# Pleeeeaseeee help!!!!!



## fotini22284 (Jul 17, 2013)

I tried for the first time to make liquid soap, I've used hot process a long time and I never had any problem.... since, I tried to meet the monster of LIQUIDS.... I calculated and measured my ingredients right, I didn't superfat at all, I cooked for almost 4 hours but when it came at vaseline stage and measured the ph it was 13-14!!!! When I diluted at water, the water was pretty transparent, but the ph never drop down no matter the more hours I cooked it... Is it normal???? All infos I read online or at forums don't mention which should be the ph at that phase, but as far as I can understand it should be much lower (no?). What might went wrong? Please any help!!!!!!!!!!


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## fotini22284 (Jul 17, 2013)

I see... I thought that the use of boric or citric acid is to lower the ph of a level 12 for example to 10 or nine.... So that is how things should be, I just had to neutralize at that phase and not expecting for the ph level to fall with more cooking??? Do I get it right?


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## FGOriold (Jul 17, 2013)

I actually cook my soap paste for up to 9 hours sometimes.  I sounds like you used a lye excess in your recipe.  Did you run it through a lye calculator making sure to specify liquid soap?  If you want to share your recipe, we can check it for you.


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## fotini22284 (Jul 17, 2013)

I run it through mms calculator, I used: olive oil 350gr, coconut oil 250gr, almond oil 150gr, castor oil 50gr, grapeseed oil 25gr, 173gr of KOH and 300ml of water....  As for cooking hours.... in hp it is supposed that after gel phase saponification is almost done, doesn't that happen at liquid soap also?


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## FGOriold (Jul 17, 2013)

Based on your oils and percentages, I get 183.5 grams Potassium Hydroxide and 545 grams distilled water at 0% superfat.  I am wondering if you are not using enough water to dissolve your KOH.  If you do not use enough water to dissolve the lye, the lye cannot properly saponify the oils and you could have an excess in your paste.


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## fotini22284 (Jul 17, 2013)

FGOriold said:


> Based on your oils and percentages, I get 183.5 grams Potassium Hydroxide and 545 grams distilled water at 0% superfat.  I am wondering if you are not using enough water to dissolve your KOH.  If you do not use enough water to dissolve the lye, the lye cannot properly saponify the oils and you could have an excess in your paste.




Now I lost it completely... Why there is such difference between your calculation and mine? And in comparison of the 2 measurments, I used less lye, so there should be unsaponified oils and much lower ph level, for the amount of water I don't know how it reflects in the soap in this case(less lye to dissolve in less water)... The monster of LS is going to swallow me....!!!!:smile:


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## FGOriold (Jul 18, 2013)

Even with only 173g of KOH, 300 ml of water is not enough to fully dissolve the KOH.  A good rule of thumb is that you water should be about 3x your KOH - so you should have at least 519ml water for the KOH you used.

I ran your recipe through two reliable lye calculators for liquid soap (summerbeemeadow and brambleberry) and both came to around the same KOH/water at 0% superfat.  I would not use the mms calculator for liquid soap.  The water amount is too low.

Try again with more water.


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## fotini22284 (Jul 18, 2013)

I run it through brambleberry and the results were similar to yours... I guess you are right! So, except from the lye amount should I do something different? Is neutralization at the end necessary in this case?


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## FGOriold (Jul 18, 2013)

Yes, neutralization is necessary to bring down that ph.  A ph of anything higher than 10.2 or so is going to be very harsh and possible caustic.


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## fotini22284 (Jul 18, 2013)

ok... thanks for all info!!!! I will try again and hope for best results!!!!


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