# Do I need and MSDS to sell handmade soaps?



## oeyjay (Sep 30, 2013)

This weekend I was talking with an owner of a small store and asking if they would be interested in carrying our soap. His first question was, “do you have a MSDS?” This somewhat caught me off guard. As of now we are in a half dozen stores and have never been asked this question. Being one that wants to do things correctly, it brings up the question do we need one and are they difficult to get? I know that our material suppliers have them available to us as soap manufactures but it never crossed my mind that we would need one for our finished product.
Do we need and Material Safety Data Sheet for our soaps and where do we start on getting one?
Thanks, Joey


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## soap_rat (Oct 1, 2013)

"Oh no!  I dropped a bar of his soap!  It's a chemical spill!  What should I do, there's no MSDS?"
"OMG, I have his liquid soap all over my hands, HOW DO I GET IT OFF MEEEeeeeeeee"

Does he demand MSDSs for, say, handmade cards, too?

I'm sure someone can come along with a proper answer, but I would have been just as surprised as you!  
And now that I'm done making myself giggle about this, we'll find out that yes, we're all supposed to have MSDS for our soap.  :''''''''(      (I sure hope not)


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## savonierre (Oct 1, 2013)

I had to look and see if there is such a thing, there is so.
http://vermontsoap.com/private-label-and-bulk-organic-soap/material-safety-data/castile-bar-soap-msds/


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## dagmar88 (Oct 1, 2013)

soap_rat said:


> "Oh no!  I dropped a bar of his soap!  It's a chemical spill!  What should I do, there's no MSDS?"
> "OMG, I have his liquid soap all over my hands, HOW DO I GET IT OFF MEEEeeeeeeee"
> 
> Does he demand MSDSs for, say, handmade cards, too?



Can handmade cards hurt you when not made properly?


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## Saswede (Oct 1, 2013)

Lol!  I guess that handmade cards could cut your finger, Dagmar!  But that would be more about not using them properly than not making them properly!!  (Sorry - but it's difficult to be serious about this topic ....!  Particularly after some of the earlier posts!)


Sent from my iPad using Soap Making


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## dagmar88 (Oct 1, 2013)

I knew someone would give that reply as soon as I posted.


Coming from a country where cosmetics are regulated to the extreme, I'm always amazed by the lack of it in the USA.


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## Saswede (Oct 1, 2013)

I'm also based in Europe, Dagmar - so am very sensitive to the EU regulations too.  

But I'm afraid that my (weird and sadistic?) sense of humor got the better of me when I read soap rat's comments!  And the comments struck a chord because I was required to do a training course on how to deal with a chemical spill recently, before I could start work on a consulting project for a pharmaceutical client - and I work in the marketing department, which is located in offices about 50km away from the lab.s and manufacturing facilities .......  So the most hazardous substances in the entire site were the cleaning products!




Sent from my iPad using Soap Making


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## lsg (Oct 1, 2013)

Oejay, now that Savonierre has found you a sample form, just tailor it to fit your product. I wonder how they came up with the boiling point for a solid bar of soap.  I know other solid ingredients have a boiling point listed, but they usually come from big manufacturers with big labs.


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## grayceworks (Oct 1, 2013)

I like how technical they are... "Evaporation rate: slower than ether -- Vapor density: lighter than air"




savonierre said:


> I had to look and see if there is such a thing, there is so.
> http://vermontsoap.com/private-labe...p/material-safety-data/castile-bar-soap-msds/


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## oeyjay (Oct 1, 2013)

Question for ya’ll…  Is a MSDS something that can be writing by the company producing the soaps or is there a governing agency that must generate it or at least approve it?


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## DeeAnna (Oct 1, 2013)

If you are a supplier or manufacturer of chemicals, hazardous or not, technically yes you should be prepared to supply MSDS to your customers or the public upon request. Even for bar soap. For truly hazardous materials (highly explosive, reactive, flammable, or toxic materials), suppliers/manufacturers may be ~required~ to supply MSDS annually.

You can write MSDS yourself. Or you can hire someone to do it. There are specific requirements about what has to be in the MSDS, but the format is flexible. Most people use standardized forms, however. 

Examples of bar soap MSDS:
http://catalog.abejan.com/components/com_virtuemart/MSDS/PGC 32136.pdf
http://www.andersonsanitary.com/MSDS/Dial_Bar_Soap.pdf
http://vermontsoap.com/private-labe...p/material-safety-data/castile-bar-soap-msds/

Info for creating and maintaining MSDS:
http://www.ehso.com/cssmsds/msdsoverview.htm
http://www.safetyawakenings.com/how...ets-osha-tips-questions-dratt-outline-format/
http://www.msdswriter.com/learn_writer.cfm
http://www.ilpi.com/msds/faq/partc.html

As far as federal or state government approval ... none is required in the USA. But OSHA does reserve the right to review your MSDS and issue fines if the document does not provide all required information.


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## oeyjay (Oct 1, 2013)

Thanks


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## SugarandOats (Oct 1, 2013)

lolllll!


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## Robert (Oct 1, 2013)

I laughed at the statement on the MSDS of one ingredient I used that said it should be removed with soap & water, "Dammit, it is soap & water!"


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## DeeAnna (Oct 1, 2013)

Even though I wrote a few MSDS many moons ago, they were for chemicals that really were dangerous enough to need MSDS. I personally think MSDS are no more needed for handcrafted soap than they're needed for a Dove Beauty Bar. But if someone requests a MSDS, it be the rules that the earnest, hardworking, manufacturer shall supply same. As an engineer, I got used to doing scutwork like this -- just part of the job, unfortunately.


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## Hazel (Oct 2, 2013)

Briefly, MSDS is required to have only for occupational use, the hazards involved with working with the ingredients and to know how to safely handle them. (There is a lot of info on them but I’m not going into it.) This means you should have MSDS for all your ingredients in a binder just in case OSHA decides to drop in to take a peek at where you make soap and look at your paperwork. As far as I can tell, it is not required to provide a MSDS for consumers so I don't know why a retailer would ask for it. 

  I checked on the FDA site and couldn’t find any reference about having MSDS for cosmetic products. Of course, soap isn’t regulated by FDA but by the Consumer Product Safety Commission. I couldn’t find anything on that site, either. However, just because I couldn’t find anything, doesn’t mean there isn’t something mentioned. But I doubt it.

  However, as DeeAnna already mentioned, this person has asked for one so if you want the business, then you give it to the retailer. I think the first one would be the hardest to write. Once you have a template, you could basically copy and paste the info to cover your other soap.

Out of curiosity, has this store been in business for awhile?


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## Robert (Oct 2, 2013)

Hazel said:


> Briefly, MSDS is required to have only for occupational use, the hazards involved with working with the ingredients and to know how to safely handle them. (There is a lot of info on them but I’m not going into it.) This means you should have MSDS for all your ingredients in a binder just in case OSHA decides to drop in to take a peek at where you make soap and look at your paperwork. As far as I can tell, it is not required to provide a MSDS for consumers so I don't know why a retailer would ask for it.
> 
> I checked on the FDA site and couldn’t find any reference about having MSDS for cosmetic products. Of course, soap isn’t regulated by FDA but by the Consumer Product Safety Commission. I couldn’t find anything on that site, either. However, just because I couldn’t find anything, doesn’t mean there isn’t something mentioned. But I doubt it.


They've got nothing to do with MSDS, but the local fire code might.  The fire code might say that any time you have over X amount of a substance stored in a place, it needs a MSDS.


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## DeeAnna (Oct 2, 2013)

MSDS are regulated by OSHA, not the FDA. The info in an MSDS is intended to be used by emergency response teams when handling spills, fires, and other disasters and by workers to be informed about the basic health hazards of a material and to know how to provide basic first aid. A retailer has every right to have MSDS on file for these reasons -- also local governments may require businesses to maintain MSDS for their emergency response teams.


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## Hazel (Oct 3, 2013)

Thanks for explaining why a retailer might need MSDS.

And yes to everyone, I know MSDS is regulated by OSHA. If you look at the first paragraph in my above post, I stated it was in case OSHA showed up (which is actually a possibility if someone has a larger soap business and has employees). I used to have to deal with them and make sure all MSDS were in our big black book. I searched FDA and CPSC sites to see if they mentioned any regulations about MSDS because I was trying to be thorough. I didn't want to state FDA and CPSC wasn't concerned about MSDS without actually make sure of it.


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