# CP LS not working



## jnl (Aug 28, 2015)

I have tried the CP method for LS three times now and it has only worked once, the first time.

The last time, it took FOREVER to get thick, and after it got really thick i covered it up and wrapped towles around it. even a couple days later the pheno tests was still bright pink.  so eventually i threw it in a pot and melted it (it easily melted to a liquid, just with a smidge of water added.....so strange).  and its been sitting in the pot on my stove for a month (ph meter died right after i used it the first time.  stupid thing.)

i just did another batch, this time with 40% hard oils.  and it took FOREVER to get thick.  and after i wrapped it up and let it sit for like an hour, its still testing bring pink with the pheno.

i do the 1/3 water with the KOH....then i add 2/3 glycerin.  did that way all 3 times.  first time that it worked it was 100% olive oil.  then i did a mix of 70% CO and 30% sunflower and that one took forever to trace and never fully worked.  this batch is a bunch of different oils, 40% hard.

im going to head out and try to find some more batteries for my PH meter so i can test that old batch to see if the PH is safe.


anyone have any idea why the CP method is not working?

there is one difference......i used "normal" glycerin the first time...made from palm.  and the last 2 times i used glycerin made from sweet potatoes (so says the supplier - cranberry lane).


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## IrishLass (Aug 28, 2015)

How are you testing with phenol, and what color are you expecting? 

I ask because to properly test with phenol, one must first make a 1% solution out of 1 gram soap dissolved in 99 grams distilled water, and then you add the phenol drops to that. Most soapers I've seen testing with phenol on YouTube just drop the phenol onto their soap paste, which is the wrong way to test with pheno. But even if you do it correctly, it is very hard to judge the pH unless you have a really good eye for different shades of pink, since pheno turns various shades of pink from 8.2 pH to 12 pH (which for the most part- other than 12- is the normal pH range for lye-based soaps), and is clear from 0 pH - 8.2 pH, and also clear again over 12 pH. 

If you are hoping for clear, how will you know if your paste has a pH of over 12 or below 8.2? (it could go either way).

Since the actual pH does not matter as much as lye-excess matters, the best way to check for lye excess is the zap test (not phenol). Have you zap tested the paste?


IrishLass


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## jnl (Aug 28, 2015)

putting a little paste on paper town and putting pheno drops on top.  its coming out electric pink.  i know its not the most accurate way, but its fairly accurate when it comes out bright pink.

im NOT zap testing it when its that pink, that hurts.
ive done it before
when its a pale pink i zap test it

and the last batch that failed i could tell just by looking at it that it wasnt done cause there was a tiny bit of oil sitting on top (of a 0% SF batch).


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## jnl (Aug 28, 2015)

do i need to recalibrate my ph meter after new batteries?  it was just calibrated last time i used it (about a month ago)


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## jnl (Aug 28, 2015)

just pheno tested paste again and it was a pale pink so i zap tested
no "zap" but it does taste a bit chemical (different than a light zap for a NaOH soap, which to me usually tastes "sour" when its a little lye heavy, and "salty" when its very close to done)...so i think its ALMOST done.  i will give it another hour or so and then throw it in the pot.

strange...i could taste the cocoa butter in there....
while i was mixing it it smelled strongly of cocoa butter, which is not usual for the cocoa butter i have....and it still smells strongly of cocoa butter, tho usually my cocoa butter scent is totally gone once saponified.  this is the first time i have used it in liquid soap, so maybe it holds its scent more in liquid soap.

so its working better this time, tho still taking much longer than the other people who are having it ready after like 20 min (which was how it was for me the first time i did it too).


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## Susie (Aug 28, 2015)

If you would post the recipes in weights, and document your entire process, we can troubleshoot.  It is difficult to try to figure out what is going on from what you said above.  

Also, the pH meter is not going to tell us anything useful either.  I never trust phenolpthalein after seeing every paper towel turn it pink.  If you absolutely won't zap test, at least try a clarity test.  That will at least tell us if all the oil has been saponified.


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## jnl (Aug 28, 2015)

i did zap test.

i just wont zap test when the pheno comes out neon pink, cause thats going to be a painful test.  lol

i think its good now, it just needed a few hours to sit, instead of like 20 min.

what would affect that?  is my glycerin strange because its from strange ingredients?  or is it because i used 1 part water and 2 parts glycerin?


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## Seawolfe (Aug 28, 2015)

I've zap tested soap batter that showed bright pink pheno drops on it, with no zap. That's when I really understood the disconnect.

I think what's wrong is your unreliable pheno test. And yes you pretty much need to calibrate your pH meter every time you use it, and most need recalibration after battery changes. And they still don't tell you what you really need to know about free lye.


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## Susie (Aug 29, 2015)

I can't tell you why your soap is testing pink without a recipe in weights and a process.  

However, the likelihood of it being caused the source of the glycerin is slim to none.


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## Dahila (Aug 29, 2015)

My pheno drops came out very pink (waste of money was to buy it) and my soap butter did not zap.   I had diluted and had and still have a beautiful liquid soap) Zap does not kill , I promise :evil:


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## DeeAnna (Aug 29, 2015)

Seawolfe and Dahlia -- Me too. I just made this soap today, and it most definitely does NOT zap. Phenolpthalein drops used like this absolutely cannot tell you whether the soap has excess lye or not. One needs to do a free alkalinity test. Phenolpthalein is not used in analytical chemistry like soapers use it. Ever. All the angst over "too high" pH in soap, whether tested by phenolpthalein, pH strips or pH meters, is mostly wasted worry and work.


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