# First time made lotion --- RASH all over???



## Vidasworld12 (Nov 7, 2017)

Hi Everyone,

So on the weekend I made lotion for the first time - it was swift crafty monkey recipe 

70 % water
15 % oil  - ( i used avocado oil )
5 % shea butter 
3 % cetyl alcohol
5 % polawax
1 % Fragrance oil - ( i used baby powder FO )
0.7 % germall plus

so I did all it asked BUT did forget to hold for extra 20 min - it was heated for aprox 30-35 min when i realized it was at 70c , then mixed water into oils then mixed with frother - the amount was too small for SB

waited for 45 c then added FO and Germall plus, let it cool , put into plastic bottle i bought from place i buy products from ( did spray bottle with alcohol prior to putting lotion in )

I applied to my whole body, next day everything was fine and I used on me and kids ... fast forward to 3rd day- today , I woke up and I had a rash all over .. mostly mid section , itchy, bright red... I clearly didnt put on anymore

so what happened?? The FO was my first thought- what do you guys think???its a small amount( 100 g ) so its not too bad throwing it out
But im just wondering if anyone experienced this and what could it be???

all replies are appreciated ...

thxx in advance


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## Cellador (Nov 7, 2017)

I am new to lotion making, but my first thought is...do you have known allergies? Is this the first time you've used any of these ingredients?
I believe Polawax has a proprietary blend, so the manufacturer does not provide a list of ingredients, so maybe something there. Or, the FO like you mentioned.


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## Saponificarian (Nov 7, 2017)

Liquid Germal Plus max usage is 0.5% I believe, that could give you issues. My other suspect will be Shea Butter maybe? Some people react to it. If it were me, I will eliminate Shea and then liquid Germal plus. I would try Phenoxyethanol or Phenonip


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## Vidasworld12 (Nov 7, 2017)

Cellador said:


> I am new to lotion making, but my first thought is...do you have known allergies? Is this the first time you've used any of these ingrefients?
> I believe Polawax has a proprietary blend, so the manufacturer does provide a list of ingredients, so maybe something there. Or, the FO like you mentioned.





I dont have allergies to anything ( that im aware of ) I mean Ive used plenty of creams/lotions  from all over ( store bought ) , so im sure the ingredients I used in this lotion ive come in contact before else where- and ive bought cheap brands in my past lol..

thx for the reply


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## Vidasworld12 (Nov 7, 2017)

Saponificarian said:


> Liquid Germal Plus max usage is 0.5% I believe, that could give you issues. My other suspect will be Shea Butter maybe? Some people react to it. If it were me, I will eliminate Shea and then liquid Germal plus. I would try Phenoxyethanol or Phenonip





HEY saponificarian!

So nice to hear from you again... you think its the preserve? so its 0.5%? the shea butter is refined- ive used plenty in my soaps 

you think I should try with a 0.5 % on the preserve and see what it does.. I would hate to not be able to use it ... i didnt buy alot of it but its still such a waste 

thxxx for always replying


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## SparksnFlash (Nov 7, 2017)

Oh my, you could have an allergy to any one of those things (with the likely exception of water).  It would be best to check with a doctor, but if you don't you might try putting a tiny dab of each ingredient on the inside of your arm.  One per arm per day, and remember what you put on what arm, and see if you have a reaction to anything individually.


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## Vidasworld12 (Nov 7, 2017)

Gini said:


> Oh my, you could have an allergy to any one of those things (with the likely exception of water).  It would be best to check with a doctor, but if you don't you might try putting a tiny dab of each ingredient on the inside of your arm.  One per arm per day, and remember what you put on what arm, and see if you have a reaction to anything individually.




ya.. thats a good idea actually thxx


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## Vidasworld12 (Nov 7, 2017)

Saponificarian ,

at what % should the phenonip or phenoxyethanol be used at?? is there info some where out there were I could look this info at?

thxxx


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## Cellador (Nov 7, 2017)

Vidasworld12 said:


> Saponificarian ,
> 
> at what % should the phenonip or phenoxyethanol be used at?? is there info some where out there were I could look this info at?
> 
> thxxx



Usually, .25% - 1%. But, Phenonip is a little more specific- it is inactivated by certain ingredients and it has to be added at different temperatures than LGP. 

Just make sure to read the info provided by the seller.


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## penelopejane (Nov 7, 2017)

I hope you have a really accurate scale. Measuring such tiny amounts means you have a lot of room for error. A couple of drops too many could take an ingredient from 1-4%.


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## Saponificarian (Nov 7, 2017)

http://swiftcraftymonkey.blogspot.com.ng/p/preservatives.html?m=1 And Phenonip here. http://swiftcraftymonkey.blogspot.com.ng/2010/10/preservatives-phenonip.html?m=1.

The patch test makes a lot of sense. There is this voice in my head that keeps saying it’s the LGP. Get an accurate scale try it at 0.3%. Heat and hold for 20mins. I know Cetyl alcohol is very very safe, I would drop it simply because it is one less thing to worry about at this time and also the fragrance oil; You might have used it and be fine in soap but lotion stay on your skin longer than soap ehn?  It’s an elimination game right now till you find out what could be the problem


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## carebear (Nov 8, 2017)

Sounds like you became sensitized to one of the ingredients.  Unfortunately, a single patch test won't tell you if that's going to happen.  Was the fragrance oil skin safe for a leave-on product?


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## dixiedragon (Nov 8, 2017)

Cellador said:


> Usually, .25% - 1%. But, Phenonip is a little more specific- it is inactivated by certain ingredients and it has to be added at different temperatures than LGP.
> 
> Just make sure to read the info provided by the seller.


 
I know Phenonip is deactivated at certain temps, but I never read anything about certain ingredients! Link?


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## Saranac (Nov 8, 2017)

dixiedragon said:


> I know Phenonip is deactivated at certain temps, but I never read anything about certain ingredients! Link?



I think there's incompatibilities between Phenonip and polysorbates.  EDITED TO ADD LINK: http://swiftcraftymonkey.blogspot.com/2010/11/preservatives-choosing-preservative.html

As for the allergy issue, have you used avocado before?  I think that some who suffer from latex allergies have issues with avocado.


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## Dahila (Nov 8, 2017)

avocado or shea butter, in soap it is different, remember shea butter contains natural latex.  Had anyone get this reaction? 
Germall would be a culprit too.  someone said is max %0.5 !!!
Phenonip I use at 1% and it is more forgiving  about temps that Germall.  Phenonip will be deactivated if the temp is more than 70C ,  
Polysorbate, deactivating even Susan is not 100% sure about it.  No enough research about this, at least I had not find any research


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## Saranac (Nov 8, 2017)

Dahila said:


> No enough research about this, at least I had not find any research



I'm not sure if it's okay to post links to other forums, so I won't, but elsewhere I've scene talk about polysorbates deactivating some preservatives, and that you have to

"overwhelm the inactivation capacity of the polysorbates with a higher level of preservatives than would ordinarily be used without the presence of polysorbates in the formulation."

Not my words, but I can provide a link to the (forum) post if it's not against this forum's policies. . . .  Otherwise, just google that entire quote and read on.


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## Cellador (Nov 8, 2017)

dixiedragon said:


> I know Phenonip is deactivated at certain temps, but I never read anything about certain ingredients! Link?



http://swiftcraftymonkey.blogspot.com/search?q=Phenonip&m=1
I think it is also deactivated by ceteareth 20 which is found in some e-waxes.


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## Dahila (Nov 8, 2017)

I am not sure I use ewax with phenonip, I believe that it can be deactivated that why I use at 1%


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## magali (Nov 14, 2017)

Can you use phenoxyethanol alone to preserve a lotion?


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## Susie (Nov 14, 2017)

Gini said:


> Oh my, you could have an allergy to any one of those things (with the likely exception of water).  It would be best to check with a doctor, but if you don't you might try putting a tiny dab of each ingredient on the inside of your arm.  One per arm per day, and remember what you put on what arm, and see if you have a reaction to anything individually.



Draw a circle on your skin (might be better to use your legs so they are covered) with Sharpie.  Label what the ingredient is. Dab a small amount into that circle.  Do not erase that circle for 72 hours.

Actually, with the rash occurring on the trunk first, it sounds more like an ingestion allergy.  So, I have to ask if you are on any new medications or have eaten something that you don't eat very often.  But you can develop an allergy to anything at any time, so rule out the lotion first, but then you need to look at the rest of everything.


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## Saponificarian (Nov 14, 2017)

Answering the Phenoxyethanol question: 

I use it but only for cream cleaners I use for my children for bathing which I make every 2 weeks and it’s in a pump bottle. And heat and hold for 20mins plus Good Manufacturing Process. All these steps to be safe because Phenoxyethanol does not have a fungicide. It takes care of bacteria and yeast but not fungi. So if your lotion/cream is going to be in a cup with people dipping their hands inside and you are not too sure of your equipment/Bottle Sanitization and you don’t know how long you are going to be keeping your cream for, I won’t advise you use it.


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## cmzaha (Nov 14, 2017)

magali said:


> Can you use phenoxyethanol alone to preserve a lotion?


I would not. Here is a link to read as to why http://www.lotioncrafter.com/phenoxyethanol.html


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## Saponificarian (Nov 14, 2017)

Wow! Learnt something new from that link to lotioncrafter. Thanks cmzaha.


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