# the use of EO's vs FO's



## Stacey (Aug 22, 2011)

I got into a very friendly discussion with another soaper about the use of EO's vs FO's. 

I thought that I had read that there is belief that the EO will lose some (if not all) of it's "theraputic" value when combined in the CP process.  Mostly because the lye monster will eat it up.  Or maybe also be because of the gelling heat.  :?: 

If you're using the EO only for the "aroma therapy" value then yes, spend the extra money for the EO.  

But otherwise FO's are way more affordable and are much more varied in the fragrances.  And one would be better off using the EO in a different application where you could use less and more directly. 

Was I close to being right or am I completely off base?  Can someone please confirm or correct my thinking?


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## soapbuddy (Aug 22, 2011)

That's my thinking too. Soap is a wash off product. You won't get much therapeutic value from EO's that way.


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## Stacey (Aug 22, 2011)

Thanks for answering, Soapbuddy!

However, it looks like I should've done more research before I posted my question.    It appears there is a thread with the same debate over in other boards. 

http://www.soapmakingforum.com/forum/vi ... hp?t=26576

No sense in starting a new thread here when it's already in progress elsewhere.  'Doh!  So sorry for not doing my homework ahead of time. 

Mods:  feel free to delete this post.


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## tryanything (Aug 22, 2011)

Well at the very least I learned something new.  I've been using EOs only.  Mostly because they are easily available at a local health food store.  But if I can get FOs cheaper and there is no real added value EOs have over FOs I might have to try them.  I just read the stories about fast traces and have been hesitant to try.


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## IrishLass (Aug 23, 2011)

tryanything said:
			
		

> I just read the stories about fast traces and have been hesitant to try.



No need to be too hesitant. There are _plenty_ of FOs that soap beautifully. It's usually the few notorious ones that give the meriad of other FOs a bad rap. Out of the tons of FOs that I own, only a small handful need special handling. Before you decide to buy any, just check out the ScentReviewBoard or other review sites to read the experiences of those who have soaped the scents you are hoping to try. Or you could just post a query about whichever ones you are interested in right here in the fragrance section.

IrishLass


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## Dragonkaz (Aug 23, 2011)

I was an EO snob when I started soaping ... all about the need to keep natural soap natural etc.  I had access to loads of EO and most priced competitively.

Then I found soap with amazing aromas ... and they were FO's, so I did some investigating ... and I've never looked back.

Where possible I read the reviews and have some idea about risk of acceleration, ricing etc.  I never do a water discount with new FO's and if I'm using one I can't find review about, I do a small batch, so that if something does go wrong ... there's minimal waste.


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## judymoody (Aug 23, 2011)

I use mostly EOs, not for any purported therapeutic value (I agree that it probably doesn't survive the lye monster).  But I find that I prefer the smell of EOs over most FOs I've encountered and I've tried multiple reputable vendors - TSW, BB, EBB, NDA, CG, LS, SGS, SS, AHRE, Peak, CS, BCN, and NG.  Also FOs can fade in the short or long term just as EOs can.  I agree with the other posters about Lilli's invaluable Soap Scent Review Board to help determine which fade, morph, discolor, or misbehave.

That said there are a number of FOs I like a lot alone or as blenders with other FOs/EOs.  Most have been easy to soap.  But my personal preference is for EOs.

p.s. If you are going to continue using EOs, buy from a reputable on-line dealer.  The health food stores charge outrageous prices for them.


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## LauraHoosier (Aug 23, 2011)

> p.s. If you are going to continue using EOs, buy from a reputable on-line dealer. The health food stores charge outrageous prices for them.


They sure do.  Ours charges for .5oz EO what I'd pay for 1-2oz from a supplier.  Speaking of....in my area I just heard about EOU http://essentialoils.org/  Centrally located should make shipping charges less painful that's for sure and I loved the long list of available EO's.


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## Hazel (Aug 23, 2011)

Stacey said:
			
		

> Thanks for answering, Soapbuddy!
> 
> However, it looks like I should've done more research before I posted my question.    It appears there is a thread with the same debate over in other boards.
> 
> ...



Tsk tsk! Naughty Stacey!   

It's okay but I'll move this thread to the Fragrance forum, okay?

eta: Have you seen the FO spreadsheet by SMF members? I think PrairieCraft started it and others have been contributing to it. Here's the link if you haven't seen it.

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc ... tswL#gid=0


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## tryanything (Aug 24, 2011)

Yeah, definately learned something new.  I checked BB after you mentioned the price difference and wow. I can get 2 oz of oil for what I've been paying for 1 oz locally.


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## Guest (Aug 28, 2011)

OK, this has really been bothering me for quite some time. At first I started soaping because I got tired of laying down $5 a pop for soaps that *I* felt like did not last long enough because they were not allowed to properly cure. These soaps used essential oils, but once I started doing my research, they are SO many yummy, fun fragrance oils out there. I know alot of people don't want any chemicals in their soap but my thought on the matter is - even the plant material that is being extracted in the steam distillation process is a chemical. In fact, when I took organic lab way, way, wayyy back in the day (yeah I am getting old ;P) we did a synthesis of banana oil and actually bees secrete banana oil when they sting someone. Point is, many natural products are synthesized. So like I could drop $40 - 200 on 16 ozs of lavender essential oil or I could drop $15 on lavender fragrance oil that contains the same active compound to give the fragrance (granted, it contains other chemicals and that is why the purists turn their nose up at it) but I am really finding it hard to justify spending that much money to scent my soaps!!! I don't really think essential oils added to soap have any therapeutic benefit in soap, and not because that benefit is canceled from the lye, but because to really get a therapeutic benefit you have to put the oil on your pressure points and inhale it. Maybe if you sat in your shower and sniffed your soap for 15 mins you would get the benefit, but doubtful. So anyway the point of this rant/smeal is that I started out thinking I was going to be a purist and it turns out that I am going to use fragrance oils instead because I honestly don't think they are bad or harmful. You should wear a mask when adding them though, but same goes for essential oils.


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## Stacey (Aug 29, 2011)

Thanks for all the responses.  

There are good points for and against the use of EO's vs FO's.  The person I was discussing this with was all about using the EO's for the "theraputic" value.  

Just as sure as I was at being right about the lye monster, she was sure that she was right about her soaps having the theraputic value because of the EO's she was using. 

Can I just say that I LIKE being right??  :wink: 

Thanks again!


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## Guest (Aug 31, 2011)

lol. I will probably be using both EO and FO  But for starters, with FO being SO much cheaper, its really difficult to justify using only EOs. I know for some customers they really look for that, but the majority of people (think the Bath and Body Works consumer) really could care less.


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## carebear (Aug 31, 2011)

you should work with whatever works for you.  you are not yet at the level to sell, so what your "customers" want isn't relevant yet.  just have fun and learn.  really, that's what you should focus on - pretend soaping is chemistry lab and just an opportunity to LEARN.


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## Guest (Sep 2, 2011)

carebear said:
			
		

> you should work with whatever works for you.  you are not yet at the level to sell, so what your "customers" want isn't relevant yet.  just have fun and learn.  really, that's what you should focus on - pretend soaping is chemistry lab and just an opportunity to LEARN.



True - that is why I bought a ton of samples of FOs, EOs, micas, and pigments in very small quantities - I plan on making a bunch of different soaps, distributing them to everyone I know, and asking them to give me feedback about what they liked and what they didn't like. I plan on waiting at least one year before selling, because that is how long soap should be shelf stable for, at a minimum (hopefully longer if it is decorative). Lord knows I would not want DOS or spoilage and you have to be patient to see if that will occur. However, I also want to be cost efficient - so using FO for now is fine. If I can justify spending more on EO later, I will. I have some EOs - lavendar, tea tree, rosemary, peppermint, just the basic cheap ones now - and the more exotic scents like dragons blood, for example, well, for now I will be using a FO instead of trying to recreate that scent with a bunch of EOs - that can get really $$$ - once I have the technique down and if people start requesting EOs then I will use more of them and less of FOs. My point about the customers is just that most people really don't care about FOs or they would not wear perfume and etc. I know some people don't wear perfume or want any fragrance, but they are in the minority (although more of them may be wanting to buy hand made soap). When planning and designing your soaps and recipes, however, the ultimate goal is to make a product that holds up well, is shelf stable, last a long time, is pretty, and that people want to buy.


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## Hazel (Sep 2, 2011)

TikiBarSoap said:
			
		

> I have some EOs - lavendar, tea tree, rosemary, peppermint, just the basic cheap ones now - and the more exotic scents *like dragons blood*, for example, well, for now I will be using a FO instead of trying to recreate that scent with a bunch of EOs



You have dragon's blood EO that actually has a scent? I've heard that dragon's blood EO is actually a blend of the resin and other EOs to produce a fragrance.

I've only used the resin which scent doesn't stay in soap which is why I used the FO to add fragrance.


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## Ms. Moore (Sep 20, 2011)

I prefer EO's.  I mostly HP soap and add the oils at the end.  I don't have to use as much oil when that way.  I am still playing around:  I like aromatic intensity in my HP soaps but CP are aesthetically pleasing...


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## Soapy Gurl (Sep 21, 2011)

I use almost all EOs.  I agree with the thought that the actual therapeutic benefit doesn't make it through to the end.  But an FO just can't duplicate nature.  
Something that I noticed wasn't brought up was skin sensitivity.  I cannot use a heavily scented bar made with FOs.  It irritates my skin.  Some of the FOs will also do it, even when lightly scented.  I have yet to have a problem with an EO.  Now I don't go over scenting with cinnamon or known irritating EOs, lol.  I also have a family member with extremely sensitive skin.  She can use my soaps unscented or lightly scented with a gentle EO. 

I like the natural quality of EOs.  I make a lime spearmint soap for a customer (mojito) and it does not smell the same as an FO.  Now saying that, I love vanilla, hazelnut, pumpkin spice and a few other FOs.  I use them in lower amounts and seem to do well with the foody scents.  Anything mimicking a perfume or floral will also give me a headache.  So there are definitely benefits to EOs for some of us!


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