# Farmers Market advice, please! (Australia)



## cinta (Feb 12, 2010)

Hi everyone, 

I am in the process of building up my handmade CP soap stocks, and I'm very interested in selling them at our local Farmers Market. I popped in to the market this morning and picked up a stall application form, but the guy was unable to answer a few of my questions. I'll give the organizer a call on Monday to clear up anything I'm still unsure of by then, but I thought I'd pick all your brains first!  

Here are my questions... 

1. Do I need an ABN to apply for public liability & products liability insurance? 

2. Am I required to register with the National Industrial Chemicals Notification and Assessment Scheme (NICNAS) before I can sell my soaps at the market? If so, do I need an ABN to register with NICNAS? 

3. For those of you who have public & products liability insurance, who is your insurer? There are so many out there! Their cover & fees are all quite similar, but I'd be interested to hear some reccomendations. 

I'm in Victoria, Australia, and I'm not sure if the legalities concerned with selling at markets vary from state to state. I probably have alot more questions, but these are the main things I'm wondering about for now. 

Thanks!


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## Becky (Feb 12, 2010)

Hi Cinta.

Yes, you need to be registered with NICNAS. It's not at all complex, you can download an application for registration form from their website, fill it in & send it to them. Pay your $381, and wait for them to send you your certificate of registration.

I don't know if you _need_ an ABN to register with them or to get insurance. I already have one, so that was never an issue for me. Again, if you want/need an ABN, it is very easy - it was an online application.

I'm insured with CGU, thru EBM brokers. I pay about $600 per year.


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## Lynnz (Feb 25, 2010)

Yes you will need an ABN to register with NICNAS


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## ChrissyB (Mar 11, 2010)

Yes yes and yes. 

Nicnas is a PITA but something we have to do.
There was a petition floating around a while ago asking them to reduce their fees for hobbyists, but I don't think that's going to happen.


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## Chemical_x (May 11, 2010)

Can I ask what registering with NICNAS actually does?

I hadn't heard of them until I joined this forum (lots of info for Aussies, yay) and I've gone to the website but I don't actually know what they do.

If there is a petition for hobby soap makers I would love to sign it. $381 registration for $0 income up to $500,000, that's insane! I don't understand why someone making an income as high as $500,000 pays the same fee as someone who only does it for enjoyment


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## Becky (May 11, 2010)

NICNAS do next to nothing for your $381. They take your money, add you to the database & rub their hands as they move onto the next small-time soapmaker.

Taken from the NICNAS website (http://www.nicnas.gov.au):

_About NICNAS

Established in 1990, NICNAS: 

Provides a national notification and assessment scheme to protect the health of the public, workers and the environment from the harmful effect of industrial chemicals; and 

Assesses all chemicals new to Australia and assesses those chemicals already used (existing chemicals) on a priority basis, in response to concerns about their safety on health and environmental grounds. 

We are committed to increasing knowledge about chemicals and chemical safety through:

More than 2,400 scientific assessment reports that contain safety recommendations for the handling and labelling of the chemical 

The Chemical Gazette which we publish electronically every month; and 

The Australian Inventory of Chemical Substances (AICS) which lists more than 38,000 chemicals. _

So, for me? All that means is that I am $381 poorer every August. If they did any kind of assessment of my manufacturing, I would be happy to have it. If they offered any kind of relevant service, I would be happy to pay the money (maybe a searchable database of FO manufacturers?) but they don't. It's a revenue raiser.


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## cinta (Apr 6, 2011)

Oh wow, thanks heaps for the info guys!    Sorry I havn't been here for a while to read these very helpful posts (been off having bub #4, and the soapmaking was put on hold).

Gee, so to sell my soaps at a market a couple of times a year I'm going to have to outlay up to $1000 first?! That's insane, I probably won't make that much back in sales!!


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## SonyaX (Apr 11, 2011)

Re NICNAS - it seems a rip off, I thought it would be like organic certification, where you had to keep records of all your materials and where they were sourced, recipes, batch numbers etc, but no its just a one page form, you pay just under $400 and that's it.

But on the up side, its so much easier than in the UK, you see poor soap makers over there with piles of paperwork and each individual recipe having to be approved by some authority somewhere. 

We do have a lot more freedom here and it makes the NICNAS inconvenience look a little better.


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## Sezzah (Jun 7, 2011)

$400 a year for that really does seem to me like A MASSIVE RIP OFF!! plus then insurance etc. What a hassle and what an expense! Think of how many bars of soap you have to sell just to cover the cost of those, let alone cover cost of goods, time etc. Pffft. Sometimes it really feels like small businesses never had a chance to begin with. So many hoops to jump through!


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