# Substitute for tallow?



## goldieloxj95 (Jul 15, 2011)

Hello, 

We are knew to soap making.. actually we are about to embark on our first soap making adventure. My husband and I think we have everything to get started, but we cannot find tallow. Do you know where we can buy it locally? Do you know a substitute that we may use instead of Tallow? How do we figure the substitution measurements?

We are going to make our basic soap, then branch out from there.. 

I would appreciate any help I can get :O)

Thanks!


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## krissy (Jul 15, 2011)

you can use use lard instead, you just have to run your new numbers through a soap calculator with the new oils. www.soapcalc.net is very useful.


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## Lindy (Jul 15, 2011)

I buy mine from the Butchers and Lard is a good substitute, or if you're wanting a vegetable replacement then Palm Oil is also a good substitute too.

Have fun.


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## jennikate (Jul 15, 2011)

Well i use fat from cooking beef render it to get tallow. Generally tallow is something you often go to meat dept of store ask about suet take it home and either boil it or fry it to end up with tallow. Lard is aval in baking section green and white  box most  stores ready to use. Either work well if you use lard instead of tallow make sure rerun recipe to check lye amount.


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## honor435 (Jul 15, 2011)

I dont use animal fats( but some do and it makes a nice hard bar), you can get palm oil from a online place called soapers choice. 
palm, olive oil, coconut and castor(more bubbly)would make a nice bar.


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## morrainewoods (Jul 15, 2011)

I use lard, and really love the texture of the bar.  You can easily buy it in the grocery store too.


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## goldieloxj95 (Jul 15, 2011)

*To Tallow or not to Tallow?... that is the question..*

We bought Canola oil AND Olive oil yesterday.. we were going to use both of them to make soap.. Will the olive oil substitute the Tallow and how much should I use?


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## NancyRogers (Jul 15, 2011)

You didn't say where you are, but if you have a Wal-Mart near you, their GV Shortening (not the veg. kind) has tallow and palm.  It makes fantastic soap and it's very affordable.  SoapCalc even has it on their list of oils/fats so no guess work about sap rates.


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## MsSharLee (Jul 15, 2011)

Wal-Mart carries Armor lard in tubs and blocks (ours does anyway) from my understanding lard actually is pig tallow ... its the pig fat rendered and all the impurites removed ... Fields Lard is excellent and very cheap if you have a Save A Lot they carry it.  It's somewhere in the area of $5 for a tub.


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## carebear (Jul 15, 2011)

In it's broadest sense, tallow means animal fat.  But in most of the US - tallow means beef fat and lard means pig fat.  

Soapcalc is quite specific about the type of fat.


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## Lindy (Jul 15, 2011)

Olive Oil is not going to be a sub for tallow.  Truly if you're willing to use animal fat then you really should get lard for your replacement - very easy to get.  Keep in mind that it is not a straight across switch so run your numbers through a lye calculator.


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## IrishLass (Jul 15, 2011)

I don't know where on the planet you are located, but if you are in the western half of the USA, there is a place called Smart & Final (a chain of restaurant supply stores that's open to the general public & with no membership fees). They sell ready-to-use beef tallow there in 50 lb cubes (at least the one by me does).

If you can't find beef tallow, the Walmart GV tallow/palm blend that NancyRogers mentioned looks like the next best thing since their properties are pretty close to each other (that's awesome that SoapCalc has a listing for it. I wasn't aware of that).

Lard is great, too (I _love_ lard), but like Lindy said, just be aware that lard is not exactly a straight across 1:1 sub for beef tallow. It's properties differ somewhat from beef tallow in that it produces a slightly softer, less bubbly and more conditioning soap. It still makes awesome soap, though. I actually like to use lard and tallow together. What one lacks, the other one makes up for.

Palm oil is a good veggie sub for beef tallow. It has a few slight differences, but makes a good, hard bar.

No matter which one you choose to sub out the tallow with (if you can't find tallow), just remember to run everything through a good online soap calculator like SoapCalc, among others, because each sub calls for differeing amounts of lye.

Oh, and like Lindy said- olive oil is not a sub for tallow. Their properties differ way too much from each other.

IrishLass


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## goldieloxj95 (Jul 15, 2011)

Thank you all for your help! I will look and see what we have available around us. I might have more questions.. so stay tuned ;O)


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## Lindy (Jul 15, 2011)

Irish Lass it never occurred to me to put Lard and Tallow together - what a great idea!  Thank you.


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## adoptapitbull (Jul 16, 2011)

You may also be able to find lard in Hispanic food stores. I believe it's calld "Manteca".

I buy the Walmart GV Shortening, the one with the fried chicken on the label. It's $3.38 here for a nice sized tub. The veggie shortening is right next to it, as is lard in a green and white package.

Be careful with canola...it is prone to DOS. Keep the % small and you should be OK.


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## lsg (Jul 16, 2011)

Palm oil is a good substitute for tallow.  If you don't want to order palm oil, the new formula Crisco contains palm oil.


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## Bama (Jul 16, 2011)

Thank you for sharing about the GV shortening. I want to try that. I love this forum. Learn something new and helpful all the time.


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## adoptapitbull (Jul 16, 2011)

The GV stuff has both tallow and palm, which I like because it saves money on buying palm! That stuff is not cheap!


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## goldieloxj95 (Jul 16, 2011)

AdoptaPitBull... What do you mean DOS?

I am getting a little confused.. Sorry guys    But what you are saying is... Instead of tallow I can buy shortening, whether it is Beef or PIg doesn't matter, and use that in place of the tallow.. Do I melt it down and use the exact weight as I would use for the tallow?

I think I am going to give it a try today.. Another question.. I know that the basic soap has to try for like 4-6 weeks before you can package it.. BUT does the basic soap have to try the whole 4-6 weeks BEFORE you can use it for handmilled soap? 

I thank all of you for your feedback.. this has been most helpful


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## krissy (Jul 16, 2011)

you can use either one in place of the tallow however you will have a different lye amount so you will need to run your recipe through a soap calculator. if you post the recipe you intended to use (with tallow) we can help you with a replacement recipe.


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## IrishLass (Jul 16, 2011)

goldieloxj95 said:
			
		

> AdoptaPitBull... What do you mean DOS?



Not AdoptaPitBull, but DOS, which is short for "Dreaded Orange Spots', is a common possibility with certain oils that are high in linoleic acid in soapmaking if too much are used in ones formula.

In appearance, a DOSsed soap is one that looks like it has come down with a case of orange-colored measles. It usually occurrs when too much of high linoleic acid oils are used in ones' formula, or if one used rancid oils in their formula. If you live in a climate with high humidity, it increases the chance of DOS.

What happens is this: the linoliec acid in the oil, which is very sensitive to heat and light, starts to break down and go rancid and show up as orange spots in your soap. It usually shows up about a month or more into cure. Canola oil, as well as soybean oil are both high in linoleic and are notorious DOSers in soap. They can be used successfully in soap, but you need to be savvy with them in terms of not going overboard with their usage amounts. Because of this problem, certain suppliers sell canola oil that is high in oleic acid as opposed to linoleic acid (the same for sunflower oil, too).



			
				goldieloxj95 said:
			
		

> I am getting a little confused.. Sorry guys    But what you are saying is... Instead of tallow I can buy shortening, whether it is Beef or PIg doesn't matter, and use that in place of the tallow.. Do I melt it down and use the exact weight as I would use for the tallow?



Yes, and yes, but make sure to run the recipe through a good lye calculator to get the correct amount of lye, because the lye amount will be different.



			
				goldieloxj95 said:
			
		

> I think I am going to give it a try today.. Another question.. I know that the basic soap has to try for like 4-6 weeks before you can package it.. BUT does the basic soap have to try the whole 4-6 weeks BEFORE you can use it for handmilled soap?



No- as long as the soap does not 'zap', you can use it for handmilling fresh out of the mold if you like. 



IrishLass


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## goldieloxj95 (Jul 16, 2011)

Ok, so this is my plan (let me know if I am doing it wrong please)... I am going to go buy some cheap shortening instead of making my own tallow. I will melt the shortening down to a liquid and measure it accordingly. I am going to use the recipe for the basic soap that I have and make sure that the lye is at the exact ratio it should be. 

Then after this sets.. I can handmill it and add what I like to the soap and then let this bar cure for about 4-6 weeks before packaging.. 

*Should I put the finished soap out in a storage shed to dry or keep it in the cool house? 

*What is Zap?

*How do I know that the soap turned out ok? 

Thank you for all the information    You are terrific


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## krissy (Jul 16, 2011)

goldieloxj95 said:
			
		

> Ok, so this is my plan (let me know if I am doing it wrong please)... I am going to go buy some cheap shortening instead of making my own tallow. I will melt the shortening down to a liquid and measure it accordingly. I am going to use the recipe for the basic soap that I have and make sure that the lye is at the exact ratio it should be.
> 
> Then after this sets.. I can handmill it and add what I like to the soap and then let this bar cure for about 4-6 weeks before packaging..
> 
> ...




you skipped running your new recipe through a soap calc. you absolutely HAVE to do that otherwise you could end up with a lye heavy batch.

you can store your soap in a closet, extra bedroom etc.

zap is when you touch your tongue tip to an inside cut of a bar and if you get a tingle/burning "zap" then it is still working on saponifying or it is lye heavy. leave it for a week and zap test again.

you will know your soap turned out ok once you have zap tested and inspected it. if there are no little white pockets in your soap and it doesn't zap, then you are good to go. you can use it right away but it will be very soft and not at it's best. if you wait 4 weeks it will be much better.
since you and hand milling (why are you going to do that?) you can grate up your soap and add whatever you intend once the soap no longer zaps.


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## goldieloxj95 (Jul 18, 2011)

Zap: so, I am supposed to cut into my new bars of soap each week to test them? 

Handmilling: I was going to make a basic soap, then use handmilling (because all the books I have been reading said this was the best way) to make different batches of soap with different ingreadients..?..

What is Soap Calc? All this terminology is confusing me    

Could you give me some instructions that you think I should follow? 

Thanks for all your help!


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## adoptapitbull (Jul 18, 2011)

goldieloxj95 said:
			
		

> Zap: so, I am supposed to cut into my new bars of soap each week to test them?
> 
> Handmilling: I was going to make a basic soap, then use handmilling (because all the books I have been reading said this was the best way) to make different batches of soap with different ingreadients..?..
> 
> ...



You'll want to cut the loaf into bars as soon as they are hard enough to do so. Usually 24-48 hours is long enough to harden up. Could be more, could be less. Don't panic!

Why do you want to hand mill? It's a lot of work! If you've made a great batch, then there is no need. Reserve handmilling and rebatching for soaps that have an ugly color, lack scent, or that are not "pretty". 

Soap Calc is the way to figure out how much lye is needed for your oils. You cannot just substitute tallow for olive oil or palm oil for canola. Each oil needs a different amount of lye.


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## goldieloxj95 (Jul 18, 2011)

Thanks again for your wisdom in soapmaking   

As far as handmilling.. How do you create different smelling soaps or try new recipes from a basic soap when you don't want the whole batch the same? How do YOU do it?

How do I figure out the Soap Calc? Is there a specific book you can recommend to me that I may get that has good recipes and calculations converts?

I have a book with calculation converts in the back.. but I guess my question is... How do you know how much fat your oils have to calculate with the lye? This is a lot of work   

Thanks again!


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## adoptapitbull (Jul 18, 2011)

Hey goldie, check your private messages.


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