# "oceanizing" a water scent ...



## not_ally (Jul 14, 2015)

I like water scents, but most/all of them are almost too pretty.  I would like to add something to them to make them smell more briney, salty, surfy - I'm not doing a very good job getting my point across here, but you know what I mean.  I have kelp and spirulina on hand, but am afraid they will just be stinky/fishy   Any ideas?


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## IrishLass (Jul 14, 2015)

I know exactly what you mean, not_ally. I've used kelp before with my Salty Sailor FO. It actually lent a really nice, real-life, seaweedy/beachy hint to it...... for all of a few weeks anyway.... and then it totally disappeared. I was too chicken to use any more than 1/8 tsp. ppo, you see (I read of too many 'low-tide' experiences of others). lol One day, I'll try again, but with a little bit more than 1/8 tsp.


IrishLass


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## cmzaha (Jul 14, 2015)

You certainly do not want to use much more kelp powder than IL mentioned above. I use kelp powder in my "Kelpie Soap" it takes a very light touch. Otherwise you risk the smell of stinky ocean muck. If you like salty type Salty Sea from soapsupplies.net is fantastic. I will bring a Salty Sea Soleseif with me on Sat if you are going to be there


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## snappyllama (Jul 14, 2015)

Ahoy Matey from Daystar is more briney than floral. It's a fast mover though - and very strong.


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## not_ally (Jul 14, 2015)

Shoot, Carolyn, don't think I will be, although I would like to see you and C.  Next time.  I wish he would do it a little later, 9 am in LB on Sat am is a bit early for me   I wanted to bring you my unused canola before it goes off too, rats.

I am kind of more interested in finding something that I can add, just so that I can play around and see how it works w/different water scents.  I googled and am thinking of adding some oakmoss, one site said that the EU is banning the use of algae in scents for some reason and the mfrtrs are thinking of adding oakmoss, which (in combination w/other unspecified things, hopefully they are not crucial) is supposed to be similar.  Also ordering some sniffie samples from SOS of some of their "oceany" smelling components to see if they work.  Will update if they do!


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## hmlove1218 (Jul 14, 2015)

Next time your purchasing from WSP add a bottle of Sea Glass to your cart  You won't regret it lol. It's very "salty" and I absolutely love it!


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## not_ally (Jul 14, 2015)

Just checked, I have Salty Sea Air from ss.net, WSP Sea Glass and Daystar's Salty Sailor.  Like all of them, but still too darn pretty.  I really want to add a something that will make me thing of the beach - in a Puget Sound on a windy day kind of way, not a Coppertone kind of one.  Not asking for *too* much, right ?


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## Aline (Jul 14, 2015)

This is a good one: 

http://shop.perfumersapprentice.com/p-5957-marine-ozone-key-accord.aspx

plus Ultrazur: http://shop.perfumersapprentice.com/p-5976-ultrazur-g.aspx?keyword=ultrazur


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## not_ally (Jul 14, 2015)

Those look great, Aline, thank you!  Am going to have to spend several hours checking out PA now!


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## Seawolfe (Jul 14, 2015)

I dont know if this is on the right track, but I've used this blend called "sea breezy" from Catherine Failors liquid soap book, and I recall it being quite fresh and nice, and not really "pretty"
2 parts Eucalyptus EO
2 parts lemongrass EO
1 part rosemary EO (there I go with the rosemary again )

Im sorry you cant make it this Sat! We will be sure to talk about you


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## not_ally (Jul 14, 2015)

If I feel my ears burning on Sat. am I will break into your house and steal all your knives.  I may do that anyway


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## cmzaha (Jul 14, 2015)

Seawolfe said:


> I dont know if this is on the right track, but I've used this blend called "sea breezy" from Catherine Failors liquid soap book, and I recall it being quite fresh and nice, and not really "pretty"
> 2 parts Eucalyptus EO
> 2 parts lemongrass EO
> 1 part rosemary EO (there I go with the rosemary again )
> ...


I have used a very similar blend but just do not find it salty. Did you find it salty Seawolfe. Granted it has been quite a while since I have been out on the ocean. I just remember being at the islands with the wind blowing and it reminded me very much of Salty Air. On the boat in the harbor was a whole different story, you would want a lot of kelp then :crazy: but then we were slipped next to the side with the "snow capped rock wall"or I wish it was snow...


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## Seawolfe (Jul 15, 2015)

I don't find it salty, but fresh, like when your in no cal on the piney coast - say Carmel?
I find the salty mariner from Daystar too perfumy. But seriously, if you want true ocean I think you need kelp or bird poop in it 

Funny story, we got a return shipment that got mis-delivered last week. Was some very long dead bat stars (they were alive when shipped out, but fed ex messed up) that stunk up our whole building through FOUR sealed plastic bags. It was truly horrific. The sea, she is wild and stinky...

PS bring extra colors, I probably won't like mine again


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## not_ally (Jul 15, 2015)

Yes, when I said oceany scents I was thinking the nice parts, not the bird poop and dead thing parts.  Aline, or anyone who has used scents from the Perfumers Apprentice, would any of them - there are different chemical types - survive the lye?  I have emailed to ask, but if anyone knows of the top of their head from experience, that would be even better .....


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## jblaney (Jul 15, 2015)

I think Salty Sea Air from Rustic Essentials is what you are looking for.   It's very salty smelling and not floral or perfumey.   I just bought a large bottle and can give you a sample if you are interested.   It sticks great too.


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## Aline (Jul 15, 2015)

not_ally said:


> Yes, when I said oceany scents I was thinking the nice parts, not the bird poop and dead thing parts.  Aline, or anyone who has used scents from the Perfumers Apprentice, would any of them - there are different chemical types - survive the lye?  I have emailed to ask, but if anyone knows of the top of their head from experience, that would be even better .....


They are simply aroma chemicals like those used to create fragrance oils so yes, they will certainly survive lye. I imagine the main issue will be cost (although you can be sure they are undiluted, which can't be said for some FO's I have purchased!)


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## not_ally (Jul 15, 2015)

J, I just added that to my wish list at AHRE - they are having a sale including $1 samples coming up, I am afraid I am going to miss it so keep checking every day! 

Aline, I have to figure out how to use those things.  I thought you could just use little dashes of them b/c they were so concentrated.  Will have to do more research.  Otherwise they are too expensive, you are right.


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## lionprincess00 (Jul 15, 2015)

ArRe has an ocean breeze. It isn't as salty, but to me it smells very oceany and not quite as perfume like. It doesn't A either. They also have a sea salt yuzu that's very salty oob...Haven't soaped it yet because it is said to A. Also, it's yuzu, not ocean so it may not be what you're looking for.


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## not_ally (Jul 15, 2015)

Hey LP.  Saw the ss yuzu, but avoided it b/c of the yuzu (don't like yuzu for some reason.)  I did put the ocean breeze on my sample list, along w/the salty sea air and sea kelp.  

What is it about water scents that ALWAYS makes them accelerate?  The few that don't, don't actually smell like water at all to me.

B/t/w, I came across an old post of yours w/a recipe that you really liked at the time, I have it on my to-do list!


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## lionprincess00 (Jul 15, 2015)

Which is that???

Sea kelp. Yeah. Kids love it, I however did not. Very organic kelpy smell to me. Still don't like it, but as I said the kids loved it (go figure!).


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## not_ally (Jul 15, 2015)

LP, did the sea kelp stick?  That actually sounds kind of good to me.  I must have juvenile tastes 

I didn't save the link to your post, just a quote so that I could make the soap, I think it might have been on a thread on sugar.    Is this still one of your favorites?

"I did a soap with bentonite clay, avocado puree, GM concentrate, and sugar at 1 TBS ppo.
It is. A. W. E. S. O. M. E. The best soap thus far for me."


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## lionprincess00 (Jul 15, 2015)

not_ally said:


> LP, did the sea kelp stick?  That actually sounds kind of good to me.  I must have juvenile tastes
> 
> I didn't save the link to your post, just a quote so that I could make the soap, I think it might have been on a thread on sugar.    Is this still one of your favorites?
> 
> ...



I wouldn't call the taste juvenile, I'd call mine finicky;-)

Ok, it isn't my best soap now. It was my 6th soap and I've made over 60 now
Now I know more, I'd make a few changes. It has potential to be awesome imo, though. I used too high a superfat and the lather is inhibited. I also had a ton of water so it needed a very long cure. I've thought of redoing it recently in fact. 
If I did I'd do something similar to
20% coconut
7% castor 
33% sweet almond or olive 
25% tallow 
15% lard 

A 1:1 lye ratio. Either half the water amount in gm concentrate or gm powder to make full gm.
1tsp ppo bent clay in a little water.
2-4 oz avocado puree depending on the size of the batch 
3-4% Superfat since avocado and gm will increase it. 

Hmm. May have to really rethink it and retry it! I also now use sodium citrate which this batch didn't have and it makes a world of difference in my soaps now.


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## not_ally (Jul 15, 2015)

I can't believe you've *only* made 60.  You are so thoughtful, and your soaps look so good, that I thought you had made much, much more. 

So you like using more tallow than lard?  I have been using large amts of lard, which I do love, and have been experimenting on and off w/tallow.  I like the hardness it produces, but don't like the lather.  And just the skin feel, somehow, as compared to lard.  We are all so different!

I think I have been SFing too high w/the avocado/fat heavy milk soaps.  

Why does the CA make a world of difference?  Curious, I use EDTA for soap scum, but could add CA if it is for something other than scum/DOS.


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## lsg (Jul 15, 2015)

You might try a touch of rosemary or eucalyptus EO to the fragrance oil.  Most of my ocean blends contain bergamot also.


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## lionprincess00 (Jul 15, 2015)

It is shown to increase lather. Either Deanna can find it faster, or give me a half hr and I'll link the additives test results from a swap posted yrs ago.

I used 40% tallow in my soaps, and while rendering got a mix of pork and cow. Those render blends made for so much nicer soaps imo than straight tallow. tallow also bumps the bubbly numbers slightly, a welcome when I use under 20% co in my soaps.


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## not_ally (Jul 15, 2015)

Thanks, LSG.  I have a list of stuff going that might "oceanize" scents, Seawolfe suggested the rosemary and eucalyptus as well, so those look like definites.  Bergamot, interesting, I would not have thought of that.  Darn Aline, she got me corresponding w/the Perfumer's Apprentice owner and now I might have a new addiction, I am going to order some stuff from there as well, and see what happens.

Wow, I am really OCD.


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## not_ally (Jul 15, 2015)

LP, don't spend time looking for it.  If it was the huge DISH lather lovers swap results, I have those bookmarked somewhere.  Enough to know that was the function of it, for you ....


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## kchaystack (Jul 15, 2015)

not_ally said:


> Why does the CA make a world of difference?  Curious, I use EDTA for soap scum, but could add CA if it is for something other than scum/DOS.



If you have a chelator in your soap, and have hard water, it helps lather for the same reason it cuts down on scum.  It allows the soap to react with the water, and not the metals, so it can create lather.


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## not_ally (Jul 15, 2015)

Might add some CA just to see what if it does increase the lather.  I do include sugar, SL and EDTA in all my soaps, all are supposed to boost lather a bit, so I am OK w/what I have.  But it is like the too rich/too thin thing equivalent of soap goals ...


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