# help



## terr (Mar 22, 2015)

I am new to soap making and have made 3 batches all with different oils however all my soap batches come out brown even before adding any additives can anyone help me? please:?


----------



## Dorymae (Mar 22, 2015)

We would need the recipe to troubleshoot a cause for you.  Too many possibilities to go through with out one.


----------



## Susie (Mar 22, 2015)

Hey and welcome!  Please post the recipes(in weights, please), including additives, and we will be happy to troubleshoot with you.


----------



## terr (Mar 22, 2015)

hi this is the last recipie 
1 Palm Oil 35.00 0.386 6.17 175.00
2 Coconut Oil, 76 deg 30.00 0.331 5.29 150.00
3 Olive Oil 35.00 0.386 6.17 175.00
Totals 100.00 1.102 17.64 500.00

the one before was

1		Coconut Oil, 76 deg	50.00	0.551	8.82	250.00
2		Cocoa Butter	20.00	0.220	3.53	100.00
3		Safflower Oil	30.00	0.331	5.29	150.00
 	 	Totals	100.00	1.102	17.64	500.00
hope you can help

:???:


----------



## newbie (Mar 22, 2015)

DId you add any milk or anything else? What did you use for your liquids? Any fragrance added? And botanicals/clays etc.. added to the soap? And what level of brown did you get? If you could post a picture of the color, that would be helpful too.

I know you said no additives but just curious if you used only water and lye. The cocoa butter one might be a brownish (light) color because of the cocoa butter. The first recipe should be just an off-white because of the palm, but not brown. What type of OO do you use?


----------



## terr (Mar 22, 2015)

i used water for liquids first one was-


 	Pounds	Ounces	Grams
Water	0.838	13.40	380.00
Lye - NaOH	0.336	5.37	152.34
Oils	2.205	35.27	1,000.00
Fragrance	0.068	1.09	31.00
	3.447	55.15


the second one was 
Water 0.419 6.70 190.00
Lye NaOH
0.159 2.55 72.22
Oils 1.102 17.64 500.00
Fragrance 0.034 0.55 15.50

getting really despon:???:dant now!!


----------



## terr (Mar 22, 2015)

forgt to add that it goes a dark caramel colour sorry no photos as have chucked it all just in case!


----------



## Seawolfe (Mar 22, 2015)

What was the fragrance? Anything with vanilla will go brown. I had a grocery store tea tree oil go brown on me too. If it still smells and feels ok, then it's just cosmetic.


----------



## terr (Mar 22, 2015)

1st fragrance was rose oil 

2nd was jasmine 

however soap was brown before adding these
:???:


----------



## DeeAnna (Mar 22, 2015)

Yep, those soaps shouldn't be brown unless your fragrance is the culprit. But, oh, gosh, don't throw the soaps away!!! There's probably nothing wrong with them that an "attitude adjustment" won't cure. I mean this as a gentle tease, but there's truth in it -- sometimes we get locked into one way of viewing a situation and later find out the situation is not at all the way we first perceive it to be.

edit: Okay, just read your last post and I'm confused -- you explained the soap was brown before adding the fragrance. Can you explain your method of making your soap, please?


----------



## DeeAnna (Mar 22, 2015)

Also, what equipment are you using to make soap -- are you using any aluminum items, perhaps?


----------



## terr (Mar 22, 2015)

i weighed all the fats, mixed the lye and water and when oils were fully melted added the lyewater and used stick blender to acheive thick trace, I then put crock on low for 15 mins then checked on it and it was already going brown! i checked again after 15 mins and stirred it then left  it for 30 mins until it was like brown vaseline then added my flavourings and colours ( however none of the colours actually worked !

I dont really want to give up but whats the point ? Everybody elses soap looks lovely and mine looks like dog sick!

:???:


----------



## terr (Mar 22, 2015)

no aluminuim my pot is earthnware and everything else is stainless steel or glass use disposable pots for the lye and fragrances


----------



## TVivian (Mar 22, 2015)

You soap was probably going through a gel phase where it turns dark and translucent. After it's done doing that, and you put it in the mold, it lightens up again!


----------



## Seawolfe (Mar 22, 2015)

Yeah the translucent phase in hot process is a golden brown color for every soap Ive seen. Kind of like this:


----------



## terr (Mar 22, 2015)

yes thats exactly what mine looked like was it fully cooked then? or should i have cooked it longer?


----------



## newbie (Mar 22, 2015)

You could have just molded it then and let it cool. It would have lightened up as it cooled, maybe not to snow white but definitely whiter. See the color of the cooled portions on the wall of the crockpot? that's the color that soap will be when it cools.


----------



## Susie (Mar 22, 2015)

And there is no need to cook the soap.  Just get it to trace, and pour into a mold.  Let it sit out at room temperature and go through gel phase in center so you know what that looks like.  There is nothing wrong with it, even if it ends up a bit two-toned due to partial gel.


----------



## Dorymae (Mar 22, 2015)

Were you using distilled water?  The only thing I can think of is if the water you used had a high iron content that may have reacted with the soap to make it brown.


----------



## terr (Mar 22, 2015)

yes distilled water so I would have been fine with that ! sugar cant believe that i just threw it away  still at least i know now and the next batch i will save and show YAY ! while on the subject what do you ladies usee too colour your soap and will the next one turn out white?


----------



## DeeAnna (Mar 22, 2015)

Oh.... Obviously what I thought to be brown is quite different than what Terr means. A great example of "50 Shades of Brown".

Soap batter can be many colors. The color of the batter is not always the color of the finished soap. One of my soaps was bright lemon yellow when I poured the batter into the mold, but the finished soap bars were ivory colored.

Pure white is going to be tough without adding a white pigment. In general the finished color of the soap will depend on the oils you use and the fragrance and other things you add to the soap. I expect the color of my soaps to be ivory to light tan most of the time if I don't add anything unusual.


----------



## newbie (Mar 22, 2015)

I would do a little more reading before your next batch so you have a better idea what to expect and you won't get thrown off. I would also use cheaper oils to start (rather than 30% cocoa butter) so if you have a botch, it's not a very expensive mistake. A good basic starting recipe is something like:

40% tallow/palm/lard
40% olive oil
15% coconut oil
5% castor

Here is a picture of batter poured in the mold on the left, starting to gel in the middle picture and at full gel on the right. Once it cools from gel stage it will be lighter than that brown color. Get a few good batches under your belt before you start adding colors and all, so you get the hang of it. That way you are familiar with the basic process before you make it more complicated.


----------



## Susie (Mar 22, 2015)

Awesome pics, there!  PERFECT examples of gel.


----------



## not_ally (Mar 22, 2015)

That middle picture is why I either CPOP or refrigerate.


----------



## Seawolfe (Mar 22, 2015)

Terr, why are you making your first soaps as hot process instead of cold process? There are fewer steps in cold process. 

I only cook my 2-4 lb HP batches about 30-40 min (until they don't zap and look like that picture of soap in the pot), and then cool, color, scent and mold.


----------



## terr (Mar 23, 2015)

the reason i started with hp was family demand!! however will try your recipe with cold process and i will let you know how i get on , thanks sooo much , by the way what colourants do you use in your soaps??


x


----------



## The Efficacious Gentleman (Mar 23, 2015)

Regardless of family damand, HP soap still needs the same cure as CP, well I would even say it needs more of a cure than CP.  Sure, it is able to be used sooner, but that does not mean that it is anything near ready to be used.


----------



## El_Granado_Loco (Mar 23, 2015)

Hi terr! Good to see your soap is fine!
For adding colour, there is a great variety to choose from.
Apart from pigments, you can use clays, cocoa powder, paprika, indigo. There are also things like spirulina, alkanet root and lots more that other people can suggest, in which I don't have any experience because I can't find them easily. But what I can suggest is natural stevia powder for green and carrot oil for orange. 
A little honey will turn your soap a little brown, in the sense you describe it in your post.
You can also try micas and oxides, but I can't advise you on those either.
Good luck!


----------



## Susie (Mar 23, 2015)

I use only stuff I can find in the grocery store for colorants:  Paprika, annato, coffee(liquid), cocoa, turmeric.  I have lots of allergies, so I tend to stick to things I know are safe for me.

I infuse the paprika and annato into liquid oils.  I use the cocoa and turmeric dry mixed into the oils before adding the lye water.  I use the coffee as a water substitute.  I have tried using tea as water substitute, but the color does not come out right.


----------



## dixiedragon (Mar 23, 2015)

Stuff you can find without going on the internet - cocoa, dried parsley, beta carotene (snip the capsule and squeeze, the capsule won't dissolve in the soap.) For WHITE soap, you can use titanium dioxide. Most of us order it online, but you can get small bottles of icing color at places like Hobby Lobby, Michael's, etc. The brand is Wilton's. Look for the white that has titanium dioxide in the ingredients. You can also use their red if it contains Red Dye #40. I think that's the number.

ETA: if you decide to order ingredients online, make sure the colorants are approved for CP. There are some things that work wonderfully in MP but don't work in CP. I love Brambleberry, TKB trading, and Nurture soap supplies b/c they include pictures of the colorant in CP.


----------



## terr (Mar 23, 2015)

thanks wow what a lot of resources for colouring !! cant wait to try these on my soap will now do cp I think


----------

