# 50:50 lard:olive oil. The results are in.



## Missmoneypenny (Oct 8, 2013)

I mentioned I'd post after I'd tried the above mentioned soap. Well, it was only the 2nd batch I ever made, after a 100% olive oil soap. It compares pretty well in terms of hardness (a little harder) and lather (larger, creamier bubbles). It is not at all drying on the skin. I also used lavender infused oil, I think about 60% of the olive oil was thus perfumed. However I noticed that over the course of the curing  the perfume got feinter and feinter. It is now just about discernible, and I find that as the soap wears on the perfume gets stronger ie it was very weak in the new bar, but half way through using it up you can smell the lavender better. I have to say though that if you sniff hard there is also a fatty, lardy smell. 
I would make this bar again, it is very economical (50 pence per bar, that's about 70 cents) and performs well, but maybe add some lavender essential oil during saponification to mask the lardy smell.


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## MOGal70 (Oct 8, 2013)

I Love a bar with a high percentage of lard!


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## Obsidian (Oct 8, 2013)

One of my first batches was 100% unscented lard. I really liked it but after nearly three months it still had a piggy smell so I rebatched and added some cucumber mint FO. Everyone who uses it, really likes it.


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## savonierre (Oct 8, 2013)

Lard makes an awesome soap, for sure..


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## MidwestSoaper (Oct 8, 2013)

Most of my soaps contain a high %age of lard.  I usually melt the CO and then add the lard, being careful not to get it too hot.  The oldest control bit of soap I have, nearly 2 years old, still does not smell piggy.


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## Missmoneypenny (Oct 9, 2013)

Yes, I realise lard is not a good selling point and yet it makes really good soap, it appears. I m only a hobbyist and have no problems using a by product of the meat industry ( you could argue that's also what milk is). Next up,I 'm going to try using beef fat. My favourite commercial soap is from a French brand and lists  sodium tallowate in the ingredients- a nice way of disguising the fact it 's got beef fat!


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## shunt2011 (Oct 9, 2013)

I too love lard in my soap.  I have a couple recipes I use it in.  Customers don't seem to mind it at all.  I also have all veggie oil soaps if they have a preference.


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## cm4bleenmb (Dec 9, 2013)

*lard and soapcalc numbers*

I was told by a very experienced soaper that soaps with lard and tallow were more likely to give you that 'ring-around-the-bathtub' effect but I keep seeing all these comments online from people who love to use it and claim the soaps are wonderful. I would like a basic recipe for a good, white soap and am finding that the numbers soapcalc gives me don't always seem to make sense with the information I read about the properties of the individual oils I plug in. How am I to interpret it when I put in an oil that is supposed to make a hard bar and it gives me a rating of 30? Would I be correct in thinking that even the low numbers are going to be a reasonably firm bar? And a low cleansing number is still going to get my skin clean?

I may as well just go for it, a one pound batch won't cost that much. 

Unrelated question: will using brewed coffee for my water give my soap any scent?


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## Cashie (Dec 9, 2013)

I can answer the unrelated question! The coffee scent will get killed by the lye. I use coffee quite a bit because I like how it looks in the ingredients list.  for scent, I use a fragrance oil.


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## DeeAnna (Dec 9, 2013)

"...How am I to interpret it when I put in an oil that is supposed to make a hard bar and it gives me a rating of 30? ..."

That's probably plenty hard enough. There's also a difference, by the way, between hard-like-a-rock and long lasting. They aren't necessarily the same.

"...Would I be correct in thinking that even the low numbers are going to be a reasonably firm bar? ..."

If 30 is "low", then yes, you'll be fine, unless you use a high superfat percentage or include additives, neither of which are included in "the numbers" you are talking about.

"...And a low cleansing number is still going to get my skin clean?..."

Yes, and soap with a relatively low "cleansing" number will get you clean without stripping all the oil off your skin.

To be honest, "cleansing" is a misnomer for this particular number, because too many newbies misinterpret what that means. 

ALL soap cleans, even a true castile with a "cleansing" of zero. A soap with a high "cleansing" number is a soap that is highly soluble in cold, hard, and/or salt water. If you need a soap for those purposes, design a soap with a high cleansing number. 

For a basic bath bar that is mild, not overly drying, however, you might design a soap with cleansing from zero to perhaps 20. My goal for my soap recipes is zero to 10 for the cleansing number.


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## cm4bleenmb (Dec 9, 2013)

Thank you all for your input. One of my biggest challenges in soap making has nothing to do with the soap, it's getting over the idea that every batch I make has to be perfect. Intellectually I know that every batch gains me something much more valuable than a bar of soap because it gains me knowledge but in my heart, it is hard to accept sometimes. Guess I'll just need to keep on soaping until I learn my lesson!


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## dixiedragon (Dec 9, 2013)

cm4bleenmb said:


> I was told by a very experienced soaper that soaps with lard and tallow were more likely to give you that 'ring-around-the-bathtub' effect but I keep seeing all these comments online from people who love to use it and claim the soaps are wonderful. I would like a basic recipe for a good, white soap and am finding that the numbers soapcalc gives me don't always seem to make sense with the information I read about the properties of the individual oils I plug in. How am I to interpret it when I put in an oil that is supposed to make a hard bar and it gives me a rating of 30? Would I be correct in thinking that even the low numbers are going to be a reasonably firm bar? And a low cleansing number is still going to get my skin clean?
> 
> I may as well just go for it, a one pound batch won't cost that much.
> 
> Unrelated question: will using brewed coffee for my water give my soap any scent?



IME, homemade soap does give more of that "ring around the tub" affect that store bought. Probably the things we love - the glycerin and other unsaponifiables - contribute to that.

Soap calc - in my inexpert opinion, the soap calc hardness number refers to how hard the soap is when it is fairly new. Soaps with a high hardness score will be much harder a day or two after soaping than a low number. A soap high in olive oil will eventually get very hard. OTOH, soaps with a lot of canola and soy (IME), tend to stay on the softer side.

Coffee - when I make coffee soap, I don't brew coffee, I just chuck a lot of grounds in the lye water. My soap does have a faint coffee scent. I think it comes from the grounds.


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## judymoody (Dec 9, 2013)

cm4bleenmb said:


> Unrelated question: will using brewed coffee for my water give my soap any scent?



No, but adding some very finely ground coffee beans will leave some scent.


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## mbaldwin (Dec 10, 2013)

An unscented high percent lard soap was my first, and it has the pig smell if you put your nose right up to it, but it is not really all that noticeable. Maybe the smell depends on where the lard is purchased from? Not sure. I used the same shelf stable lard for my soaps and pie crusts. I would like to get some fresh lard from my brother who works at a packing plant.

Michael


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## lsg (Dec 10, 2013)

I like a lard and rice bran oil bar.  I add coconut oil and a little Castor oil for more bubbles.


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## DeeAnna (Dec 10, 2013)

"...homemade soap does give more of that "ring around the tub" affect that store bought. Probably the things we love - the glycerin and other unsaponifiables - contribute to that...."

Well, no, the additives and unsaponifiables do not create soap scum. It is the reaction of a water-soluble sodium soap with the minerals in hard water -- calcium and magnesium -- to form insoluble calcium soap or magnesium soap. If you have soft water, you won't get too much (or any) soap scum. If you have hard water, you will get more, sometimes a lot more.

Commercial "soaps" are a blend of non-soap detergents and "true" soap or are wholly non-soap based cleansers. Non-soap detergents remain soluble in hard water, so no soap scum and no bathtub ring.

As an aside, insoluble soaps based on calcium, magnesium, or lithium do have a useful purpose, just not in the bathroom. These soaps can be used as lubricants for machinery.


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## lsg (Dec 10, 2013)

Adding Tetrasodium EDTA to your soap is supposed to reduce soap scum.


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## girlishcharm2004 (Dec 10, 2013)

I wonder if adding Tetrasodium EDTA would be good in a shampoo bar to reduce the residue build-up in the hair.


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## Lin (Dec 10, 2013)

A filtering shower head can make a huge difference for those with hard water. I first got one when I moved into an apartment and the water was so hard that I started to get this buildup in my hair, right where the water was hitting my head while standing in the shower. I tried all sorts of stuff before I realized it was being caused by the water. It went completely away after the filtering showerhead. 

Apple cider vinegar rinse can also help rinse out soap scum left behind in your hair after washing with shampoo bars. This is enough for many people, and it also helps seal the cuticle on the hair and conditions on its own. And some people will use bottled distilled water for a final rinse of their hair.


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## cm4bleenmb (Dec 19, 2013)

*another soap calc question*

Everyone has been so helpful, I really appreciate the willingness of you all to share your hard-earned knowledge. As someone who only plans to make soap for myself and a little bit of gifting, I have found it invaluable--it has shortened the learning curve considerably.
I have another question about interpreting the soapcalc numbers. I decided I should just go to some tried and true recipes from experienced soapers instead of starting right out making up my own and like a good little soaper, I run any recipe through a lye calculator before I think about using it. I was hoping I could learn something by comparing the numbers with the book's description of the soap.
The recipe I'm using for an example is from a book by Delores Boone, in the description she says that the oils are easy to obtain and are economical but have minimal conditioning. It uses canola, castor, CO, and OO and soapcalc gives it a 79 for conditioning. Isn't that the high end of the range? 
On another occasion, I decided to keep increasing the percentage of cocoa butter (because I had read it contributed to hardness) and see what it said. But every time I raised it, the hardness number went down! And it didn't help with the conditioning at all. I'm beginning to think there's no point in looking at those numbers at all and that's kind of discouraging because for someone who won't make pounds and pounds of soap, being able to use something like that to help choose what to do could be so helpful.


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## The Efficacious Gentleman (Dec 19, 2013)

cm4bleenmb said:


> Everyone has been so helpful, I really appreciate the willingness of you all to share your hard-earned knowledge. As someone who only plans to make soap for myself and a little bit of gifting, I have found it invaluable--it has shortened the learning curve considerably.
> I have another question about interpreting the soapcalc numbers. I decided I should just go to some tried and true recipes from experienced soapers instead of starting right out making up my own and like a good little soaper, I run any recipe through a lye calculator before I think about using it. I was hoping I could learn something by comparing the numbers with the book's description of the soap.
> The recipe I'm using for an example is from a book by Delores Boone, in the description she says that the oils are easy to obtain and are economical but have minimal conditioning. It uses canola, castor, CO, and OO and soapcalc gives it a 79 for conditioning. Isn't that the high end of the range?
> On another occasion, I decided to keep increasing the percentage of cocoa butter (because I had read it contributed to hardness) and see what it said. But every time I raised it, the hardness number went down! And it didn't help with the conditioning at all. I'm beginning to think there's no point in looking at those numbers at all and that's kind of discouraging because for someone who won't make pounds and pounds of soap, being able to use something like that to help choose what to do could be so helpful.



I think this might have been worth a whole new thread - a little bit of a hijack of this thread.

In answer, CO will up the cleansing figure and most people use less than 25% CO unless they're making a salt bar.


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## cm4bleenmb (Dec 19, 2013)

You are so right Efficacious Gentleman, and I apologize. It would be an interesting thread, I am very curious to see what others have to say about it. I think I will take my last post and start one!

Nevermind, I found this and hopefully it will start some more discussion: http://www.soapmakingforum.com/showthread.php?t=33563


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