ROE is a good hedge against rancidity if you are concerned about it.

ETA: I do use citric acid or sodium citrate as a chelator in all my soaps.


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