# Body and room spray preservative



## elmtree (Jun 3, 2014)

What do you guys use for body and room spray preservatives? I stay away from parabens and formaldehyde releasers. Also,
I'm going to use CME as my emulsifier because I get a clear product. Anyone have experience with that? I've tried poly 20 and I just get cloudiness. I want a clear end product. But.... I am using metal bottles.... Hmmm I know that poly 20 can deactivate some preservatives which is why I'm thinking I'll use  CME.


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## aab1 (Jun 18, 2014)

What's CME?

Thanks


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## elmtree (Jun 18, 2014)

aab1 said:


> What's CME?
> 
> Thanks




It's caprol micro express or CME. It's a solubilizer that is supposed to provide a clear and non sticky product unlike poly20 which can make products unclear and sticky.


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## craftymommy (Jul 4, 2014)

*preservatives?*

I have seen recipes for body sprays using vodka and distilled water, and eo. I was wondering if you can use just vodka and eo, and leave out the water since adding water calls for a preservative? Im clueless when it comes to how much preservative to add, never been good at math. I tried adding germell once, and it made my spray smell like medicine. thanks


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## Aline (Jul 4, 2014)

I would think the vodka would act as a preservative....


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## craftymommy (Jul 4, 2014)

*vodka*

that's what I thought, I see a lot of recipes for body sprays with just distilled water, vodka and eo. But have read that you still a preservative, but if effects the scent, and I don't know how much is enough.


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## new12soap (Jul 18, 2014)

I just saw this post, I don't know if you ever got your answer.

Yes, you can use alcohol if you really want to, but it's more expensive and needs to be used at high concentrations to be effective. I am not sure how high, but for some reason 60% is sticking in my mind. Don't quote me on that. BUT... that is the percentage of _alcohol_ you need. Vodka is 140 proof, so that is only 70% alcohol if you used vodka for ALL the liquid, so don't forget to take that into account.

I love CME and use it all the time for body/room/linen spray, and I mix it with distilled water and use Liquid Germall Plus for my preservative. It is easy, inexpensive, widely available from a lot of suppliers, and works very well. Recommended usage is 0.1-0.5%, so if you were going to make up, say 100 grams of spray, use 10g CME, 1-2g fragrance, 86.5 to 87.5 grams distilled water, and 0.5 grams of LGP. I tend to use the max, I live in a climate where things I can't pronounce grow in everything. You can use less if you like. If you want to make larger quantities, just multiply your total amount by 0.005 on a calculator, that's it.

For an excellent tutorial on preservatives, try a little light reading here http://swiftcraftymonkey.blogspot.com/p/preservatives.html

 eta: no a preservative has never affected the scent of anything I have made


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## Dorymae (Jul 18, 2014)

Liquid Germall Plus should not be used in an airborne product.  I believe it states it on the MSDS sheet.

Just quickly you can find the information here:

http://www.lotioncrafter.com/reference/tech_data_liquid_germall_plus.pdf

under toxicology it states:

One of the components in the blend, Iodopropynyl  Butylcarbamate, (IPBC) is readily absorbed by 
the skin and it should not be used  in oral and lipcare products. There are also inhalation issues with IPBC, a component of Liquid Germall Plus and thus, it should not be used in products intended to be aerosolized.

Don't get me wrong I love the product in my lotions and creams but not in anything airborne that could be inhaled.


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## new12soap (Jul 18, 2014)

It is my understanding that while it should not be _aerosolized_ it is perfectly safe in a pump sprayer as they are not the same thing.

 eta: http://swiftcraftymonkey.blogspot.com/2009/07/liquid-germall-plus-in-spray.html

 there are of course alternatives.


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## elmtree (Jul 19, 2014)

new12soap said:


> It is my understanding that while it should not be _aerosolized_ it is perfectly safe in a pump sprayer as they are not the same thing.
> 
> eta: http://swiftcraftymonkey.blogspot.com/2009/07/liquid-germall-plus-in-spray.html
> 
> there are of course alternatives.




Yes, I read this too. But if it shouldn't be aerosolized should I feel comfortable in spraying it all over my body and house? What is your view on this? Do you think potassium sorbate would work?


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## new12soap (Jul 19, 2014)

Yep, I am perfectly comfortable spraying it all over myself and my house. As I said, it is used in very small amounts and it _is not aerosolized_. YMMV, and if you have concerns my advice would be to do some research and find something that you think would be suitable.

 No, I do not think potassium sorbate would work, it isn't a broad-spectrum preservative and isn't very effective against bacteria. It would not be my choice. If I did not want to use LGP, my next choice would be Germaben but you said you didn't want to use parabens (I also have no problems with parabens, there is a crazy amount of very bad information out there, but again that's a personal choice).

 Again, I would recommend spending some time on Susan's blog, just browsing through the different preservatives and their qualities.


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## elmtree (Jul 19, 2014)

new12soap said:


> Yep, I am perfectly comfortable spraying it all over myself and my house. As I said, it is used in very small amounts and it _is not aerosolized_. YMMV, and if you have concerns my advice would be to do some research and find something that you think would be suitable.
> 
> No, I do not think potassium sorbate would work, it isn't a broad-spectrum preservative and isn't very effective against bacteria. It would not be my choice. If I did not want to use LGP, my next choice would be Germaben but you said you didn't want to use parabens (I also have no problems with parabens, there is a crazy amount of very bad information out there, but again that's a personal choice).
> 
> Again, I would recommend spending some time on Susan's blog, just browsing through the different preservatives and their qualities.




I agree on the parabens about the bad information, however my customers do ask so I don't use them. There is some new info out on methylparaben though that is interesting  it was done by researchers in San Fran and has to do with methylparaben and cancer fighting drugs. Thanks for the info and I love Susan's blog and use it daily!!


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## Dorymae (Jul 20, 2014)

new12soap said:


> Yep, I am perfectly comfortable spraying it all over myself and my house. As I said, it is used in very small amounts and it _is not aerosolized_.




I think you are splitting hairs here.  It is not suppose to be aerosolized because it is not suppose to be breathed in.  When you spray it into the air there is the chance of it being breathed in.  This is from warehouse supplies plus:

Excellent broad spectrum antimicrobial preservative. No known inactivators. Compatible with virtually all cosmetic ingredients. Good for water based formulas. Not to be used in sprays or aerosols.

Everyone will use what they want but I would not feel good about using this in an airborne product, especially if I sold it.  

Just a note to say even swiftmoney was confused and in the end left it up to each individual with no real answer - only saying that aerosols make it easier to inhale because they make the product so fine (microscopic).


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## elmtree (Jul 23, 2014)

Dorymae said:


> I think you are splitting hairs here.  It is not suppose to be aerosolized because it is not suppose to be breathed in.  When you spray it into the air there is the chance of it being breathed in.  This is from warehouse supplies plus:
> 
> Excellent broad spectrum antimicrobial preservative. No known inactivators. Compatible with virtually all cosmetic ingredients. Good for water based formulas. Not to be used in sprays or aerosols.
> 
> ...




Yes, I remember that post by her. I'm going to use optiphen plus. In my findings it said it was good for aqueous products.


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## itunu (Jul 27, 2014)

As optiphen plus contains an organic acid you'll need to reduce the pH so that it will be effective.  If you don't wish to change the pH there are lots of other options incl Ecocert approved ones - see this page which has reviews of 27 preservatives - http://makingskincare.com/preservatives/


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## BrambleNBumble (Aug 4, 2014)

For my body sprays I've used this formula: Add 1/2 teaspoon vodka, 1/2 teaspoon aloe vera gel , 1/2 teaspoon glycerin, 1/2 teaspoon witch hazel extract, fill the bottle up with distilled water.  After I shake it I'll add drops of EO or FO and shake again.  I have a test bottle that I have been using and leaving in my truck, for the last month or so, to sit in the midwestern heat and so far, knock on wood, I've had no issues with it going bad or losing it's scent.


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## aab1 (Aug 5, 2014)

BrambleNBumble said:


> For my body sprays I've used this formula: Add 1/2 teaspoon vodka, 1/2 teaspoon aloe vera gel , 1/2 teaspoon glycerin, 1/2 teaspoon witch hazel extract, fill the bottle up with distilled water.  After I shake it I'll add drops of EO or FO and shake again.  I have a test bottle that I have been using and leaving in my truck, for the last month or so, to sit in the midwestern heat and so far, knock on wood, I've had no issues with it going bad or losing it's scent.



I may be wrong but I think alcohol acts as a preservative when used in significant amounts, I'd imagine between the 30-70% range. I don't see how half a teaspoon in an entire bottle would do much at all as a preservative.


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## DeeAnna (Aug 5, 2014)

I agree about using enough alcohol in a formulation to actually act as a preservative. Vodka and witch hazel extract contain some alcohol. The aloe would also contain preservative, if it's a commercial product. It's risky to count on these little dabs of preservative power to ensure your product stays sanitary, however. You aren't necessarily going to *see* cooties growing in a product, whether it's beer or a room spray, but they can be present all the same. 

Think about it -- beer is NOT preserved by its alcohol, which is typically under 10% by volume. Moving up the strength spectrum, wine is generally preserved by its alcohol content, but that typically runs in the 10% to 20% range by volume. Note that these *volume* percentages convert to roughly 13% to 26% alcohol by *weight*.

"...I've tried poly 20 and I just get cloudiness...."

Try polysorbate 80 instead. I have had nice results with PS80 in a similar type of application to yours. PS20 = cloudy, separated out even at high dosages, PS80 = clear, stays nicely solubilized with the correct dosage. PS80 is also definitely less sticky than PS20. I haven't compared either to CME, so can't offer any perspective about that.

As far as Germall Plus in spray applications, I think we're all going to have to agree to disagree on that one. I can see both sides of the argument, and I can also see where continuing debate could get rather non-constructive. :shock:


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## BrambleNBumble (Aug 11, 2014)

aab1 said:


> I may be wrong but I think alcohol acts as a preservative when used in significant amounts, I'd imagine between the 30-70% range. I don't see how half a teaspoon in an entire bottle would do much at all as a preservative.




I should have also mentioned that this is for a 2 oz bottle, very little is actually water.


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## aab1 (Aug 11, 2014)

BrambleNBumble said:


> I should have also mentioned that this is for a 2 oz bottle, very little is actually water.



That still makes the mixture less than 2% alcohol (half a teaspoon is 2.5ml out of 60 ml in 2 oz makes 4%, considering the vodka is itself only 40% that means you end up with less than 2% alcohol).


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