# 80% Lard Soaps..OK, I Get it Now.



## Susie (Mar 26, 2015)

I finally tried my 80% lard, 20% CO soap this morning(4 weeks cure only, I couldn't wait).  I get it now.  Wow.

Thank you Obsidian, and everyone else who said to try it.  I think I now have a new go-to recipe.  I hate that I just bought a whole bunch of Olive Oil and Coconut Oil(2 gallons each!).  I have to use at least the olive oil up before switching completely to this new recipe.  

Have y'all tried Castor Oil 5% in this?  If so, did it change it any?


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## The Efficacious Gentleman (Mar 26, 2015)

Okay, now I have another planned soap.  Enablers, I tell you!


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## Susie (Mar 26, 2015)

Enablers, indeed!

You just won't believe it until you try it.  Seriously!  Even 2 weeks earlier than I normally try my soaps, it is just amazing.

I would even suggest you make this today, as The Admirable Lady may want to use it before the baby is born for that annoying itchy skin.


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## ngian (Mar 26, 2015)

Is this recipe nice for the hair too?


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## Seawolfe (Mar 26, 2015)

Ya Susie - thats what I did first time with lard: 5% castor, 15% coconut and 80% lard 5% SF - and sugar for bubbles cant hurt 
its my lardy lard piggy soap 

If youre not on the castille hating bandwagon, make up some proper castille soaps, they might be ready for Christmas gifts. I did some with rosemary EO that I am just loving.


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## lsg (Mar 26, 2015)

I use Castor oil in most of my recipes including the ones containing lard.  I think it adds to bubbly lather.


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## Obsidian (Mar 26, 2015)

Welcome to to club lol I haven't made it with castor yet but I plan to soon. I do use citric acid in mine since I've noticed that lard makes more soap scum.
I have tried this in my hair and really didn't like it, it imply make too much soap scum and left my hair really gunky. It might be ok if you have soft water.


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## The Efficacious Gentleman (Mar 26, 2015)

Would you take the castor out of the CO or the lard?


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## Susie (Mar 26, 2015)

I was thinking the lard, but I am waiting for the experts to speak up.

ETA-Seawolfe, I just saw your post, so you vote the CO?  I was thinking it was plenty creamy(wow, is it ever!), but am more than willing to try taking it out of the CO.


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## Obsidian (Mar 26, 2015)

I will take it out of the lard.


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## not_ally (Mar 26, 2015)

Obsidian, how do you add the citric acid?  I'm being lazy, I know there are previous threads on this but when I have looked at them in the past I got nervous b/c it seemed it messed w/the lye amounts which is nervous-making for someone who is newish.   

I have a huge problem w/hard water/soap scum - have been adding EDTA as per Irish Lass' posts (with great results, thanks, IL)  but would like to try citric acid, am just nervous about the lye.  If you have an easy-ish way to suggest that would be great, if not no worries.


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## Seawolfe (Mar 26, 2015)

I've never made lard soap without castor oil. I find the percentages I posted above make a really nice soap. 
I have a friend in China who had a surplus of lard and last year that's all he could get, so all his soaps were 100% lard, and they used them all last year quite happily. This year he is branching into coconut and sweet almond oil in his lard soaps.


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## The Efficacious Gentleman (Mar 26, 2015)

Add maybe 1.5% (oil weight) CA to the lye water - I do mine before the lye.

To quote DeeAnna now - 

10 g citric acid neutralizes 6.24 g NaOH, so add an extra 6.24 g of NaOH for every 10 grams of citric added to the recipe.

Do if you make a 1,000gram recipe, you need 15grams CA and you need to add in an additional 9.36g of lye to what is calculated


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## lenarenee (Mar 26, 2015)

Susie said:


> Enablers, indeed!
> 
> You just won't believe it until you try it.  Seriously!  Even 2 weeks earlier than I normally try my soaps, it is just amazing.
> 
> ...


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## The Efficacious Gentleman (Mar 26, 2015)

So I am looking at making - 

75% Lard
20% CO
5% Castor

Looking forward to this and waiting is not an issue as I have the EU swap soaps to play with which will give these a long old cure.


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## not_ally (Mar 26, 2015)

That is easy-ish and makes sense, EG, thanks.  So basically add in the CA to the water at 1.5 % in proportion to oils. Then take the CA amt and add in an additional amount of lye at the rate of 6.24 to every 10 grams of CA added, mix that total lye amt with the water.  Then proceed as usual?  

I thank you, and my bathtub seconds.


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## The Efficacious Gentleman (Mar 26, 2015)

Don't thank me - thank DeeAnaa


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## not_ally (Mar 26, 2015)

I do (at least in my head when I read her posts) all the time!


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## Sonya-m (Mar 26, 2015)

The Efficacious Gentleman said:


> So I am looking at making -
> 
> 75% Lard
> 20% CO
> ...




This is exactly the recipe my EU soap swap was made to

Edit: I did use infused OO to colour though


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## Sonya-m (Mar 26, 2015)

not_ally said:


> That is easy-ish and makes sense, EG, thanks.  So basically add in the CA to the water at 1.5 % in proportion to oils. Then take the CA amt and add in an additional amount of lye at the rate of 6.24 to every 10 grams of CA added, mix that total lye amt with the water.  Then proceed as usual?
> 
> I thank you, and my bathtub seconds.




Or you can use sodium citrate which has the same effect without needing to recalculate the lye since the citric acid has already been reacted with a base so won't eat any of your lye


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## MorpheusPA (Mar 26, 2015)

Bloody hell, now I'm staring at the lard entry in Soaper's Choice/Columbus Foods trying to resist the impulse to try seven pounds of the stuff.

Hey, I eat the bacon, I don't mind using the lard.  I actually feel better if I use and appreciate the entire animal.

Oh heck.  I keep hearing about the Wonders of Lard.  Submit order.  Off to reformulate recipes.


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## Susie (Mar 26, 2015)

We are evil little enablers!


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## MorpheusPA (Mar 26, 2015)

Susie said:


> We are evil little enablers!



Wicked little enablers indeed.

My lard is ordered, which by Soaper's Choice speed, means it'll be out the door today and here on Monday.  Wow, that stuff is cheap!

And from the profile in SoapCalc, it's nice stuff.  While I love my olive oil, I have a feeling I just found a new best friend...


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## cmzaha (Mar 26, 2015)

I use castor in all soap at 6 percent. I would take it out of the lard


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## Seawolfe (Mar 26, 2015)

I was doing a test on indigo and patchouli, and just threw together a recipe using up my almond oil that was going to go bad. It ended up being 65% lard, 15% coconut and 20% almond oil - 5% superfat, sugar in the lye water. Its a freakishly good soap, people are asking for more, and lathers way beyond what I expected. So I guess my point is, lard goes with everything


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## Obsidian (Mar 26, 2015)

I have a bit different amount, also posted by Deeanna. I dissolve my CA in a little water then add that to my cooled lye solution. 

_For every 1000 grams of oils, you would add 10 g of citric acid and 6 g of extra lye to your water solution to create sodium citrate without extra superfat.


_


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## not_ally (Mar 26, 2015)

Off to search sodium citrate now ...


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## Be Love (Mar 26, 2015)

Another soap to add to my very long to do list......ENABLERS!


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## Luv2Soap (Mar 26, 2015)

Seawolfe said:


> I was doing a test on indigo and patchouli, and just threw together a recipe using up my almond oil that was going to go bad. It ended up being 65% lard, 15% coconut and 20% almond oil - 5% superfat, sugar in the lye water. Its a freakishly good soap, people are asking for more, and lathers way beyond what I expected. So I guess my point is, lard goes with everything


 
Sounds amazing!!! Do you find this is a slow mover?


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## Seawolfe (Mar 26, 2015)

Luv2Soap said:


> Sounds amazing!!! Do you find this is a slow mover?


I was just pouring into cavities, but yeah - it wasn't gloppy, and I'm the queen of glop.


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## Obsidian (Mar 26, 2015)

Lard is quite slow to trace, using a high amount is great for swirling recipe.


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## Luv2Soap (Mar 26, 2015)

Seawolfe said:


> I was just pouring into cavities, but yeah - it wasn't gloppy, and I'm the queen of glop.


 
Thanks, Your Majesty!  :grin:


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## not_ally (Mar 26, 2015)

Sorry, you guys, couple last questions on this hard water thing.  After a quick search it seems that you can either add sodium citrate w/o adding lye or citric acid and add lye.  Is there any tangible benefit to doing one or the other (ie; if they are equivalent it seems easier to just add CS)?  Also, at what percentage of oils would you add CS?  Thanks as always for everyone's generous advice.

Edited (after your post Sonya) to say:  just saw on another link that CS is more expensive than CA, maybe that is part of it.


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## Sonya-m (Mar 26, 2015)

not_ally said:


> Sorry, you guys, couple last questions on this hard water thing.  After a quick search it seems that you can either add sodium citrate w/o adding lye or citric acid and add lye.  Is there any tangible benefit to doing one or the other (ie; if they are equivalent it seems easier to just add CS)?  Also, at what percentage of oils would you add CS?  Thanks as always for everyone's generous advice.




I don't know if there is a benefit one way or the other - other than it meaning no extra calcs - I'm sure someone else can answer though

Regarding use, I initially tried it at 0.5% total oil weight but didn't see a benefit so I've just done a batch using 2% total oil weight but haven't used the soap yet

I think I recall reading anything over 3% can result in making your soap soft


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## not_ally (Mar 26, 2015)

Thanks, Sonya.  Going to try CA for now (have it here) and order some SC.  You have joined the enablers club


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## Luv2Soap (Mar 26, 2015)

Just ordered some Sweet Almond Oil so I can try this recipe over the weekend - ENABLERS!


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## lenarenee (Mar 26, 2015)

Obsidian said:


> Lard is quite slow to trace, using a high amount is great for swirling recipe.




And if you soap cold, bring the batter to a bare trace...you have enough time to
divide and make 10 colors (micas) for an unfinicky swirl like a drop or itp swirl.
Something more exacting like a dandelion zebra...I don't know.


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## TRBeck (Mar 26, 2015)

I use plenty of lard in nearly all of my soaps, and unless the FO I'm using is just a real bear, I can swirl to my heart's content. A bit of extra stick blending is all that is required if I want it thicker for certain types of swirls or other techniques. Otherwise, though, yeah, you can stop at emulsion/thin trace and divide into a bunch of colors. In fact, I made a rainbow soap recently for my kids and had to stick blend for a few additional seconds on each color to get it thickened up enough for the swirl I was doing.


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## Luv2Soap (Mar 26, 2015)

lenarenee said:


> And if you soap cold, bring the batter to a bare trace...you have enough time to
> divide and make 10 colors (micas) for an unfinicky swirl like a drop or itp swirl.
> Something more exacting like a dandelion zebra...I don't know.


 
I'm so excited about this now! Thank you!!!


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## lenarenee (Mar 26, 2015)

Luv2Soap said:


> I'm so excited about this now! Thank you!!!



Well that's great!  I've been soaping over a year now, so I'm still slow at swirling and mixing colors so I think this recipe will be great for you. 

Btw, in case it's helpful. I mix micas with a couple tsps oils taken from the measured oils of the recipe in plastic cups, pour in emulsified or barely traced batter and mix....and out of the tools I've seen people use on videos like tiny whisks, frothers...etc., I've had the best results with just a regular spoon!  Much much faster for me than any other tool I've tried. (Duh. Sadly it was the last method I thought to try!)


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## Luv2Soap (Mar 26, 2015)

I appreciate the advice about the micas. I just received some samples from Nurture Soaps and I'm dying to try a column swirl this weekend. Now...if I can only get my husband to make me that mold asap


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## grumpy_owl (Mar 26, 2015)

I made the 80% lard/20% coconut oil and got a light case of DOS on my sparkly white Angel Wings soaps. But I superfatted at 8% for reasons I don't remember. So I was kind of asking for it.

With all this ENABLING going on, Imma try it again this weekend. If it fails, I'm coming after *Obsidian* for inspiring me to do this, along with salt bars, pumice bars, anise-scented bars...she's like the Pied Piper of soapy experimentation.


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## Obsidian (Mar 26, 2015)

Bring it! lol  I use 8% with my lard soap and have never gotten DOS but there is virtually no humidity here. 

I'm making a green tea and mugwort swirl salt bar tomorrow, mugwort is said to be good for the skin.  Try it, you know you want too.


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## grumpy_owl (Mar 26, 2015)

Darn you all to heck!!! My precious Angel Wings were green tea scented. Behold my DOS, Temptress of Darkness! I shall defeat your recipe, and I shall rule the soap world!!
Um, sorry. Ahem, I mean, I shall make a nice lard-coconut oil soap.


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## not_ally (Mar 26, 2015)

Just said to my dog "we are going to have to buy that big ass box of lard from Smart and Final, bud."  He looked at me quizzically, but I think he sort gets it, if not, looks  forward to licking the outside of the box.  For those of you w/dogs, how do you get them to stop that?  JK, kind of.

Edited to say:  I don't sell and any giftee knows that there is going to be some Freddie DNA, some way/some how on my soap.  Sorry if that is gross.


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## jules92207 (Mar 26, 2015)

My giftees understand that too!


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## Seawolfe (Mar 26, 2015)

On lard soap making days all the freaky little furry fiends know to line up for a dab of lard in their bowls. Makes the dogs coats shiny, and cuts down on nasty hair balls from the cats.


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## grumpy_owl (Mar 26, 2015)

I have more cats than I care to mention, and occasionally there is a car hair in my oils. I usually get it out in time, but for all I know, I haven't gotten them all out. No one has complained so far, but it's a good thing I don't sell.

P.S. Does anyone want to buy me a barn or other outbuilding just for cat-free soap-making? Free soaps for life and, uh, hugs.


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## MorpheusPA (Mar 27, 2015)

There's the occasional Bichon Frise hair in mine, what with having two of them.  I usually catch it.  I hope.

Fortunately, my hair is very short and doesn't tend to fall out anyway.


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## not_ally (Mar 27, 2015)

My hair is longer, blacker, and distinguishable from Fred's, I find mine way more disgusting than his.  Although I think potential soap users would um, not like either variety.  I really do not know how I would deal with if I sold, Freddie sheds quite a bit.  I can usually fish the hairs out, but not not sure if I am I always perfect.  Hopefully the lye breaks that stuff down


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## lionprincess00 (Mar 27, 2015)

Ah grumpy,
If I wasn't a days drive from you, I'd go on with you on a soapy property prefurnished with a soapy shed.

Prewired with air conditioning and a water line, of course!

Think we could meet in the middle, and I know a lard lover is nearby somewhere...

Lookin at you Susie!


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## grumpy_owl (Mar 27, 2015)

Only one day, *Lionprincess*? Let's buy a cabin on the bayou and build a shed out back for soaping. Guaranteed cat-hair-free and unlimited local lard.


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## hlee (Mar 27, 2015)

I will never give up my creamy white lard.
I think it's time to try some tallow too.


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## The Efficacious Gentleman (Mar 27, 2015)

Oddly enough, we had a whole thread about how the proteins in silks used for soaping aren't so different from hair - so you're all making lovely soaps there with hair


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## LittleCrazyWolf (Mar 27, 2015)

I love this thread for so many reasons! :grin: Love my lard bars but the highest I've gone is 50% so far. Now I'm going to have to try 80%. Also, I'd have to wear a spacesuit or set up a cleanroom environment in order to keep any cat hair from following me into my soaping room. And even that probably wouldn't work. So I guess I'll just have to keep staring intently at my bowl of oils to suss out the occasional hair.


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## Luckyone80 (Mar 27, 2015)

How long did you wait to unmold the 80% lard soap? I would think it would be pretty soft still after 24 hours that I usually wait.


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## Susie (Mar 27, 2015)

grumpy_owl said:


> Only one day, *Lionprincess*? Let's buy a cabin on the bayou and build a shed out back for soaping. Guaranteed cat-hair-free and unlimited local lard.



You don't want to live on the bayou, too many mosquitoes, and too many DEQ regulations these days.  Let's build a soaping community out in the country somewhere.


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## not_ally (Mar 27, 2015)

Yes!  A soaper's retreat, like those fancy-schmancy writing ones.  I can imagine the heated discussions about palm-no palm, butters v. animal fats, eos v. fos, though.  We might have to have a time-out room


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## Sonya-m (Mar 27, 2015)

Luckyone80 said:


> How long did you wait to unmold the 80% lard soap? I would think it would be pretty soft still after 24 hours that I usually wait.




Mine is always ready to go after 24 hours - lard is pretty hard


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## FlybyStardancer (Mar 27, 2015)

not_ally said:


> Yes!  A soaper's retreat, like those fancy-schmancy writing ones.  I can imagine the heated discussions about palm-no palm, butters v. animal fats, eos v. fos, though.  We might have to have a time-out room



I think a soaping retreat wouldn't need it... After all, knitters & crocheters don't have time-out rooms on their retreats and I've seen some epic internet acrylic-vs-wool fights!


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## The Efficacious Gentleman (Mar 27, 2015)

FlybyStardancer said:


> I think a soaping retreat wouldn't need it... After all, knitters & crocheters don't have time-out rooms on their retreats and I've seen some epic internet acrylic-vs-wool fights!




And those folks have needles!


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## Susie (Mar 27, 2015)

OK, well, I have to confess that I crochet also...so I need a yarn room next to the soaping kitchen.  And we need a big screened in porch with an indoor/outdoor kitchen for all the gumbo and stuff we are going to be cooking.


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## not_ally (Mar 27, 2015)

That actually sounds kind of heavenly.  I am oddly wistful for this imaginary place.


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## FlybyStardancer (Mar 27, 2015)

The Efficacious Gentleman said:


> And those folks have needles!



Thin little needle-sharp hooks can be even worse once they're inside too! And don't forget about the knitters with circular needles... They can be used as a garrote! :twisted: :angel: lol


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## MorpheusPA (Mar 27, 2015)

FlybyStardancer said:


> Thin little needle-sharp hooks can be even worse once they're inside too! And don't forget about the knitters with circular needles... They can be used as a garrote! :twisted: :angel: lol



You.  People.  Scare.  Me.

On the other hand, I'm a gardener.  My favorite trowel has a serrated, back-cut edge like an old-fashioned dagger designed to rend flesh and make you bleed to death.  I guess I shouldn't talk...


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## The Efficacious Gentleman (Mar 27, 2015)

I was going to say that my most dangerous item looks pale in comparison - my shot gun.  But then I looked at my box of straight razors and realised that it is the every day items that are most scary


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## Seawolfe (Mar 27, 2015)

Oooh a soapers retreat!! Ill bring my hammock and the cocktails!!
I went to my first soapers meetup and it was SO much fun - everyone making soap at their crockpot stations, and talking soap and doing zap tests behind the leaders back cause he liked phenolphthalein...


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## FlybyStardancer (Mar 27, 2015)

Gent--and you have a famous literary example of such a thing being used for nefarious purposes. At least for yarn-crafters you have to go to obscure literary sources to find it.


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## jade-15 (Mar 27, 2015)

I know the perfect place for our retreat!! A medieval village... 

http://mobile.news.com.au/finance/r...-for-just-750000/story-fncq3era-1227264878116


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## not_ally (Mar 27, 2015)

"But then I ....  realised that it is the every day items that are most scary".

Just wait until baby EG starts to toddle   It is amazing what they can fit up their little noses.


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## Dorymae (Mar 27, 2015)

jade-15 said:


> I know the perfect place for our retreat!! A medieval village...
> 
> http://mobile.news.com.au/finance/r...-for-just-750000/story-fncq3era-1227264878116



Well, if we all pitched in. . . How many stone masons do we have? Plumbers? How about painters and carpenters ?

Could you imagine a village full of soap makers on vacation?! Well not from soap of course.


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## not_ally (Mar 27, 2015)

I know, I actually thought about that too.  A medieval village soap co-op.  Awesome.


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## Susie (Mar 27, 2015)

I have veggies and herbs planted...I don't know if you would call me a gardener, as it is very little.  But I know that trowel.

Craig-Before the little one arrives, you need to crawl through the house on hands and knees and remove everything remotely swallow-able from all of the areas you can reach when you are on your knees.(If it will fit into a cardboard toilet paper tube, it will fit in their mouths.)  Then cover the electric outlets, put child proof latches on any drawers/cabinets you don't want them in, etc.  It really is a big job, as you make the first pass through to identify what you need to install/remove, then you go through and do that, then you go back through double checking it.


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## grumpy_owl (Mar 28, 2015)

I say we pitch in and buy the medieval village and turn it into a crafting town. And have an annual festival called Cardstock. And btw, I am a writer as my main profession and knit as well, so I'll need the foofy writer's retreat segment as well as sheep, looms, and a dying shed.
Let's get on this, people; there's work to do.


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## jules92207 (Mar 28, 2015)

I'm so signing up.


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## Jstar (Mar 28, 2015)

Ooooo a soapers retreat! Im in. I crochet too, so looks like we gonna need more than a couple fiber nooks


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## Luv2Soap (Mar 28, 2015)

I'm all in  Please sign me up!


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## LBussy (Mar 28, 2015)

Is this a long cure soap or ... ?

I wait 4 weeks for a version of Irish Lass' OO/CO/Lard soap.  Longer for this or no?


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## DeeAnna (Mar 28, 2015)

I'm going to have to revisit this type of recipe. I did a 90% lard, 10% CO, beer soap a few years ago -- nicknamed it my "pickled pig" soap. It didn't lather all that well at first so I wasn't at all impressed, and I think that first unfavorable impression stuck with me and overshadowed my later opinions of this recipe.

From my notes:
Week 3: "Lather is 1 out of 3 (3=very good, 2= acceptable, 1=minimal). Creamy, minimal."
Week 4: "Lather is much better after 4 wk cure – it is now about a 2 out of 3. Nice, long lasting in the shower and for hand washing. Much happier with this soap now."
A year later: "Lather is lovely!"

So, Lee, give it at least a month -- two if you have the patience. I think adding a tish more CO and a dash of castor as y'all are doing will make this type of soap perform even better sooner.

***

For those asking about citric acid -- the reason why most of us use the acid+lye version, it's because citric acid is usually cheaper and easier to find than sodium citrate. 

The Gent gave more accurate numbers: 10 g citric acid neutralizes 6.24 g NaOH, so add an extra 6.24 g of NaOH for every 10 grams of citric added to the recipe. Since most soapers don't have a scale that reads to tenths of a gram, I simplified the numbers in later posts to this: 10 g citric acid neutralizes 6 g NaOH. 

For the amount of CA used in a hobbyist size batch of soap, either version will work fine. If you're scaling up, you'd want to use the more accurate numbers The Gent gave and round just the final answer.


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## newbie (Mar 28, 2015)

Let's get back to this village idea. There was one on eBay even!! It seems there are many to choose from...wouldn't that be cool?

It's an older listing but still the concept...

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/wor...r-sale-Italian-alpine-village-for-195000.html


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## biarine (Mar 28, 2015)

I did used lard a while back using 70% lard, 15% CO, 15% Avocado oil and 5% castor, I put Vetiver EO. My friends like it but I don't like the smell of vetiver and lard combined. I felt sick but it's very creamy and nice in the skin.


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## not_ally (Mar 28, 2015)

Biarine, did you really detect the scent of the lard in the soap after cure?  I don't, but my sniffer might not be that sensitive.


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## biarine (Mar 28, 2015)

Yes I did my sense of smell is very strong  I love vetiver but with the smell of lard combine I can't stand it.


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## reinbeau (Mar 28, 2015)

What is the citric acid for?  I missed something.  Is it for hard water/soap scum?


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## not_ally (Mar 28, 2015)

That is kind of awful, just b/c I love lard and would hate to give it up.  Sincerely sorry.  But glad that there are lots of butters out there for you to sub!


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## LBussy (Mar 28, 2015)

DeeAnna said:


> I'm going to have to revisit this type of recipe.


I was making a batch of shaving soap today to finish up my article (part 3 is the actual process) and I decided "while I'm at it" ... did lard/co/castor and my wife's favorite FO.  

I used a red coloring that I originally bought for lip balm (to make it pink) and it sucked there.  I figured it would emulsify better here. It did but it turned tan.  I guess it was not lye safe.

My recipe notes say "Whee-Pig! Soap" because it was supposed to be pink.  I guess it is the same color as a real pig anyway.



> So, Lee, give it at least a month -- two if you have the patience. I think adding a tish more CO and a dash of castor as y'all are doing will make this type of soap perform even better sooner.


Will do.  I'll make myself feel better about the wait by taking a shower with a nearly year old castille. 



newbie said:


> Let's get back to this village idea.


I know I did hijack the thread didn't I?  :Kitten Love:

As long as the village has Internet, I'm there.  I also make fireworks so I have the 4th of July celebration covered.


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## not_ally (Mar 28, 2015)

Ann, I think it was for soap scum (at least that was the intent of my  query).  I think I was one of the hijackers, sorry.  I guess a lot of us like lard and are wanderers)


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## Jstar (Mar 29, 2015)

Meh..if anyone buys that village, they have to keep to the masterplan and 'fix it up' according to what the remaining residents want.

We could instead buy a ghost town.

http://abcnews.go.com/Business/connecticut-ghost-village-sale-time-halloween/story?id=26073755

Sorry for hi-jacking


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## DeeAnna (Mar 29, 2015)

Sodium citrate reduces soap scum by reacting with hard water minerals. It can chelate (bind up) metals that can trigger DOS/rancidity.


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## Luv2Soap (Apr 6, 2015)

Seawolfe said:


> I was doing a test on indigo and patchouli, and just threw together a recipe using up my almond oil that was going to go bad. It ended up being 65% lard, 15% coconut and 20% almond oil - 5% superfat, sugar in the lye water. Its a freakishly good soap, people are asking for more, and lathers way beyond what I expected. So I guess my point is, lard goes with everything


 
First of all - thank you again for this recipe! It's so creamy - it's unbelievable! Do you find that people have told you it's too slippery? For some reason, that's the reaction I'm getting from my husband and son when they used it for the first time. They like it, but it's too slippery and like washing your hands with lotion. Um...that last part is the whole point but, whatever...men...  

Is there anything you can do to reduce the slip a little?


----------



## Seawolfe (Apr 6, 2015)

Luv2Soap said:


> First of all - thank you again for this recipe! It's so creamy - it's unbelievable! Do you find that people have told you it's too slippery? For some reason, that's the reaction I'm getting from my husband and son when they used it for the first time. They like it, but it's too slippery and like washing your hands with lotion. Um...that last part is the whole point but, whatever...men...
> 
> Is there anything you can do to reduce the slip a little?



Yeah, try some clay like French green or something. I noticed it makes the bars less slippery. Perhaps AC or oatmeal would do the same. I just made a batch and am waiting for it to harden properly, its a slow poke.


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## Obsidian (Apr 6, 2015)

The extra slippery-ness was something that bothered me at first too but I got used to it. You could use a little extra fine pumice, its not gritty at all and should provide more grip. or tell them to man up


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## Luv2Soap (Apr 6, 2015)

I have some Rose Kaolin Clay coming today from WSP. Maybe I'll give it a try in there to see if it reduces the slip a little. I really love this soap! I may sub a little almond oil for some butter (have the hard butter sampler pack coming in today too from WSP). Gave a bar to my sister to test out so we'll see how she likes it.

How much clay ppo would you add? 1T or 1t.?



Obsidian said:


> The extra slippery-ness was something that bothered me at first too but I got used to it. You could use a little extra fine pumice, its not gritty at all and should provide more grip. or tell them to man up


 
LOL - I'd love to just tell them to man up   My oldest son is pretty picky and high maintenance  I would have thought this soap would have been right up his alley per say. I was going to put FO in my batch, but forgot. I smell NOTHING when I put it to my nose, but his super sniffer says it smells the oils. Think it's all in his head


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## sheri_gurney (Aug 4, 2015)

OK, just a quick lard question - is lard for soap the same as the stuff I buy at the grocery store to make pie crust? I haven't made lard soap, but now I'm tempted - unfortunately, I'm planning a soap day today, and the grocery store is my only local supply store!


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## The Efficacious Gentleman (Aug 4, 2015)

As long as it is lard, it is good to go.


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## not_ally (Aug 4, 2015)

It should be, sheri, as long as it actually says lard/manteca (ie, not shortening, that sometimes includes blends of other oils which will mess up your SAP calculation.)


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## cmzaha (Aug 4, 2015)

Luv2Soap said:


> I have some Rose Kaolin Clay coming today from WSP. Maybe I'll give it a try in there to see if it reduces the slip a little. I really love this soap! I may sub a little almond oil for some butter (have the hard butter sampler pack coming in today too from WSP). Gave a bar to my sister to test out so we'll see how she likes it.
> 
> How much clay ppo would you add? 1T or 1t.?
> 
> ...


Most Rose Clay needs to be used lightly. Like red clay it will run color badly. I do not measure how much I use but I use just enough to get a light pinkish color.


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## reinbeau (Aug 4, 2015)

I don't find rose kaolin clay to be particularly 'stainy'.  Australian red reef clay yes.  I use a tablespoon ppo of the rose kaolin all the time in my soaps.


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## DeeAnna (Aug 4, 2015)

I made this high-lard recipe:

75% Lard
20% CO
5% Castor

Used distilled water that I infused with sweetgrass to make a deep green "tea". 31% lye solution concentration, 2% superfat. Tetrasodium EDTA powder at 0.5% of the soap (fat + lye + water) weight. Sweetgrass FO from Nature's Garden. No sugar, milk, etc., although I suspect the sweetgrass contributed some sugars. Batter was probably in the 110-120 deg F. The recipe traced slowly -- plenty of time to do fancy work, had I been so inclined.

I added a tiny titch of green ultramarine to part of the batter in a lame attempt at doing an in-the-pot swirl. My coloring didn't work, as you can see from the pic of this soap -- I learned I didn't add nearly enough to change the color enough to matter. The green is basically all from the sweetgrass infusion. So far the color from the sweetgrass is holding, but I don't expect it to last. Dried sweetgrass bleaches out with time to a golden tan (see other pic), so I expect that's what will happen to the color of the soap too.

Very good lather after 4 weeks of cure -- nice blend of dense suds and fluffy bubbles. I'd give this recipe an "A+" grade for lather. I like the initial hardness of the soap as well -- the soap easy to unmold and cut. 

The soap happily gelled without being insulated or CPOP'ed. At first, I covered the molded soap with a tea towel and set out on the counter while I cleaned up. I had planned to put it into my cold oven for feline and canine safety, but when I finished cleaning up, I noticed the top was cracking slightly, so I set the mold on a wire rack and put a fan on it to cool it down.

Like Susie said about her high-lard soap, I expect this will become one of my go-to recipes. Up to this point, my go-to base recipes had 50% to 60% lard and 13% to 17% coconut with castor and some mix of olive, HO safflower, and/or avocado making up the balance. I like the simplicity of the recipe, how nicely the batter behaved when soaping, and the lather and skin feel of the bar.


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## TeresaT (Aug 4, 2015)

I have really hard water so I use 2% CA for every batch of soap.  Since I always make 2# batches, I know to add 18 gm CA to my water and an extra 11 gm NaOH to my lye solution.  I've been using a premade 50% lye solution, so I add the 11 gm to the water and dissolve it before I add the rest of the lye solution.  That helps bring the temp back down.


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## Seawolfe (Aug 4, 2015)

OH that soap is so pretty! And the fade to gold will also be pretty if those plants are anything to go by. Heh be a cute marketing theme "watch as the seasons roll by in this all natural soap that is linked to the rhythms that drive all life..."


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## Jstar (Aug 4, 2015)

Very pretty


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## Sonya-m (Aug 4, 2015)

That's my go to lard recipe too DeeAnna - discovered I loved it when I wanted to soap on a budget whilst still learning


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## DeeAnna (Aug 4, 2015)

"watch as the seasons roll by in this all natural soap that is linked to the rhythms that drive all life..." 

Wowser, Seawolfe, you have a way with words! Can I hire you as my advertising consultant?


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## traderbren (Aug 26, 2015)

This thread inspired me to make an 80% lard soap a few weeks back. I pulled out one of the small round bars for my shower the other night to test, and I GET IT NOW! It was completely lovely and creamy and felt wonderful on my skin. Of course, as soon as I tried it, I had to go print out a bunch of soapcalc recipes with small additions (yesterday I tried a little castor and cocoa butter and took the CO down to 15%, today or Friday I will make some with 75% lard/20% CO/5% castor). Thank you so much for the inspiration! I already loved lard, but hadn't tried such high percentages.


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## Susie (Aug 26, 2015)

Add 1 Tablespoon of sugar PPO to boost your bubbles.  Just lovely.


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## IrishLass (Aug 26, 2015)

Okay, I'm going to have to try this. I was just leafing through my notes and found a long forgotten gem- I saw that on April 13 of 2007- back in my newbie, furiously crazy, experimenting days when I was making batch after batch of various formulas (all different, mind you, so I can see how it got forgotten)- I actually made a batch of lard soap with these ingredients: 

-70% lard
-10.5% coconut oil
-10.5 % castor oil
-8% olive 
-1% cocoa butter (Don't ask me why, because I don't know. It just is what it is )
-And some ground-up salt soap flakes from 2 bars that were made from 100% CO and 100% sea salt with a 10% s/f.

The overall batch had a superfat of 5%.

My notes say that I tested it out 4 months later at the sink (unfortunately, I have no in-the-shower comments). Here's what my at-the-sink notes say:

*"Used at sink. Wow, I did not expect much lather, but it had great lather that felt really nice like I was washing with water-softener water. Smooth and lotiony, but nice & bubbly. I was surprised! Very nice." *


I'm sure the salt soap flakes contributed something to that lather, but I don't know how much since I never made a version without salt soap flakes.... or any other batch using that particular lard formula for that matter. 

Well, no matter. In any case, I think I'll go ahead and give this a try:


70% lard 
15% coconut oil
10% castor
5% olive
.5% edta per total weight of batch

(without any salt soap flakes)


IrishLass


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## BlackDog (Aug 26, 2015)

omg what happens when you see these threads about new exciting recipes that you're dying to try and you can't soap until the weekend?!?!  gahhhhh *flails*  IT'S ONLY WEDNESDAY


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## BlackDog (Aug 26, 2015)

Seawolfe said:


> On lard soap making days all the freaky little furry fiends know to line up for a dab of lard in their bowls.



That is adorable, and makes me want to be your friend.  And it makes me feel like not such a weirdo that my pooch gets an egg in her bowl when I do fried-egg Saturdays.


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## Soap Techniques (Aug 26, 2015)

Susie said:


> Add 1 Tablespoon of sugar PPO to boost your bubbles. Just lovely.


Susie, does sugar really make a difference? I remember reading somewhere that you wanted to make some experiments to be sure.


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## The Efficacious Gentleman (Aug 27, 2015)

Not Susie, but I've noticed a difference. As with other bubble boosters, sugar needs at least something to work with in the first place, but it really does dial up the later button a bit


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## IrishLass (Aug 27, 2015)

I've noticed a difference with sugar, too. I use it at 5% ppo (basically 2 tablespoons ppo).


IrishLass


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## Susie (Aug 27, 2015)

It does make a difference.  I happened to grab an older version of the soap I was just using (I am short, and my soap is stored above my head), and the older version had sugar in it.  There was a distinct difference in the amount of bubbles.  Not the quality of lather, but just the amount of it.


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## rparrny (Aug 27, 2015)

Luv2Soap said:


> I appreciate the advice about the micas. I just received some samples from Nurture Soaps and I'm dying to try a column swirl this weekend. Now...if I can only get my husband to make me that mold asap


Just my two cents: I was having problems getting my micas dissolved in oil, a member here recommended vegetable glycerin which I tried and was SO much easier and better blended I use nothing else now.


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## reinbeau (Aug 27, 2015)

IrishLass said:


> 70% lard
> 15% coconut oil
> 10% castor
> 5% olive
> ...


What is the edta for, please?

http://www.soapmakingforum.com//www.pinterest.com/pin/create/extension/


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## DeeAnna (Aug 27, 2015)

EDTA is included to reduce the chance of rancidity (DOS) and to reduce the amount of soap scum that soap makes in hard water. You can also use sodium citrate (or citric acid plus the appropriate extra amount of lye) to do much the same thing as EDTA.

See:
http://www.soapmakingforum.com/showpost.php?p=432635 especially Post 19
http://www.soapmakingforum.com/showthread.php?t=54669


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## IrishLass (Aug 27, 2015)

Yep- what DeeAnna said. My water is pretty hard, so I add the tetrasodium EDTA to help reduce scum, and it also has the added benefit of increasing my bubblage some, as well as preventing DOS. 

Also- I use the tetrasodium EDTA instead if citrate or citric acid because I always have EDTA on hand for my lotions (I use it along with Phenonip in my preservative system).


IrishLass


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## IrishLass (Aug 30, 2015)

Well, I was going to do this: 

70% lard 
15% coconut oil
10% castor
5% olive
.5% edta per total weight of batch

But instead I made this:

65% Lard
15% coconut oil
10% castor oil
5% olive oil
5% shea butter
.5% tetrasodium EDTA per total batch weight
@6% S/F

I can hardly wait until it cures!

Here's a pic (hit the refresh button if you can't see it):








IrishLass


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## Sonya-m (Aug 30, 2015)

Looks lovely - so creamy!!

Love the little piggy!!


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## CaraBou (Aug 30, 2015)

OMG -- is that a soap cutter (with cut bars) in that pigs paws??  No wonder he's smiling!!


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## IrishLass (Aug 30, 2015)

Nope, that's actually a computer keyboard he's holding. It's my hubby's piggy (he works with computers for a living). I like the idea that it looks like a soap cutter, though. 


IrishLass


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## not_ally (Aug 30, 2015)

Those are beautiful, IL, all aspects of them.  Did you use one of those Wilton liners for the exterior surfaces?  Would you mind posting a picture of it if so?  So beautifully trimmed/beveled as well.  

I remember seeing a thread about bevelers a while ago and being seized w/envy of yours, it is the Lotioncrafter one, right?  I tried to find one, but LC does not make them any more, there were no second hand ones to be found, and nothing else like it on the market that I saw ....


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## LBussy (Aug 30, 2015)

What's unique about the beveler?  

I agree, those are very pretty bars!


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## not_ally (Aug 30, 2015)

The way it makes that indented line/rim/angle combo.  The other ones just do a plain angle.  I am not explaining this very well, though.


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## LBussy (Aug 30, 2015)

Ah, I see.  It is a very nice effect.


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## IrishLass (Aug 30, 2015)

not_ally said:


> Those are beautiful, IL, all aspects of them. Did you use one of those Wilton liners for the exterior surfaces? Would you mind posting a picture of it if so? So beautifully trimmed/beveled as well.


 
Thanks not_ally! Yes- I used Wilton's Graceful Vines fondant mat as my mold liner. It comes in a 20" x 20" roll, and I basically just cut it into individual pieces to fit the bottom, top, and each side of my log mold...well, every side except for the 2 short ends of my log mold, that is. For those, I like to use mylar to line so that each of the faces of my soap come out flat/smooth. 

Once my soap is all poured into the mold, I lay the top fondant liner right on the top surface of the soap and gently press on it to make the raised impressions penetrate into the surface of the batter. 

Here's a pic of the fondant mat I use: http://www.wilton.com/store/site/product.cfm?id=93495AAA-423B-522D-F11F0C5BE27A3F93 I bought mine at Michaels's craft store in the cake baking section. It's real easy to cut-to-fit. Over the years, I have been able to buy enough rolls to have fondant liners for all my collapsible wood molds (I really love these as liners, as you can tell).

When I go to soap, I just 'glue' each of the cut liners into place in my mold with Vaseline, and then when I unmold, I collapse my mold and peel the liners off the soap. They peel right off quite easily and cleanly like buttah. I should probably mention here that I gel all my soaps and also use sodium lactate, which I'm sure helps in how easily and cleanly the peel off. Oh, and for what it's worth, the liners don't need any 'greasing' with mineral oil or anything like that since they are made out of silicone. 



not_ally said:


> I remember seeing a thread about bevelers a while ago and being seized w/envy of yours, it is the Lotioncrafter one, right? I tried to find one, but LC does not make them any more, there were no second hand ones to be found, and nothing else like it on the market that I saw ....


 
Nope- LotionCrafters no longer sells them, but you might be able buy them elsewhere. This is something I recently found out a year or 2 ago, but the LC beveller that I have is not actually a soap beveller, but a Japanese woodworking tool made by Kakuri. It is called a Kakuri 1/8" and 1/4" Radius Plane. There used to be a place in California called Japan Woodworker that sold them, but I can't seem to bring their site up. It looks like they might have closed? In any case, I just tried to do a search and it looks like there's a place in Australia that sells them, only they all it a Kakuri Round Molding Plane (it looks exactly like mine, though): http://www.japanesetools.com.au/collections/planes/products/kakuri-round-molding-plane 

Anyway, if you can find one, it's really worth the price. It seems to be built to last for generations, and the blade can be sharpened if need be. As you've noticed, it makes great soap bevels, and it is completely adjustable so you are not stuck with one size/dimension/angle of bevel.


IrishLass


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## LBussy (Aug 30, 2015)

Molding/Moulding planes are a not completely uncommon tool in the US as well.  I would be careful to treat any metal surfaces after use to avoid corrosion, but I'll bet an industrious person could find some really nice ones.

The reason these are so named - look at the molding around doors, base molding around the room, etc.  These days they are made with large shapers or routers but they used to be made by hand, each shape a different blade.

Here are some router bit profiles that should give you ideas of shapes to look for:







Most all of them I have seen are vintage - if you don't want a carpenter to cry, search for repro's.


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## not_ally (Aug 30, 2015)

Irish Lass, I just want to thank you now, for past advice, and what I know will come in the future.  You are one the most generous soap makers I know.   The combination of that and the fact that I really *trust* that advice is why I am your mini-me/would-be soaping doppelganger, not sure what we came up w/there 

I *really* like the way the liner and the trimming/bevelling worked here, they were perfect with a single-colored/unswirled soap.  They really provided a sense of luxury and evident work-craftmanship, if that makes sense. 

I am going to do some research on those Kakuri planes and put the result on my Christmas present request list (it is usually hard to hit the right kind of thing at the right cost level, this is a good one!)  I have to admit, it was kind of hard to figure out how they worked from the picture in that link, but I'm sure several hours of experiments (and then 5 ms w/my crafty brother-in-law) will make me really happy   Thanks again.

ETA:  OMG, Lee, we were cross-posting, you have scared the crap out of me!  JK, I will just show the pic from IL's link to my BIL and he will tell me if I am capable of using it w/o losing a significant amount of skin/digit


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## DeeAnna (Aug 30, 2015)

Here's a variety of chamfer/edge/radius planes sold in the States, including IL's chamfer plane --

http://www.leevalley.com/US/Wood/page.aspx?p=41200&cat=1,230,41182
http://www.leevalley.com/US/Wood/page.aspx?p=41197&cat=1,230,41182
http://www.leevalley.com/US/Wood/page.aspx?p=32682&cat=1,230,41182
http://www.leevalley.com/US/Wood/page.aspx?p=41232&cat=1,230,41182
http://www.garrettwade.com/ebony-chamfer-plane/p/67B01.05/
http://www.rockler.com/carbide-tipped-radius-plane-or-chamfer-plane-radius-plane


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## LBussy (Aug 31, 2015)

DeeAnna said:


> Here's a variety of chamfer/edge/radius planes sold in the States, including IL's chamfer plane --


That's the stuff I was looking for!  I knew Lee Valley had to have them.  My Google-fu was broken over the weekend.

I buy enough from them these days that sneaking a couple in will be no problemo.


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## DeeAnna (Aug 31, 2015)

Lee Valley is one of my favoritest places for woodworking stuff. Great products.


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## silverette (Sep 17, 2015)

*80% lard soap recipe*

Can you tell me how to find the above recipe?  Thanks


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## SudsandLather (Sep 17, 2015)

*Lard and Hydrogenation*

I know that grocery store lard is hydrogenated to make it shelf stable but is hydrogenated lard a concern for anyone? As far as it also is often treated with bleaching and deodorizing agents, emulsifiers, and antioxidants, such as BHT...

I've made grocery store lard soap before and truly love animal fats in soaps. I have a grass-fed tallow farmer so I can render my own tallow ... Haven't found a reasonable supplier of lard straight from a farm before it's processed. Hydrogenation produces trans fats, which no one should eat but what about in a soap application on the skin?

Thoughts?


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## DeeAnna (Sep 17, 2015)

There is not a full, detailed recipe posted in this thread, Silverette. All we are talking about here is just the basic proportions of fats, with lard being a large proportion of the total fat. See the first few posts in this thread for inspiration and use Soapcalc or your favorite soap recipe calculator to design your own recipe. 

Post 1: 80% lard, 20% CO
Post 5: 5% castor, 15% coconut and 80% lard 5% SF - and sugar for bubbles
Post 14: 15% CO, 5% castor, 10% high oleic safflower, 70% lard
Post 15: 75% Lard, 20% CO, 5% Castor
etc.....

ETA: 
"...is hydrogenated lard a concern for anyone?..." 
No. I use store bought lard and home rendered lard interchangeably for soap.


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## Susie (Sep 17, 2015)

silverette said:


> Can you tell me how to find the above recipe?  Thanks



Which recipe, specifically?



SudsandLather said:


> I know that grocery store lard is hydrogenated to make it shelf stable but is hydrogenated lard a concern for anyone? As far as it also is often treated with bleaching and deodorizing agents, emulsifiers, and antioxidants, such as BHT...
> 
> I've made grocery store lard soap before and truly love animal fats in soaps. I have a grass-fed tallow farmer so I can render my own tallow ... Haven't found a reasonable supplier of lard straight from a farm before it's processed. Hydrogenation produces trans fats, which no one should eat but what about in a soap application on the skin?
> 
> Thoughts?



I hardly think that any harmful effects can happen from a 3-5 minute exposure on skin...even if there were any possible harmful effects of hydrogenated oils on skin.


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## soapysarah (Sep 17, 2015)

I've been making hair soap for some time, primarily for my husband so that he cuts down on the over-chemicalled commercial soap.  He is fine with the soap for his hair - green tea and soap nuts.  However, I have found that I can no longer use it as it makes my hair really greasy.  It started off fine and then I coloured my hair with a different make of colourant (I'm obviously happy to use chemicals to cover the grey!) and it stopped working.  I've done some research on this and found out that using a soap for hair can make hair greasy, it depends on the history of the hair and individual makeup.  It appears that with continued use this should change and the hair no longer gets greasy once all the previous additives have gone.  There was nothing about this effect on any of the sites I visited which sold cp shampoo bars.


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## Dharlee (Sep 17, 2015)

I have a crazy question. Lard, is this the same as tallow? I have been wanting to try this for some time. Everyone says it's wonderful. I have found tallow for sale, but not lard per se.


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## not_ally (Sep 17, 2015)

No, lard is pig fat, tallow (if used w/o a modifier) is beef fat.  Tallow is used with respect to other animal fats, but then people use a modifier (ie; buffalo tallow, deer tallow, etc.)


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## snappyllama (Sep 17, 2015)

I find this definition which makes me happy in a vocabulary nerd way:

Fat from goats, sheep, llamas, alpacas, deer, moose, elk, caribou and other ungulates is hard and when rendered is called tallow.  
Fat from pigs, bear, and rabbit is soft fat, and when rendered is called lard.  
Fat from poultry such as duck, geese, and chickens is called “schmaltz” and is soft, almost liquid, at room temperature.  

I cannot wait until DH makes BBQ chicken so I can annoy him with talking about his schmaltz sputtering on the grill.


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## DeeAnna (Sep 17, 2015)

My understanding is tallow comes from herbivore ungulates (hooved animals that eat only plants) and lard is from omnivorous ungulates (hooved animals that eat plant and animal foods -- pigs). I haven't seen rendered rabbit and bear fat also called lard, but maybe that's a more common usage in culinary circles?


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## The Efficacious Gentleman (Sep 17, 2015)

Just to throw a spanner is the works - schmalz is a generic term for semi solid cooking fats. Like schweinerschmalz (spelling is wrong, but I'm too tired) is lard, butterschmalz is a kind of processed butter for cooking with. In fact, schmalz is translated often as lard or shortening


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## TeaLeavesandTweed (Sep 17, 2015)

snappyllama said:


> Fat from poultry such as duck, geese, and chickens is called “schmaltz” and is soft, almost liquid, at room temperature.



Unrelated to soap, but duck fat is liquid at warm-ish room temperature and can be used to make salad dressing. Really awesome salad dressing.

Related to soap, I have an 80% lard, 20% CO soap that will have been curing 4 weeks a week from tomorrow. Should I give it a test or another 2 weeks before diving in?


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## navigator9 (Sep 17, 2015)

snappyllama said:


> I find this definition which makes me happy in a vocabulary nerd way:
> 
> Fat from goats, sheep, llamas, alpacas, deer, moose, elk, caribou and other ungulates is hard and when rendered is called tallow.
> Fat from pigs, bear, and rabbit is soft fat, and when rendered is called lard.
> ...



snappy, your talk of schmaltz reminds me of a trip to Florida some years ago to visit my aunties, who grew up poor, and never threw anything away, including schmaltz, which they saved, along with bacon fat, to fry things. So of course, not knowing this, I took the little tub of "I can't believe it's not butter", assuming that's what it actually was, and slathered some on my morning toast, and took a bite before one of the aunties could say, "Oh no, that's not the one for toast!" lol It also reminds me of a Jewish boyfriend's grandmother who used to make me chopped liver with schmaltz. I can still taste it's silky wonderfulness!


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## Seawolfe (Sep 17, 2015)

I see no harm in trying it out tomorrow - I cant believe you haven't been testing it all along! But it might well be even better in a couple more weeks or so. I typically start using my soaps at 4 weeks just because they are MY soaps and I CAN! Well, except for the castiles.



TeaLeavesandTweed said:


> Related to soap, I have an 80% lard, 20% CO soap that will have been curing 4 weeks a week from tomorrow. Should I give it a test or another 2 weeks before diving in?


----------



## not_ally (Sep 17, 2015)

snappyllama said:


> I find this definition which makes me happy in a vocabulary nerd way:
> 
> Fat from goats, sheep, llamas, alpacas, deer, moose, elk, caribou and other ungulates is hard and when rendered is called tallow.
> Fat from pigs, bear, and rabbit is soft fat, and when rendered is called lard.
> ...



That is interesting, Snappy.  

Nav, no way to have good chopped liver w/o schmaltz.  That stuff is awesome.

Tea Leaves, for some reason I've seen a couple other references to cooking w/duck fat lately (as a flavor additive, not as the main oil).  Somewhere I got the impression it is very expensive and kind of hard to find.  Where do you get yours?


----------



## silverette (Sep 18, 2015)

Susie said:


> Which recipe, specifically?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


----------



## jade-15 (Sep 18, 2015)

silverette said:


> Susie said:
> 
> 
> > Which recipe, specifically?
> ...


----------



## TeaLeavesandTweed (Sep 18, 2015)

Seawolfe said:


> I see no harm in trying it out tomorrow - I cant believe you haven't been testing it all along! But it might well be even better in a couple more weeks or so. I typically start using my soaps at 4 weeks just because they are MY soaps and I CAN! Well, except for the castiles.



I mean, I licked them a couple times. That's like testing, right?

I kid. I saw the lather looked promising when I cleaned out my bowl a few days after making it, but figured I'd be patient and use up a bar a friend gave me while they cured. But I'll definitely try them out next weekend.



not_ally said:


> Tea Leaves, for some reason I've seen a couple other references to cooking w/duck fat lately (as a flavor additive, not as the main oil).  Somewhere I got the impression it is very expensive and kind of hard to find.  Where do you get yours?



I bought a 2-lb. tub of it from US Wellness Meats once when I wanted to buy some jerky and needed to make the minimum order, but my first experience was with fat rendered from a duck I cooked for Christmas dinner one year. It was a small-medium duck and gave me 2 cups of fat. Nice flavor. It was the trendy thing to do fries in a couple years ago. There's also a site called Fatworks that sells duck fat.


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## DeeAnna (Sep 18, 2015)

silverette said:


> I am looking for the 80% lard soap recipe that everyone seems to like.
> Thanks



Like I said in my previous post, no one has posted a detailed soap making recipe in this thread, just proportions of fats.

If one soaper suggests the basic proportions of fats to make a soap that she/he really likes, most of us are able to design our own soap recipe from just that information. 

Are you having trouble with this design process?


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## IrishLass (Sep 18, 2015)

DeeAnna said:


> My understanding is tallow comes from herbivore ungulates (hooved animals that eat only plants) and lard is from omnivorous ungulates (hooved animals that eat plant and animal foods -- pigs). I haven't seen rendered rabbit and bear fat also called lard, but maybe that's a more common usage in culinary circles?


 
That's always been my understanding, too- that lard is specifically/uniquely pig/hog fat, which makes sense because the word comes from the Latin word 'lardum', meaning 'bacon'. Mmmmmmm, lardum!  

I have one more week of cure to go on my own experimental high % lard soap with 66% lard. I can hardly wait, although I think my impatience might get the best of me today and I'll end up trying out the small bar that I formed by squishing my bevel scraps into a guest-size indy mold. I'll let y'all know what I think of it.


IrishLass


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## Dharlee (Sep 18, 2015)

So do you guys just buy lard from the grocery store? I have never made lard soap and have heard from others that it's amazing. I have some tallow on order but I found lard from walmart in a big bucket and wondered if that's ok to use?

Thanks! BTW going to introduce myself now!


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## afbrat (Sep 18, 2015)

Dharlee said:


> So do you guys just buy lard from the grocery store? I have never made lard soap and have heard from others that it's amazing. I have some tallow on order but I found lard from walmart in a big bucket and wondered if that's ok to use?
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks! BTW going to introduce myself now!




That's the lard I use


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## TeresaT (Sep 18, 2015)

I only know "schmaltz" as being as being sappy or ridiculously romantic.  Never knew schmaltz was chicken fat.  Eewwww.  I remember the old ladies saying about their husbands, "He might be a schmaltz, but he's MY schmaltz."  You mean all that time tgey were calling him chicken fat and not hopeless romantic?


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## debikers (Sep 22, 2015)

I made my first batch of lard soap the other day. What
A mess. I forgot
To add fragrance and I did put
Jasmine tea in my lye water. The color looks like baby poop and it's soft and wet feeling after 48 hours. Is this normal ( the soft
And wet part)? Also, I didn't cover it
With anything after
I got
Done. No towels or
Plastic wrap. Now it's lighter colored on top and dark brown on the center where I cut it. 
 I know it's a total flop, but it's my first
Batch of
Lard soap. Apparently my mind wasn't
In it. I shall have to try again only just
Do a basic recipe with no extras. I need to know how it handles before I use it and decide
Whether or
Not I like it. 

 just
Wanted to share


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## IrishBeautyUS (Sep 25, 2015)

I made my first batch of soap using bacon fat not too long ago. I only had about 3.5 oz so I had to add additional oils. I did a superfatting level of 3%, but I think next time I will go 2% because it gets a wee bit slimy when you wash your hands with it. Plus side is that it is super moisturizing. :razz: What superfatting levels have you used when making soap with bacon grease/lard?


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## rparrny (Sep 25, 2015)

TeaLeavesandTweed said:


> Unrelated to soap, but duck fat is liquid at warm-ish room temperature and can be used to make salad dressing. Really awesome salad dressing.




Yup, I was trained in french cooking and duck fat is the best for giving foods a really silky texture.  Once I started cooking kosher it was a lifesaver for me when I could no longer cook my meat in butter.  I wonder if duck fat would lend the same silkiness to soap?  Has anyone tried it?


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## The Efficacious Gentleman (Sep 26, 2015)

Okay, today I poured a wee batch of 80% lard, 15% co and 5% castor. Let's see what all the fuss is about.......


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## Susie (Sep 26, 2015)

I buy the lard from Walmart in the 4 lb tub.  Works fine.  BTW-you can mix soap in those tubs, so think twice before discarding.

I am making soap for several of the ladies I work with that all have eczema.  No specific allergies, just eczema.  If they like the soap, I will do a soapmaking lesson with/for them.  I am saving all those lard tubs and such for them to use.  I also gave them the link for this site.


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## PortlandSoaper (Oct 6, 2015)

I was going to make an 800 g batch today of 50% OO, 25% Lard, and 25%  CO... but then I read this thread and decided to try the 80% Lard, 20% CO. So far, I am totally impressed! I used 35% water. I wrapped it in blankets and was gone this evening. When I got home it was really hot, but I couldn't tell if it completely gelled. It is a really nice white color and it is firming up nicely! It looks like it will be ready to cut in the morning. It has a wonderful texture already. I am so glad I tried this combo. It isn't something I would have guessed to try on a whim. I will definitely be adding this recipe to my usuals. The lard is so inexpensive. It has just been as of recent that I started adding lard to my soaping oil choices. I really like it!

I combined four different fragrances and it smells delicious. No lard smell and it is still warm. I used almost equal parts of these to scent it: watermelon FO, sweet orange EO, pink grapefruit EO, and Green tea & Honey FO.
I also disolves 1 tablespoon of powdered sugar and 1 tablespoon of table salt in my hot lye water.
I have a dedicated 8 cup blender that I use for mixing 800 g batches  in. I love making these small batches in the blender! It traces quickly and makes really smooth and even batter.


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## Susie (Oct 6, 2015)

Don't be surprised if the EO scent sort of fades under the lardy scent while curing.  A quick hand wash or two will bring it right back.  High lard soaps seem to be the worst for the EO hiding during the cure.


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## Susie (Oct 6, 2015)

debikers said:


> I made my first batch of lard soap the other day. What
> A mess. I forgot
> To add fragrance and I did put
> Jasmine tea in my lye water. The color looks like baby poop and it's soft and wet feeling after 48 hours. Is this normal ( the soft
> ...



If you could post your entire recipe in weights (not percentages) we could troubleshoot it with you much better.


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## BlackDog (Oct 6, 2015)

Susie said:


> Don't be surprised if the EO scent sort of fades under the lardy scent while curing.  A quick hand wash or two will bring it right back.  High lard soaps seem to be the worst for the EO hiding during the cure.



ooh! thanks Susie, I had not heard this little tidbit.  I have my first high-lard batch curing right now and I was starting to feel bummed because I had found a dupe of my favorite long-discontinued B&BW scent to use with it, and it wasn't smelling very strong during cure.  Now I have reason to hope it will be back!


----------



## Susie (Oct 6, 2015)

It will be back.  Never you fear.  At least the EOs that are not citrus.  I am afraid you are probably going to lose the pink grapefruit EO.  Citrus EOs are notorious faders in CP.


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## BlackDog (Oct 6, 2015)

I should be ok.  It's Brown Sugar & Fig.  Yummo!


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## brandnew (Oct 6, 2015)

PortlandSoaper said:


> I also disolves 1 tablespoon of powdered sugar and 1 tablespoon of table salt in my hot lye water..



What a noonie! I have substituted pwd. sugar in my strawberries but have never considered it for making my soap! Duh! :-? Thank you!

lard is absolutely brilliant....it was my first ever bar and still a fav'


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## PortlandSoaper (Oct 6, 2015)

*Calling it "Paleo Soap" ~ My First batch of 80% Lard, 20% CO*

I have been soaping for about 4 years & I JUST recently started using Lard. Before this batch, I had made several batches using 25 and 30% lard. This thread inspired me to try the High lard batch. I am out of castor oil, or I would have done 75% lard, 20% CO, 5% castor.

Here is a picture of the bars cut from the small batch (800g) of 80% Lard, 20% coconut oil I made yesterday. I used a combination of FO'S and EO'S and it smells really nice. No lard smell at all. It makes and extremely white bar.

I will definitely be using high lard recipes moving forward. The results are really nice and the cost is awesome! It is going to be a long 4 weeks waiting to use it!

I'm thinking of calling high lard batches my "Paleo Soap"!

80% Lard
20% CO
Water 35%
Fragrance combo: Watermelon FO, Green tea & Honey FO, sweet orange EO, pink grapefruit EO
1 heaping Tablespoon of powdered sugar &
1 Tablespoon of table salt added to lye water


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## ngian (Oct 6, 2015)

It seems sweet as sugar! 

I will use a known quote from other soapers around here: "welcome to the Lardy side!"


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## The Efficacious Gentleman (Oct 8, 2015)

Okay, so this is from a bar which is only 11 days old -




I'm in love!


----------



## ngian (Oct 8, 2015)

Do you have hard water Craig?


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## The Efficacious Gentleman (Oct 8, 2015)

Fairly - but I use SC (well, CA and more lye) to help fight it. Considering this is less than 2 weeks old and it's cp, I think it's going to age to be rather nice


----------



## ngian (Oct 8, 2015)

Where is the bar though? We only see the smoke and not the fire


----------



## Susie (Oct 8, 2015)

The Efficacious Gentleman said:


> Fairly - but I use SC (well, CA and more lye) to help fight it. Considering this is less than 2 weeks old and it's cp, I think it's going to age to be rather nice



You have read about the wonders of lard soap all this time, and you are just getting around to trying it...


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## The Efficacious Gentleman (Oct 8, 2015)

Susie said:


> You have read about the wonders of lard soap all this time, and you are just getting around to trying it...



I know! All this time wasted.  Seriously, people - make this if you don't mind using animal fats



ngian said:


> Where is the bar though? We only see the smoke and not the fire



Those are being kept tightly under wraps.  Well, not literally, as I want them to cure..................


----------



## osso (Oct 8, 2015)

Oh, the things you miss when you don't read an entire thread!

Off to buy some lard.


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## DeeAnna (Oct 8, 2015)

I tested the one bar I still have from of a batch I made this past 10th of July. The theme of the soap was the wiry sweetgrass (Hierochloe odorata) that I've been growing and harvesting this summer from a planting I did last year.

The recipe is 75% lard, 20% coconut oil, 5% castor oil, 0.5% EDTA, 2% lye discount (superfat). Sweetgrass FO from Natures Garden -- this is a sweet herbal clean scent. (Real sweetgrass doesn't have an essential oil although you can make a hydrosol from it. Bottom line is I can't get any scent by using the real thing.) The blue-green color is an infusion of sweetgrass (buffalo grass) in distilled water. No other additives. The soap lathers really nicely in cool water, and I like how the FO is sticking well at 3 months out. 

The bar seems to be very slightly drying to my hands, but I could easily argue that the dryness is as much the fault of I do for a living as the soap. Working with dyes and solvents tends to keep my hands slightly dried out, so they're already on the edge of dryness when I wash up. 

I think I may try the same recipe this weekend except take 5% away from the coconut oil and give it back to the lard -- 80% lard, 15% CO, 5% castor -- and see how that does. Especially now that winter is coming, it might be good to have a lower myristic and lauric acid content for gentler cleansing, even if the lovely lather is affected a wee bit.


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## brandnew (Oct 8, 2015)

Do try a 100% lard bar....don't know how well lots of you hold onto bars but after making batch after batch of soap one tends to discover the odd forgotten bar and one of my 1 1/2 year old lard bars was heavenly!


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## DeeAnna (Oct 8, 2015)

I've done 90% and 100% lard. Like castile, it seems a pure or almost pure lard soap takes a longer time to show its full colors. I'm not particularly impatient, but I'd prefer most of my soaps to do reasonably well within a few months, and a modest dab of coconut and castor help a lot in that regard. Just me....


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## mandy318 (Oct 11, 2015)

The Efficacious Gentleman said:


> Okay, today I poured a wee batch of 80% lard, 15% co and 5% castor. Let's see what all the fuss is about.......



I just made a 2lbs batch with these proportions. I have used lard in all but one soap so far. I'm very excited to see how this turns out. 

Scented with WSP White Christmas, french green clay and nettle powder added to most of it for green color. Also 2 tbs ppo of sugar added to lye water. (Separated out some for a white top.)


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## Krystalbee (Oct 11, 2015)

I have never had any interest incorporating lard in my soap recipe. To be honest I always kind of wrinkled my nose at the idea   I see now that I must simply try using lard because so many people on this forum have raved about. Can't wait for my next day off!


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## TeaLeavesandTweed (Oct 13, 2015)

Has anyone noticed slime from high-lard soaps? My 80% lard, 20% CO soap is lovely and has nice bubbly lather that feels very creamy, too, but sometimes the creaminess edges into slimy territory. I mean, it doesn't not make sense, since lard is high in monounsaturated fats like olive oil is, but has anyone else noticed this? Or could this just be the scummy feel that some get from lard?


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## Obsidian (Oct 13, 2015)

No, I have never noticed slime from lard, not even my 100% bars. Lard does make a really slick bar for me though.


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## Susie (Oct 13, 2015)

TeaLeavesandTweed said:


> Has anyone noticed slime from high-lard soaps? My 80% lard, 20% CO soap is lovely and has nice bubbly lather that feels very creamy, too, but sometimes the creaminess edges into slimy territory. I mean, it doesn't not make sense, since lard is high in monounsaturated fats like olive oil is, but has anyone else noticed this? Or could this just be the scummy feel that some get from lard?



Not me, either.  How old is your bar?


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## TeaLeavesandTweed (Oct 14, 2015)

Susie said:


> Not me, either.  How old is your bar?



Not old. About 6 weeks. Could just be young soap.


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## DeeAnna (Oct 14, 2015)

My high lard soaps do feel slick and smooth when they're wet -- especially if the soap doesn't go through gel as happens when I pour any extra batter into a small individual bar molds. But I don't perceive that as slime. What is slime to me is when a soap forms a rope of goo when I press a fingertip into the wet soap and gently pull it away. Or when I wash my hands with the soap and it forms a ropy scant lather until I add more water to loosen it so it can foam better. The ropes of lather are sticky and gooey -- another word is slimy.


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## ngian (Oct 14, 2015)

It's all about the perception of everyone while bathing. My 75% lard 25% PKO 5% castor soap that has cured for 6 months, feels like it it produces lather on my body that is very waxy, silky and slippery. Maybe the wax feeling is also due to PKO.

I think I feel the same with lard before saponifying it. It has a waxy, silky and slippery texture both as an oil and as a soap when it lathers.


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## Hippy-Nerds-Wife (Oct 14, 2015)

*Lardy, Lardy, Lardy!*

My very first Soap was 100% Lard with 0% Superfat.   It was for my friend who has more allergies than digits!  I used it to make her some of my Laundry Soap and gave her a bar as a stain stick.  

She got lather on her hands (from the bar/stain stick), liked it so much she used the rest as a hand soap! And asked me for more! Scentless/chemical free/colorless soap is both expensive and hard to find locally!  So started my soaping journey.  I am both richer and poorer as a result! But very happy!


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## yinepu (Oct 14, 2015)

I've read through the thread and it seems that most of you are superfatting your lard recipes pretty low (2% for example). Is there a reason why? I've never made lard soap before; but I have made soap from other oils and I usually superfat those recipes around 5 to 7%. 
I have lard on hand, just need to order out some of the Sodium citrate or Tetrasodium EDTA before I make a batch.


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## DeeAnna (Oct 14, 2015)

Use whatever superfat makes you happy. Those of us who superfat at the lower end of the typical range happen to like the results we get, but we're not by any means saying our choice of superfat is the only right solution for every soap and every soaper.

There is one basic safety reason for using a slight superfat and that is to ensure the soap is not lye heavy. But some of us have learned that lye heaviness is not the "kiss of death" for a soap, if it's otherwise properly made. Moderate lye heaviness (as much as -5%) will completely dissipate in a properly-made soap during a typical 4-8 week cure time.

A lot of soaps contain a higher superfat than needed just for safety. The extra fat is thought to increase the "conditioning" property of the soap so the skin is less likely to become irritated or dried out by the soap. I'm not convinced a higher superfat is the only way to ensure a soap is mild and non-irritating. If I carefully choose fats that make mild soap to begin with, then I don't need a higher superfat to ensure mildness -- the soap is already gentle enough.

I also think there are downsides to a superfat that is higher than necessary -- a higher superfat can cut lather, can increase the chance of DOS (rancidity), and can make soap softer. These are all good reasons to not use a higher superfat than is needed for a particular soap. 

If I were to make a 100% coconut oil soap for bathing, would I use a high superfat? You betcha! 

Do I use a high superfat in a soap with a high % of lard? Nope. It's mild enough already.


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## JayJay (Oct 14, 2015)

I agree with what DeeAnna said. Also, I believe that my lard soaps with 5% superfat leave a gross greasy residue in my tub. I think that it is more than just scum. It's like scum sealed under a layer of oil. It actually takes a fair amount of elbow grease to scrub it off of my tub floor. I am thinking about reducing my superfat to 3% to see if it helps the problem. I'm not sure if anyone else has had this issue.


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## yinepu (Oct 15, 2015)

JayJay said:


> I agree with what DeeAnna said. Also, I believe that my lard soaps with 5% superfat leave a gross greasy residue in my tub. I think that it is more than just scum. It's like scum sealed under a layer of oil. It actually takes a fair amount of elbow grease to scrub it off of my tub floor. I am thinking about reducing my superfat to 3% to see if it helps the problem. I'm not sure if anyone else has had this issue.



JayJay, do you have hard water? I'm wondering if that adds to the issue of greasy residue or not. We have extremely hard well water (TDS of over 5k), so it always makes me wonder just what effect that has on the soaps other than increased soap scum


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## yinepu (Oct 15, 2015)

DeeAnna said:


> Use whatever superfat makes you happy. Those of us who superfat at the lower end of the typical range happen to like the results we get, but we're not by any means saying our choice of superfat is the only right solution for every soap and every soaper.
> 
> There is one basic safety reason for using a slight superfat and that is to ensure the soap is not lye heavy. But some of us have learned that lye heaviness is not the "kiss of death" for a soap, if it's otherwise properly made. Moderate lye heaviness (as much as -5%) will completely dissipate in a properly-made soap during a typical 4-8 week cure time.
> 
> ...



Ah... now see, the only lard soap I ever used was made by my grandmother back in the 60's. She still used the wood ash method and her lard soaps would eat the paint off a car (well, not quite that bad.. but you get the idea). So I've never had the pleasure to try a GOOD bar of lard soap. I'll try my recipe at a 2% superfat for the first batch and see how that does with our well water. 
Thanks for the info!


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## DeeAnna (Oct 15, 2015)

I would also consider adding a chelator to your recipe to reduce the amount of soap scum that forms in your hard water. Many people use sodium citrate and some of us use tetrasodium EDTA. Both work well. 

I've provided info about how to use citrate and EDTA in other threads on SMF, but I'm also collecting this information on my own website so it's all in one place and easier to find -- click the link at the bottom of this post.


----------



## yinepu (Oct 15, 2015)

DeeAnna said:


> I would also consider adding a chelator to your recipe to reduce the amount of soap scum that forms in your hard water. Many people use sodium citrate and some of us use tetrasodium EDTA. Both work well.
> 
> I've provided info about how to use citrate and EDTA in other threads on SMF, but I'm also collecting this information on my own website so it's all in one place and easier to find -- click the link at the bottom of this post.



I ordered both yesterday!


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## quiltertoo (Oct 29, 2015)

After reading several pages of this thread I made a batch of lard soap. 75% lard, 20% coconut oil and 5% castor. 5% superfat. It is finally cured  and I am using my first bar. I really like this soap. The lather feels so rich and creamy. The only thing I will do differently next time is add sugar. I add sugar to every batch but somehow forgot to add it to this batch. I miss those big bubbles. 

Mary Lou


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## mymy (Oct 30, 2015)

quiltertoo said:


> After reading several pages of this thread I made a batch of lard soap. 75% lard, 20% coconut oil and 5% castor. 5% superfat. It is finally cured  and I am using my first bar. I really like this soap. The lather feels so rich and creamy. The only thing I will do differently next time is add sugar. I add sugar to every batch but somehow forgot to add it to this batch. I miss those big bubbles.
> 
> Mary Lou



Does is smell?


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## quiltertoo (Oct 30, 2015)

Do you mean does it smell like lard ? No, no lard smell. I did scent it with French Lavender and Honey. Just a light scent and it is lovely.

Mary Lou


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## mymy (Oct 30, 2015)

Cuz I try to avoid fragrance oil as much as possible. I have super sensitive skin :'( Will lard make sensitive skin goes outrage?


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## Obsidian (Oct 30, 2015)

Lard is great for sensitive skin. Some people are quite sensitive to the piggy smell and a really high amount of lard may be detectable by some, I can smell it at 80% but not 50%. My go to recipe has 50% lard and even unscented, it just smells soapy.


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## mymy (Oct 30, 2015)

I can use beef tallow instead to replace lard? Or do they have different properties? Soap made by animal fats are safe on facial skin?


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## Obsidian (Oct 30, 2015)

You can but lard makes a better soap then tallow, its gentler and creamier. Yes, animal fats are safe on skin, in fact they are quite nice. I like high lard better then just about any other oil in a gentle facial bar.


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## kisha (Oct 30, 2015)

I've discovered that soaping while tired is a I tried making a salt brine 80% lard bar and added double the salt to the water. Needless to say, I had to strain out the excess salt but so far it's really nice. I scented it with rosemary and spearmint. Even with my blunder, I can tell that this is going to be a staple recipe for me!


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## The Efficacious Gentleman (Nov 19, 2015)

To update, this is currently my shower bar and, as a short-haired chap, I use it as shampoo.  It is really quite good for that!  As well as being a generally lovely bar, of course.


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## leilaninoel (Nov 19, 2015)

So, curious - I read that salt kills lather, thus the high CO use in Salt bars. For salt brine bars, is that less of an issue? Or does the 80% lard bar just not lather as much?


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## silverette (Mar 10, 2016)

*80% lard, 15% coconut oil, and 5% castor oil*

We made this soap last Saturday for the first time and my husband (the soapmaker) had a couple questions:

1)With those percentages what percent would the lye and water be?  ie. when making soap the ingredients are by weight so my question is how much lye and how much water would I use with the 80, 15, 5 recipe?

Also, he took out of mold and they appear chalky and fall apart easily.

Any ideas?  

Thank you


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## DeeAnna (Mar 10, 2016)

Hi, Silverette -- Mostly we don't say much about lye and water, because those depend on the preference of each soaper -- what superfat and what lye concentration each person likes best. I know some websites and books specify everything in the recipe, but that limits you to only what the book author or website owner thinks is best -- and that's not always a good idea. Even when everything is spelled out, it's a wise thing to always, always run the recipe through a soap recipe calculator to make sure there is no typo or other mistake -- if you don't double check someone else's recipe, you run the risk making a batch of bad or unsafe soap.

If you have never used a recipe calc, then now may be a good time to consider learning. It's not hard to do once you've tried it a time or two and it will be a huge help in your soaping to be able to do these calculations. Here's a link to a tutorial for SoapCalc: http://www.soapmakingforum.com/showthread.php?t=49627

To figure the lye and water for YOUR version of the 80-15-5 recipe, you would put the percentages of the fats into the calculator, choose a total weight for the fats, set the superfat to your desired amount (the default is usually 5%, but typical range is 3% to 8%), and choose your preferred lye concentration ("full water" is about 28%, but typical range is 28% to 33% lye concentration). Once all that is set, then let the calculator figure out the amount of lye and water. 

As far as the soap you made looking chalky and falling apart -- we need to know the specific weights of everything in your recipe and how you made the soap. Without good information, it's nearly impossible to give good advice. Also a picture would help to show exactly what you mean.


----------



## silverette (Mar 11, 2016)

Thank you very much DeeAnna for your input and advice


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## noodle (Mar 20, 2016)

Thanks for the inspiration... I'm very keen to try my own lard based soap after my first foray into soap making a few months ago (goats milk). 
Would this sort of recipe be possible to make without a thermometer? It's late summer here and my CO is liquid at room temperature - was wondering if I could use the heat from the lye solution to melt the lard?


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## Susie (Mar 20, 2016)

noodle said:


> Thanks for the inspiration... I'm very keen to try my own lard based soap after my first foray into soap making a few months ago (goats milk).
> Would this sort of recipe be possible to make without a thermometer? It's late summer here and my CO is liquid at room temperature - was wondering if I could use the heat from the lye solution to melt the lard?



I never use a thermometer.  If it is winter, and my house is too cool, I melt my solid oils.  If it is summer, and my house is 76 degrees (25 C) or more, I use the heat from the newly mixed lye water to melt my oils.  If your house is warm enough to have your CO liquid at room temperature, it is warm enough to use the heat transfer method.  But if you choose to use cool lye water, melt your lard first.


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## Arimara (Mar 20, 2016)

Susie said:


> I never use a thermometer.  If it is winter, and my house is too cool, I melt my solid oils.  If it is summer, and my house is 76 degrees (25 C) or more, I use the heat from the newly mixed lye water to melt my oils.  If your house is warm enough to have your CO liquid at room temperature, it is warm enough to use the heat transfer method.  But if you choose to use cool lye water, melt your lard first.



I use a thermometer to help be determine when to pour my lye solution. After that, I get lazy with it mostly. :mrgreen:


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## noodle (Mar 24, 2016)

Thanks for your help everyone...
I made my soap Monday afternoon, the temp had dropped about 5 degrees so I did help my lard along to get it more liquid. I also cooled the lye water a little before adding it.

80% Lard
15% CO
5% Castor oil

5% SF
175g water
70g Lye

2 tsp sugar in lye water

EO 60% Sandalwood and 40% Neroli

I mixed by hand at first but was taking a while, so got the hand blender out to bring it to a light trace. It stayed relatively runny even after adding the oils.
I wrapped it up warmly ( wasn't sure it needed help to gel ) 
Checked on it the next day, it set up enough to cut but still soft enough to leave fingerprints. There was also a layer of 'sweat' on top? Not sure if it's a problem... Pretty happy with the lather and the scent so far!


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## LisaAnne (Mar 26, 2016)

I didn't want to start a new post, so I will ask here. I've been upping my lard as you all suggest, thank you very much by the way, I've learned so much here and my soap is definitely improving. Everyone is patient and generous with your knowledge. I have a slow moving recipe I believe for a wood grain soap I'm going to attempt. I read that sugar can speed things up, what I'm wondering is if anyone still adds their sugar for bubbles. I'd hate to leave it out, but I will.  I guess what I'm asking is if I should use all water with no additives.


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## Susie (Mar 26, 2016)

I use 1 teaspoon of sugar PPO in most soaps.  I just like lots of bubbles, and I like not using much CO.  You can do one batch with sugar and one without, so that then you will know which one you prefer.


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## LisaAnne (Mar 26, 2016)

Susie said:


> I use 1 teaspoon of sugar PPO in most soaps.  I just like lots of bubbles, and I like not using much CO.  You can do one batch with sugar and one without, so that then you will know which one you prefer.



Thank you Susie, I use less than 15% coconut and I also love my bubbles. So I will keep the sugar in.


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