# Older person soap



## Lee242 (Jul 5, 2016)

Looking for a recipe for a conditioning soap that is exfoliating and good for Cerepy Skin. 
Does shredded coconut work to exfoliate and will it smell like coconut?
Not much on adding fragrance but I will if it works.


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## Obsidian (Jul 5, 2016)

I think shredded coconut would be way too scratchy and no, it won't smell like coconut. For older skin you need a mild soap, I wouldn't use any coconut oil or at least not very much.
I made a 50% lard, 50% olive oil that is nicely mild. For exfoliation, I really like extra fine ground coffee but it can make your soap brown with brown lather. Extra fine ground pumice is really gentle too.


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## shunt2011 (Jul 5, 2016)

I agree with not using a lot of coconut. I like oatmeal ground into a powder. Maybe add a little honey too. High lard with some olive or avocado would make a lovely soap.


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## Dahila (Jul 5, 2016)

Older skin is always dry and vurnable, it needs really mild soap;  I just made a soap (4)weeks ago, and not cured yet but seems very mild, at least on my hands.  Buttermilk and zink oxide 75%OO 20% CO and 5% castor.  then the soap should follow a good body butter; actually lotion just a bit thicker so it have a staying power


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## Susie (Jul 5, 2016)

I would never suggest that anything exfoliating be used on crepey skin.  That skin is so very thin and fragile!  I would just suggest a high lard, low CO soap with an appropriate amount of superfat for the person's preference.


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## TeresaT (Jul 5, 2016)

I made an amazing  soap with a bunch of butters I had in the house and goat milk as a water replacement.  (I actually used powdered goat milk.)  I used 10% of each of these butters:  cocoa, kokum, shea, and mango.  10% babassu oil, 45% lard and 5% castor oil.  I would not suggest you go and purchase these specifically to make a soap because they're a bit pricey; however, if you already have them on hand, they make a great soap when put together.  My batch is not fully cured yet, but I've been using a tester bar since I made it and it is lovely on my skin.  (I'm 50, so I guess I'm an "older" person.)


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## Arimara (Jul 5, 2016)

TeresaT said:


> I made an amazing  soap with a bunch of butters I had in the house and goat milk as a water replacement.  (I actually used powdered goat milk.)  I used 10% of each of these butters:  cocoa, kokum, shea, and mango.  10% babassu oil, 45% lard and 5% castor oil.  I would not suggest you go and purchase these specifically to make a soap because they're a bit pricey; however, if you already have them on hand, they make a great soap when put together.  My batch is not fully cured yet, but I've been using a tester bar since I made it and it is lovely on my skin. _ (I'm 50, so I guess I'm an "older" person.)_



Lies. You're 35 and that's final.

Seriously, I can't add nothing yet. I need an extra 17 yrs.


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## earlene (Jul 5, 2016)

Susie said:


> I would never suggest that anything exfoliating be used on crepey skin.  That skin is so very thin and fragile!  I would just suggest a high lard, low CO soap with an appropriate amount of superfat for the person's preference.



I agree.  As we age our skin's epidermis and subcutaneous tissue layers become thinner, making the skin more fragile. Other factors also contribute, such as smoking, genetic make-up, excessive exposure to the sun, etc.  Doctors often advise against use of exfolients in the elderly and people with diabetes.

For my 67 year old skin, I have learned that high coconut oil content or high palm oil content often irritates my skin and makes it feel much too dry.  My skin does like soap that feels very moisturizing. When I look at the recipes in SoapCalc it looks like the ones with the higher 'conditioning' numbers are the ones that my skin seems to benefit from the most.  Not always, though.  There is one I made with a high conditioning number, but my skin 'hates' it.  Wouldn't you know, that one was 34% CO, so I see now see why.  I didn't know then because I hadn't been soaping for very long and didn't have the experience yet.  Of course I am still learning and still have a lot more experience coming my way.


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## Cindy2428 (Jul 5, 2016)

I too am trying to perfect an "older" persons skin. I use coconut milk as a water sub and add lanolin - it creates a barrier reducing the cleansing properties of the soap. I also agree with Susie about limiting the exfoliating property to your soap. Fragile skin can bruise with just a handshake. Anyone taking a blood thinner is even more at risk.  

Also, remember soap is primarily for cleansing. I would pair a moisturizer with your soap to add as a product to protect/repair the crepey skin.


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## Bamagirl (Jul 6, 2016)

It is not cured yet, but I decided to experiment with my last batch and made a 
75% lard/20% OO/5% castor. I made it because my regular bars that have 15% CO dry my sil skin out and that really bugs me, so I decided to experiment. It won't be ready until the end of this month, but I am hoping it will be really gentle.


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## Susie (Jul 6, 2016)

Bamagirl said:


> It is not cured yet, but I decided to experiment with my last batch and made a
> 75% lard/20% OO/5% castor. I made it because my regular bars that have 15% CO dry my sil skin out and that really bugs me, so I decided to experiment. It won't be ready until the end of this month, but I am hoping it will be really gentle.



It will be.  That is going to be some rich, creamy lather.  Not much on bubbles, but the richness will make up for it.


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## Bamagirl (Jul 6, 2016)

Susie said:


> It will be.  That is going to be some rich, creamy lather.  Not much on bubbles, but the richness will make up for it.




Oh wow, now I can't wait to try it. Now I'm thinking it really needs to be "tested" at 3 weeks lol.


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## Arimara (Jul 6, 2016)

Bamagirl said:


> Oh wow, now I can't wait to try it. Now I'm thinking it really needs to be "tested" at 3 weeks lol.



You'll be fine if you do but you might want to endure another 3 week wait.


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## Susie (Jul 6, 2016)

I routinely cure my soaps 6-8 weeks.


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## Lee242 (Jul 6, 2016)

What does this look like to you.
1         Castor Oil                             4%
2         Canola Oil                          10%
3         Coconut Oil, 76 deg           15%
4         Lanolin liquid Wax               1%
5         Lard, Pig Tallow Manteca   50%
6         Olive Oil                              15%
7        Sunflower oil                           5%

Hardness 37
Cleansing 11
Conditioning 57
Bubbling    14
Creamy 30

I would like to ad some sugar and some salt.


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## Cindy2428 (Jul 6, 2016)

I would probably drop the coconut to 9-10% and increase the lard or olive oil. The cleansing number is a little high for gentle soap - I try to keep mine in the 7-8 range and I use a 100% coconut milk sub. BTW- I have done a lot of experimenting with lanolin; try 3% to start- you won't be sorry


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## Susie (Jul 6, 2016)

Lee242 said:


> What does this look like to you.
> 1         Castor Oil                             4%
> 2         Canola Oil                          10%
> 3         Coconut Oil, 76 deg           15%
> ...



I would not add salt, you won't need it. 

Why did you want to add canola and sunflower oils?  What are they going to bring to the soap that the other oils are missing?

I would add lanolin @ 5% at least, and castor oil, also.  I will give my opinion on the rest of the recipe when I understand why the canola and sunflower oils.


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## Lee242 (Jul 7, 2016)

canola and sunflower oils from what I read there good for skin.
http://www.stylecraze.com/articles/best-benefits-of-sunflower-oil-for-skin-hair-and-health/
http://vkool.com/benefits-of-canola-oil/


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## The Efficacious Gentleman (Jul 7, 2016)

I read the first link, but it was only about using the oil rather than a soap made with the oil - which is not the same as the oil by any means. How much of the beta carotene and vitamins survive the saponification process, and how much impact would it have in the soap?

It's not always the case that  the oil properties are the same as it would be when the oil becomes sodium xxxxate


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## Susie (Jul 7, 2016)

^^^That.  Lye has it's merry way with oils, and the "beneficial properties" thereof.  If you want to use specific oils to help whomever, think about making a lotion or body butter.  It will stay on the skin much longer to help.

OK, I would suggest you make the batch like you wanted, then try this, and compare the two when they are cured:

Castor Oil 5%
CO 10%
Lanolin 5%
OO 15%
Lard 65%

Superfat 5-8%, depending on the time of the year.  More for winter soap.


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## Lee242 (Jul 7, 2016)

I don't doubt what you are saying and your opinions,advise and answers are inportant to us.
This is why I was thinking of using these two oils. I have skin trouble and I know that the the Vitamins and things in these are [FONT=&quot]excellent[/FONT] for skin.
Your further opinion is [FONT=&quot]appreciated.[/FONT]

Soap Making Characteristics: Canola Oil makes a great addition to your soap making oil collection. Aside from the obvious plus of being super inexpensive, it also produces a soap with a lovely dense, creamy lather.
It's light colour is very helpful when attempting to produce a white soap and it is slow to trace making it a good choice when using techniques like swirling.
You can replace up to 40% of the liquid oils in a recipe with Canola Oil though I prefer to keep it around the 20% range.

One of the more economical options, Sunflower Oil can be used to help reduce the cost of a batch of soap.
Being less expensive doesn't mean less worthy! This oil is chock full of good things like Vitamins A, B, D and E and is super high in Oleic acid which makes it moisturising and conditioning.
Soap Making Characteristics: Highly conditioning but is slow to saponify and will produce a soft bar. Best used as a supplementary oil in quantities of 5% - 15%. This oil would benefit by being kept in a cool, dark location  and refrigerated upon opening.


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## Cindy2428 (Jul 7, 2016)

Lee, what they are saying is to keep it simple. My first year and a half I researched all the oils listed in soapcalc that I thought I would ever use. I still have my flashcards..... I look back at my earlier recipes - I had one with 11 different oils!

If you note in the characteristics of your sunflower oil(which I love), and canola - they both are good subs for olive oil.  As you go through your own testing, see if you can have some help and do some blind tests. I think you will be surprised

With the exception of salt bars, the only differences I was 100% correct on during my testing were with lanolin, lard and coconut milk/water in my soap.  I couldn't even discriminate my butters. Now I did use the same colorants to prevent cheating, but I could smell the cocoa butter - unscented soaps.

By all means, try this recipe. I am happy that you know why you chose the oils that you did - some don't even go that far and they sell. Please let us know how your soap turns out.


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## DeeAnna (Jul 7, 2016)

"Sunflower Oil ... is super high in Oleic acid..."

This is true only if the sunflower is a high oleic version. HO sunflower is a substitute or alternative for olive oil. 

Regular sunflower is high in linoleic acid. This version of sunflower is similar to canola.

So ... depending on the kind of sunflower you have, it has roughly the same properties as the olive or the canola in your recipe.


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## Susie (Jul 7, 2016)

And I understand that you are trying to make the best soap possible.  I do!  I tried all those oils, I made many batches with 7 oils or so.  I tried blind testing them on my family.  Those oils did not impress anyone.  The bar that everyone loved, from young to old, was the high lard bar.  Don't believe me, though.  You try it out on everyone in your family for yourself.


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## chela1261 (Jul 11, 2016)

I wouldn't use anything for exfoliating except maybe colloidal oatmeal as an elderly persons skin is like paper. I've seen it tear just by someone touching it. IMO I would make a nice baby soap for them with a little coconut oil, butters and lots of olive oil


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## Susie (Jul 11, 2016)

Their skin is not like paper.  Paper is much more durable than elderly skin.  Think wet tissue paper.


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## TDS (Jul 15, 2016)

I have older skin as well. This thread has great information!


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## chela1261 (Jul 18, 2016)

Susie said:


> Their skin is not like paper.  Paper is much more durable than elderly skin.  Think wet tissue paper.[/QUOTE
> 
> Depending on how well hydrated they are their skin can be like copy paper to your wet tissue paper and any kind of paper can rip


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## cmzaha (Jul 18, 2016)

I love HO Sunflower and HO Canola in soap. For that matter I also love regular canola in soap and have never had dos. I do add in ROE as soon as I open up my soaping oils


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