# Help with increasing bubbly lather



## Godiva (Nov 5, 2011)

I bought a bar of Zum and cannot believe the amount of lather it has - much more than mine!  I use castor oil, sugar, coconut oil - and still can't get the bubbly lather I would like.  I use basic recipe - 30% ea of OO,CO,PO, 7% castor oil, and 3% of other oils or butters - i.e. shea, almond, apricot, etc.  

I'm thinking about trying fractionated coconut oil.  Has anyone used this and does it help with lather?

Or is there anything else anyone can suggest?

What number of bubbly lather do you look for in soapcalc?

I still like my soap ok, but friends who have tried my soaps have said they do not lather much.


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## Hazel (Nov 5, 2011)

I did an experiment with FCO and it doesn't help with bubbly lather. I don't recommend it for soap. 

I've never used a Zum bar so I don't know how well they lather. But I looked at your recipe and I don't know why your friends don't think it lathers enough. It should produce plenty of bubbly lather. The bubbly value number is higher than most of mine and mine produce nice bubbly lather. I also use less CO. Do you have hard water? That might be killing the lather.

How much sugar are you adding to your batches? You could eliminate the oil or butter that you put in at 3% and up the castor to 10%. That would help increase bubbly lather.


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## Bubbles Galore (Nov 5, 2011)

As a test, try removing your butters and stick to PO, CO, OO, CO. I just tested this soap to show you the bubbles. It's 39% olive, 28% palm, 28% coconut and 5% castor. Made with water and nothing else. Can't complain about the bubbles. Starts off with plenty of lacy bubbles and becomes creamy after a few seconds.


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## Godiva (Nov 5, 2011)

Thanks.  I'll try again.


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## carebear (Nov 5, 2011)

Increase your coconut oil dramatically and double your superfat/lye discount to compensate.


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## Bubbles Galore (Nov 5, 2011)

If you use a nylon scrubby ball in the shower, you get Bubbles Galore, even from castile soap.  :wink:


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## Stinkydancer (Nov 5, 2011)

Bubbles Galore said:
			
		

> If you use a nylon scrubby ball in the shower, you get Bubbles Galore, even from castile soap.  :wink:



Yep- 100% I agree with this- it's amazing.


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## busymakinsoap! (Nov 5, 2011)

I use coconut oil at 30% with an 8% superfat, and my soap doesnt bubble very much in the shower.

I think the high superfat mixed with my other oils and butters decreases the bubbles, but I don't mind, I kinda like that silky feel - it's a personal preference.  I liken it to body wash, which doesn't lather when you add it straight to your skin, it needs a poofer, and tradtionally body wash is said to be more moisturising than store brought soap :wink:


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## Bubbles Galore (Nov 5, 2011)

The soap on my hand (above) is superfatted (lye discount) at 14% which is quite high for me to do with that kind of soap. That's bubbly enough I think but perhaps other people want more bubbles.  :wink:


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## tlm884 (Nov 6, 2011)

I noticed that adding some extra glycerin helps a bit with the later issue. It doesnt increase the lather, but it def makes it more stable


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## Northland Naturals (Nov 6, 2011)

it's been said before, but soapcalc is a loose guide.  the best lather i have gotten from bars has been from relentless experimentation.  i've settled on a recipe that based on soapcalc is low on cleansing and barely on the charts for lather.  but in combination with my other ingredients, it bubbles like crazy.  keep experimenting and don't count on those soap calc numbers too much.


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## Godiva (Nov 6, 2011)

busymakinsoap! said:
			
		

> I use coconut oil at 30% with an 8% superfat, and my soap doesnt bubble very much in the shower.
> 
> I think the high superfat mixed with my other oils and butters decreases the bubbles, but I don't mind, I kinda like that silky feel - it's a personal preference.  I liken it to body wash, which doesn't lather when you add it straight to your skin, it needs a poofer, and tradtionally body wash is said to be more moisturising than store brought soap :wink:



I use a washcloth and get lots of lather in the shower, but bar alone doesn't produce much.  The Zum bar was quite another story though.  It produces plenty of lather.

Does goats milk add lather?  I thought it would make it creamier.  I haven't used goats milk much though.


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## Stinkydancer (Nov 6, 2011)

The sugars in the milk create a creamy as well as bubbly bar. 

I have only found this to be true with liquid goat milk. I used powder a couple of times and didn't get the same result.


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## judymoody (Nov 6, 2011)

Is ZUM CP or M&P?


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## Hazel (Nov 6, 2011)

I've only seen CP but they might do some MP.


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## Fragola (Nov 6, 2011)

Stearic acid is bubbly.

Not only milk sugars, but also regular sugar helps with bubbles (like 1-2 tsp ppo).

Seems to me that a slightly lower superfat also bubbles more.


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## dcornett (Nov 7, 2011)

great advice so far...I've found that coconut milk soaps lather really well, you might want to try that instead of goats milk.


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## Soapy Gurl (Nov 7, 2011)

I just got the Zum Bar catalog and this is what is in the soap.  Goats milk, olive, coconut, palm and castor.  They use 100% essential oils.  They have a picture of them making the bars in wood slab molds and hand swirling them.  So it is a simple recipe, all natural, no bubbling additives.


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## Hazel (Nov 7, 2011)

Fragola said:
			
		

> Stearic acid is bubbly.
> 
> Not only milk sugars, but also regular sugar helps with bubbles (like 1-2 tsp ppo).
> 
> Seems to me that a slightly lower superfat also bubbles more.



I add extra sugar or honey to some of my batches. Just be careful because sugar can make the loaf overheat.


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## Stinkydancer (Nov 7, 2011)

Stearic killed some of my lather in a low amount...hmmm not sure how bubbly that is.


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## carebear (Nov 7, 2011)

It is a very dense, stable lather.  Not big bubbles.


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## Stinkydancer (Nov 7, 2011)

carebear said:
			
		

> It is a very dense, stable lather.  Not big bubbles.



That explains it and why I don't use it. Thanks!


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## honor435 (Nov 7, 2011)

if your soap bubbly number is 28-30 it will have bubbles, I dont use sugar either.


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## panzerakc (Nov 7, 2011)

Godiva said:
			
		

> I bought a bar of Zum and cannot believe the amount of lather it has - much more than mine!  I use castor oil, sugar, coconut oil - and still can't get the bubbly lather I would like.  I use basic recipe - 30% ea of OO,CO,PO, 7% castor oil, and 3% of other oils or butters - i.e. shea, almond, apricot, etc.
> 
> I'm thinking about trying fractionated coconut oil.  Has anyone used this and does it help with lather?
> 
> ...



You could also take your 30% coconut oil and split that percentage into 15% coconut and 15% palm kernel.  Or 10/10/10 coconut/palm kernel/babassu.

Anita


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## busymakinsoap! (Nov 7, 2011)

dcornett said:
			
		

> great advice so far...I've found that coconut milk soaps lather really well, you might want to try that instead of goats milk.



Same - I wonder if that is because coconut milk and oil have the same properties?

I ran out of dish wash liquid a while back and was forced to use an unscented 100% coconut oil bar with coconut milk to wash dishes and benches and it's super bubbly (it actually worked really well, even cleaned the frying pan!).  Maybe just a nice simple reicpe like that?  With a 20% superfat, your 7% castor and 3% butters - that would make a beautiful bar.


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## melinda48 (Dec 30, 2018)

Godiva said:


> I bought a bar of Zum and cannot believe the amount of lather it has - much more than mine!  I use castor oil, sugar, coconut oil - and still can't get the bubbly lather I would like.  I use basic recipe - 30% ea of OO,CO,PO, 7% castor oil, and 3% of other oils or butters - i.e. shea, almond, apricot, etc.
> 
> I'm thinking about trying fractionated coconut oil.  Has anyone used this and does it help with lather?
> 
> ...


When you look at the Soap Calc info, there is a “show graph” button that visibly illustrates the characteristics of the soap recipe you have entered. I find it useful!


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## shunt2011 (Dec 30, 2018)

melinda48 said:


> When you look at the Soap Calc info, there is a “show graph” button that visibly illustrates the characteristics of the soap recipe you have entered. I find it useful!



This post is 7 years old. The OP hasn’t been here in years.  Please don’t pull up old threads. You are welcome to start a new thread and link to old threads.  Thank you!


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## lsg (Dec 30, 2018)

Sodium lactate is suppose to increase lather.


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