# How Important is Sodium Lactate?



## MellonFriend (Jul 6, 2021)

I'm trying to decide whether to buy some sodium lactate for my first soap making attempts.  Brambleberry makes it sound like it's absolutely essential, which I know it's not, but does it really make the soap that much better?  How many of you don't use it?


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## The_Phoenix (Jul 6, 2021)

I have never ever ever used it.


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## glendam (Jul 6, 2021)

I have used it, but not in a while.  My recipe doesn’t seem to need it.  If you are using silicone molds and your recipe has a high amount of liquid oils, it will help with removal from the mold, but so would freezing the soap for an hour prior to removal, usually.


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## AliOop (Jul 7, 2021)

I don't use it if I'm using vinegar for my lye solution. I sometimes use it if my recipe has more liquid oils or more water than normal. But I have a love-hate relationship with SL because I feel like it can make chalky spots in soaps that are poured at emulsion for swirling, etc.


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## KiwiMoose (Jul 7, 2021)

I use it sometimes.  But I don't think it's at all essential for starting out.  What type of mold do you plan on using? If it's silicone ( loaf or cavity moulds) then maybe, but you could equally just dissolve a teaspoon of fine table salt into your water before adding the lye for the same effect.  or just not worry about it at all.


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## Juggsy (Jul 7, 2021)

I have a love hate/relationship with SL big time. I love it in shampoo bars and I use it in some formulations, but in soap, I don't always have success. I find it finicky I'm not sure if it's me or not. Some formulas it works in, some it doesn't. I know Soap Queen/Bramble Berry is popular but I don't watch videos (i never wear my hearing aids and struggle with youtube because subtitles are BS) so I've not really looked at them. I know that ASS* (Aussie Soap Supplies) promotes their videos which is crazy to me as everything is in ounces and not metric.


*Remember it's only the US that officially spells ARSE as ASS... although it did stop us from naming our daughter Amélie Samara because so many people spell it the American way - which is something that I take issue with, I wish I didn't but, we are supposed to spell in English over here not American English which is only different all because you lot (well ancestors) wanted to .... ... the old king  just like driving on the wrong side of the road hehehehehehehe (I am teasing you all, please remember that)


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## ResolvableOwl (Jul 7, 2021)

Never saw much advantage of lactate in CP, it rather imparts the danger of a chalky finish if dosed (too) generously. I have issues with unmoulding patience anyway, regardless if it's 8 hours or 72 hours in the mould.

In HP, however, it is a highly valuable ingredient to get the batter, after cooking, from the consistency of half-set concrete, down to pancake batter.

Instead of relying on lactate to speed up early soap unmoulding experience, I'd rather recommend to choose a recipe that is well-behaved by itself in the first place.


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## earlene (Jul 7, 2021)

IMO SL is not necessary, however many soapers do use it and say their soap benefits from it by virtue of faster unmolding and harder soap.  Although not everyone notices significant differences after cure.

If you want to make your soap harden faster to get it out of the mold sooner, you can make your own SL by purchasing the powder and mixing it up yourself.  I suspect there is probably a cost savings that way.









						How to Make Sodium Lactate at Home - ProfitableVenture
					

Sodium lactate in soap is commonly used to harden the resulting soap bar. There are many ways to affect the hardness of your bar, but sodium lactate is very popular with soap makers. At a usage rate of 1 teaspoon per pound of oils in your base soap making recipe, it is economical and a...




					www.profitableventure.com
				




More about SL: https://classicbells.com/soap/lactate.asp

There are many online sources for the powder, as well as the pre-mixed liquid.

Here are some threads where the use of SL has been discussed and different views on whether to use it or not:






						Sodium Lactate vs Salt & Sugar
					

Since returning to CP soaping I've decided to spread my wings. I'm looking at options for hardening my soaps and have decided not to use Stearic acid due to it's likely palm content. Now I'm contemplating SL or just using Salt & Sugar. Reading the reviews for SL on Brambleberry, I'm a bit...




					www.soapmakingforum.com
				








						Replacement for sodium lactate
					

I have been reading recently about the benefits of adding sodium lactate to HP soap.  Since it proves to be difficult to purchase in my area, does anybody know of an other ingredient with similar qualities ?




					www.soapmakingforum.com
				








						Any substitute for Sodium lactate  ?
					

To make the bars harder?  I think I read somewhere sea salt would work?   Any information, specially if it could be already in my kitchen cabinet will be much appreciated.




					www.soapmakingforum.com
				




From those you can see some folks suggest using plain table salt to harden soap, or vinegar (which when mixed with lye will create sodium acetate to harden soap - calculations are required). 

For the new (beginner) soap maker, I would suggest save your money and just use table salt.  Later if you want to explore using vinegar, read up on the related threads how to do that (*link* to @topofmurrayhill's vinegar to harden soap phase II thread).

IF you ever choose to trial using vinegar in soap, the calculations are done for you in this calculator:  Soapmaking Recipe Builder & Lye Calculator


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## Rick Jarvis (Jul 7, 2021)

I use it. Been so long I don't recall why I started. Probably a thread like this. My soaps come out of my silicone molds easily. I have never seen the chalkiness. It's inexpensive so whether or not it is a placebo or a real helper isn't worth the time to experiment. It seems to work. I have no complaints about softness. I'll keep using it.


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## MellonFriend (Jul 7, 2021)

Thanks everyone for your input.  I think I'll hold off on it for right now.  I feel like if I don't try without it, I might think I'll always need it.  No silicone molds yet either.



Juggsy said:


> *Remember it's only the US that officially spells ARSE as ASS... although it did stop us from naming our daughter Amélie Samara because so many people spell it the American way - which is something that I take issue with, I wish I didn't but, we are supposed to spell in English over here not American English which is only different all because you lot (well ancestors) wanted to .... ... the old king  just like driving on the wrong side of the road hehehehehehehe (I am teasing you all, please remember that)


Haha, this is really funny.   My mother's initials before she was married were ASG and she married my dad whose last name starts with "S"...


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## Obsidian (Jul 7, 2021)

I bought some years ago and never really seen a difference with it. It is handy in HP to help keep it fluid but it never hardened my soaps.


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## jcandleattic (Jul 7, 2021)

Is SL necessary? no, it isn't, however, I personally use it in every soap as I feel it gives the soaps a "slip" feeling that it doesn't have without it. Also it helps me unmold my soaps faster than if I don't use it.


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## amd (Jul 7, 2021)

I agree with @earlene it's really not necessary for CP soap, I found that salt was better performing than SL. A shame because I have 16oz on my shelf that's been there for years...


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## AliOop (Jul 7, 2021)

Juggsy said:


> *Remember it's only the US that officially spells ARSE as ASS...


Hate to burst your bubble, but calling someone an "ass" is a reference to donkeys, aka asses, which are stubborn, obnoxious creatures.

The correct spelling for that animal name is "ass," not "arse." Thus, the correct spelling for the pejorative is also "ass."

_(and now you know why my friends call me Grammar Girl.  Some times they say it like that's a bad thing? )_

But I completely agree that the metric system is far superior to the Imperial; wish the US had switched way back when. I'd even be willing to go through the pain to switch now.


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## Becky1024 (Jul 7, 2021)

It's not essential. Since you are a beginning soap maker you want to keep your recipe simple. It's easy for a beginner to make a mistake with a complex recipe. Sodium lactate is useful for hardening up the soap quicker so you can unmold it sooner, but if your soap is too soft to unmold you can either wait for a day or two or freeze it. Or add a little table salt in the next batch. Much easier for a beginner! Sodium lactate also gives fluidity to HP soaps so they are easier to pour into the mold, but again that is not essential for a beginner. Once you get more experience and have a recipe you like but want to improve it, then it is time to try.

I probably was making soap about 5 years before I tried sodium lactate. It improved the fluidity of my HP soaps and I use it all the time now with my HP recipes. I tried it in my CP soaps and frankly table salt works just as well and is cheaper so that is what I use.


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## Zing (Jul 7, 2021)

It's not essential but it's in every batch I make, mostly because I am an impatient man and like to unmold in 24 hours.  I use silicone molds.  I use it at 3% of total oil weight.
*must resist urge to rant on U.S. measurement system*


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## dibbles (Jul 7, 2021)

I have used sodium lactate in all my batches since I started making soap. I guess I wouldn't necessarily have to use it, but the few times I've forgotten to add it I have noticed a difference in the time it takes to unmold. I primarily use silicone lined wood molds and gel my soap.


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## KiwiMoose (Jul 7, 2021)

AliOop said:


> _(and now you know why my friends call me Grammar Girl.  Some times they say it like that's a bad thing? )_


Grammar wars!  
I have a Masters in Applied Linguistics ( but still always guilty of typos and other errors when not paying attention).
Ass is technically an animal, yes, but I have noticed the use of it in the USA can be inclined to indicate that it is someone's backside (what Americans would call a fanny, but let's not even go there, right @Juggsy?) For example: He needs a good kick up the ass. And of course there's always the use of it followed by the word 'hole'.
I'm so sorry @MellonFriend - back to our regular programming now: Sodium lactate.


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## Juggsy (Jul 7, 2021)

AliOop said:


> Hate to burst your bubble, but calling someone an "ass" is a reference to donkeys, aka asses, which are stubborn, obnoxious creatures.
> 
> The correct spelling for that animal name is "ass," not "arse." Thus, the correct spelling for the pejorative is also "ass."
> 
> ...


Haha, I was going to mention "ass" as in donkey. But, I'd argue that the etymology of our colloquium "arse" is older. The roots are Germanic. Originally it was a polite way of saying bum, but, by time king Henry VIII was around, it was used colloquially. It was only around the 19th century, that the American "ass" emerged.

Interestingly, we pronounce ass (as in the animal) to rhyme with ‘mass’, and arse to rhyme with ‘farce’.

There'd be some who'd argue they are interchangeable, but only to a point, in my opinion.

We don't use it colloquially to mean donkey, but rather, the human or animal posterior. As in, "you are the donkey's arse"

I had an etymology obsession for a while, absolutely love looking at where words came from.


I know this is completely off topic. I apologise 

@KiwiMoose haha, great minds, we were obviously typing at the same time


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## Steve85569 (Jul 7, 2021)

Still haven't used SL.
I do use salt or vinegar. I've even made sodium acetate out of vinegar and dried it for storage.

I measure mass in grams and soap by mass - not weight. 
I do still measure volume with imperial measurements. Probably because all the good cookie ( cracker to some of you) recipes are listed in imperial.
I tend to celebrate our differences as well. It would be a boring existence if all I had was a world full of me.


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## MellonFriend (Jul 7, 2021)

Juggsy said:


> I know this is completely off topic. I apologise


It's okay guys, I actually am sort of a knowledge nut as a result of having a sister who is a knowledge connoisseur.  I've learned both what I needed to from this thread and more so it's all good.


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## KiwiMoose (Jul 7, 2021)

Steve85569 said:


> Still haven't used SL.
> I do use salt or vinegar. I've even made sodium acetate out of vinegar and dried it for storage.
> 
> I measure mass in grams and soap by mass - not weight.


And mass rhymes with....


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## AliOop (Jul 7, 2021)

MellonFriend said:


> It's okay guys, I actually am sort of a knowledge nut as a result of having a sister who is a knowledge connoisseur.  I've learned both what I needed to from this thread and more so it's all good.


Hey everyone, reading the above, I'm not sure  but @MellonFriend might be politely telling us to stop going off like a bunch of arses and start our own thread on these random topics.


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## KiwiMoose (Jul 7, 2021)

MellonFriend said:


> It's okay guys, I actually am sort of a knowledge nut as a result of having a sister who is a knowledge connoisseur.  I've learned both what I needed to from this thread and more so it's all good.


...and more that you didn't want to know?


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## MellonFriend (Jul 7, 2021)

You guys are too funny! 

I should rename this thread: Sodium Lactate and The Etymology of Ass


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## AliOop (Jul 7, 2021)

PLEASE DO!!


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## Trinidad Kelly (Jul 8, 2021)

I have stopped using it as it's a costly expense for me. I have to import it to my country. So I only use it in my lotions and butters. I use regular sea salt in my water before adding my lye and use hard butters and oils up to 40% in my recipes. Soaps release easily from the molds. Saves money lol.


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## SPowers (Jul 8, 2021)

I've always used SL but that's only b/c I read it somewhere in my initial research and thought it would help.  Obviously I don't really have a clue if it helps since I've never made soap without it.  
I think when I run out of my  current supply, which will be soon, I won't rebuy until I try a few batches without it!  May as well save a few pennies if it's not necessary!


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## MellonFriend (Jul 8, 2021)

AliOop said:


> PLEASE DO!!


I tried, but I don't think I can edit the title.


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## AliOop (Jul 8, 2021)

MellonFriend said:


> I tried, but I don't think I can edit the title.


Oh it’s ok - I just had the late night sillies and was enjoying your good humor about it all.


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## earlene (Jul 8, 2021)

MellonFriend said:


> I tried, but I don't think I can edit the title.


No, you cannot.


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## Trinidad Kelly (Jul 8, 2021)

MellonFriend said:


> I'm trying to decide whether to buy some sodium lactate for my first soap making attempts.  Brambleberry makes it sound like it's absolutely essential, which I know it's not, but does it really make the soap that much better?  How many of you don't use it?


Oh forgot to say, I use salt at 1/2 tsp Per Pound Batch Oils. Dissolve in liquid before adding the lye.


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## Peachy Clean Soap (Jul 8, 2021)

Juggsy said:


> I have a love hate/relationship with SL big time. I love it in shampoo bars and I use it in some formulations, but in soap, I don't always have success. I find it finicky I'm not sure if it's me or not. Some formulas it works in, some it doesn't. I know Soap Queen/Bramble Berry is popular but I don't watch videos (i never wear my hearing aids and struggle with youtube because subtitles are BS) so I've not really looked at them. I know that ASS* (Aussie Soap Supplies) promotes their videos which is crazy to me as everything is in ounces and not metric.
> 
> 
> *Remember it's only the US that officially spells ARSE as ASS... although it did stop us from naming our daughter Amélie Samara because so many people spell it the American way - which is something that I take issue with, I wish I didn't but, we are supposed to spell in English over here not American English which is only different all because you lot (well ancestors) wanted to .... ... the old king  just like driving on the wrong side of the road hehehehehehehe (I am teasing you all, please remember that)


Precisely my thought's' "driving on the wrong side of the road"
  Beep Beep "Jackass" ( male donkey ).  of course i'm kidding.


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## cmzaha (Jul 8, 2021)

I can count on one hand the number of times I used SL in soap and that is because someone gave it to me and I wanted to use it up. When I first began soaping I did add salt but gave it up completely other than Soleseife and Salt bars, when I started soaping with vinegar. I just learned to formulate a hard bar which can be done with the addition of lard, tallow, palm, soy wax, shea butter, or cocoa butter.


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## Peachy Clean Soap (Jul 8, 2021)

Peachy Clean Soap said:


> Precisely my thought's' "driving on the wrong side of the road"
> Beep Beep "Jackass" ( male donkey ).  of course i'm kidding.


@ResolvableOwl 
I love my German Made Car'  Beep Beep.


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## Microchick (Jul 9, 2021)

Juggsy said:


> I have a love hate/relationship with SL big time. I love it in shampoo bars and I use it in some formulations, but in soap, I don't always have success. I find it finicky I'm not sure if it's me or not. Some formulas it works in, some it doesn't. I know Soap Queen/Bramble Berry is popular but I don't watch videos (i never wear my hearing aids and struggle with youtube because subtitles are BS) so I've not really looked at them. I know that ASS* (Aussie Soap Supplies) promotes their videos which is crazy to me as everything is in ounces and not metric.
> 
> 
> *Remember it's only the US that officially spells ARSE as ASS... although it did stop us from naming our daughter Amélie Samara because so many people spell it the American way - which is something that I take issue with, I wish I didn't but, we are supposed to spell in English over here not American English which is only different all because you lot (well ancestors) wanted to .... ... the old king  just like driving on the wrong side of the road hehehehehehehe (I am teasing you all, please remember that)


Gosh I miss Aussie humor...oops, humour


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