# Other vendors copying your products



## soapsydaisy

I recently started selling in a few markets for the summer. Even though selling soap is new to me (I have been making soap for 3 years) I have a lot of experience selling other things at farmers markets. I was very upset and caught off guard when I noticed that another vendor was copying my products. I lost it when she posted on the markets FB page that she was making a soap that looks just like our signature soap with the same fragrance. She often walks into my booth acting friendly but she is checking out our "goods". She isn't even exclusively soap, she sells mostly trinkets from other countries. Have any of you had this happen to you? How did you handle it?

On an angry little side note, I checked out her FB page and noticed she sold her 1st batch of soap! The whole situation makes me so mad


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## kharmon320

Personally, I think this will happen and there's not much to do about it.  Instead of getting angry, just figure out how you can "market" your product better.  I always believe that in the long run karma will bite the copycats in the butt.  (It might take a really long time, but I still believe it will happen. )

Do you have anything posted on the markets FB page?  If not, get on it!


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## pamielynn

It is frustrating, but if you have superior product, customers will be back for yours, not hers. I have a vendor next to me that sells soap alongside her farm products - the packaging is fun (and expensive) so a lot of people are drawn to hers. I've bought from her and her soap SUCKS. I hate to say that, but it does. I've spoken to a couple of people who have bought her soap and they say they won't buy from her again. Repeat customers are your goal - so just sit back knowing that most likely customers will realize the difference. Plus, start heavy sampling of your product - that wins people over 

As for her copying - if you think you can prove you started making that particular bar before she did, send her a cease & desist.


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## meeplesoap

You could always add a line to your packaging - "the original XYZ soap!" Whatever you do, don't talk disparagingly about her or her products to your potential customers. Even if it's true, it still doesn't come across as professional.


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## soapsydaisy

I plan on remaining professional. I am trying to stay positive. I was thinking about making a sign about our products saying something along these lines, "We have perfected our soap recipes over three years and hundreds of batches." My husband wants me to promote the fact that I am member of the Soap Guild.

 In the future, I am not going to announce new soaps on our FB until they are packaged and ready to take to the market.


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## Mommysoaper

Sounds incredibly frustrating for you.  At my farmer's market there is a lady that sells goat milk soap along with beef from her farm.  ( I only make one or two soaps with goat milk and my soaps are a different style so I felt ok applying for a spot) Her soap is pretty basic and not fancy, but I'm sure it's fine.  haven't gotten a chance to try it myself, but hope to pick some up after I'm done with the stash I have at home already.  About a month ago at market, I noticed another lady was selling some soaps along with her baked bread goods.  I was a bit disappointed.  I had known about the goat milk soap lady when I applied to the market, but didn't know there was another soaper.  I was worried it would affect my sales especially since I was new to the market.  Being a military family, I always seem to be the "newbie" trying to get into markets and shows.  Anyway, my sales have been steadily increasing each week and I have received many compliments and repeat customers.  I am thankful and it proves that there are enough customers for all of the soapers at the market!  I hope things work out for you!


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## nebetmiw

If all she is copying is the scent or color there is not much you can do.  I do not think she can copy your soap recipe but she can use same ingredents.  Advertising you are a member of the Guild is good and not posting on FB is better for your new soaps till they have hit the market.  Having a special soap each week which is not of your normal scents would help also.  

Another note copying you is the highest form of flattery.  Look at this way she thinks your soap is better than hers.


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## Sweetums

*CopyCats*

I may be new to Soap, but man do I have experience with those trying to out do me at the Wedding Shows (when I was doing Cakes). 

I have to agree with Nebetmiw, make it a positive experience and take it as "The highest form of Flattery".  Your husband is right! Advertise how long you've been making Soap.  And whatever you do don't point her out or talk about her in any way.  Allow your soaps/customer service to standout and speak for itself, you will out do her in the "Right" way (which won't be her way!)

Long story short, I had a Big (well known bakery (in my area) ask me to make flowers for them, (that means they sell my art and put their name on it!) I said "No thanks!"  Their response:  2 owners stood in front of me (while I was doing Demos in the entrance of my Booth) in an attempt to block the view of prospective customers!   

Although it was frustrating, it was also VERY flattering to think such a well established Big Bakery was threatened by Me!  I waited until people were 4 deep, than I put on a smile and called them by name  and told them it was not necessary to watch me, because I would come do a "FREE DEMO" at "their Shop". When the crowd realized what they were trying to do, things changed.

If she is frequenting your booth, it's because hers is not getting enough attention.  Put a smile on your face and ask her how business is going at her booth.  People in your booth will see you as friendly and  unthreatened and at the same time, they will see her for who she is!

Best of luck, let us know how it goes.


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## Kleine Teufel

Some people just stink. There's another soaper here, we often do the same shows, but it has never come to that! She stops at my booth every time, and I try to make it to her's, but in a friendly manner. We've become "show friends" and get along great, even though technically we're competing.


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## OrganicGirl

There is no replacement for true experience.  I have been there where I thought I could just make a bunch of  soap and go out there an sell, sell, sell!  Oh, and I did sell A Lot of soap because It was awesome, but..... I must say, my inexperience caught up with me when I ventured away from some recipes I found in a book and decided I wasn't sure how I liked them and became concerned about the organgutangs and the rain forest and so on and so forth. I also wasn't satisfied because I got my recipes from a book.  Yea, they worked but they weren't mine......  And just remember, your competiter will be thinking this very same stuff, if they are a true soaper!  But if they are only in it for the money, you will win every time!!!  So, don't worry because you are true.  And they are only temporary.


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## MaitriBB

Kleine Teufel said:


> Some people just stink. There's another soaper here, we often do the same shows, but it has never come to that! She stops at my booth every time, and I try to make it to her's, but in a friendly manner. We've become "show friends" and get along great, even though technically we're competing.


 
Same here.  There's four of us in the area.  One only makes vanilla and honey based soaps, so that's fine.  The other two make all natural using all vegan ingredients and all essential oils, so that's fine.  Then I make the more swirly, colorful, glittery, goat milk soaps.  I think I'm the only GM soaper around for now.  I try to maintain friendly relations with the other soapers - we're people first, competitors second.


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## savonierre

People that do that do not seem to last long, selling soap is not a get rich quick business by any stretch..They will tire of it and you will still be going strong..


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## squigglz

I had a soaper trying to get my scent blends out of me this weekend at a show >.< So annoying. Just know that your product is superior, and unless she has the same ratio of EVERYTHING, it's not going to be right.


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## Stakie

I feel like I am the oddball out. I use to sell soap awhile ago and plan to again in the future. I never cared how many people started to sell soaps after I was doing it. I actually have went to a few booths and bought their soaps, even though I have more than enough to suit any need I have. I enjoy my business, but I also like supporting others who do it.


Now to get back on topic, if she did copy you that's a big no-no. If you are in a farmers market you could also talk to the manager. It's very unprofessional to steal someone elses idea. However it will probably cause confrontation, which is a bad thing. I think some really good suggestions have been made already. Kill her with kindness is always the best way to go about things IMHO.


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## SlickerySoaps

I'm having an issue like this as well...but it's from two of my friends.  My friends started making jams and jellies.  We would work the local crafting shows setting up beside each other.  Then they got it in their head to start making similar products as mine, such as lotions and scrubs.  What the heck?  Now, I understand there is more than enough business for all of us, but I just find it in poor taste.  When I shared my concerns with one of them, she couldn't understand why I was feeling stepped on.  She thinks they are making different products because her's are "all natural".  What does she think I put in mine, plastic?  I do not market myself as all natural because I do use fragrance oils at times, but for the most part, I use essential oils.  Gah!


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## Nightlilly

If she is till selling jams and jellies as well as soap out of the same booth. I wouldn't worry about it too much. If I want to buy soaps from someone and I see 2 vendors, one who JUST sells body products and one who sells a small portion of body products as well as other things. I'm going to check out the first vendor first because I feel they'd spend more effort on those products. I do have to say it is in bad taste to start selling the same items when she knows you'll be setting up right next to each other.


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## neeners

I agree with all that has been said.  kill the other soaper with kindness, and win because you have a superior product.  I haven't sold anything, but from a consumer's standpoint, I prefer a higher quality product.  I have, will, and continue to spend more on quality made goods.  keep fighting the good fight!


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## SlickerySoaps

Nightlilly said:


> If she is till selling jams and jellies as well as soap out of the same booth. I wouldn't worry about it too much. If I want to buy soaps from someone and I see 2 vendors, one who JUST sells body products and one who sells a small portion of body products as well as other things. I'm going to check out the first vendor first because I feel they'd spend more effort on those products. I do have to say it is in bad taste to start selling the same items when she knows you'll be setting up right next to each other.



Yep, she sure is.


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## Robert

pamielynn said:


> It is frustrating, but if you have superior product, customers will be back for yours, not hers. I have a vendor next to me that sells soap alongside her farm products - the packaging is fun (and expensive) so a lot of people are drawn to hers. I've bought from her and her soap SUCKS. I hate to say that, but it does. I've spoken to a couple of people who have bought her soap and they say they won't buy from her again. Repeat customers are your goal - so just sit back knowing that most likely customers will realize the difference. Plus, start heavy sampling of your product - that wins people over
> 
> As for her copying - if you think you can prove you started making that particular bar before she did, send her a cease & desist.


Which can easily be ignored.  What exactly was being copied?  A name?  If not a name, there would have to be something so distinctive and not useful about yours that it would constitute a trademark for you to have a legal interest in it.  (I'm assuming there's no design patent involved!)


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## MaitriBB

squigglz said:


> I had a soaper trying to get my scent blends out of me this weekend at a show >.< So annoying. Just know that your product is superior, and unless she has the same ratio of EVERYTHING, it's not going to be right.


 
I'd be tempted to give her some nasty combos rather than the real ones.  Vanilla Oregano anyone?


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## soapsydaisy

Update - Today she came up and started asking me questions about salt bars. I was busy at the time so I didn't talk to her. I still don't know why she feels the need to come into my booth, I never go near hers.


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## pamielynn

Don't feel bad; they're everywhere. I got a new girl at my FM, of course selling "natural and organic" melt and pour soaps. She started thumbing through my samples yesterday. This is after quizzing me endlessly about what's in my soap. Go AWAY!!


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## squyars

Nightlilly said:


> If she is till selling jams and jellies as well as soap out of the same booth. I wouldn't worry about it too much. If I want to buy soaps from someone and I see 2 vendors, one who JUST sells body products and one who sells a small portion of body products as well as other things. I'm going to check out the first vendor first because I feel they'd spend more effort on those products. I do have to say it is in bad taste to start selling the same items when she knows you'll be setting up right next to each other.



I'm with you.  I would definitely respect and trust the vendor who only had one product line, than one who tries to dabble in several different products.  Makes me think they don't really know enough of one thing to make enough money on it.

Good luck!


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## savonierre

IME people like that are not there for the long haul, they lack imagination and are basically lazy, they fizzle out soon enough and you will still be going strong.


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## MOGal70

Personally, if she were to come in and ask me questions while I was waiting on customers, I would smile and say "I have worked hard to perfect my products and the information you are asking for would be considered a trade secret."


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## cmzaha

LOL, I actually had a fella that was selling soap at the same venue as me that asked me what was my best selling fragrance. I laughed and asked him if he was kidding and he said no. We actually got along quite well during the 2 dayer, but I never gave him the name of my best seller. You just cannot stop someone from copying fragrances when they can go buy the fragrance. The only advantage is they do not know your supplier and as we all know FO varies widely. All you can do is make your product better and try to come up with new ideas. My Friday market has a new soaper selling and she likes my plumeria, I chuckle to myself because she is just a few booths from my supplier of that particular fragrance. I wish you well Soapdaisy because I find the FM's suck around here these days. There has been a considerable decrease in sales in the last 1.5 yrs. Yep I am also So CA  Make exceptional soap and spend the time building your customer base. I have outlasted several soapers in my market


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## freesia792

That is a problem. One I've wondered about with sharing recipes too (if a person is in business - I'm not). I hope to one day, but certainly I am not experienced enough to do that yet. I liked the suggestion you got about "the original xyz".


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## eleraine

I had people copy my ideas, my marketing style, etc. I have also had people ask me for my supplier contacts or to share shipping (when I next order stuff from that supplier) - mainly because I use expensive oils (for where I am) in my soaps - or I got a pretty good deal on some of my stuff (organic, etc). The former (ideas and marketing style) I can't control but the latter, sorry, but I can't tell you everything. I worked hard to get these contacts.

I have seen some stuff on FB and Etsy whereby they do not disclose the full ingredients list and if you want it, you'll have to buzz the seller for more info. Would that be a better idea (for those selling online)?


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## cmzaha

As for her copying - if you think you can prove you started making that particular bar before she did, send her a cease & desist.[/QUOTE]

Cease & desist what? Making a soap with a fragrance we can all buy, using the same combo of oils, etc, there is nothing you can do. I have a soap I make I would love to have the funds for FDA approval and market as a drug, but realistically what little guy that affrod that. I know and my customers that buy it know they cannot find an exact duplicate of my formula. My loyal users of this soap are actually afraid to try anything else and always ask if it the sam, but I simply cannot stop anyone from trying to sell a bar that they tried to make like this one. 
You just have to have good marketing and a way to get customers to return to your booth. I have done a 2 weekend holiday craft fair that has had up to 4 soapmakers, two of us return for both the spring and fall shows. I actually buy soap from the other gal because she uses a fragrance I do not buy and I simply love the fo. If I have a customer wanting a particular fragance and I know she has it I send them to her and she does the same. You can usually tell if you are not going to sell them a soap if they want a particular fragrance or eo combination. Many times I see people that have bought my soap go outside and buy her soaps also. It just works for both of us and we have outlasted anyother soapmakers that try coming into this market. 
Market, Market, Market is the key along with Fantastic customer service. Very few of my customers walk away without a freebie. In our area of So Ca competition is everywhere since so many are just trying to make money to survive. I cannot fault anyone for trying to make money I just have to make and sell better!


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## DeeAnna

"...they do not disclose the full ingredients list and if you want it, you'll have to buzz the seller for more info. Would that be a better idea (for those selling online)?..."

IMO, no. Hiding basic information is a tactic that tends to discourage customers as much or more than it discourages copycats -- most customers won't ask, unless they are super motivated. If you're in the biz to sell, then copycats are a fact of life that one just has to live with. 

In my business (not bath & body), I've had to grit my teeth about people who have not only copied my designs in detail, but also copied information directly from my website and passed my writing off as their own. 

My conclusions after 12+ years of running a successful business, both online and off, is that it's best to just ignore the copycats. I also try to keep in mind that a good product, whether soap or something else, is not only about the specific materials used, but also about the proportions and the style in which the materials are used; the packaging and promotion of the products; the level of customer service; and the personality and goals of the maker.


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## lisamaliga

DeeAnna,
Do you have this banner or button on your website?
http://copyscape.com/


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## DeeAnna

No, I do not, Lisa. Thank you for the tip -- I will follow up on that. I checked your link out to see if anyone is doing any wholesale copying of my website. Boy was that ever easy!

I learned that no one has copied my website pages ... and that is typical of what I've seen in the past. My main competitor for the past 5 or so years (and now out of business as of this summer!) liked to plagiarize a few paragraphs that suited his needs, change a few words, and pad around my writing with his own stuff. That is also true of the eBay sellers who copy from my website.


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## eleraine

DeeAnna said:


> IMO, no. Hiding basic information is a tactic that tends to discourage customers as much or more than it discourages copycats -- most customers won't ask, unless they are super motivated.



That's true. I kept looking at it from a customer's view point. What do I like when I shop for something? People like to have all the info at hand and in every business, copycats are normal. 

I do believe, that in my country at the moment, the pie is big enough for everyone and we aren't exactly original ourselves. Our ideas came from somewhere but were tweaked over time. If the product is good, people will come back and that's what you're aiming for - return/repeat customers.


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## Atihcnoc

I can imagine that will be frustrated, but one thing you have is the original formula, so if somebody want to copy your product, maybe can be as close as the person imagine but never be as good as the original.

If your product is good, the clients will try and buy it again and again and again, I believe maybe the other person can copy how your product looks but not how it will feel when been used.

Good luck!


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## My Mountain Soaps

I agree with all the others, kill her with kindness, be firm but professional with her when she asks questions, but i will add one more thing, and you will see amazing things happen- pray for her that the Lord will do His will in both of your lives


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## hodders

I've got the same problem where I am
I asked for a crockpot on a free add site for my first attempt at hp soap. I was gifted and as a way of saying thank you. I gave her a few bars of cp soap that I had made..... Now she as started to sell soap which she states she hand made. Which is a lie as she keeps emailing me asking me how much for this soap and that soap.....it niggles me that she as acted in this way .


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## Atihcnoc

Hodders:

You can take advantage of the situation, start making business with her, ask your price for the soaps, and sell it to her but with a very good price, a fair price!!

Or, ignore her and close your eyes to the opportunity of making business with your soaps. 

Just think about it!


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## The Efficacious Gentleman

Atihcnoc said:


> Hodders:
> 
> You can take advantage of the situation, start making business with her, ask your price for the soaps, and sell it to her but with a very good price, a fair price!!
> 
> Or, ignore her and close your eyes to the opportunity of making business with your soaps.
> 
> Just think about it!


 
Agree - There is a potential reseller here.  Of course, the lying about who made it is annoying to say the least, but if you're getting your fee for the product and she is marking up, then these customers aren't finding you (or they'd buy at your price, or her marketing is better!) so you're not really losing anything.

For the OP, how much information did you give her?  List of ingredients on the pack includes % or just a list?  If she knows enough to mix the same proportions, or there abouts, then fair enough.  

Keep innovating - while you are offering new things to the market, she's playing catchup


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## lisamaliga

The Efficacious Gentleman said:


> Keep innovating - while you are offering new things to the market, she's playing catchup



Efficacious Gentleman said it very well. Couldn't agree more!


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## SoapMakingTommy

Personally i wouldnt want somone stealing my ideas, but when it comes to soap i think there's some limitations, But dont get me wrong, There is so many possibility's out there, one shouldn't have the need to copy someone else. 
Marketing and putting the love into your product and being determined, You wont go far if you dont have the determination or passion for what you do. Got to have a strong heart and stick by your product's.


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## Cutter

Or you could realize this is just how business is done. Pick a market, any market. Look at the number of competitors doing the same thing with only the slightest of variation. Companies "borrow" from each other all the time.

There's a reason you can't secure rights to scents and colours. And what is anyone doing that isn't an innovation built on something someone else was doing before them? Most of you wouldn't even be making soap if you didn't start off by learning other recipes and techniques from other people. So calling other people crooks for doing what you've done is rather hypocritical. Like Ecclesiastes says, "There is nothing new under the sun." So either grow a thicker skin - because it happens and will keep happening, and in fact the more successful you get the more it'll happen - or find another line of work. Do you think those farmers get mad at each other because other people are selling the same product? Conversely, the easy thing to do would find a different circuit to work entirely. So you know if said person is going to be at ABC show, go work XYZ market instead. It's not like there aren't other options or choices.


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## cmzaha

I have to fully agree with Cutter on this one. I really do not worry about new soapers in my markets, it just makes me have a better product. Very seldom do I run into actual competition. I do have a craft fair I do twice a year that will have up to 5 soap sellers one being my direct competition since she is as well known as me in these craft fairs. We solved the problem by not having the same fragrances, and we will send customers to each other . We feel we should not both lose a sale if we know the other has what the customer wants. LOL, we do not send out to the other newbie sellers! It is a tough market and takes a lot of fortitude to stick it out. If you have no competition it is easy to become complacent


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## The Efficacious Gentleman

I agree with some of what Cutter said.  I think the way it was said is like using a baseball bat when someone asks you to scratch an itch, though!

There is a big difference, however, between people developing products based on existing ideas and out-and-out copying.  All of the major car manufacturers, for example, have very similar cars in each class of car - but they aren't exactly the same.  In the instance of the OP, a competitor saw her new product and then the next moment suddenly had a "new" product that was exactly the same. 

That's not development, innovation or working on a theme - it's a direct copy from someone who a) didn't have the ability to think of it originally and b) didn't have the ability to develop it slightly for her own use.

I'm pretty certain that there are comparatively few combinations in soap making that have yet to be tried that will actually prove popular, so of course there is going to be overlap.  But my very first soap was not copied from a recipe from this forum or anywhere else.  But as it is a pretty basic 3 oil mix, I'm willing to put good money on the fact that someone, somewhere, has produced the same soap at some point in the past.  The duplication happened, but was not a case of me spying out what a competitor was doing and then just making the same thing.

There is no place for that in ANY market and, as you can see with apple, google, samsung et al, there are many cases where 'duplication' is chased down and beaten till it whimpers.


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## eyeroll

Cutter said:


> So calling other people crooks for doing what you've done is rather hypocritical. Like Ecclesiastes says, "There is nothing new under the sun." So either grow a thicker skin - because it happens and will keep happening, and in fact the more successful you get the more it'll happen - or find another line of work.




EG: Eh, he's just providing a public service by forcing us all to grow a thicker skin!


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## Miz Jenny

Duplication is inevitable. How you "sell" your business is not. I love educating my customers about the benefits of using natural handmade soaps and body products. I rarely sit or stand behind a table and I talk to everyone who goes by. It's up to you to bring business to your table then your products should sell themselves. You must be better than competitors at selling yourself. I see new soapers starting because "it's fun to make soap." When they discover it's not always fun and is, in fact, hard work, they fall by the wayside. Be better than the other guys at selling yourself.


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## Cococamila

I recently took a sewing class and one of the other ladies does craft shows. She went on an on about her craft whichever it was, I never understood what it was, and after I told her about my hair bows she turned around and said. You know what I do. I go to craft shows when I'm not being a vendor and copy other peoples craft ideas. I buy cheap products and resell at a higher price then they do. All I have to do is make them and sell at a higher price to make a profit with less work or inventory. I almost sewed over my hand when she said that. No wait! she suggested I do the same. I replied my that work was original because if wasn't about the money but a passion.


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## Miz Jenny

That is so unethical and wrong on many levels. Given my propensity for being direct, I'd have told her so. My forever mantra is "Lord, deliver me from people who provoke me into telling them they're schmucks."


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## navigator9

You could put a sign on your table that says, "Often imitated....never duplicated!" I've found over the years that you can't control what anyone else does. All you can do is put out a great product and once people discover it, they will become repeat customers, and word of mouth is great for your business. I strongly dislike negativity. If I went to a vendor, and they were bad mouthing some other vendor's products, I would walk away. At craft fairs, if a customer asks me about my soap compared to another vendor's I just tell them that we all use different recipes and that they should read the ingredients to make sure that they're getting what they pay for. The predominant ingredient in my soap is olive oil, so if that gets them thinking that they'd rather pay a premium price for soap made with olive oil as opposed to canola....so be it. 

Make soap you're proud of, package it beautifully, be professional, smile and be confident and customers will notice. Insecure, unimaginative, negative people will end up driving customers away. No worries.


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## dixiedragon

I have no experience with this, so I am wondering if other sellers have a thought on this. What if you brought her copying to the attention of the people who oversee the market? Has anyone ever done this?


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## navigator9

Second thoughts on this. I would imagine that most of us, starting out as soap makers, used a tried and true recipe that we found in a book or on line somewhere to make our first batch. If we found that making soap was a true passion for us, I can't imagine that early on in our exploration of the craft, we didn't get to a point where we wanted to try a recipe of our own. A soap that no one else had made before. Maybe it was great....maybe not so great, so we tinkered with it, a little more of this, or less of that, until we ended up with a great bar of soap, that was uniquely ours. It's a lot of work to get to this point, but it's a labor of love. For me, it's hard to imagine that someone who doesn't have this kind of passion for what they do, can be successful in business for long. I'm sure there are exceptions to the rule, but I think there can't be many. I try to imagine doing a craft fair without having a true passion for what I make, knowing how hard it is both to make enough product, wrap, label, etc. and then schlep it all to the craft fair, unload, set up, break down, reload, all for what is usually not a ton of money. We may do well at some fairs, and dismally at others. You just never know. I've made over a thousand dollars at one fair and close to nothing at another. Ya gotta love it, or you're not gonna make it. And if you don't love it enough to come up with your own recipe....you don't love it enough! 

Or am I just being too idealistic. It wouldn't be the first time.


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## Susie

You know, it is this very issue keeping me from trying to sell my soap.  I have not created anything original.  I am using OPR(other people's recipes) to tweak and make soap.  This is still THEIR recipe!  I could not, in any good conscience, sell a product that is not my original recipe.  Period.  I just can't fathom anyone doing it on purpose.


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## The Efficacious Gentleman

Susie said:


> You know, it is this very issue keeping me from trying to sell my soap.  I have not created anything original.  I am using OPR(other people's recipes) to tweak and make soap.  This is still THEIR recipe!  I could not, in any good conscience, sell a product that is not my original recipe.  Period.  I just can't fathom anyone doing it on purpose.



For me it would depend on how much you have tweaked it.  I don't think that there are many recipes that are new and never before done in some form or another - taking EOs/FOs out of the equation.

If someone is selling a soap where they have no idea about why it is good or not and what could improve the recipe and what could make and worse and why that is the case - if they are in effect using another recipe that they would never be able to recreate because they just don't know soap at all, that is wrong.


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## cmzaha

Susie said:


> You know, it is this very issue keeping me from trying to sell my soap. I have not created anything original. I am using OPR(other people's recipes) to tweak and make soap. This is still THEIR recipe! I could not, in any good conscience, sell a product that is not my original recipe. Period. I just can't fathom anyone doing it on purpose.


 
Unfortunetly you are never going to make a soap that someone else makes. Lets face it soap is lye, fats, liquid. It is what we do after that that makes it unique or not unique. I have some soap recipes that I know no one could perfectly duplicate, but it does not mean they could not or do not make the basic bar, it is my essential oil that makes it unique and is listed as proprietary. Unless you invent a "New" way to make soap it will always basically be what others make. In my main market the management have been bringing in additional soapmakers and these people are telling them theirs are different from mine. Yeah right... Fortunetly for 5 years I have outlasted all the new soapmakers that come in my markets. Only one market I have asked them to keep out newbies because it is one I have not attended long enough to establish myself and can barely make my booth. I do this market because the owner of this market is hurting and I go to support him, but darn don't bring another.  He is the owner of most of my markets


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## navigator9

The Efficacious Gentleman said:


> For me it would depend on how much you have tweaked it. I don't think that there are many recipes that are new and never before done in some form or another - taking EOs/FOs out of the equation.



I agree, there are only so many ingredients that can be variables in any recipe. I think the real issue is that any soap maker worth their weight in soap, has worked on a recipe of their own. They've made a batch, tried it out, thought to themselves, "Hmmm....I wonder what would happen if I upped the castor oil just a bit." So they tried it, and if that turned out well, they wondered what could make it even better. Then they tried that, and on and on through much trial and error, until they were happy with what they had done. The final result may be very similar to someone else's recipe, but they arrived at it on their own. They didn't just rely on a recipe they found in a book, or stole from someone else.

It took me about two years to arrive at the basic recipe I use now. It's a very simple one. But I made batch after batch before I decided on a keeper. During that process, I studied the properties of the oils and butters I was using, spent hours tweaking Soap Calc til I couldn't see straight any more, tried out many ingredients and techniques that I'll never use again, filled a notebook with trial recipes......and learned more than I ever could by reading alone. Anyone can read a book on how to make soap, and make themselves a batch. In the beginning, we all copy recipes that we find, because we're not yet skilled enough to come up with one on our own, but eventually, if you have a real passion for soap making, it leads you to want to create a recipe that's your own. A real soap maker does the work. They don't need to imitate or steal.


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## Khanjari

soapsydaisy said:


> I plan on remaining professional. I am trying to stay positive. I was thinking about making a sign about our products saying something along these lines, "We have perfected our soap recipes over three years and hundreds of batches." My husband wants me to promote the fact that I am member of the Soap Guild.
> 
> In the future, I am not going to announce new soaps on our FB until they are packaged and ready to take to the market.



That will be a great idea! !!!! If I were you,  I would do it!!!!!!

I agree with the other posts that remain professional and SMILE!  (I was in a similar problem at a craft fair and the 'pro (s)' advised me to do that!  Very difficult but do-able....

Good luck dear!


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## freesia792

My first recipe truly was my own . It didn't turn out, but not because the recipe wasn't good, it's because I didn't know what to expect - never mind I watched video's, and read blogs for almost 3 years before attempting my own. Once I learned about the soap calculators, I was off to the races. I  messed with that for over 5 months before trying to actually make soap the first time. My first attempt was lye heavy. That the oils turned to a solid product at all was a miracle to me. I was SO HAPPY, even though I was afraid of it. I ended up grating it up and using it in a scrub cleanser product (that worked extra great). I had no idea that I shouldn't add more lye if I thought it didn't look right (I've only ever done HP, and what is look right anyway to a newbie? Besides, soap making isn't baking/cooking which is what I based) I kept at it, and I hit on a recipe that I just LOVE! I have learned though, what is perfect for my skin, isn't perfect for other people's skin - not even close relatives such as siblings or children. They request a recipe I consider to drying, but it works for them. It makes no sense to copy (steal) another recipe since different recipes work different for different people. I have not once copied or even used a recipe I didn't design myself. Others may have made it before me, but I do my homework based on my own education, experience and diligence. I still do not scent mine well though. That disturbs me.


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## Khanjari

Soapsydaisy,  I had loved this post on a similar thread I had started. Thought I'd Share. It might help. ....

http://www.soapmakingforum.com/showthread.php?p=416302


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