# Fractionated Coconut Oil in CP



## Saipan (Apr 18, 2018)

So, I find myself having a bottle of Fractionated Coconut Oil...

It's clear, it's liquid.  Can it replace regular coconut oil in CP?  Or HP?

Possibly super fat with it?


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## jcandleattic (Apr 18, 2018)

Saipan said:


> So, I find myself having a bottle of Fractionated Coconut Oil...
> It's clear, it's liquid.  Can it replace regular coconut oil in CP?  Or HP?
> Possibly super fat with it?



No, FCO and regular CO are different, and they have different SAPs, different qualities, etc., 
FCO is really better suited for leave on products like body sprays, lotions, and roll on perfumes.


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## dixiedragon (Apr 18, 2018)

We don't typically soap with fractionated CO, because the other kinds are cheaper. You can certainly try it and find out! I love it as a leave on product. I put it in my thin lotion (lotion that I want to squeeze from a bottle). I also infuse it with calendula and put it on my dogs.


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## soapmaker (Apr 18, 2018)

Makes a wonderful lotion!


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## DeeAnna (Apr 18, 2018)

Also FCO has a higher % of shorter chain fatty acids that are harsher on the skin when made into soap. It's better to use FCO in cooking or directly on skin & hair.


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## dixiedragon (Apr 18, 2018)

I also love it in whipped butter. I get my shea butter soft and melty (but not all melted, it needs to be able to hold it's shape a bit), whip it with my hand mixer, then drizzle in some vitamin E and the Fractionated Coconut until I like the texture.


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## earlene (Apr 18, 2018)

I had a gallon of Fx CO sitting around for a long time and decided to soap with it to make space in my soaping area.  It works fine in soap, so if you don't plan to use it for B&B products, then go ahead and use it in soap.  However, now I need to buy some more for some B&B products I am making for my granddaughter.  I had not anticipated this 6 months ago, but it is what it is.

Just remember that it has a different fatty acid profile and different SAP value than the other CO's, so make sure to use your lye calculator.


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## Zany_in_CO (Apr 3, 2021)

I used *Costco's  MCT Oil* (Medium Chain Tryglycerides) *aka* _"FCO - Fractionated Coconut Oil"_ to make 100% Coconut Oil LS for laundry. It was a HUGE disappointment -- flat (little lather), little cleansing, and irritated my skin when used to wash my hands.  I was shocked to see it was added to the *SoapCalc* list of oils. That's what actually made me try to soap it.

*FCO - Fractionated Coconut Oil * has a history of being wonderful in leave-on products. It has a long shelf life, resists rancidity, and is one of my favorite ingredients in lotion for the silky feel it imparts to the product. It is expensive compared to regular coconut oil 76°F and is not normally recommended for CP.

To compare the two oils on *SoapCalc*, enter coconut oil 76°F at 100%. Then press "Calculate" It shows up in the right column on the left menu. Then choose coconut oil, fractionated. It shows up in the left column on the left menu for easy comparison.







I honestly don't know why it reads as if the FCO is hard, cleansing and bubbly under the
"Soap Qualities" scale. The "Fatty Acids" result in no way verifies that. I'm flummoxed.


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## earlene (Apr 4, 2021)

Zany_in_CO said:


> _"FCO - Fractionated Coconut Oil"_
> 
> I honestly don't know why it reads as if the FCO is hard, cleansing and bubbly under the
> "Soap Qualities" scale. The "Fatty Acids" result in no way verifies that. I'm flummoxed.



I know, right?  I have never tried to make a single oil bar soap using only FxCO, but wonder if it really would get hard. But if it is true that a higher Iodine number means softer soap, wouldn't the reverse be true for harder soap?

Maybe one day, I will test out that theory with my next purchase of MCT oil (Fractionated CO).


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## soapmaker (Apr 4, 2021)

NDA is the least expensive place for MCT oil, correct me if you know better.


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## Zany_in_CO (Apr 4, 2021)

soapmaker said:


> NDA is the least expensive place for MCT oil, correct me if you know better.


Costco's MCT Oil I referenced in Post #8 is $19.49 for 32 oz.


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## earlene (Apr 4, 2021)

At Soaper's Choice, 7 pounds is currently $22.40 plus tax & shipping.





						MCT | Soaper's Choice
					

MCT MB CU-RSPO SCC-832478 MCTs (Medium Chain Triglycerides) also known as Caprylic/Capric Triglycerides, Fractionated Coconut Oil.  It is derived from the distilled fatty acid fractions of Palm Kernel Oil. It esterified with USP high purity glycerin.  Refined, Bleached and Deodorized. Due to the...




					www.soaperschoice.com
				




That is much cheaper than NDA's current price.

However, I don't know what the shipping costs are to Canada, so that's another factor.


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## soapmaker (Apr 5, 2021)

earlene said:


> At Soaper's Choice, 7 pounds is currently $22.40 plus tax & shipping.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


It is not only shipping but duty and brokerage fee.


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## soapmaker (Apr 5, 2021)

Zany_in_CO said:


> Costco's MCT Oil I referenced in Post #8 is $19.49 for 32 oz.


That size is $15.?? at NDA.


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## Zany_in_CO (Apr 5, 2021)

soapmaker said:


> That size is $15.?? at NDA.


+ Shipping?


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## soapmaker (Apr 5, 2021)

Zany_in_CO said:


> + Shipping?


Yes, that's true, + shipping.


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## soapmaker (Apr 5, 2021)

I have never seen it at our Costco.


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## soapmaker (Apr 5, 2021)

soapmaker said:


> It is not only shipping but duty and brokerage fee.


Also NDA's is Ecocert and derived from coconut. Not up on the different palm varieties but wonder how it can be called FCO if it is derived from palm kernel oil.


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## Zany_in_CO (Apr 5, 2021)

soapmaker said:


> Also NDA's is Ecocert and derived from coconut. Not up on the different palm varieties but wonder how it can be called FCO if it is derived from palm kernel oil.


I wonder that too!   As a matter of fact I was just planning on looking into it.


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## earlene (Apr 6, 2021)

The first time I ordered Fractionated Coconut Oil, the bottle I received was labeled MCT oil, which really confused me, especially a few months later when I had forgotten that it was Fx CO (per the vendor website.)   I had to do the research again so I could label it accordingly for the next time using it.

I also wonder about MCT oil made from Palm vs Coconuts, but coconuts come from palm trees, so I am not really sure that 'derived from palm' versus 'derived from coconut oil' means any different result.  It's still Medium Chain Triglycerides - caprylic acid and capric acid in the end result.

See this article:  What Is Fractionated Coconut Oil Good For?


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## ResolvableOwl (Apr 6, 2021)

*MCT: *All lauric oils contain MC fatty acids (C6:0…C10:0) to some degree (a few % of each). *Palm kernel oil* and *coconut oil* are the most economical sources, and manufacturers choose whatever is cheaper (and what to do with the “waste” lauric/myristic and long-chain fatty acids). To make MCT oil, a lot of fancy transesterification is going on, to concentrate the MC fatty acids with satisfactory yield; in the end it is somewhat “synthetical” regardless of the origin of the fatty acids. If manufacturers mix CO and PKO, the three FAs of one single MCT triglyceride molecule will probably originate from photosynthesis of both _Elaeis guineensis_ and _Cocos nucifera_. (If the blend is 1:1, it's a fun little mathematical exercise to calculate that the chance, for any triglyceride, to source from both plants, is 87.5%).

*Fractionated Coconut:* the MCT-rich fraction of coconut oil. You might know the drops that sweat out of unrefined coconut oil when stored around room temperature for an extended time? It's just this liquid, just made by industrial-scale purification (like splitting palm oil into olein and stearin). Its MCT percentage (and, consequently, the saponification value) is very much dependent on how far the purification went, anywhere between “dirty” natural separation, and highly refined grades that are chemically indistinguishable from transesterified MCT. You won't easily know.

It is unfortunate that vendors really don't care about this distinction, and appear to wildly mix them up, depending on if they want it to appear a “high purity chemical” or a “natural ingredient” (serving very different markets that worship very different “red flags”, sigh). Saponification value critically depends on the precise fatty acid composition, and I'm actually surprised how close the different values are (0.232, 0.237, 0.2321, 0.237 [from my notes; they removed that value sometime in the last year]; theoretical values: tri-C12:0=0.188, tri-C10:0=0.216, tri-C8:0=0.255, tri-C6:0=0.310). However, additions are probably so small that these differences don't matter anyway, with the limited value of MCT oils (whatever variety) as soapmaking oils in mind (not even talking about price).

I have used MCT oil once as a solvent/carrier oil for grated orange zest, added to HP soap after cooking. Colour and scent carried over well, and the high excess fats didn't leave the skin greasy or inhibit lather as badly as long-chain superfats would.


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## Zany_in_CO (Apr 6, 2021)

ResolvableOwl said:


> I have used MCT oil once as a solvent/carrier oil for grated orange zest, added to HP soap after cooking. Colour and scent carried over well, and the high excess fats didn't leave the skin greasy or inhibit lather as badly as long-chain superfats would.


Good to know! I'm planning on using MCT oil at 5% SF to 0% SF CP soap for the *Grocery Store Soap challenge*.


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## soapmaker (Apr 6, 2021)

A while back NDA made an issue out of this, saying most companies were selling what they called fractionated CO but it was actually palm kernel oil. ( as was theirs I'm assuming) because they put theirs on sale as clearance and got the actual Ecocert CO.
( And put the price up)


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## Adobehead (Apr 6, 2021)

I was taught in massage school that fractionated coconut oil was the best for massage because it doesn't collect in the sheets and go rancid making them permanently stinky like other oils.  That's what I always used with a few drops of EO for fun.  
So, if you don't know what to do with it, try making massage oil.  Easy product to make!


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## ResolvableOwl (Apr 7, 2021)

Just found this by chance:








						The Secret to the Absolutely Best Soap Recipe
					

Tired of testing endless recipes from randos on the web, never finding the perfect one? Well, I’m going to let you in on the secret.




					www.modernsoapmaking.com
				





> (_Capric, caprylic and palmitoleic acids are generally at such low quantities that they don’t contribute to soap qualities in a noticeable way. However those fatty acids are similar to lauric and palmitic but more conditioning._)



Not quite happy with either of these statements. Well, except for the “_generally at such low quantities that they don’t contribute to soap qualities in a noticeable way_”. This is reasonable – except if you use fractionated or transesterified MCT oil (for capric/caprylic), or macadamia/buckthorn oil or some animal fats (OT, but I'd love to see some first-hand experience on palmitoleic acid C16:1. I'd _bet_ that it behaves more like oleic acid C18:1 rather than palmitic acid C16:0).


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## Zany_in_CO (Apr 7, 2021)

ResolvableOwl said:


> Just found this by chance:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


IMHO (In My Humble Opinion), Kenna is both brilliant and generous with sharing her knowledge and experience with soapmakers. The FREE workbook at the end of the article is just icing on the cake for those wishing to turn their efforts into a business. Thanks for posting that link. I'm thinking It belongs in the Beginner's Forum as a dedicated thread. 






ResolvableOwl said:


> Not quite happy with either of these statements. Well, except for the “_generally at such low quantities that they don’t contribute to soap qualities in a noticeable way_”.


Try soaping it first to see if what you think is true.  

Like I said *here* earlier in this thread.... IME (In My Experience) FCO, neither CCT or MCT oil, is a good candidate for making soap. It's wonderful in lotion & creams. In soap, not so much. I'm going to experiment with it @ 5% SF in a 0% SF *Trinity of Oils* formula w/lard for *Grocery Store Soap Challenge* - that's where I think it may serve it's best purpose in soap. But that's just me. I should change my handle to "The Tinkerer!"


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## Peachy Clean Soap (Apr 7, 2021)

Zany_in_CO said:


> IMHO (In My Humble Opinion), Kenna is both brilliant and generous with sharing her knowledge and experience with soapmakers. The FREE workbook at the end of the article is just icing on the cake for those wishing to turn their efforts into a business. Thanks for posting that link. I'm thinking It belongs in the Beginner's Forum as a dedicated thread.
> View attachment 55884
> 
> 
> ...


Fantastic info, I saved links to my readers list.  Much appreciated .

Ive used my MCT OIL in my HP soap & add @ end, that way I know its not eaten up by the lye.  I usually wont add it to my CP soaps.


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## Zany_in_CO (Apr 7, 2021)

Peachy Clean Soap said:


> Ive used my MCT OIL in my HP soap & add @ end, that way I know its not eaten up by the lye.  I usually wont add it to my CP soaps.


So, do you formulate your oils at 0% SF then add 5% SF MCT OIL at the end? 

I was inspired to add MCT as SF from @Kcryss who also does HP and adds it at the end.
I'll be doing CP and adding it to my warmed oils before adding the NaOH solution. 
Just curious to see if it makes a discernible difference.


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## Peachy Clean Soap (Apr 7, 2021)

Zany_in_CO said:


> So, do you formulate your oils at 0% SF then add 5% SF MCT OIL at the end?
> 
> I was inspired to add MCT as SF from @Kcryss who also does HP and adds it at the end.
> I'll be doing CP and adding it to my warmed oils before adding the NaOH solution.
> Just curious to see if it makes a discernible difference.


I account for 5% sf then added MCT Oil @ end. My soap often was soft but I used a little extra cure time.


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## Zany_in_CO (Apr 8, 2021)

Peachy Clean Soap said:


> I account for 5% sf then added MCT Oil @ end. My soap often was soft but I used a little extra cure time.


Just to be clear... So the entire batch is HP processed at 5% SF.  
You wait until the end to add the MCT Oil -- *Which may not be 5% of the total oils?*


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## RDak (Apr 12, 2021)

Zany_in_CO said:


> Just to be clear... So the entire batch is HP processed at 5% SF.
> You wait until the end to add the MCT Oil -- *Which may not be 5% of the total oils?*


Yes, I could be wrong but what I too think she meant is she creates her 5% SF recipe but waits to the end to add the amount of MCT Oil listed in her recipe.

Whether that gives her a 0% SF, negative SF or positive SF while cooking I don't know.


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