# Want to try new soap recipes.



## Gaspar Navarrete (Mar 21, 2015)

Hello everyone,

I'm looking to try new soap receipes. However, I don't know know of any good ones.

Can anyone recommend a soap recipe (for bathing and washing dishes) that uses oils from the following list ? I can get these oils without problem and they are not that pricey:

Canola Oil
Castor Oil
Grapeseed Oil
Sunflower Oil
Sesame Oil
Olive Oil
Peanut Oil
Soybean Oil
Vegetable Oil
Coconut Oil
Palm Oil
Corn Oil

Here are the soap recipies that I have already tried (all with 6% lye discount).  I like to use the hot-process method:

Castille soap (slimy, doesn't last long, didn't clean well)
64% Olive Oil / 32% Coconut Oil / 3% Castor Oil soap
50% Olive Oil / 23% Red Palm Oil / 21% Coconut Oil / 6% Castor Oil soap (a little drying to the skin)


Thanks


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## not_ally (Mar 21, 2015)

Here are my (relatively inexperienced) thoughts.  Hopefully one of the mavens will chip in.

Of the ones you have listed, I think you should use a combo of OO, CO and PO.  Castor to add lather, but maxing out at maybe 7% (most people recommend using 5%). 

About some of the others:  canola and soybean are said to be more likely to cause DOS. Grapeseed, short shelf life, so also not likely to keep well/cause rancidity.  Vegetable oil, not sure how you would determine the SAP values unless it was something that was already included in lye calculator values. Corn oil, never thought of using, so don't know (sorry, hate it when people post to say they don't know.)


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## Susie (Mar 21, 2015)

Tried and true recipe:

Palm/Tallow/Lard 55%
Olive Oil 20%
Coconut Oil 20%
Castor Oil 5%

Superfat 5-8%

I add 1 tsp/PPO sugar to boost bubbles.  Give it 4-6 weeks cure, and it should be fine.  

My favorite recipes thus far have all had more hard oils than liquid ones.  This is a good starter recipe that you can tweak endlessly.


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## shunt2011 (Mar 21, 2015)

Your first recipe would need a really long cure.  However, I don't like 100% OO either.  Your second recipe the CO is way too high.  I don't exceed 25%  except in salt bars.

Your 3rd recipe should be pretty decent.  What superfat did you use? You could possible increase your SF or drop the CO a bit more. That's a very common recipe for beginning.   You could also do a 45% Palm, 20% CO, 30% Olive and 5% Castor. Superfat at 6-7%


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## Gaspar Navarrete (Mar 21, 2015)

Hello shunt2011,

The 3rd recipe did come out okay, it seemed like a decent soap.

My castile soap cured for about 7 months. But it still became slimy in the center.



shunt2011 said:


> Your first recipe would need a really long cure. However, I don't like 100% OO either. Your second recipe the CO is way too high. I don't exceed 25% except in salt bars.
> 
> Your 3rd recipe should be pretty decent. What superfat did you use? You could possible increase your SF or drop the CO a bit more. That's a very common recipe for beginning. You could also do a 45% Palm, 20% CO, 30% Olive and 5% Castor. Superfat at 6-7%


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## nebetmiw (Mar 21, 2015)

Don't use the following for the go bad fast. Soy,canola, corn, sunflower  and sesame. All the others are fine. Now go to soap cal. You need to read and play and make your own recipe.


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## Gaspar Navarrete (Mar 21, 2015)

Hello not_ally,

I read the same thing, that one can use up to 10% castor oil for lather.

I am hesitant to use those other oils for exactly the reason you said - the tendency to make the soap rancid and DOS.

everyone, 

Okay, sounds like I'll do my 3rd recipe again, but this time I'll up the palm oil (as suggested by Susie and Shunt 2011).

I'll also avoid the rancid prone oils.

But in general how does one determine percentages. I know to keep the Palm oil under 25% and the castor oil under 10%. But how about the other oils ?

Can I do a lye discount rather than a superfat ?

nebetmiw,

what is the url for the soap cal ? How do I make my own recipe ?

Apart from the coconut oil and castor oil rules as mentioned above, guessing the proportions for other oils on the soap-cal seems like a haphazard way of making soap to me (from my novice perspective).


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## Susie (Mar 21, 2015)

soapcalc.net is what they are talking about.  Here is a good tutorial:

http://www.soapmakingforum.com/showthread.php?t=49627

The palm oil can be over 25%.  You don't want your Coconut Oil over 20% yet.  And I don't personally like castor oil over 5%.  But that is just me.  

We wrongly call lye discount superfat, because that is what the lye calculators call it.  It is not the same thing, but both will give you unsaponified oils at the end to help with conditioning.


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## not_ally (Mar 21, 2015)

Gaspar, I use the majestic mountain sage calculator and soapcalc, usually together.  They both have pros/cons - mms is (IMO) easier to use and lets you resize easily, soapcalc gives you prediction values, although they are not always correct since they do not factor in substances that do not saponify, I think.  But they are really valuable tools.  Here are the links:  

https://www.thesage.com/calcs/LyeCalc.html
http://soapcalc.net/calc/SoapCalcWP.asp

They are essential in determining lye amts/saponification values that you must have unless you are a math genius and can do it yourself (which I am not.)  Also relatively easy to use after a bit.  Re a recipe, here is one that Suzy - a great and helpful poster here - suggests for beginners, I am trying it myself tonight.  Do you have lard/tallow available to you?   I think, although maybe be misremembering, that she has suggested you could use a combination or just one of lard/tallow/PO instead of just lard here, hopefully she will see this and correct me if I am wrong.

Suzy's recipe:

Lard 55%
Coconut Oil 20%
Olive Oil 20%
Castor Oil 5%
Superfat 5-8%

Edited to add:  sorry, suzie, posted before I saw yours ....


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## Susie (Mar 22, 2015)

I don't mind.  He can use either lard, or tallow, or palm.  They all have similar SAP values, and are really similar in qualities.  I like lard the best because it is easily and cheaply available here, and because it is lusciously conditioning.

That is not really my recipe, I saw it so many places that I figured the people posting it had to be onto something wonderful.  I was right.  And it makes a good recipe for folks who need a starter recipe that they can compare other soaps to, then tweak it and make it their own.


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## not_ally (Mar 22, 2015)

Also, sorry for misspelling your name - three times - in my post, that takes some real talent! Will do better in the future.


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## Susie (Mar 22, 2015)

Don't worry about it!  Really!  I don't care what anyone calls me, as long as it doesn't get you in trouble with the mods. LOL


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## cmzaha (Mar 22, 2015)

nebetmiw said:


> Don't use the following for the go bad fast. Soy,canola, corn, sunflower and sesame. All the others are fine. Now go to soap cal. You need to read and play and make your own recipe.


I use a lot of canola because I like the feel of it in soap, much more than olive. I have used it up to 35% and never had a bar go rancid. Still have a couple around that are over 2 yrs old and not a spot on them. I do not use high oleic, but do add in some roe.


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## The Efficacious Gentleman (Mar 22, 2015)

Gaspar, I would read a lot of the posts here about recipes - you see what people suggest and why. Sure, the recipe itself might not be 100% what you are after, but people will say things like 'oh, you should lower the castor or the bar is likely to be too sticky. Less than 10% is fine but most people find that 5% is spot on'

Then you have that nugget of information stored away. Then in another thread someone talks about using butters in their recipes and someone says 'I find too high % of butters lowers lather. I use either palm oil, lard or tallow at about 50% instead of butters' and there you have TWO good tips that you can factor in. 

This is a great way to learn. It's like watching a game being played to learn the rules in practice when there are too many to learn just by having it explained

In fact, directly below this thread (at the moment) are two such examples - one about lard amounts and the second is a 'my second batch' thread. Both examples of where you can see some recipes and get tips and feedback.


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## navigator9 (Mar 22, 2015)

Exactly what Craig said above. A great way to learn soapmaking is to take a recipe you find that looks good to you, and tweak it in Soap Calc. This teaches you a lot. It gets you used to using Soap Calc, a very valuable tool to soapmakers. (It's not the only lye calculator, but it's probably the most used.) It also teaches you about oils and butters. Soap Calc will give you a predicted range of values for the ingredients you've chosen. If you add more olive oil, you will see the conditioning numbers go up. If you add more coconut oil, you will see the fluffy lather numbers go up. But the numbers do not tell the whole story. After you've made your soap, and cured it, try it and see what you think. Is it what you hoped for? If not, go back to Soap Calc, and work on it some more. You will learn a lot along the way by experimenting like this, and in the end, you'll have a recipe that is uniquely yours.


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## nebetmiw (Mar 22, 2015)

cmzaha said:


> I use a lot of canola because I like the feel of it in soap, much more than olive. I have used it up to 35% and never had a bar go rancid. Still have a couple around that are over 2 yrs old and not a spot on them. I do not use high oleic, but do add in some roe.



Ah but the point here is that you use ROE to preserve it. There for you are less likely to get DOS or go rancid.


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## Gaspar Navarrete (Mar 23, 2015)

Okay, I will start playing around with the soap-calc.  For now, I'll make Susie's recipe.  I'll post the results when I'm done.

I did read one blurb about canola oil needing to be blended with some "saturated oils" to saponify well.  What is a "saturated oil" and which ones are the saturated oils ?

Also, what is a "richer" oil.  I read that as well.


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## The Efficacious Gentleman (Mar 23, 2015)

Where are you reading these terms?

A saturated oil likely refers to one that is high in saturated fat.


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## Gaspar Navarrete (Mar 26, 2015)

It was from a soap making book.  It said that canola oil isn't good on its own.


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## dixiedragon (Mar 26, 2015)

Millersoap.com has lots of recipes with different ingredients.


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## The Efficacious Gentleman (Mar 26, 2015)

Gaspar Navarrete said:


> It was from a soap making book.  It said that canola oil isn't good on its own.



Just had a look on the old Soapcalc and Canola is indeed mostly unsaturated fat, so it seems that is what they were driving out.  

Interesting thought - I also look at lard and it is pretty much half and half, but makes a fairly decent 80% soap from what I have read recently.


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## Dorymae (Mar 26, 2015)

One thing to understand is soap ingredients are very subjective. The "rules" are too. Take coconut oil, as a general rule under 25% some say under 20%, but you will find people on this forum who love and swear by recipes that have 30% coconut or more!  

To start out follow the general rules, but as you go along don't be afraid to push the envelope and see what happens. It is sort of like baking a cake, some people substitute apple sauce for the oil, some say it makes a cake too soft, some like cake flour only, some use a mixture. 

The whole idea is to find what you like, and that may be very different from what I like or others like.  This is one reason soap making is such an awesome past-time, it is always changing, never the same. You can make soap for 10 years, then someone comes along with an experiment that changes the whole way you think of things. 

Bottom line is this is not an exact science. It is more like a blend of art and science.


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## shunt2011 (Mar 26, 2015)

^^^
Exactly this.  I certainly experimented a whole lot before finding what works for me.  I've tried Canola, Sunflower, Grapeseed, high Castor etc.   It's all part of the learning process.  And fun too I must admit.


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## Susie (Mar 26, 2015)

Soapmaking is science in that you need X amount of lye to saponify Y amount of this particular oil.  There is no getting around this part of it.  

Everything else is art.  What I love, you may hate.  Or vice versa.


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## cmzaha (Mar 26, 2015)

dixiedragon said:


> Millersoap.com has lots of recipes with different ingredients.





nebetmiw said:


> Ah but the point here is that you use ROE to preserve it. There for you are less likely to get DOS or go rancid.


I did not clarify that the Canolive bar I had for a year and uses it off and on and it never got one spot of dos. I received it in swap and it was a Canolive recipe from Miller Soaps site.I add roe to most of my oilswhen I open the 5 gallon totes


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