# Vanilla Stabilizer affecting scent?



## sarahsartaj (Feb 28, 2021)

Hi peeps,
I made some MP soap yesterday with some vanilla stabilizer and a peaches n cream fragrance oil. However, I noticed that it didn’t smell like the soaps I had previously made without VS... do you think the VS takes away certain notes of the fragrance?


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## Todd Ziegler (Feb 28, 2021)

sarahsartaj said:


> Hi peeps,
> I made some MP soap yesterday with some vanilla stabilizer and a peaches n cream fragrance oil. However, I noticed that it didn’t smell like the soaps I had previously made without VS... do you think the VS takes away certain notes of the fragrance?


VCS should not affect the scent and if it does it usually disappeares within a few minutes.

Did you use the VCS for MP soap? Because there is a difference.


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## MonicaT73 (Feb 28, 2021)

I was going to ask the same question: I used a “vanilla color stabilizer” for CO from Wholesale Supplies Plus for two different batches (the first fragrance was “Birthday Cake” from Crafter’s Choice and in the other batch I used “Oatmeal Milk and Honey” by BB) and both fragrances were completely gone upon unmolding/cutting. Both batches are curing, but I doubt the fragrances will come back (I hope I am wrong).


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## bluebirdwing (Feb 28, 2021)

Todd Ziegler said:


> Did you use the VCS for MP soap? Because there is a difference.


Wow, so, there is two types of VCS? So, the recipe you shared is for CP?


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## Todd Ziegler (Feb 28, 2021)

bluebirdwing said:


> Wow, so, there is two types of VCS? So, the recipe you shared is for CP?


Yes there are 2 VCS's for soap making. I have never used the one for MP or seen it in person but I believe it is just sodium thiosulfate. The one that I helped make is just for CP soap making. 

Does your VCS have a sulfer/acrid smell? If it does then you have the CP VCS. If it has no smell then you have the MP type.

You can make your own MP VCS by buying some sodium thiosulfate and mix it 1:1 with distilled water and then you can use it at a 1:1 rate with your FO.


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## bluebirdwing (Feb 28, 2021)

@Todd Ziegler Thank you for confirming.



Todd Ziegler said:


> Does your VCS have a sulfer/acrid smell? If it does then you have the CP VCS. If it has no smell then you have the MP type.


We dont get VCS here, thats why I was trying to make my own.



Todd Ziegler said:


> You can make your own MP VCS by buying some sodium thiosulfate and mix it 1:1 with distilled water and then you can use it at a 1:1 rate with your FO.


Ok, Thank you.


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## earlene (Mar 4, 2021)

Yes, I have noticed it at least once.  It was the BCN VS when mixed with Mad Oils Dragon's Blood FO.  It changed the smell to Root Beer and that persisted for some months.  It is weakening now, but the DB odor remains altered in that particular soap.

Edited to add:  I should have mentioned, it was for CP soap, not MP.  I didn't realize I was in the MP forum when answering the question.


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## rdc1978 (Mar 4, 2021)

sarahsartaj said:


> Hi peeps,
> I made some MP soap yesterday with some vanilla stabilizer and a peaches n cream fragrance oil. However, I noticed that it didn’t smell like the soaps I had previously made without VS... do you think the VS takes away certain notes of the fragrance?



I used a VCS with my Ylang Ylang and Amber f/o from nurture soap and I noticed a slight difference in the scent.  I think it made it a little more complex, but there was something a little different to it, but I liked it.   But it was pretty slight and overall I still got what I wanted.  I also have a pretty sensitive nose.  So, I think its possible, but I think if you're getting the same general scent its possible no one else will smell it because they may not have a nose as sensitive.  

Its also possible that its f/o dependent and many f/o have no change in scent with the use of VCS.


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## Arimara (Mar 4, 2021)

Todd Ziegler said:


> Yes there are 2 VCS's for soap making. I have never used the one for MP or seen it in person but I believe it is just sodium thiosulfate. The one that I helped make is just for CP soap making.
> 
> Does your VCS have a sulfer/acrid smell? If it does then you have the CP VCS. If it has no smell then you have the MP type.
> 
> You can make your own MP VCS by buying some sodium thiosulfate and mix it 1:1 with distilled water and then you can use it at a 1:1 rate with your FO.


I never bothered with the stabilizers so it's good to know there are two types available. Thanks.


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## jcandleattic (Mar 5, 2021)

earlene said:


> Yes, I have noticed it at least once. It was the BCN VS when mixed with Mad Oils Dragon's Blood FO. It changed the smell to Root Beer and that persisted for some months. It is weakening now, but the DB odor remains altered in that particular soap.


Really? That's so weird. I use BCN VS in every batch of soap I make, and Mad Oils DB is the only DB I use and I've never gotten a Root Beer scent. 
It's always smelled the same in the soap as it has OOB, possibly just a little less subtle. 

As for VS changing the scent of my soaps, it does sometimes, but by the time a full cure is achieved, the weird chemically smell induced by the VS is gone (usually got by the time I cut it, but some scents are stubborn! LOL)


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## MonicaT73 (Mar 7, 2021)

I made my third batch of CP using VCS and, for the third time in a row, the scent is gone (my percentage for fragrance is always around 3%). I understand it may come back after curing but even my first batch (made a few weeks ago) is not smelling any better. Is there any other way to avoid discoloration without using a VCS, for example, by using more TD? My last batch was made with a FO called “lemon pound cake” (which had 7% vanilla) and I definitely didn’t want it to turn brown. How do other soapers deal with this? Or am I the only one having issues with a VCS and fragrances disappearing.
Also, sorry if I am long, could the fact I am using milk instead of distilled water be a factor (in all the three mentioned batches I used milk)? Thank you so much and sorry if I am long!!!


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## dibbles (Mar 7, 2021)

@MonicaT73 You should start a thread in the Lye Based Forum section. You are asking about CP soap in the M&P section, and I think you will get more/better answers if you start your own thread. That said, I use vanilla stabilizer (but not from WSP) without problems.


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## MonicaT73 (Mar 7, 2021)

dibbles said:


> @MonicaT73 You should start a thread in the Lye Based Forum section. You are asking about CP soap in the M&P section, and I think you will get more/better answers if you start your own thread. That said, I use vanilla stabilizer (but not from WSP) without problems.


Oh, I am so dumb...I didn’t realize that. Thank you!


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## dibbles (Mar 7, 2021)

MonicaT73 said:


> Oh, I am so dumb...I didn’t realize that. Thank you!


Not dumb at all! It's easy to forget to check which part of the forum you are in.


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## earlene (Mar 9, 2021)

I know, it is odd! I was not expecting this at all, and have kept that particular soap near at hand to watch for a change.


Here is an update on this:

Knowing, as I do, that medications can alter the sense of taste and the sense of smell, I decided to look at that more closely, even though I had not noticed any other smell sensations changing.  

What I found was that some BP meds, including the one I am currently taking, have been known to alter the sense of taste and smell.   I have not noticed any changes to my sense of taste, and since they are so closely linked (taste & smell), it had not occurred to me to consider one of my meds as a suspect.  I had not thought of that until recently because, I had only ever noticed it when significant and thankfully temporary.  (St John's Wort produced the most noticeable taste alteration I have ever experienced along with a changed sense of smell.)

Now this really does paint a different picture as related to how to interpret my soaping FOs in the future!  I don't know how I feel about this now.  I certainly don't intend to put soapmaking above my health, so I guess I'll just have to adjust somehow, and live with it.  But does this now mean all FOs and EOs are going to smell differently to me than they did before I took BP meds?  I have only noticed it with DB, though and only with that one batch, although I have not used DB with VS since, so cannot be sure it would or will not happen again.

So another factor that occurred to me, but now seems to be less likely to be a causal factor, is that with that batch of soap, I used the bottom-of-the bottle of DB FO, and maybe there was a different concentration of ingredients at the bottom of the bottle or some residue?  I don't and can't really know as that was not something I would look for when making soap. But, as I said, this has never happened before for me with DB, and it wasn't the first time I had used up the last of a bottle.  But it was the first time I had mixed BCN VS with DB, so that's how I came up with my interpretation.

Now I can't be sure. I'll keep an eye (or a nose) on it.




jcandleattic said:


> Really? That's so weird. I use BCN VS in every batch of soap I make, and Mad Oils DB is the only DB I use and I've never gotten a Root Beer scent.
> It's always smelled the same in the soap as it has OOB, possibly just a little less subtle.
> 
> As for VS changing the scent of my soaps, it does sometimes, but by the time a full cure is achieved, the weird chemically smell induced by the VS is gone (usually got by the time I cut it, but some scents are stubborn! LOL)


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## jcandleattic (Mar 9, 2021)

earlene said:


> Now I can't be sure. I'll keep an eye (or a nose) on it.


Yes, let us know. I mean, if the only variable is the VS, then it seems like there is something to it for you. Just another one of those weird soaping phenomena's. LOL


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