# Embracing the Ash



## Tienne (Oct 24, 2013)

I have been tinkering around, trying to come up with a clone of a  brand-name Dead Sea Mud soap. (Am I allowed to mention the name of it?  I'm new here, so I don't know, but it's name starts with an "A".)

Their ingredients list says it contains 80% Palm Oil and 20% Palm Kernel Oil.

At first I baulked over such a high amount of Palm Oil, but seeing that  their soap is famous, then they must be doing something right, so I  decided reluctantly to just go with it. So far, so good, but there was a problem... I  live in Sweden and here it is simply impossible to get a hold of Palm  Kernel Oil, so I dabbled around with a soap calculator for a while and  came up with a recipe using other oils, that brings me as close as  I could possible get to their soap quality numbers;

Their numbers are;               55, 14, 43, 14, 41, 46 and INS 161

My recipe's numbers are;     54, 14, 42, 14, 41, 46 and INS 165

Close enough! The recipe I make is at 5% SF, soaped at 50C and CPOP'ed uncovered for  an hour. I unmold and cut it 12 hours later. It hits pH 8 / 9, just  24 hours later.  It gives a really hard bar of soap, just the way I  like it. Here's the recipe;

Palm Oil 77%
Coconut Oil 19%
Avocado Oil 4%
1 heaped Tbs (wet) DSM ppo

 I add 1 capsule of Vitamin E ppo as well, just for luck. I  scented it with "Energy" FO at 15 g ppo, but I reckon 10g ppo would have  been sufficient.  It's a very androgenous scent. Next time I'll  probably go for something a little more "dusty" or earthy or powdery  smelling, but it's okay.

The recipe is really easy to work with. It isn't in any hurry to  trace, so it's a very relaxing recipe to deal with. I slurry up the  DSM with a little of my weighed out (rain)water and add it to the recipe  after emulsification and then I just SB'ed it until it reaches light to  medium trace. (I don't want it too sloppy in case the mud settles  towards the bottom, so I make sure it had just a little gooeyness to it  before pouring. I also hold back pouring the last teensy bit of the  slurried up mud in, just in case there's any grit at the bottom, which you don't want to get in the soap. There usually isn't, but it's better to  be safe, than sandy. LOL  I use my plastic SB for this recipe and  don't use any metal utensils at all while making this soap, since it's  rumoured that metal will de-charge the mud and ruin it's properties (or  some such thing, but there you have it. )

I love this soap and so does my face... but there is ONE little aber  dabei about this recipe, though. It has a tendency to create ash. Now,  some proper soapers are probably going to be horrified, but I actually  like this soap to ash! :clap:  I think it gives this particular soap character  and a nice silvery-looking contrast to the otherwise monotonous  metallic grey/brownish colour. So I embrace the ash! If I can't beat it, I use it! 8)  

I  guess you could alcohol-spray the bazeezes out of the soap after  pouring, in an attempt to fight off the ash, but I like that this recipe  is stress free to make, so I'd rather just work with it and make it  work for me. To get the most out of the ash, you don't want to pour at  too heavy a trace or make a wildly textured top with big peaks and  valleys. Ash can be finicky and it will have a tendency to show up  unevenly and look blotchy. So it goes for smooth-topped versions as  well. The ash won't appear uniformly and it just ends up looks mucky.  You want a pour consistency where you keep the top level and can just make small delicate  little swirls on top and the ash will be ever so obliging and show up  neatly and evenly across the level top, giving it a little 3D look about it.  (Well, it does for me anyway, so that's my story and I'm sticking to  it. :grin: ) 

A few tips; This recipe wants to be gelled. I CPOP mine at 75C and  preheat my mold before pouring to make sure I get a full and even gel  and the ash top I like. I haven't tried just insulating, but you do not  want to leave it ungelled. The ash will be horrendous looking and the  soap won't get that rich look to it and the colour will have more of a  greenish murky tint to it. Also, cure the cut bars upright, textured  side up on a rack. If you lay them down you risk getting ash on the  sides. That can of course be planed off, but better to just leave them  standing upright for a few weeks to get the ash where you want it, that  is on the top and on the top only. 

This is my first post on the forum and I hope it hasn't been too long or  boring or has put me in bad light, me being an ash-enabler and all...  LOL... but all in all it's a very nice soap. It's a mild and gentle  facial soap and it's very hard-wearing. I really like it and I hope you  like it as well. I have read so many good tips and advice on this forum  already and I had to wring my brain to think of something that I could  contribute with and this is what I came up with.

I'm not sure I know how to do this right, but I'll try to attach a few pictures of the soap. For comparison, you can see how the soap turns out when un-gelled and in  single cavity molds. The gelled loaf version is to the left and the un-gelled single cavity  soaps are to the right. Both were poured at the same time and made from  the exact same batch of soap. See what I mean? The ash is having a field day on those un-gelled soaps! 

So to make a long story short, (Ugh! Too late!) pour at a  light to medium trace, keep the top level and just do some ever so slight texturing, gel, cure  standing upright and then just relax... and embrace the ash. :smile:

-Tienne-


----------



## Pepsi Girl (Oct 24, 2013)

That top is lovely!  And the color also!


----------



## Moody Glenn (Oct 24, 2013)

Now that's the spirit! Good for you Tienne. Your soap looks great with that extra dusting. I allow my soap to undergo a full gel and wait about 16 to 24 hour to unmold and cut. Most will have a slight dusting of ash. I eventually learned 'it's no big deal' and accept it. This is handmade soap so ash proves that it is.

PS: I also learned some fragrance oils greatly contribute to the development of ash. Some form much more while others less or not at all. I don't know why....  And before I forget - welcome to the forum! :wave:


----------



## judymoody (Oct 24, 2013)

Pretty soap!


----------



## Skatergirl46 (Oct 24, 2013)

I think those are pretty. I really like the color. I look at ash as something that just goes along with home made soap. 
That said, I'm just a hobbyist. I don't generally make more than about 10 pounds a month. I certainly can sympathize with those of you who make a lot of soap to sell and have to clean every bar to make them look great for your tables. 

I'm interested in hearing about what this soap is like once it's cured. Does the high conditioning of the Avocado Oil make up for the high cleansing of the Palm Oil and CO?  Also, what is DSM?


----------



## Tienne (Oct 24, 2013)

Oh, thank you all so much for your kind comments! After posting, I was worried if my post was silly and would be face-palmed behind the scenes. Whew! 

Moody Glenn, I did not know that fragrance oils can contribute to ash! Boy, I sure hope that isn't the case with this one because this particular FO was on sale so I got 500 mls of the stuff I have to get through! 

OMG... please don't let it be the FO...   :shock:


----------



## Tienne (Oct 24, 2013)

Skatergirl, I am hoping that because the numbers are very similar to the original, that this clone will end up with approximately the same qualities. That's my hope anyway! The soap is only about three weeks old but I have already snuck a lather and it seems to be okay even now! I'll post the outcome when it's around 8 weeks old and let you know. If anything, I am not so worried about it's mildness, I am more worried that it will be hard as a rock seeing that it's already very hard, but again, it has the same hardness index as the original, so I hope it will be just as nice as the real version. :smile:

(DSM is short for Dead Sea Mud.)  :wink:

I am a home soaper, too. I don't have the confidence to sell anything.


----------



## Skatergirl46 (Oct 24, 2013)

Tienne said:


> (DSM is short for Dead Sea Mud.)  :wink:
> 
> I am a home soaper, too. I don't have the confidence to sell anything.



Thank you.   I have never sold a bar. I give them to friends and family. Your soap looks really nice. I'll bet you wouldn't have trouble selling it if that's something you would want to do.


----------



## Tienne (Oct 24, 2013)

Wow, what a nice thing to say! Thank you so much, Skatergirl! That was so nice of you. 

I wouldn't know where to start, though. I just give mine away, too.


----------



## Saswede (Oct 24, 2013)

I agree, Tienne - the ash looks lovely on your soap!  And if you were to sell, I'm sure that any prospective buyers would agree .....




Sent from my iPad using Soap Making


----------



## kazmi (Oct 24, 2013)

Tienne I really like your soap!  The swirls on top are so perfect!  You'll have to let us know if you like it once its done curing.  I've never used that high of palm oil before so I'm curious.  My skin loves avocado so I use it in almost all of my soaps.   I hope you enjoy it!  and welcome to SMF!


----------



## Hazel (Oct 24, 2013)

Tienne said:


> After posting, I was worried if my post was silly and would be face-palmed behind the scenes.



Not at all! I thought it was a wonderful post and I enjoyed reading it. It's also generous of you to share your recipe. Your soap looks wonderful! I think the color and textured tops make them look elegant and professional. It definitely looks like soap you'd find in a spa or natural/health type store. I can see this as being a good seller when you start to sell. 

I'm ambivalent about ash. I don't mind it on my "rustic" soap in which I use earthy colors and I actually like the effect. But I hate it when I get it on soap with a white/cream colored base and lighter colors.

BTW, your pictures are professional looking, too. :grin:


----------



## Tienne (Oct 25, 2013)

You're all just too kind. I'm so overwhelmed by all the kind and sweet responses. I wasn't expecting that. Thank you so much, guys! You all rock!!  :razz:


----------



## Pepsi Girl (Oct 25, 2013)

So you say don't use metal, so what did you cook it in? I normally use a SS pot.
I just retread and you cpop, I've never tried that do you think I would need to.
Are you using a powder or the actually mud, and where do you find it? Thanks


----------



## Tienne (Oct 26, 2013)

Hi Pepsigirl! 

The soap is just cold processed and then I put in the oven afterwards to make sure it gels. I would think just insulating the soap would be fine, as long as it gels, because as you can see, this recipe looks horrible un-gelled. 

My soaping room is in the basement and it can get pretty cold down there, so I am always on my toes trying to keep both the batter and the poured soap warm. That's why I soap it at a pretty warm temp (and also because it has so much solid fat in it that I don't want it to start solidifying and giving me a false trace) and that's why I preheat my molds and CPOP as well, because I get so disappointed if the soap cools down too fast and I get a partial gel. I can live with ash, but I hate partial gels.

I'm not sure what you mean by retread?

Also, after thinking about, I realize that the soap batter _did_ actually touch metal. I mixed it in a Pyrex bowl and I used a plastic stick blender BUT the blades on the SB are metal! Doh! :crazy:

That being said, I'm not sure I really believe that it matters. After all, the saponification process itself makes the batter itself chockerblock full of charged anions and kations swapping places and the soap molecule's "head" is also charged and polar, so I don't see how one could avoid de-charging the mud, if it is charged at all. (??) I dunno. Maybe someone else knows?

In any case, I'm not that worried about such things, but if one did want to go by the DSM "rules", then you could just SB until light trace and then banish the SB and _then_ add the mud incorporating it using only some non-metallic utensil. :smile:

I use wet mud. I get it from here;

http://www.westlab.co.uk/natural-dead-sea-black-mineral-mud


----------



## debbyski (Oct 26, 2013)

*Fantastic!*

Please keep posting!


----------



## Pepsi Girl (Oct 28, 2013)

Tienne said:


> Hi Pepsigirl!
> 
> I'm not sure what you mean by retread?
> 
> ...



LOL it was suppose to say reread not retread !  Silly "fill in the word" iPad.
Ok so I looked at that site thank you didn't order from them as I wanted someone in the states, but that site got me to a site and I ordered my mud! Thanks I'm looking forward to making it as I have several people in my family with skin issues.


----------



## Tienne (Oct 28, 2013)

LOL! For a while there, I was thinking "Retreading must be some kind of process I haven't heard of before!!" and I was totally clueless about what THAT was all about. LOL So funny. 

Autocorrect. Gotta love it.


----------



## Tienne (Oct 28, 2013)

debbyski said:


> Please keep posting!



Debbyski, you silly goose! LOL Thanks, hunny. 

(PS; Debbyski is a dear friend of mine who is totally stoked that I finally joined a social site where I can mingle with other serial soapers. She's not a soaper, so I reckon she's REALLY really happy now and hopeful that she's off the hook now, having to listen to me _constantly_ talk about soap.)


----------



## Hazel (Oct 28, 2013)

Tienne said:


> She's not a soaper, so I reckon she's REALLY really happy now and hopeful that she's off the hook now, having to listen to me _constantly_ talk about soap.)



No, she's not off the hook. She's a member now so I expect to see more posts from her about you teaching her how to make soap. Bwhahahaha! :twisted:


----------



## Tienne (Oct 29, 2013)

LOL!! I know she'll say she doesn't have the time... but I'll try. I'm not even sure she has subscribed to this thread, she just joined and posted to tease me. She's like that. Always yanking my chain. LOL  I'll email this thread on to her though and tell her to read it. (I'll bet she just looked at the pictures and then moved on. Haha.) 

Not having time is no excuse though, don't you agree? I'm often a midnight soaper. I don't need much sleep! Ahem... what I *do* need though, is an automatic chicken door opener. Why can't those earlybirds learn to sleep in?? Yaaawwwn.  :yawn:


----------



## Hazel (Oct 29, 2013)

I agree it's just an excuse. You'll have to make soap and then brainwash her with it.


----------



## Tienne (Oct 29, 2013)

Will do! I will leave no soap unswirled until she's a convert and can see the error of her ways. I have creamy, milky, evil plans underway to turn her over to our side.  I will banish the words "It's just soap" from her lips forever... or die trying!


----------



## Tienne (Oct 29, 2013)

BREAKING NEWS!! 

She's caving!! I just got an email and she said and I quote;

"Maybe I will!  It can't be harder than making jelly.  Will you tell me how?"

Victory is ours!! We'll have her in the fold in no time now. It's only a matter of time now before she's one of us. Resistance is futile!! Mwahahahahaha!


----------



## Hazel (Oct 31, 2013)

I laughed out loud at your posts.

Resistance is futile, indeed. 

Debbyski...

You.Are.Getting.Sleepy.Sleepy.Sleepy...
You.Will.Make.Soap.You.Will.Make.Soap.You.Will.Make.Soap.


----------



## Tienne (Nov 1, 2013)

Hazel said:


> I laughed out loud at your posts.



LOL, right back at ya, Hazel! I'm sitting here giggling like a little schoolgirl. That little zombie guy is absolutely priceless. 

When she finally gets around to reading all this, Debbyski is going to think we're insane. No wait... she already knows I'm crazy, but now I'm dragging you down with me! :shock:

It's too late for me, I'm too far gone, but you still have time to save yourself! Run Forrest, run!


----------



## Hazel (Nov 1, 2013)

You're not sucking me into your insanity. As you read through the forum, you'll see some wackadoodle comments by me interspersed among my "let's pretend I'm normal" posts.

But to be fair...I'm not the only one. There are quite a few members who are able to hold it together and appear sane for long periods of time. (Some of them are even on the moderator team.) Then...I don't know...the moon is full? Brain synapses misfiring? They forget to take their meds? If not this, then maybe they need to be on meds? Who knows? But then craziness ensues, makes me laugh and I think "I love this forum" because I know I'm not alone in the belfry. Of course, there are also a few members you know from the start have only been playing with a deck of fifty one. Not that I'm going to mention names. *cough* Dennis *cough* (You should look for his posts - very funny.)

Perhaps a good slogan for this forum would be "You don't have to be crazy to be a member. We can teach you".

Disclaimer: This is only my opinion, doesn't reflect other member's beliefs or is the official position of the forum. I don't mean to offend anyone by my comments.


----------



## Tienne (Nov 1, 2013)

This reminded me of a quote some smart person once said;

"Insane people are always sure that they are fine. It is only the sane people who are willing to admit that they are crazy."

Life should never ever be taken so seriously that one forgets how to play.  :razz:


----------



## Hazel (Nov 1, 2013)

Cool! This means I'm sane. I guess the Monty Python comment is true - "Some people are born sane and some people go sane later in life". 


Psst! Sneak over here and read the posts. I bet you thought I was exaggerating when I mentioned not being alone in the belfry.


----------



## Tienne (Nov 1, 2013)

Haha, I see what you mean! 

Having conversations with dogs?? Geeez! You're right. Some people really are just that one beer short of a six-pack! I got my cat Phoebe to read the post too and she laughed out loud and then just shook her head. I won't repeat what she then said, because uhm... she's Swedish and uhm...  it just kind of loses something in translation.    She really should have her mouth washed out with soap though, which reminds me, I need to whip up another batch of catnip soap. She's not all that fond of patchouli. :lolno:

On a more serious note though, (enjoy it while it lasts LOL) it's so nice that the friendly atmosphere on this forum leaves room for some fun and silliness. I have yet to come across anything that even remotely resembles hostility or rudeness and that is SUCH a rare thing these days on the internet. I'm really, really glad I found this place.


----------



## Pepsi Girl (Nov 1, 2013)

Hazel said:


> Cool! This means I'm sane. I guess the Monty Python comment is true - "Some people are born sane and some people go sane later in life".
> 
> 
> Psst! Sneak over here and read the posts. I bet you thought I was exaggerating when I mentioned not being alone in the belfry.




Hey, wait one minute!  I resemble that remark!:crazy:


----------



## Tienne (Nov 1, 2013)

BUSTED!!


----------



## Hazel (Nov 1, 2013)

Pepsi Girl said:


> Hey, wait one minute!  I resemble that remark!:crazy:



You misunderstand me. Talking to dogs is the sanest thing you can do.   They're wonderful listeners, everything you say is fascinating to them   and they don't judge you. However, you did seem to have some  issues  with posting pics. 




Tienne said:


> I have yet to come across anything that even remotely resembles hostility or rudeness



Read further through the forum. It's there and generally in my posts.


----------



## Pepsi Girl (Nov 1, 2013)

Hazel said:


> You misunderstand me. Talking to dogs is the sanest thing you can do.   They're wonderful listeners, everything you say is fascinating to them   and they don't judge you. However, you did seem to have some  issues  with posting pics.



It's the IPad thing, however at my age,just getting it on the forum at all is huge!

If they were listening, what's with the big yawn!


----------



## Hazel (Nov 2, 2013)

I don't know but I wouldn't worry about it. I get the same reaction from family and friends when I talk about soap.


----------



## CaraBou (Nov 3, 2013)

Great post.  Loved your DSM story!


----------

