# Crumbly Salt Bar… What went wrong



## Jenny Sparks (Dec 10, 2021)

I attempted to make a small batch of salt soap for the first time today. I did 80% coconut oil, 5% castor oil, and 15% olive oil with 20% superfat. Lye:water ratio was 1:1.8 and I soaped at room temperature. I also added 1 small spoon of green clay to the oils. I added a fragrance oil calculated at .5 oz/ per lb oils at light trace. (One that I’ve used with no problems). Then I added an equal mix of Himalayan pink salt and European Sea Salt calculated to 75% of the weight of the oils. Okay, so my understanding of salt soap is that they get very hard very quick and it’s best to un-mold within 4-12 hours and cut it soon after. Now I wonder if that’s correct. I un-molded at 5 hours and it was smooth and hard on the outside. I cut one slice and it was pretty crumbly and dry. The cut bar broke into 2 pieces. I left the rest of the loaf alone for know. Can anyone tell me… did I cut too soon or is this a recipe problem? If I wait a day, would the rest of the loaf be likely to cut better or will it still be dry? Any way to salvage this if not?  Thanks!!


----------



## KiwiMoose (Dec 10, 2021)

I find salt bars can often be crumbly.  For this reason I tend to use cavity molds instead.


----------



## Jenny Sparks (Dec 10, 2021)

That’s does sound better! I’ll try that next time.


----------



## The Efficacious Gentleman (Dec 10, 2021)

Even when an experienced soapmaker tells you it should take between X to y hours, they should tell you to keep checking it regardless - so many variables play in to cutting time that it can vary a great deal from what one person experiences.


----------



## Obsidian (Dec 10, 2021)

Waited too long to cut. I've had salt bars that were ready in one hour, others 8.
I mostly use individual molds now so I don't have to baby sit the soap for the perfect moment.


----------



## Rsapienza (Dec 10, 2021)

Not related to your crumbly issue, but I would seriously suggest doing a search regarding Himalayan salt. It tends to be way too sharp for soap and has actually cut people when they’ve used it.


----------



## Jenny Sparks (Dec 10, 2021)

Thanks, that’s good to know, I’ll read up on it. Does that apply to the fine ground salt or just coarse grind? I used an equal mix of finely ground Himalayan and fine sea salt.


----------



## Jenny Sparks (Dec 10, 2021)

Rsapienza said:


> Not related to your crumbly issue, but I would seriously suggest doing a search regarding Himalayan salt. It tends to be way too sharp for soap and has actually cut people when they’ve used it.



Thanks, that’s good to know, I’ll read up on it. Does that apply to the fine ground salt or just coarse grind? I used an equal mix of finely ground Himalayan and fine sea salt.


----------



## Jenny Sparks (Dec 10, 2021)

Obsidian said:


> Waited too long to cut. I've had salt bars that were ready in one hour, others 8.
> I mostly use individual molds now so I don't have to baby sit the soap for the perfect moment.



That sounds like the way to go for the future. I ended up pulverizing the bars and rebatching them. After melting, I put them in individual molds.


----------



## RusticUrban (Dec 10, 2021)

Jenny Sparks said:


> Thanks, that’s good to know, I’ll read up on it. Does that apply to the fine ground salt or just coarse grind? I used an equal mix of finely ground Himalayan and fine sea salt.



I use fine Himalayan salt in my bars without a problem, no scratching or sharp edges. I love the creamy lather it ends up making with a sort of polishing feel to it


----------



## Jenny Sparks (Dec 10, 2021)

RusticUrban said:


> I use fine Himalayan salt in my bars without a problem, no scratching or sharp edges. I love the creamy lather it ends up making with a sort of polishing feel to it



I’m glad to hear that because I want the Pink Salt to work out !!


----------



## Obsidian (Dec 10, 2021)

Everytime I've used Himalayan salt, even fine, it ended up scratchy


----------



## Rsapienza (Dec 11, 2021)

Personally, I wouldn’t use any Himalayan salt. I still have a batch from 3 or 4 years ago that I couldn’t give to anybody and I used fine. I am able to use them with a wash cloth, but I certainly wouldn’t sell…or even give them away for that matter. I, too, wanted so badly to make a salt bar with Pink Himalayan salt and ignored all the posts and advice on here. Needless to say….I’m hardheaded


----------



## chigirl (Dec 27, 2021)

I have wanted to make a good M&P salt bar from the moment I started soaping and I finally got one!  I used clear MP base from WSP with Blood Orange FO, dendritic salt, honey powder and 1ml rice bran oil. I found a blog somewhere that said to pour in layers, let set a bit then sprinkle the salt. Do that until you have what you want for salt content. I did three layers with the alcohol spray, of course, wrapped it tightly with plastic wrap and said a prayer. Well, when I unwrapped it it was a greasy mess and I thought I had another failure. I planned to make it into salt scrub cubes. Then I remembered something I read in one of these forums about hot process and drying out salt bars. I figured it couldn’t hurt to try. I unmolded the bars very carefully and layered them on paper towels in a cake pan. Then I wrapped it up again tightly and threw it in the fridge for three days. When I pulled it out to check I found the most beautiful salt bars!  And the lather is amazing!  It’s also very very moisturizing.  Hopefully the photo comes through for you.


----------



## Jenny Sparks (Jan 1, 2022)

Obsidian said:


> Everytime I've used Himalayan salt, even fine, it ended up scratchy



Its only been a few weeks so my rebatched bars are not done curing but I gave one of them a try to get an idea of whether they would be usable (for personal/ family use). You were right about the Himalayan salt. These came out more than scratchy though- they actually feel sharp. And it’s fine Himalayan blended 50/50 with sea salt and rebatched with hot process so I’m surprised it’s so rough. Otherwise the bar is already super hard, smells great & has incredible lather so I’m still going to use it inside a soap saver bag.


----------



## Obsidian (Jan 1, 2022)

Jenny Sparks said:


> Its only been a few weeks so my rebatched bars are not done curing but I gave one of them a try to get an idea of whether they would be usable (for personal/ family use). You were right about the Himalayan salt. These came out more than scratchy though- they actually feel sharp. And it’s fine Himalayan blended 50/50 with sea salt and rebatched with hot process so I’m surprised it’s so rough. Otherwise the bar is already super hard, smells great & has incredible lather so I’m still going to use it inside a soap saver bag.



The color in himalayan salt comes from a gritty, sandy clay. If you dissolve a spoonful in a glass of water, you can see the grit left behind.
Its this grit that can scratch or even cut. I sliced my chest once with larger grained salt.
I only use cheap sea salt or canning salt now.


----------



## TheGecko (Jan 1, 2022)

Jenny Sparks said:


> Then I added an equal mix of Himalayan pink salt and European Sea Salt calculated to 75% of the weight of the oils.



First of all, Salt Salt is going to be a bit crumbly unless you use cavity molds...it's just the nature of the beast.  Second, I'm going to say that you used too much salt; general rule of thumb is 50% or less.  Your unmolding time is going to vary depending on your recipe, how much salt you use, the size of your recipe, whether you gel or don't gel, the temperature and humidity levels of the room your soap is saponifying in, the size and type of your molds, etc.  I was always told to check every hour.

With that said...salt soap and I don't get along; I've tried three times now and ended up tossing it.  Even my nicest tester said that it was bad.  LOL


----------



## Rsapienza (Jan 1, 2022)

TheGecko said:


> I'm going to say that you used too much salt; general rule of thumb is 50% or less


I have to say, I have never heard this “rule of thumb”, and I have used up to 100% without issue. I’m pretty sure other soapers do as well.


----------



## TheGecko (Jan 2, 2022)

Rsapienza said:


> I have to say, I have never heard this “rule of thumb”, and I have used up to 100% without issue. I’m pretty sure other soapers do as well.



Are you sure you are using 100%?  I only ask because I've made a Salt Scrub with 100% and it's barely moveable.


----------



## Rsapienza (Jan 2, 2022)

100%…positive. I also use up to 150% in scrubsnot sure why you have such an issue. Actually, my scrubs are sugar, not salt (not sure if that makes a difference). I’m almost positive there are other makers who use 100% salt in soaps with no issue. Maybe one will chime in. I am able to color and swirl and I love, love, love my salt bars. I do give them a ridiculously long cure….at the very least 12 months.


----------



## TheGecko (Jan 2, 2022)

Rsapienza said:


> 100%…positive. I also use up to 150% in scrubsnot sure why you have such an issue. Actually, my scrubs are sugar, not salt (not sure if that makes a difference). I’m almost positive there are other makers who use 100% salt in soaps with no issue. Maybe one will chime in. I am able to color and swirl and I love, love, love my salt bars. I do give them a ridiculously long cure….at the very least 12 months.



Who said anything about an 'issue'?  If it works for you...great.


----------



## Obsidian (Jan 2, 2022)

TheGecko said:


> Are you sure you are using 100%?  I only ask because I've made a Salt Scrub with 100% and it's barely moveable.



There are quite a few members who use salt at 100%. I used to but found it didn't lather is well in my harder water so I kept tweaking the amount until I found the perfect amount for my conditions.

You said you don't like salt bars, how long did you cure them? They need a good long cure, at least 6 months but a year or two is better.
If you happen to have a old one tucked away somewhere, give it a try.


----------



## The Efficacious Gentleman (Jan 3, 2022)

I use salt at 80% of the oil weight in my salt bars with no issues at all


----------



## Rsapienza (Jan 3, 2022)

TheGecko said:


> Who said anything about an 'issue'?  If it works for you...great.


You made reference to your salt scrub being “barely moveable” at 100% and also stated that you have tossed 3 batches of salt bars. Would you not call those “issues”? Maybe I misunderstood and if so, I apologize.


----------



## TheGecko (Jan 3, 2022)

Rsapienza said:


> You made reference to your salt scrub being “barely moveable” at 100% and also stated that you have tossed 3 batches of salt bars. Would you not call those “issues”? Maybe I misunderstood and if so, I apologize.



That's the problem with this kind of communication, so much can get lost in translation.  LOL  No worries.


----------



## TheGecko (Jan 3, 2022)

Obsidian said:


> You said you don't like salt bars, how long did you cure them? They need a good long cure, at least 6 months but a year or two is better.
> 
> If you happen to have a old one tucked away somewhere, give it a try.



It's not that I don't like them, they don't like me.  The first ones (50%) were rough when I pulled them out of the cavity mold.  The second ones did the same and I went with 40%.  The first two were 100% CO, 20% SF, 33% Lye Concentration...no scent or colorants.  The third batch...80% CO, 20% Avocado Oil, 20% SF, 33% Lye Concentration made with 100% Coconut Milk and a tad bit of Chromium Green...I was really happy with how they looked, all nice and smooth and then they started sweating...and sweating and sweating.  They finally quit sweating after about four months and the texture went from smooth to rough.  I held onto all three for close to eight months.  None of my testers like them, I didn't like them.  Way too drying.  And I wouldn't have mined a little roughness with use since I was wanting to sell it as a foot scrub to begin with, but it was crumbly rough, not exfoliating.  Unfortunately, I had space constraints at the time, so I just tossed them.

I'm considering trying it again.  Smaller batch this time...4 instead of 8 bars and I have the space now so I can just put them on the top shelf and forget about them.


----------



## Obsidian (Jan 3, 2022)

TheGecko said:


> It's not that I don't like them, they don't like me.  The first ones (50%) were rough when I pulled them out of the cavity mold.  The second ones did the same and I went with 40%.  The first two were 100% CO, 20% SF, 33% Lye Concentration...no scent or colorants.  The third batch...80% CO, 20% Avocado Oil, 20% SF, 33% Lye Concentration made with 100% Coconut Milk and a tad bit of Chromium Green...I was really happy with how they looked, all nice and smooth and then they started sweating...and sweating and sweating.  They finally quit sweating after about four months and the texture went from smooth to rough.  I held onto all three for close to eight months.  None of my testers like them, I didn't like them.  Way too drying.  And I wouldn't have mined a little roughness with use since I was wanting to sell it as a foot scrub to begin with, but it was crumbly rough, not exfoliating.  Unfortunately, I had space constraints at the time, so I just tossed them.
> 
> I'm considering trying it again.  Smaller batch this time...4 instead of 8 bars and I have the space now so I can just put them on the top shelf and forget about them.



I've had single bars come out crumbly before too, leave them in the mold longer. Fresh salt soap is hard but also fragile.

Try 80% coconut, 20% olive with 30% salt and 20% SF.
I don't like olive at all but its nice in a salt bar. Maybe make them during your dry season or use a small fan to keep them dry.


----------



## TheGecko (Jan 3, 2022)

Obsidian said:


> I've had single bars come out crumbly before too, leave them in the mold longer. Fresh salt soap is hard but also fragile.
> 
> Try 80% coconut, 20% olive with 30% salt and 20% SF.  I don't like olive at all but its nice in a salt bar. Maybe make them during your dry season or use a small fan to keep them dry.



Thanks.  I'll wait until mid-June/July then.


----------



## melinda48 (Jan 11, 2022)

Rsapienza said:


> Not related to your crumbly issue, but I would seriously suggest doing a search regarding Himalayan salt. It tends to be way too sharp for soap and has actually cut people when they’ve used it.


I use fine Himalayan sea salt in my bars and have never had any complaints; actually one of my most popular soaps. I think the key is that the salt must be “fine” - not medium or coarse. “Fine” seems to be just fine.


----------



## melinda48 (Jan 11, 2022)

Obsidian said:


> I've had single bars come out crumbly before too, leave them in the mold longer. Fresh salt soap is hard but also fragile.
> 
> Try 80% coconut, 20% olive with 30% salt and 20% SF.
> I don't like olive at all but its nice in a salt bar. Maybe make them during your dry season or use a small fan to keep them dry.


Check out the video for making salt bars from “I Dream in Soap”. It will change your life (well, it will enable you to make awesome salt soap anyway).


----------



## AliOop (Jan 11, 2022)

melinda48 said:


> I use fine Himalayan sea salt in my bars and have never had any complaints; actually one of my most popular soaps. I think the key is that the salt must be “fine” - not medium or coarse. “Fine” seems to be just fine.


I also use the fine Himalayan pink salt from Costco - no complaints from anyone. But with all the other complaints I've read of actual skin lacerations, it does make me wonder if Costco's version is actually authentic Himalayan sea salt, or something else with pink coloring.


----------



## Zany_in_CO (Jan 17, 2022)

@Jenny Sparks 





You may want to read through this thread:

*ADVICE TO BEGINNERS*


----------



## Phantomka (Jul 16, 2022)

Jenny Sparks said:


> That sounds like the way to go for the future. I ended up pulverizing the bars and rebatching them. After melting, I put them in individual molds.


Please, I just had the same problem with exactly the same recipe. But I did go gel phase with one part and the other I put in individual mold and fridge. The one that went thru gel phase crumbles a bit,the other one is perfect. I just tried the soap to see the lather and it is super creamy and white. 
Could you tell me how you rebatched yours? I don't have a crockpot.


----------

