# Laundry powder



## PippiL (Mar 21, 2013)

I decided to take on laundry powder.
Just a few questions.
I will research more tonight.....
What is important when making the soap.No SF,what kind of oils ( lard,coconut)?No coloring, does the soap has to cure like we usually do?
How about HE machines, like I have? Ratios?
Thank you, maybe if you have tutorials on here?
:shifty:


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## Seifenblasen (Mar 21, 2013)

Most people either use a straight coconut soap or soap high in coconut and/or lard for laundry soap with no superfat to 1 - 2% max.  It doesn't have to cure for a long time, but at least till there is no zap.

Anne Marie tested her recipes with HE (about 2 tablespoons per load) and they all worked OK.  I have been using a modified version (1 cup shredded soap, 1 cup borax, 2 cups washing soda, 1/2 cup oxyclean) using my blotched soaps (and sometimes trimmings) for about 6 months now, so far so good.  

http://www.soapqueen.com/bath-and-body-tutorials/home-crafts/three-diy-laundry-soap-recipes/


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## Lindy (Mar 21, 2013)

Actually the best laundry soap is lye heavy as it increases the cleansing.  You don't want any free-floating oils in your laundry or you are defeating the purpose of washing.  Borax is important as is washing soda.  Oxyclean is a nice addition but I would prefer baking soda and citric acid....


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## DeeAnna (Mar 21, 2013)

I have been using 50% lard, 50% coconut with a 3% lye discount. (Maybe when I get more confidence and experience, I'll try a lower discount.) I have done stovetop HP and CPOP. A day or so after the soap is made -- while it's still soft -- I shred it with my food processor, then roughly mix the shreds with equal parts by weight of baking soda, borax, and washing soda. 

I use the blade in my food processor to powder the grated soap with the other ingredients until the soap is a powder -- the texture I'm going for is like coarse cornmeal. I include the other ingredients with the soap in the processor bowl to keep the soap from softening and "mooshing" together rather than turning into a powder. (Found that tip out the hard way.)

I use about 2 tablespoons of this mix for a typical medium load and 3 tablespoons for a dirty or large load. I have a top loading HE washer, and I almost always use cold water. Because the soap is so finely ground, I haven't had any problems with it dissolving quickly and rinsing out properly.

I got curious about the other ingredients -- what do they contribute to the party? You'll find recipes that do have baking soda, and others that don't, for example. Given the many variations on this theme, it's obvious that there are many opinions about what makes a good laundry soap mix. Here's what I concluded:

Baking powder is a fabric softener, secondary water softener, and pH buffer. Its pH is slightly above 7.
Borax whitens, cleans, and deodorizes. Its pH is about 9.5.
Washing soda is the primary water softener. It whitens and degreases. Its ph is about 11.

A lot of people, like Siefenblasen, also add oxiclean to the mix. I have seen some recipes that include the citric acid that Lindy mentioned, but not as many. I add oxiclean separately as needed -- that's just my preference.

Oh, and I stumbled across some inexpensive plastic shot glasses at Walmart --  a dozen for under $2. A shot is about 2 TBL, so they make great scoops and reduce the temptation to add too much soap to the load. A little condiment cup scrounged from the local burger joint would work too. 

Pet peeve -- I hate the big caps that commercial laundry detergent comes in!!! I am convinced they are cleverly designed to make the consumer use way too much expensive detergent. :x


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## Kansas Farm Girl (Mar 21, 2013)

I made 0% SF lard soap for use in my laundry soap, with washing soda and borax. I added baking soda to the second batch. I have added BS to my laundry for yrs so it was just natural. I mixed it into my soap. I like liquidy soap, not powder so melt this all in water. I have been using this for about a year now and cannot ever see myself buying commercial laundry detergent again. I have seen a recipe to mix the oils, lye, water, sodas and borax together to make the soap as one process rather than making a batch then grating it up to mix with the rest of the ingredients. I have not tried that yet, but that is the plan for the next batch. Using coconut oil, maybe some lard since I have a plethora of lard.


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## sweethavenarts (Mar 21, 2013)

My vote I to make a small batch what ever you try. A fair bit of laundry soap had to be given away when I discovered I've got some sort of sensitivity to borax.


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## whitetulips (Mar 21, 2013)

I've been using 1 cup Borax, 1 cup Arm and Hammer washing soda, 1 finely ground bar of Fels Naptha and mixing it together.  I use 2 Tbsp. per load in my HE washer.  I really like a fragrance, so I added some in this last batch.  I prefer the powder soap over making it into a liquid because it rinses out of the soap dispenser in my washer better.


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## CaliChan (Mar 21, 2013)

I've been using my lye heavy soaps for my laundry mixed with borax, washing soda and baking soda.


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## whitetulips (Mar 21, 2013)

I have to try to make some CP soap.  The Fels Naptha really gets grease stains out well.


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## houseofwool (Mar 21, 2013)

I've been making a soap with a 1% sf, 1 lb of lard and 8 oz of coconut oil.  I shred it after it is cured, but I've found the center is still a bit gummy, so I leave the shreds sit out for a day or two to harden up and then whiz it up in a food processor to get that fine cornmeal texture.  then I mix in the washing soda and borax.  I've had great luck with it and my clothes are looking great.  I will never go back to commercial laundry detergent.  I really dislike it when my mom or the ex wash the kids' clothes at their houses because it takes several cycles for the artificial perfumes to wash out.  UGH.


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## rosevalleygirl (Mar 22, 2013)

Laundry powder was the primary reason I started making soap!

I usually make 100% lard soap, no sf.  I've also used whatever odds and ends I have around. I mix 1 part soap with 2 parts borax and 2 parts washing soda and some lavender eo.  

I use a heaping tablespoon directly into the tub (I have a front loader), with a swig of vinegar in the softener compartment.  I stopped using the powder in the dispenser this year due to buildup.

I've just been finely grating the soap, but I think I'll try to pulse it in the food processor.  I'll never buy commercial laundry detergent again. 

It doesn't use soap, but I also make dishwasher detergent.

from *http://www.ourhomemadehappiness.com*
*Homemade Dishwasher Detergent **for Hard Water: *
1/2 pound Citric Acid 
1 cup Borax
1 cup Washing Soda
1/2 cup Kosher Salt

Combine borax, washing soda, and kosher salt.  Keep citric acid  separate.  Use 1 teaspoon citric acid and 1 tablespoon borax/washing  soda/kosher salt mixture per load. You put the mix in the covered container and the citric acid in the open container.  

I also put vinegar in the rinse aid department.

You have to keep the powders separate so that it doesn't harden into a brick.  I've heard of people mixing them up and dividing into ice cube trays.  It hardens and you can use them like a the pellets.


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## PippiL (Mar 22, 2013)

Thank you so much for all the great info.I can't wait to try it.


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## melstan775 (Mar 22, 2013)

Any recipes for an unscented laundry bar? I absolutely loathe the smell of Fels Naptha.


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## siobhan1011 (Mar 22, 2013)

It's hard to get hold of borax now in the UK so I use a soap recipe that I've posted before I will post it here again if it is wanted later as I'm in my phone right now. I use half a kilo of baking soda or bicarbonate of soda as it is also known as, plus a kilo of soda crystals also known as washing soda or soda ash. I grated one sixth of the soap then put it all in a food processor to get a powder. A normal dose is two tablespoons but I use four as I have a 9kg drum machine.


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## MaitriBB (Mar 22, 2013)

I use 1 cup of borax and 1 cup of washing soda for each bar of my own CP soap that I grate up.  I recently grated up almost a whole batch of coffee-scented soap where the GM went flooey on me and burnt, so now our clothes smell like coffee, but in a good way   I should add baking soda also though, good to know for next time.  Right now I've got half of a 5-gallon bucket filled with the coffee stuff.


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## Ruthie (Mar 22, 2013)

So--- does anyone have any problems when they have used 5% superfat for laundry?  I'm using 1% I made for that purpose, but have some "flooey" bars (as Maitri calls them) that I'd just as soon NOT rebatch....  I'm guessing it works OK, but had to ask to be sure.


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## siobhan1011 (Mar 22, 2013)

I found the video I posted before, and the recipe from that is
12oz coconut oil
12oz lard
7.5oz soybean oil
5oz lye
11.9oz water


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## DeeAnna (Mar 22, 2013)

sweethavenarts said:


> My vote I to make a small batch what ever you try. A fair bit of laundry soap had to be given away when I discovered I've got some sort of sensitivity to borax.



Bummer! I suspect you might get a decent product if you leave the borax out. But you make a very good point about trying a small batch first.


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## lizflowers42 (Mar 22, 2013)

melstan775 said:


> Any recipes for an unscented laundry bar? I absolutely loathe the smell of Fels Naptha.



I'm going to be a smarty here, excuse me in advance, Mel!

Make cp/hp/cpop as usual, skipping the step where you add in any fragrance at trace.  Aaaaaaaaand done 

Seriously though, buy some vegetable shortening, plug it in soap calc with 0%sf and you are good to go.


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## siobhan1011 (Mar 22, 2013)

DeeAnna said:


> Bummer! I suspect you might get a decent product if you leave the borax out. But you make a very good point about trying a small batch first.



I've not used borax because I can't get hold of it here. I have been very happy with the results I have had with the recipe I found, in fact I my white towels have not been so white since they were first bought . I use a scoop of the oxyclean crystal white, with my whites and normal cheap generic oxy powder in my colours, but then I always have.


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## Badger (Mar 22, 2013)

I was given a recipe that has just baking soda, washing soda and the shredded soap.  I don't have oxiclean or borax in it.


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## nebetmiw (Mar 23, 2013)

Glad this thread is going answered some of my questions but.  Are we talking the baking soda you get for baking? is for cookies and such  Also how does everyone grate there soap?  I have a cheese grater and I can not imagine using it for soap way to hard on hands.  

So if I make a pound of soap up for laundry I guess I will need a 5 lb bucket to put it in.  I know that will not last long here now the MIL is coming to live with us. She has to have laundry done every two days.  She is old and has acceindents.


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## Lindy (Mar 23, 2013)

Yup baking soda like what you use for baking.  It actually has a lot of uses besides baking.  It's great for deodorizing which is oneof the reasons to have it in your laundry soap.  I have a grater that is strictly for my soap.  It's one of those that have the plastic container attached to the bottom and I love it.


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## Badger (Mar 23, 2013)

I used a cheese grater to grate my soap.  As it has never been used before to my memory, designating it as soap only was not a hardship to me.  As the soaps for laundry are usually heavier with lye, they break up on the grater fairly easily.


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## siobhan1011 (Mar 23, 2013)

I bought a second hand food processor and use that for the grating the soap and then for whizzing it to a powder with the soda crystals and bicarb


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## Lindy (Mar 23, 2013)

I bought a huge one for turning it all into powder.  Of course it is bigger, better and badder than the one for food..... :shifty:


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## melstan775 (Mar 23, 2013)

Lindy said:


> I bought a huge one for turning it all into powder.  Of course it is bigger, better and badder than the one for food..... :shifty:



Is it a ninja?   . 

I just use the fine grater for my soap, I don't bother to crunch it up to be as small as powder. In warm water that small
It dissolves fine for me.


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## Lindy (Mar 23, 2013)

Yeah! A Ninja Food Processor.... man that thing is a monster....


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## nebetmiw (Mar 23, 2013)

Lindy said:


> Yeah! A Ninja Food Processor.... man that thing is a monster....



You are so right there.  I have the blender with 3 blades.  Thing is down right scary. LOL


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## Lindy (Mar 23, 2013)

Yes but isn't it wonderful?  LOL  I used mine today to puree some mandarin oranges for soapmaking tomorrow.....


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## siobhan1011 (Mar 24, 2013)

my washing machine is cold water only fill, so I like to really blitz my laundry soap into a powder.


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## Seifenblasen (Mar 24, 2013)

Ruthie said:


> So--- does anyone have any problems when they have used 5% superfat for laundry?  I'm using 1% I made for that purpose, but have some "flooey" bars (as Maitri calls them) that I'd just as soon NOT rebatch....  I'm guessing it works OK, but had to ask to be sure.



I have used a 5% superfat soap (perfectly fine soap, but I used some FO sample I got for free with an order - yuck) and have not had any problem with rancid or dirty clothing.  Also, thank goodness the scent does not linger!  

Guess if someone is specifically making soap for laundry, 0% superfat is the way to go.  But I have been using my blotched soaps just fine.


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## melstan775 (Mar 24, 2013)

lizflowers42 said:


> I'm going to be a smarty here, excuse me in advance, Mel!
> 
> Make cp/hp/cpop as usual, skipping the step where you add in any fragrance at trace.  Aaaaaaaaand done
> 
> Seriously though, buy some vegetable shortening, plug it in soap calc with 0%sf and you are good to go.



Just saw your response Liz. So just any soap will do, or vegatable shortening? That seems too easy.  Thank you!


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## lizflowers42 (Mar 24, 2013)

melstan775 said:


> Just saw your response Liz. So just any soap will do, or vegatable shortening? That seems too easy.  Thank you!



Yep!  Some people use 100% coconut oil soap with 0%sf for a cleansing laundry soap!  Just make sure it's only for laundry!


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## PippiL (Mar 25, 2013)

I'm so glad, I asked and thank you for all of your wonderful tips :smile:


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## dudeitsashley (Apr 30, 2013)

I am glad I found this thread! Just wondering it seems like everyone leaves their soap base unscented, what is the reason for this? Does the fragrance cause some adverse effect in the clothing or something?


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## cursivearts (Apr 30, 2013)

I've done the Fels Naptha before and some of my first soaps and have even made liquid detergent (you basically just melt it all down in water). It all worked great.   I missed the scents so I went back to Tide, and I have to say, I think DeeAnna is right about people using to much.  One day after my husband had done a few loads of laundry, I noticed the detergent bottle was conspicuously empty, so I asked how much he used and he said, "I filled up the whole cap like you're supposed to."  I had to explain to him about the lines inside!  I'm still not entirely sure he is using less now.  That said, after this bottle, it might be time to go back to the homemade powdered stuff, because my husband understood that, since I wrote the directions in huge letters on a label on the front.


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## cursivearts (Apr 30, 2013)

To answer Ashley, the fragrance doesn't really carry over to the clothes.  You can use it, if you want, to make the detergent smell nice BEFORE you put it in the wash, but your clothes won't smell like it, so there is really no point.


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## dudeitsashley (Apr 30, 2013)

cursivearts said:


> To answer Ashley, the fragrance doesn't really carry over to the clothes.  You can use it, if you want, to make the detergent smell nice BEFORE you put it in the wash, but your clothes won't smell like it, so there is really no point.


Thank you for the reply I hadn't thought about the scent not sticking.


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## Smee (Apr 30, 2013)

I like using lemon or orange EO in my detergent only because I like how it smells.    
If I GOTTA do the laundry, at least let me enjoy something about having to do it 

FWIW, I make my own softener using vinegar and whatever hair conditioner
is on sale, and that scent really doesn't cling to clothes, either.


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## ParkSoap (Apr 30, 2013)

I had a bunch of Kirk's soap I needed to get rid of, so I used them to start making my own laundry powder. I don't use borax because I didn't have any when I wanted to make this, and I was too lazy to walk a block to the store to get any. Ha! I've been using this for a few months now and it works beautifully. It's a bit of a hodge-podge of different recipes I found online, based on what I had on hand.

2.5 - 4 oz. bars of Kirk's soap, grated (that's 10 oz. total)
3.5 oz. citric acid
3 lb. Nellie's washing soda
4 lb. baking soda

I use white vinegar as a fabric softener, and I add a little lavender EO to that. The lavender smell lasts through the drying, but otherwise doesn't really cling to the clothes.


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## DeeAnna (Apr 30, 2013)

I have ... or rather my DH, who does most of the laundry, has been using my powdered laundry soap mix for several months now. I just got done making a third batch of 50:50 lard:CO soap and making a huge batch of soap mix for friends, family, and us.

What I realized recently is that my washer hasn't gotten stinky in weeks and the "clean washer" light has been on for about that long. With commercial detergent, the washer really needed to be cleaned and disinfected with that expensive cleaning stuff whenever the light came on -- there was a definite odor by that time. Since we have been using the homemade mix, there is no (and I do mean NO) odor. Not to say it won't happen, especially in the depths of a humid August in Iowa, but ... wow ...

I don't claim the homemade mix itself is the cure ... I also think using the correct amount of detergent/soap is important. The huge, poorly marked measuring caps on the commercial detergent are an invitation to use way too much. With the homemade mix, we use a little plastic "shot glass" from Walmart that is just the right amount.


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## melstan775 (Apr 30, 2013)

Smee said:


> I like using lemon or orange EO in my detergent only because I like how it smells.
> If I GOTTA do the laundry, at least let me enjoy something about having to do it
> 
> FWIW, I make my own softener using vinegar and whatever hair conditioner
> is on sale, and that scent really doesn't cling to clothes, either.



You can actually just use straight vinegar. I usually throw a 1/4 cup dose right into the laundry. I splurge on white wine vinegar. I'm sure it makes no difference but it's what I had on hand first time I tried it, so I kept using it.


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## Smee (Apr 30, 2013)

melstan775 said:


> You can actually just use straight vinegar. I usually throw a 1/4 cup dose right into the laundry. I splurge on white wine vinegar. I'm sure it makes no difference but it's what I had on hand first time I tried it, so I kept using it.



I've been known to do that, too, Mel.  With the conditioner mix, I either
soak a piece of a sponge in it and throw it into the dryer with the load, or
put 1/4 cup in the washer's softener cup.  I hate being consistent :mrgreen:


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## Lindy (May 1, 2013)

I actually add Lavender EO to my laundry and it carries through to the dryer....  I love it on my sheets and blankets because it's there when I make the bed.... Love It


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## DeeAnna (May 1, 2013)

Oh, another tip to add to this discussion -- I learned yesterday that you can easily convert baking soda to washing soda at home. That's good to know, because washing soda can be hard to find sometimes. 

Spread dry baking soda in a shallow pan (aluminum is fine). Bake at 400-475 deg F (200-250 deg C) for about 1 hour. Remove and let cool. 

There will not be a huge change in appearance, but if you compare the two side by side, you will see the washing soda is slightly less shiny, slightly more granular (more like very, very fine sand), and tends to clump up a bit more. Baking soda is more of a lustrous powder that flows very easily. 

The real difference is the weight loss -- if you start with 1500 grams of baking soda, you will end up with roughly 1000 grams of washing soda, so plan accordingly if you make your laundry soap mix by weight as I do.

Be careful when you handle the washing soda -- it is dusty and more alkaline than baking soda (pH of 11 for WS vs pH of 8 for BS). The dust is much more irritating to the eyes, respiratory system, and skin than BS. Even though washing soda is obviously closely related to baking soda, WS is better at removing grease and tough stains and softening hard water.

My thanks to Soaping101 (http://www.soaping101.com/) and also to Holly Homemaker (http://hollythehomemaker.blogspot.com) for turning me on to this tip.


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## dudeitsashley (May 1, 2013)

Lindy said:


> I actually add Lavender EO to my laundry and it carries through to the dryer....  I love it on my sheets and blankets because it's there when I make the bed.... Love It


Lindy do you mind sharing how much lavender you use?


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## Hazel (May 1, 2013)

DeeAnna - 

Thanks for sharing this great tip! :grin:


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## dudeitsashley (May 2, 2013)

Has anyone made their soap base scented?


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## Lindy (May 2, 2013)

dudeitsashley said:


> Lindy do you mind sharing how much lavender you use?



Sorry - I somehow missed your post.  I use an ounce or so in the wash.  If you find it's still not sticking, put some on a wash cloth and put into the dryer.  I love the smell of Lavender on my sheets....


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## marghewitt (May 3, 2013)

I have a few bars with DOS and a little rancid smell to them. Does anyone think they would be a good or bad idea to grate and use as laundry soap? I hate to throw them away but will unless I can use them somewhere else..... any suggestions?


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## lizflowers42 (May 3, 2013)

marghewitt said:


> I have a few bars with DOS and a little rancid smell to them. Does anyone think they would be a good or bad idea to grate and use as laundry soap? I hate to throw them away but will unless I can use them somewhere else..... any suggestions?



If you can stand the greasy smell sticking to your clothes! I might be more inclined to wash dishes with it where the scent will not linger.


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## rodeogal (May 3, 2013)

DeeAnna,  I have noticed the same thing with my washer since using my own laundry soap.  I used to get a white powder residue around the seal and even though I leave the door and soap drawer cracked open, it would still begin to smell.  I no longer have either problem!


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## bluescrubby (May 3, 2013)

*Liquid vs. powder laundry soap--ratio way off?*

Hello all! Question here about liquid vs. powder soaps. 

I've been using a liquid for a while (recipe: 1 bar soap grated and dissolved, 1 C borax, .5 C washing soda, dilute to 10 gallons; at 4 oz per load, approx. 300 loads), and have had really good results (cold water, 55 liters / 15 gallon drum).  I'd like to switch to a powder, but the recipes I am finding call for 2 C soap, 1 C washing powder, 1 C borax, use 2 T per load--total 32 loads' worth!  This is 10x fewer loads for the same ingredients than with the liquid I'm using now.  

Can anyone tell my why the recipes are so different?  And can I use 90% less powder and still get the result I'm getting with my liquid detergent?

Some other random info: I use store-bought vegetable-based bar soap. Our water is really really nice. Oh, and yes, I know I didn't calculate the 2 T of powder against the smallish size of our washer.  But it still doesn't account for the 10x difference in ingredients!

TIA for any input!


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## houseofwool (May 3, 2013)

I use roughly 3 oz soap to 1/2c washing soda and 1/2 c borax.  I use roughly 1/2 to 1 tbsp per load and things come out fine.  I do use a splash of bleach with whites to keep them from looking dingy.


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## bluescrubby (May 3, 2013)

Houseofwool, thanks.  How many gallons/liters is your washer?


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## dudeitsashley (May 3, 2013)

bluescrubby said:


> Hello all! Question here about liquid vs. powder soaps.
> 
> I've been using a liquid for a while (recipe: 1 bar soap grated and dissolved, 1 C borax, .5 C washing soda, dilute to 10 gallons; at 4 oz per load, approx. 300 loads), and have had really good results (cold water, 55 liters / 15 gallon drum).  I'd like to switch to a powder, but the recipes I am finding call for 2 C soap, 1 C washing powder, 1 C borax, use 2 T per load--total 32 loads' worth!  This is 10x fewer loads for the same ingredients than with the liquid I'm using now.
> 
> ...


Here is the recipe that I am going to try out for the powdered laundry soap. [ame]http://youtu.be/kaMKcG3zSZM[/ame]


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## bluescrubby (May 3, 2013)

Yes, that's basically the same recipe I referenced before--1:1 washing soda:borax, use 1-2 T per load.  The liquid recipe has that diluted down 10:1 and still works fine!  So why do all the powder recipes call for using so much?


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## Lotus (May 3, 2013)

Lindy said:


> Actually the best laundry soap is lye heavy as it increases the cleansing.  You don't want any free-floating oils in your laundry or you are defeating the purpose of washing.  Borax is important as is washing soda.  Oxyclean is a nice addition but I would prefer baking soda and citric acid....



'Tis true. If you've ever tried to wash an oil soaked towel which has been soaked in oil, you're screwed. 

Does anyone have any advice about ridding oil of an old oily towel? Is there a homemade soap one can make that will take care of that issue?

PS: If you're making homemade laundry soap, why do I hear so much about adding chemicals to it? It just feels like it defeats the purpose.


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## dudeitsashley (May 4, 2013)

Does anyone sale their laundry soap? If so how do you go about figuring out the price?


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## Lindy (May 4, 2013)

You would figure it out the same as you would any other product.  Wholesale = 2 x cost including packaging, labels and wages that you would be paying someone else to do it even though you are the one doing all the work.  The wages need to include set-up, production, cutting, shredding, packaging and labeling.  Retail is going to be 2 x wholesale....

HTH


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## DeeAnna (May 5, 2013)

"...If you're making homemade laundry soap, why do I hear so much about adding chemicals to it?..."

What kind of "chemicals" are you referring to? The washing soda, borax, and baking soda? If that troubles you, then don't use 'em -- there's no rule that says you have to. 

But your water should be rainwater soft if you want to just use soap for your laundry, or you'll have trouble with the insoluble scum that soap forms in hard water. 

--DeeAnna  

PS: See Post 4 in this thread for the reasons why other ingredients besides soap are included in many recipes for laundry soap mix.


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## bluescrubby (May 5, 2013)

dudeitsashley said:


> Does anyone sale their laundry soap? If so how do you go about figuring out the price?



I price mine at the same price per load as the leading brand. That's why I'm really concerned that all powder recipes seem to use ten times as much washing soda and borax per load as my liquid recipe!

I think I'll just make a sample batch of powder and add the same amount of WS/borax as I would be adding with the liquid and see how it works.


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## Ruthie (May 5, 2013)

I just sell the soap part, with directions on how to make their own.  I sell it for $1/oz.


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## DeeAnna (May 5, 2013)

My costs at the moment for my laundry soap mix are in the realm of about $4.10 US per pound ($9.00 per kg), not including the cost of the EOs I like to add for a light scent. This base cost does not include any markup -- I am just getting a modest payment for my time and covering my out-of-pocket expenses for materials. 

At this price point, I'm only going to make this soap mix for myself, family, and very good friends. This pricing does not remotely compensate me for the additional hassle and risk of selling to the public.

If I wanted to sell wholesale/retail, I would need to seriously reduce my material costs by using a cheaper soap recipe (currently 50% CO, 50% lard), buying materials in bulk, upgrading to better packaging and more attractive labeling (currently zip-lock plastic bags and simple labels), eliminating the essential oils or use inexpensive fragrance oils, and adding a fair markup to my base cost for wholesale and retail sales.


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## lsg (May 5, 2013)

Soaping 101 has a great tutorial on making liquid and powdered laundry soap:

http://www.youtube.com/user/soaping101


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## dudeitsashley (May 8, 2013)

Ruthie said:


> I just sell the soap part, with directions on how to make their own.  I sell it for $1/oz.


That is an interesting way to go about it.


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## babysoap (May 8, 2013)

I am thinking of adding sodium percarbonate when I make my home made soap. I can get it pure. For the Aussies out there Napisan only has about 35% in it or something. I have kids and I'm not sure if homemade laundry would work.


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## Trinity (May 25, 2013)

My first attempt at liquid laundry detergent using 1 cup washing soda, 1 cup borax and grated bar of laundry soap that I made like 3 weeks ago with about 5 gallons of water and for some reason the detergent did not thicken up at all  I don't know how thick it is suppose to be but it is still really runnny. I did use my well water which is softened ...... Could that be it and it also has a strange smell ? Has anyone had this experience? Can it be saved?


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## tryanything (May 25, 2013)

For those that say a lye heavy soap is best to use, what negative percentage do you use?  - 1-2% or more?


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## Ruthie (May 25, 2013)

I use a POSITIVE 2%.  Don't need extra oils as I wash my clothing, but want to make sure my lye is used up, too.  I would NOT recommend a negative number.


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## PippiL (Aug 21, 2013)

My friend bought some from Etsy and she says, the person adds cocoa butter 
to the soap, so there is no need for a softener ? Do you think, that would make a difference ?


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## Kansas Farm Girl (Aug 21, 2013)

I don't use a softener with the homemade laundry soap. I do put white vinegar in the rinse to make sure there isn't any soap scum stuck in the fabric. I don't put any softener in the washer nor do I need drier sheets. I find my towels are absorbent and not rough. I don't have any problem with static either.


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## Robert (Aug 22, 2013)

bluescrubby said:


> I price mine at the same price per load as the leading brand. That's why I'm really concerned that all powder recipes seem to use ten times as much washing soda and borax per load as my liquid recipe!
> 
> I think I'll just make a sample batch of powder and add the same amount of WS/borax as I would be adding with the liquid and see how it works.


I'm disturbed that just about all the homemade laundry detergent (liquid or powder) recipes call for much more alkali than research long ago showed was optimal.  These recipes that call for more borax or washing soda (or both) than soap would produce what would've been considered a very inferior product in the days when soap based laundry detergents were the rule.

First of all, there's no point in using both washing soda and borax.  They each do approximately the same thing, soda a little better IMO.  They "soften" water, provide alkalinity, and knock down suds a little.

Alkali do help the cleaning of fabrics, but they also degrade many fabrics.  And even in helping the cleaning there are diminishing returns after a little is added.  I can't tell you the point where the value a little more of them contribute to cleaning is exceeded by the value lost due to fabric degradation, but there were extensive tests done early in the 20th C., and that point is much lower than what's seen in most of the recipes going around lately.  The best products were the ones that were mostly soap, no matter how "hard" the water was.  (What was odd was the finding in the development of Tide that it worked the other way around, in that its surfactant made clothes scratchy unless a lot more "builder" was used -- but the builders were less alkaline than the ones commonly used with soap.)  And of the builders then in common use with soaps, silicates were better than carbonate or borate.  Were there commercial powders that were higher in alkali?  Sure, but they were the cheap stuff, not the good stuff.

What the problem seems to be nowadays with soap is the prevalence of HE washers.  In principle they're similar to the old front loaders (which already tended to suds more than today's top loaders), but because of their speed and small water volume, I understand they can really make a lather out of soap, to where the laundry can wind up floating on top.  But users report that's not a problem with these alkali-heavy recipes.  Unfortunately, that's because they have so little soap that to the extent they accomplish much cleaning, they're doing so rather harshly to the fabrics.


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## PippiL (Aug 22, 2013)

Thank you Robert for sharing this, I already used more soap, but good to know.
I will just use baking soda.You have any ratios in mind ?


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## PippiL (Aug 22, 2013)

I was determined to sell laundry soap, but it's very time consuming.I'm thinking about to get the ninja blender otherwise it's impossible to pulverize the soap/powder.How do you get your's chopped and pulverized ? I already ruined one kitchen aid blender.


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## Nightlilly (Aug 22, 2013)

I bought a cheap food processor with a shredder blade. Shred the soap first then add it back to the processor with the chopping blade and an equal amount of washing soda or borax. The finer powder helps break down the soap shreds.


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## Sapwn (Aug 22, 2013)

Nightlilly said:


> I bought a cheap food processor with a shredder blade. Shred the soap first then add it back to the processor with the chopping blade and an equal amount of washing soda or borax. The finer powder helps break down the soap shreds.


 


Did this cheap food processor actually pulverize the shreds?


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## azimuth (Aug 22, 2013)

My HE Washer has its own built in measuring cup in the detergent drawer. That way I know I'm using just enough as per the machine manufacturer's requirements instead of what the DETERGENT manufacturer says.





DeeAnna said:


> I have been using 50% lard, 50% coconut with a 3% lye discount. (Maybe when I get more confidence and experience, I'll try a lower discount.) I have done stovetop HP and CPOP. A day or so after the soap is made -- while it's still soft -- I shred it with my food processor, then roughly mix the shreds with equal parts by weight of baking soda, borax, and washing soda.
> 
> I use the blade in my food processor to powder the grated soap with the other ingredients until the soap is a powder -- the texture I'm going for is like coarse cornmeal. I include the other ingredients with the soap in the processor bowl to keep the soap from softening and "mooshing" together rather than turning into a powder. (Found that tip out the hard way.)
> 
> ...


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## Robert (Aug 22, 2013)

PippiL said:


> Thank you Robert for sharing this, I already used more soap, but good to know.
> I will just use baking soda.You have any ratios in mind ?


Yeah, any amount of soap to 0 baking soda!  Baking soda's not going to do anything.


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## Robert (Aug 22, 2013)

PippiL said:


> I was determined to sell laundry soap, but it's very time consuming.I'm thinking about to get the ninja blender otherwise it's impossible to pulverize the soap/powder.How do you get your's chopped and pulverized ? I already ruined one kitchen aid blender.


Commercial soap powders (as opposed to flakes) used a rapid heating process.  (Today they'd probably spray dry.)  Bits of soap would have the trapped water in them boil and the resulting tiny broken bubbles are called beads and similar to popcorn.  Hard to do with any home apparatus I can think of to make commercial quantities; oven would be pretty slow.  Intermittent microwaving will show you the principle and produce small amounts.


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## kazmi (Sep 7, 2013)

I made a batch of soap with alkanet infused OO and it has faded a LOT.  Also I did a swirl with it so not all of the soap has alkanet in it.  Not really pleased with how it came out so was thinking of turning some if it into a laundry soap.  Even with the very light color does anyone think it may stain my laundry?  I could rebatch it and add some colorant to see if its salvageable into something that I would like but was thinking about the laundry soap route instead.  Any thoughts on this?  Maybe save it for dark clothes load only?


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## MKRainville (Sep 7, 2013)

DeeAnna said:


> Oh, and I stumbled across some inexpensive plastic shot glasses at Walmart --  a dozen for under $2. A shot is about 2 TBL, so they make great scoops and reduce the temptation to add too much soap to the load. A little condiment cup scrounged from the local burger joint would work too.
> 
> Pet peeve -- I hate the big caps that commercial laundry detergent comes in!!! I am convinced they are cleverly designed to make the consumer use way too much expensive detergent. :x




Hehe... I have one or two of those condiment cups... they mysteriously came home in my togo box once... Mostly because I didnt want the sauce all over everything!  However, I use them to weigh out F/O!  

I agree! I hate those large caps... ugh so frustrating.


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## Bridgett (Sep 7, 2013)

Robert said:


> I'm disturbed that just about all the homemade laundry detergent (liquid or powder) recipes call for much more alkali than research long ago showed was optimal. These recipes that call for more borax or washing soda (or both) than soap would produce what would've been considered a very inferior product in the days when soap based laundry detergents were the rule.
> 
> First of all, there's no point in using both washing soda and borax. They each do approximately the same thing, soda a little better IMO. They "soften" water, provide alkalinity, and knock down suds a little.
> 
> Alkali do help the cleaning of fabrics, but they also degrade many fabrics. And even in helping the cleaning there are diminishing returns after a little is added. I can't tell you the point where the value a little more of them contribute to cleaning is exceeded by the value lost due to fabric degradation, but there were extensive tests done early in the 20th C., and that point is much lower than what's seen in most of the recipes going around lately. The best products were the ones that were mostly soap, no matter how "hard" the water was. (What was odd was the finding in the development of Tide that it worked the other way around, in that its surfactant made clothes scratchy unless a lot more "builder" was used -- but the builders were less alkaline than the ones commonly used with soap.) And of the builders then in common use with soaps, silicates were better than carbonate or borate. Were there commercial powders that were higher in alkali? Sure, but they were the cheap stuff, not the good stuff.


 Robert, do you have any idea where to locate this research?  My sister and mother are allergic to SLS and need a cheap alternative to laundry detergent.


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## Robert (Sep 8, 2013)

Bridgett said:


> Robert, do you have any idea where to locate this research?  My sister and mother are allergic to SLS and need a cheap alternative to laundry detergent.


Look in library collections of trade journals from the industry.  JAOCS is the more academic, but there were also variously named soap & detergent industry journals that are indexed in libraries.  Online you can still look up more recent research done in recent decades via patents, usually for formulations with minor additives with small advantages that you can easily skip, just using the rest of the formula for guidance as to what's out there.

But I'm sure you can find laundry detergents that don't use either SLS or soap.  In fact, up until the 1990s SLS had been seeing little use for decades among the anionic surfactants for laundry, having been eclipsed mostly by SDBS, and anionics generally had been dropping in usage for laundry for decades in favor of nonionics.  Yet somehow I doubt it's particularly SLS that your family has a problem with.  You may be blaming SLS for a problem with an ingredient you don't even know about.

If you want to minimize the chance of getting laundry detergent having SLS, these days I'd suggest using a liquid or powder recommended for HE machines.  But that won't do you much good if the problem's not with SLS.


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## kazmi (Sep 8, 2013)

Robert said:


> Yeah, any amount of soap to 0 baking soda! Baking soda's not going to do anything.


 
Robert did you mean to say that she needs to turn her baking soda into washing soda first?


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## Robert (Sep 8, 2013)

kazmi said:


> Robert did you mean to say that she needs to turn her baking soda into washing soda first?


She could do that (actually it becomes soda ash when cooked, but it doesn't seem worthwhile when you can simply buy some form of sodium carbonate), but my point was simply that baking soda did nothing for soap.  You'd be better off replacing the baking soda by more soap.


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## kazmi (Sep 8, 2013)

So you just powder your soap (or turn your soap to liquid) and use nothing else for laundry soap?

The reason I'm asking these questions is because you said you prefer soda to borax and I'm trying to decide how I want to proceed with trying to use soap for laundry detergent AND if I can use my alkenet colored soap.


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## mel z (Sep 8, 2013)

I think Robert is correct on adding both washing soda and borax breaking down clothes. 

I have been doing this for over a year, powdered version as I don't want any germy skin issues from touching add water and stir version sitting around too long.

I have noticed my clothing is no longer lasting. Especially the cheap undies. The elastic is shot within 2 months of new purchase. Worse, is my work clothes, which I cannot afford to replace so frequently.

I also noticed the yucking soap scum build up in the washer, and duller clothes. Even if I add vinegar to the rinse water. I still have a big bucket of this that I will keep for winter back up if I can't get out to buy detergent, but I have now purchased another bottle of "Allergen Free" detergent. (Why it costs more than the fragrance type I don't know, but the prices shot up in this last year, I have no choice but use it.) Oh, I was using Fels Naptha - whatever the new kind is - not my homemade soap.

Maybe homemade soap is gentler? 

I was using borax in hopes of getting rid of dust mite allergen, but it is not necessary if you have to wash once a week. Work clothes need cold water, so that is why Borax _et. al._

Any advice is appreciated, or I'll stick to store bought.


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## Robert (Sep 8, 2013)

kazmi said:


> So you just powder your soap (or turn your soap to liquid) and use nothing else for laundry soap?
> 
> The reason I'm asking these questions is because you said you prefer soda to borax and I'm trying to decide how I want to proceed with trying to use soap for laundry detergent AND if I can use my alkenet colored soap.


Adding some alkali (but it's got to be more alkaline than baking soda) will make it a little stronger and a little cheaper.  But if I had to choose between some of the recipes I've seen going around in recent years that are more alkali than soap, and using nothing but soap, I would easily choose using nothing but soap for laundry.

Lately in cx with this discussion I've been doing some Googling for state-of-art soap-based formulas for laundry detergent, and they're typically 70-80% soap, 5-15% alkali (carbonate or silicate of soda), and the rest other stuff.  That's not out of line with what would've been said over a century ago.

In water that was "hard" enough to make a big difference, it never paid to add enough carbonate to wash water to take up all the calcium, etc. unless it was done separately.  Laundries would "soften" their water separately rather than doctor the soap.  Consider this:

Na2CO3 + Ca(OH)2 --> CaCO3 + 2 NaOH

Meaning that if all the "hardness" in the was water to begin with was lime (it's not, but that's not too bad an approximation), you're adding washing soda to turn it into chalk and lye -- neither of which are good for fabrics.  So typically soda-"built" soaps would have only enough carbonate in them to boost the alkalinity of the wash water a little, regardless of whether it was anticipated there'd be more calcium in the water that could react with more soap and/or carbonate.  It did the clothes more of a favor to generate scummy lime soap in the wash water than to try to precipitate all the calcium as chalk, if there was a lot of it.

Silicates were better additives than carbonate or borate, and the only reason I imagine they're not used in the home recipes is that alkaline sodium silicate is not a common grocery item.  It is a little more hazardous to work with than washing soda would be, although soaps made with the amounts of sodium silicate typically used are no more hazardous than plain soap powder.

I might recommend sodium citrate as a water conditioner for these recipes, except that I read once that citrate's affinity for Ca++ isn't high enough to efficiently pull it away from soap, so you'd have to use a lot of it.  Trisodium citrate's not so strongly alkaline so it wouldn't do clothes any harm, and it complexes calcium without making a chalky residue so it's advantageous there, but apparently you'd need a lot of it, which would cost you, to make a difference in "hard" water.

If you can get sodium hexametaphosphate (the original Calgon), that'd be even better as a water "softener".  It's still used in non-alkaline bath salts for that purpose, but has become somewhat expensive.  You can use enough of it to fully "soften" the wash water and it does clothes (and skin) no harm at all.  However, if you wanted to optimize your laundry soap, it'd still pay to put in a pinch of sodium silicate or even carbonate even if there's also enough phosphate in there to complex all the "hardness" cations.  If all the people in the world who used home recipes for laundry were to switch to phosphates for their soap "builder", the pollution impact would be insignificant because so that's so few people compared to those using no-phosphate commercial detergents (and their toilets).


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## Robert (Sep 9, 2013)

I should've mentioned one little exception to baking soda's doing nothing.  If you use chlorine bleach (usually hypochlorite), bicarbonate ion helps the bleaching action.  I don't know why this is, but it even helps (as verified by my experiments 20 yrs. ago) in the formation of chlorine dioxide from chlorite ion, so bicarbonate is useful in combination with various chlorine-oxygen species.  It seems to stabilize the active species.


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## Lindy (Sep 9, 2013)

Actually baking soda also deodorizes.....


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## Robert (Sep 9, 2013)

Lindy said:


> Actually baking soda also deodorizes.....


By itself, yes, but mixed with soap it doesn't deodorize any better than the soap by itself.


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## Lindy (Sep 10, 2013)

We can agree to disagree, it doesn't lose its ability by being mixed with soap.  Consider Oxy-Clean, I believe two of the ingredients are baking soda and citric acid, same as in a bath bomb.  It deodorizes and increases the cleansing power through oxygenation.


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## Bridgett (Sep 10, 2013)

Robert, thank you for all your help.  You can do the research a lot more efficiently than I can!  And you are correct, no doctor has officially diagnosed my family members, but when they gave up shampoo, gel body wash and commercial detergents, their dermatagraphia flared up much less often.  Regular lye soap is okay, so we're using that as a basis for experimenting.  The current plan is to use sodium hexametaphosphate to soften water (it pretty much liquid rocks where they live), and 85% by weight soap, 15% sodium carbonate as laundry detergent.  I promise to update this thread in a couple of months, when we've had a chance to give this concoction a fair chance.  We  plan on  using 50% coconut oil, 50% lard soap.


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## kazmi (Sep 10, 2013)

Bridgett keep us posted!  I would really like to know how this turns out for you.  My water is not very hard so not sure if I need it but if my soap-only detergent doesn't work I may have to consider some additives.


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## Robert (Sep 10, 2013)

Lindy said:


> We can agree to disagree, it doesn't lose its ability by being mixed with soap.


It doesn't lose its ability, but it's redundant.  The way baking soda works is by its alkalinity.  It neutralizes volatile acids that you could otherwise smell.  But soap is also alkaline, so it does the same thing.  So you gain nothing in that regard by adding baking soda to it.


> Consider Oxy-Clean, I believe two of the ingredients are baking soda and citric acid, same as in a bath bomb.  It deodorizes and increases the cleansing power through oxygenation.


If that's what it has, that's just to make it fizz with CO2 bubbles.  Baking soda doesn't do any oxygenation, that has to be by some other ingredient of OxiClean, probably percarbonate or perborate.


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## Robert (Sep 10, 2013)

Bridgett said:


> (it pretty much liquid rocks where they live)


Where's that?  I'm interested in the geology & hydrology.

What's "fun" is that if you go just ~20 mi. NW of NYC (which gets its very "soft" water from afar in that direction) you get into territory that's so geologically complex that as one side effect the water differs enormously in places that aren't far from each other.  It's part of a larger karst belt that stretches hundreds of miles roughly SW-NE, from Tenn. to Ont., but this particular bit of it is very special mineralogically.


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## Bridgett (Sep 10, 2013)

Robert, my mother lives near Tombstone, AZ.  My sister lives on the Atlantic coast of FL. Oddly enough, I live on the panhandle gulf coast of florida, and my water is soft.


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## Robert (Sep 10, 2013)

Bridgett said:


> Robert, my mother lives near Tombstone, AZ.  My sister lives on the Atlantic coast of FL. Oddly enough, I live on the panhandle gulf coast of florida, and my water is soft.


In Ariz. that's to be expected because it's so dry, the water is concentrated in everything.  Calcium & magnesium there are present largely as sulfates and other salts rather than the bicarbonates associated with "hardness" in most places.  On the Atlantic coast of Fla., yeah, it's fairly "hard" in the southern portion, although many people don't get so much of that because of municipal "softening", getting rid of the bicarbonate "hardness" via lime treatment:

Ca(HCO3)2 + CaO --> 2CaCO3 (allowed to settle out in a big tank) + H2O

The great thing about that is that it leaves nothing add'l dissolved in the water.


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## PippiL (Sep 19, 2013)

So, is there a trick to pulverize the hard coconut soap, without making my blender smoke? I already broke my kitchen aid blender, the tiny ninja is on it's way out, going to invest in a big Ninja blender.
If I grind down the fresh soap, it's to gooey even when adding the powders, now I waited for the soap to dry out,stone hard.Any tricks or advise appreciated.


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## DeeAnna (Sep 19, 2013)

Don't use cured soap -- you won't get anywhere, as you are finding out. 

Use fresh soap. Chunk it up with a knife into pieces that will fit into your food processor chute. Grate it with the grating attachment of your food processor. I spread the grated shreds out on a cookie sheet so they can cool and dry slightly before processing them into powder. Just 10 minutes or so of cooling/drying is enough to help the process go smoothly.

Switch to the blade to break down the grated shreds into a coarse powder. When you use the blade, it is very important to add some of the other powders (baking soda, washing soda, borax, etc.) along with the grated soap. If you don't do this, you're right -- the soap clumps up into a mess rather than turning into a coarse powder. The powder helps the soap break down into small bits w/o heating up and clumping. Start with 2 handfuls of powder to 1 handful of grated soap (measured as loose shreds, not packed). See how that works for you. You should be able to process this mix continuously for as long as you want w/o clumping. I get good results at about 30 seconds per batch. 

When you get the hang of it, you can try less powder per batch, but watch closely for the soap to start clumping. If it does, stop processing immediately and add more powder. Pulse the mixture a bit to mix well and cool the soap, then go back to full on. 

Don't over fill the processor bowl when grating the chunked soap or when making the powder -- the bowl should be no more than 1/2 full per batch.


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## Robert (Sep 19, 2013)

PippiL said:


> So, is there a trick to pulverize the hard coconut soap, without making my blender smoke? I already broke my kitchen aid blender, the tiny ninja is on it's way out, going to invest in a big Ninja blender.
> 
> If I grind down the fresh soap, it's too gooey even when adding the powders, now I waited for the soap to dry out,stone hard.Any tricks or advise appreciated.


You're going to need some process that boils off some of the water from the soap.  It works with a microwave oven, but is tedious.  You can cook chunks of soap, somehow flake them further (by scraping off the sides of the container or whatever), transfer to another container and microwave again.  Or you can grate, microwave, hand chop, re-microwave.  The trouble is that you can work only in small amounts at a time in a discontinuous process like that.

The original granulating, "bead"- making process was discovered by someone using a comb to scrap bits off a cake of soap onto a hot plate.  Timing is everything because you don't want to melt or burn the bits of soap but make them pop like microscopic popcorn.  If you could construct an apparatus for doing that continuously, where the hot plate fed by a rotating device and was slanted so the beads would fall off onto a conveyor belt, you'd have it.

What some people have done is sort of the opposite: Grate the soap moist, and agglomerate the dry powder--the alkaline "builder"--onto it.


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## Moonblossom (Sep 22, 2013)

I use any soap I make for mine I've yet to have a problem and I've done it for over 5 years in a HE washer. I mix with Borax, Washing Soda and Oxyclean and use up to a tablespoon for each load, my clothes are always clean and fresh smelling but I also make fabric softener with Epsom salts and EO's, I just put 1/4 cup in each washer load. Works great for me...


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## PippiL (Sep 22, 2013)

Thank you, I always appreciate your answers.


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## PippiL (Sep 23, 2013)

What kind of blenders do you use, I'm about to get a new blender.


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## PippiL (Sep 30, 2013)

How much FO are you using for laundry powder ?


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## houseofwool (Sep 30, 2013)

I add the scent after I make the soap and I find that I only need a few drops.  I just add until it is as scented as I like.


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## PippiL (Oct 1, 2013)

How good does the oxi clean works in laundry powder?


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## Pilar (Mar 7, 2014)

whitetulips said:


> I've been using 1 cup Borax, 1 cup Arm and Hammer washing soda, 1 finely ground bar of Fels Naptha and mixing it together. I use 2 Tbsp. per load in my HE washer. I really like a fragrance, so I added some in this last batch. I prefer the powder soap over making it into a liquid because it rinses out of the soap dispenser in my washer better.


 One question, sorry.
 You use very much Fels Naptha in the U.S. but How about you know the problems it has? 
http://www.ewg.org/guides/cleaners/441-FelsNapthaHeavyDutyLaundryBarSoap


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## Pilar (Mar 7, 2014)

PippiL said:


> How good does the oxi clean works in laundry powder?



Oxi clean today contains enzymes as proteases, lipases amilanases... and others ingredients as Sodium percarbonate (mineral-based), Sodium carbonate, Sodium silicate, Sodium sulfate (mineral) ... they enhance washing and It is a great alternative so we do not have to use optical brighteners (some oxys have these)


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