# Lard Label Appeal



## Luv2Soap (Mar 16, 2015)

Eventually (a LONG time from now) my goal is to offer my soaps for sale. I really love the lard bar that I made!!! When I told a friend about what was in the soap, she was surprised there was lard in it and asked if I can make it without lard. 

I think there is a stigma about lard being bad for you and, thus bad for anything. I view this as a guilt by association thing. 

My question is for those who sell soaps and use lard. How do you label your soaps and do you find customers getting turned off by having that ingredient in your soaps? 

I would rather make something people will like -vs- just making something that appeals to me only.


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## shunt2011 (Mar 16, 2015)

I just list it as lard.  I  have a couple that contain lard and have never had anyone question it. It totally depends on your market.  Are there a lot of crunchy granola types or vegans or vegetarians, then they may have an issue with it.


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## Susie (Mar 16, 2015)

Since I do not sell, I can get away with this technique, but it works well for me.  When someone in my family asks what is in the soap(usually while they are smelling it), I tell them what essential oils are in there.  That usually satisfies them.  

I have one person who had a problem with the thought of using soap made with lard, but she had been using my soap for 6 months, and when I told her so, she decided that she could not live without lardy soap.  I did have the whole conversation about using the whole animal that was raised for food, and that settled the last of her concerns.

I do, now, label all soap going out to anyone not in my immediate family.(I print out the list of ingredients on plain paper and use that to wrap each bar.  I can get 2 wrappers out of each page.)  Just to err on the side of caution for folks with allergies.  It is up to them to read or not read that label.

I do have to tell you that living in Louisiana, using all of each animal is part of the culture.  We use "everything but the squeal".


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## Luv2Soap (Mar 16, 2015)

Susie said:


> I do, now, label all soap going out to anyone not in my immediate family.(I print out the list of ingredients on plain paper and use that to wrap each bar. I can get 2 wrappers out of each page.) Just to err on the side of caution for folks with allergies. It is up to them to read or not read that label.
> 
> I do have to tell you that living in Louisiana, using all of each animal is part of the culture. We use "everything but the squeal".


 
I live in the Midwest where I wouldn't think it should be a problem, but after my friend had that reaction, who knows. I know the INCI name is Adeps Suillus but didn't know if that would cause more questions than just listing it as Lard.


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## Susie (Mar 16, 2015)

Don't let one person's hang up change what you do.  If she wants soap, hand her a bar made with lard, then one made with, say, with palm oil or Crisco.  Don't tell her which is which, and let her decide.  Don't label them 1 and 2, or A and B, or you get her picking 1 or A.  Label them something random like 5 and K.


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## shunt2011 (Mar 16, 2015)

Absolutely don't let one person direct what you make and how you make it.   However, if you ever decide to sell you may want to have a veggie oil selection in addition to any animal fat choices.  I like having diversity in my line of products.


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## cmzaha (Mar 16, 2015)

I make and sell both lard and tallow soap in Sunny CA, where a lot of crunchies live. I offer both vegan and non-vegan soaps, all fully wrapped and labeled. Very seldom do I have anyone ask but if someone ask if I use animal products I tell them yes and steer them to the veggie soaps. If they ask why I use animal products I explain that it makes the nicest, silkiest long lasting soap. Many times this is enough to get them to buy the lard or tallow soap if they are not truly vegans or vegetarians. I put on the front of the label if the soap is vegan safe.


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## Dorymae (Mar 16, 2015)

Did you ask her why? Sometimes I have run into people who will say thing like " I don't want to rub animal fat all over me".  I will then tell them that soap is nothing like the oil it comes from, then I say you don't eat raw eggs do you? To which I always get a no. So does that mean you won't eat cake?  

The idea is the same. The cake contains raw egg but once the cake is made it is nothing like the raw egg that helped to make it, remove the egg and you will get a whole different cake. 

Then give them samples of one with and one without lard while telling them, lard really does make great soap but if you want one without, I can make it. I want to be sure you'll be happy with it though because it will loose a lot of the traits lard gives. 

I think I've had maybe one or two people a year that were not vegetarian or vegan that reacted that way. Not surprisingly about half stuck with the lard. I consider that success. Remember you can lead the horse to water but you can't make him drink!

Lard and tallow soaps are my backbone for soaping but I do make some specialty soaps that are vegan. I won't use palm, (as in straight palm oil) so my vegan soaps are not in the same ballpark as the lard soaps. They are good soap, just not my best.


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## Luv2Soap (Mar 16, 2015)

Dorymae said:


> Did you ask her why? Sometimes I have run into people who will say thing like " I don't want to rub animal fat all over me". I will then tell them that soap is nothing like the oil it comes from, then I say you don't eat raw eggs do you? To which I always get a no. So does that mean you won't eat cake?


 
I did ask her and she had almost that exact response   I told her to take a look at some of the soaps she was currently using (store bought) and see some of the chemicals she's using and then tell me how that's any better than using something natural like lard. She did tell me that she would give it a try, but her initial reaction is what concerned me.

I know you guys are right - that just shows me that having a few different recipes is a good idea - vegan and non-vegan. This way if someone is opposed to the lard, I can steer them in the right direction. 

I'm going to be trying my 2nd batch of soap and changing (1) thing. I'm going to use 50% coconut milk and 50% water. I have heard such good things about using milks in soaps and how creamy and silky it makes the soap feel. From what I've read you use your water to dissolve the lye and then add your coconut milk directly to the oils (mixing well) before you add the lye to it. Sound about right?


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## Luv2Soap (Mar 16, 2015)

cmzaha said:


> Many times this is enough to get them to buy the lard or tallow soap if they are not truly vegans or vegetarians. I put on the front of the label if the soap is vegan safe.


 
LOVE this idea of putting the Vegan Safe front-and-center on the label!


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## navigator9 (Mar 16, 2015)

Explain that our grandmothers and great-grandmothers made soap with lard for a reason.....they were smart women and they knew that lard makes great soap. But just in case, have alternatives without lard. People like to have choices. Samples of both are a good idea, so that they can see for themselves.


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## dixiedragon (Mar 16, 2015)

I live in the South, and I think the majority of folks (who are not vegetarians or have religious objections to pork) are actually delighted to find a soap with lard. 

I've sold at a handful of craft shows, and one thing that helps is to have a REASON why you use lard. "I use lard because it makes a hard, conditioning bar of soap with good lather."

Of course, I am lucky enough to live in a place where people will sell fresh pork rinds on the side of the road.


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## Dorymae (Mar 16, 2015)

Luv2Soap said:


> I'm going to be trying my 2nd batch of soap and changing (1) thing. I'm going to use 50% coconut milk and 50% water. I have heard such good things about using milks in soaps and how creamy and silky it makes the soap feel. From what I've read you use your water to dissolve the lye and then add your coconut milk directly to the oils (mixing well) before you add the lye to it. Sound about right?



That is fine to add it that way, just be sure you deduct the amount of coconut milk from your water amount. Then be sure your water amount is still at least double your lye amount.  ( that way you still have enough water to dissolve the lye and your soap won't be super soft). 
Some people actually use the coconut milk to dissolve the lye, but that comes with its own problems. ( well not problems but adjustments)


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## Luv2Soap (Mar 16, 2015)

Dorymae said:


> That is fine to add it that way, just be sure you deduct the amount of coconut milk from your water amount. Then be sure your water amount is still at least double your lye amount. ( that way you still have enough water to dissolve the lye and your soap won't be super soft).
> Some people actually use the coconut milk to dissolve the lye, but that comes with its own problems. ( well not problems but adjustments)


 
That's what I've seen too - there are problems when you try to dissolve the lye in the milk. Just want to make sure I understand how it works...

Say you run your recipe through soapcalc.com and it tells you that you need 10 oz of water. If I understand you correctly, you should dissolve the lye in 5 oz of water and use 5 oz of coconut milk directly into the oils. Correct?


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## Dorymae (Mar 16, 2015)

Luv2Soap said:


> That's what I've seen too - there are problems when you try to dissolve the lye in the milk. Just want to make sure I understand how it works...
> 
> Say you run your recipe through soapcalc.com and it tells you that you need 10 oz of water. If I understand you correctly, you should dissolve the lye in 5 oz of water and use 5 oz of coconut milk directly into the oils. Correct?



Look at your lye amount. If you need 6.3 oz of lye for your recipe and the water says 22 ounces then you need at least 12.6 oz of water to dissolve the lye. The remaining 9.4 ounces can be coconut milk.  Now to tell the truth, I would make the water 14oz and the coconut milk 8 oz because I want to be sure all the lye dissolved.


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## Luv2Soap (Mar 16, 2015)

Ok...think I got it. So, you take the lye amount you need and double it. That is how much water to use - the rest is milk. Makes total sense now!!!


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## hmlove1218 (Mar 16, 2015)

Lye will dissolve in a 1:1 ratio with water. You'd only need 6.3 ounces of water, but just to be safe I personally would probably use 7 and the rest for the CM


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## Luv2Soap (Mar 16, 2015)

Would the same rule apply to Goat milk too? I'm pretty sure the answer is yes, just making sure.


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## HappyHomeSoapCo (Mar 16, 2015)

I only use entirely grass fed, organic beef tallow in my soaps. So I label it as "happy tallow". Lol. And when I'm asked about it, I explain the benefits of grass fed beef tallow and the qualities it gives the bar, and the history of using animal fats.


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## kchaystack (Mar 16, 2015)

Luv2Soap said:


> Would the same rule apply to Goat milk too? I'm pretty sure the answer is yes, just making sure.



Yeap.  Mix equal weights lye and water (I use grams to make sure I am as close as possible, maybe an extra gram of water just to be safe) and then you can use the rest of the liquid as milk.  

If you want a 100% GM soap you can add some powdered milk to the fresh GM.


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## snappyllama (Mar 16, 2015)

I think I'm the odd one in just adding my lye a little at a time to frozen milk cubes. I just stir it constantly until my cubes are fully melted.  Then I stir it until I'm sure the lye is fully dissolved and my temperatures are holding steady.  I keep an eye on the temperature and have an ice bath ready to go in case it starts to heat up.  It does make for a more pudding-ish consistency, and I cannot see if there are an lye crystals leftover. I strain my lye solution when adding it to the oils just to be sure.

Since I just make soap as a hobby, I don't mind the extra time and attention to the literally-watching-ice-melt portion of my soaping. For sure, if I was selling and thinking of labor costs there would be no way I'd do it the way I do it now.


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## AMyers (Mar 17, 2015)

Snappy, you're not alone!  I use frozen milk, because that's the method that works best for me. And has, since my second batch of soap!  I measure my lye and get started with the frozen milk first.  Then I measure out my other oils, get my colorants, molds, and fragrance ready, while slowly adding my lye to the milk.  Every single time I've added milk at trace, it accelerates the heck out of my soap.  I had some suggestions that perhaps it was a temperature thing, but since it works well for me the ice way, and not so much the trace way, you can guess how I roll! I'll make a few more attempts at the trace way, to see if I can get my issues figured out.


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