# Weird things on the INCI list



## Derpina Bubbles (Mar 5, 2014)

I know people's ideas of what's weird and what isn't can be highly subjective.  I probably find some of these things weirder than others do but I can't place them in cosmetics. By that, I mean I don't want to place them in my cosmetics. 

 So, I was flipping through the INCI list.  I hit the section "Biological additives" and I realise now how clueless I've been.  I've never needed to know INCI info other than the basics for soaps and creams. I was just looking for kicks. Eyes now wide open :shock:.  

 I'd heard of bugs, fish scales and things like that being in cosmetics but heart extract and spinal cord?  Basically someone was making a cosmetic application somewhere and went, "you know, what this needs is a dash of heart and a pinch of spinal cord".   Udder, umbilical cord, spleen, brain, liver, stomach and my favourite, Bovine calf skin (hydrolysed of course :Kitten Love.  I'm all for not wasting bits but this is like the Witches of Eastwick meet up with the Wizard of Oz and make bad haggis.

 Awww no way.  Just found ethyl minkate. Oils, mink. Poor mink is an emollient. Run little emollient! Run!  Bet I can find eye of newt if I keep looking.


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## Dennis (Mar 5, 2014)

The old saying is everything is used but the squeal and they're working on that.

Waste not, want not.


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## new12soap (Mar 5, 2014)

You know, as icky as some of those sound, to me nothing beats good old fashioned beaver butt juice. "Beaver butt juice??? In cosmetics???" you might say... Nope. In food. There is a secretion from the anal glands of beavers that is used in flavorings, and guess what? It only has to be listed on the ingredients as "natural flavor". Isn't that awesome? I shudder to think about who and how and why beaver butt juice was first tasted and someone said "Hey this would be great in food"....


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## Dennis (Mar 5, 2014)

new12soap said:


> You know, as icky as some of those sound, to me nothing beats good old fashioned beaver butt juice. "Beaver butt juice??? In cosmetics???" you might say... Nope. In food. There is a secretion from the anal glands of beavers that is used in flavorings, and guess what? It only has to be listed on the ingredients as "natural flavor". Isn't that awesome? I shudder to think about who and how and why beaver butt juice was first tasted and someone said "Hey this would be great in food"....



I'll bet it doesn't cause cancer in rats in California though.  Plus, it's 100% natural.  Organic?  Oh yeah!


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## Susie (Mar 5, 2014)

*Use everything except the squeal.*

Yeah, I am a Cajun.  We use EVERY part that is at all potentially usable of whatever it is.  It is how you save money(Cajuns are a peasant culture.), and pay respect to the animal and the hard work it took getting it to harvest size. 
And we have a reputation of 'eating every critter that has it's back to the sun.'


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## Dennis (Mar 5, 2014)

Susie said:


> Yeah, I am a Cajun.  We use EVERY part that is at all potentially usable of whatever it is.  It is how you save money(Cajuns are a peasant culture.), and pay respect to the animal and the hard work it took getting it to harvest size.
> And we have a reputation of 'eating every critter that has it's back to the sun.'


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## neeners (Mar 5, 2014)

Susie said:


> And we have a reputation of 'eating every critter that has it's back to the sun.'



that's what my great grandma used to say!  we're Chinese.....so we already have a reputation......


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## MzMolly65 (Mar 5, 2014)

Another water snorting thread .. remind me not to bend over in the vicinity of Neeners or Susie :mrgreen:  hahahah

This is just another reason not to eat haggis or hand lotion for that matter!  

I struggled enough with visits to the Hutterite Colony on "chicken head soup" night.  It's not the soup that I find disturbing because I can always just stick to the broth but the lustful way they suck the eyeballs and brains from the skulls .. YUM!!!  *shudders*


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## Dennis (Mar 5, 2014)

Yum!  Chicken soup for the soul!


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## Lindy (Mar 5, 2014)

All right MzMolly you just made me shudder....


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## Lindy (Mar 5, 2014)

Dennis that is gross..... :sick:


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## MzMolly65 (Mar 5, 2014)

Lindy said:


> All right MzMolly you just made me shudder....



Then my job here is done!!!  

My poor, city raised hubby dies every time I talk about life on the farm.  He just can't fathom anything beyond nice, sterile, chicken breast wrapped in plastic.  He lived with Asian roommates for many, many years but always left the room while the chopping was going on .. soft poof!

Meanwhile I was the farm kid who made puppets with the chicken's heads on butcher day and had cow pat fights with my cousins ....... and reading what I just wrote made me realize why I never quite fit in with the other school kids  roblem:  ***crawls back under rock***


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## Lindy (Mar 5, 2014)

I was a city kid but with farming/homesteading family so I am somewhat okay with a lot of things my peers aren't.  I know how to clean a chicken, I just don't like doing it.  I find the older I get the more squeamish I have become.  LOL


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## new12soap (Mar 5, 2014)

Derpina, I am so sorry, this thread has taken a wrong turn somewhere and I think I was driving the bus...


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## FlybyStardancer (Mar 5, 2014)

lol I'm one step further removed, Lindy. Mom and I were city-raised, but my grandmother grew up on a farm (and started cooking breakfast for the family at 8! Mother had died years before, and the older sister that had been handling it was moving out).

I'm not squeamish about the idea of where my food comes from... I just don't want to be the one handling it. lol Butterflying chicken or carving a cooked poultry carcass is about as much as I can take. It also ties into other areas where I have trouble--if people talk about injuries around me, then at some point I"ll start feeling faint. I have nearly fainted before in class when talking about major human injuries, once in third grade when I didn't even know what fainting was!


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## Derpina Bubbles (Mar 5, 2014)

new12soap said:


> Derpina, I am so sorry, this thread has taken a wrong turn somewhere and I think I was driving the bus...



ROFL good thing you were driving cause I posted then fell asleep at the wheel.

 Ok, so dead bits in cosmetics is considered normal, even umbilical cords and Mr Mink.  I feel so naïve lol.  I'm still a little disturbed (but that's another issue entirely).  Also just noticed shellac, propane and petroleum. Seriously, WTH is on my face?

 Oh, was a bread crumb off my toast from breakfast.

 Really, this list might be enough to turn me into a hippy.


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## neeners (Mar 5, 2014)

Lists like that make me happy I wear makeup like twice a year....


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## AnnaMarie (Mar 5, 2014)

new12soap said:


> You know, as icky as some of those sound, to me nothing beats good old fashioned beaver butt juice. "Beaver butt juice??? In cosmetics???" you might say... Nope. In food. There is a secretion from the anal glands of beavers that is used in flavorings, and guess what? It only has to be listed on the ingredients as "natural flavor". Isn't that awesome? I shudder to think about who and how and why beaver butt juice was first tasted and someone said "Hey this would be great in food"....



I just learned about that recently and I will be throwing out my fruit flavored extracts (I guess strawberry, raspberry, etc. have this beaver butt juice-:sick::sick:  Really???? There are some people in this world that have tooooo much time on their hands...
Cheers! Plus a little pepto
Anna Marie


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## AnnaMarie (Mar 5, 2014)

neeners said:


> that's what my great grandma used to say!  we're Chinese.....so we already have a reputation......



Lol! My husband is Chinese and from the old country, and he eats a lot of, errr, interesting things like partially formed chickens in eggs, chicken feet, cow stomach lining, and I think I will be praying to the porcelain god soon....
Cheers!
Anna Marie


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## neeners (Mar 5, 2014)

How cool AnnaMarie!  I don't eat many weird things....I've seen those fetal chicks, and I doubt I'd ever be able to make myself eat that. I do like myself some chicken feet and tripe at dim sum tho....yum!


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## AnnaMarie (Mar 5, 2014)

Yes, we like dim sum   I just let my husband have alllll the chicken feet


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## newbie (Mar 5, 2014)

I have to tell you that I laughed at you, AnnaMarie.

Saying you're just about to go puke. Cheers! ...cracked me up.


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## AnnaMarie (Mar 5, 2014)

Now I'm laughing...


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## Lindy (Mar 6, 2014)

FlybyStardancer said:


> lol I'm one step further removed, Lindy. Mom and I were city-raised, but my grandmother grew up on a farm (and started cooking breakfast for the family at 8! Mother had died years before, and the older sister that had been handling it was moving out).
> 
> I'm not squeamish about the idea of where my food comes from... I just don't want to be the one handling it. lol Butterflying chicken or carving a cooked poultry carcass is about as much as I can take. It also ties into other areas where I have trouble--if people talk about injuries around me, then at some point I"ll start feeling faint. I have nearly fainted before in class when talking about major human injuries, once in third grade when I didn't even know what fainting was!



 Not squeamish about where the food comes from just can't do the harvesting.  I was a first responder for a couple of years and injuries or blood don't bother me.  Now needles?  Totally a different story! :sick:


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## FlybyStardancer (Mar 6, 2014)

Knitting and sewing needles I'm fine with, but medical needles? Please no!! I don't know what I'm going to do next time I need blood drawn... Probably faint outright.


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## neeners (Mar 6, 2014)

I watch when ppl poke me with needles.....  :shifty:


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## Lin (Mar 7, 2014)

new12soap said:


> I shudder to think about who and how and why beaver butt juice was first tasted and someone said "Hey this would be great in food"....


Thats EXACTLY what I wanted to know when I first read about it. 

Those who have issues with medical stuff, needles, do not read further. 

I've warned you. 

Ok, so, nothing medical bothers me*. I have some health issues that started at a young age so I've been through it all. I can dissociate at will for the really bad stuff lol. This one isn't too bad. But one time I was in the ER being admitted, and the nurse asked me if I'd be ok with a nurse in training started my IV. I said sure, no problem. So she was trained to start them in the hand apparently, and examining my hands that wasn't going to work. So I showed her where on my elbow they generally do my IVs. I could tell how nervous she was just by how she was moving around and speaking. She gets the IV in and blood starts pouring out of the end. She hesitated a moment in horror, and then stuck her finger over the end to try to plug it as she reached for the stuff she needed off the tray. By the time she got the IV connected, pinched off, and taped down there was blood all over my forearm, I'd moved my leg JUST in time to not get blood all over my jeans, and it was dripping off the bed onto the floor. The supervising nurse had just stood in the back watching the whole time, and when it was over goes "yea, you got to be ready with the big veins" and walked out of the room. I felt SO bad for the poor girl! She was physically shaking, and kept apologizing over and over. I had to calm HER down! I kept telling her it was ok, I was fine, no big deal etc. She was just rambling on in anxiety and told me it was actually the very first IV she'd ever started, and had only finished the class earlier that day. I said hey, but you got it in on the first stick!

*except Drs who purposefully cause pain and don't care that they're causing you pain.


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## MzMolly65 (Mar 7, 2014)

> I said hey, but you got it in on the first stick!



Ya .. unlike the nurse who trained on me for her first I.V. and stuck me about 10 times before the trainer nurse stepped in to take over and get it done.  I'm totally ok with needles and actually preferred the new nurse who was fumbly .. at least she didn't hurt me, even tho she poked me 10 times.  The trainer jabbed me once but left an enormous bruise that covered 1/2 my arm.


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## grayceworks (Mar 7, 2014)

Lin said:


> ...But one time I was in the ER being admitted, and the nurse asked me if I'd be ok with a nurse in training started my IV. I said sure, no problem. So she was trained to start them in the hand apparently, and examining my hands that wasn't going to work. So I showed her where on my elbow they generally do my IVs. I could tell how nervous she was just by how she was moving around and speaking. She gets the IV in and blood starts pouring out of the end. ... She was physically shaking, and kept apologizing over and over. I had to calm HER down! ... I said hey, but you got it in on the first stick!


 
I swear I have had this exact experience soooo many times. lol

And yes, getting it on the first stick is great! And really getting it -- not that thing where they stick and then slide it around underneath trying to find the vein they thought they felt... I hate that. I'd rather be stuck again. lol


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## grayceworks (Mar 7, 2014)

When I was growing up, some Mexican friends of ours taught me how to make a lot of stuff, tamales, enchiladas (and sauce from scratch), HOT salsa, etc. And menuedo -- with beef tripe. I didn't know what it was then. I was like 10yrs old. And she wouldn't tell me. I loved the menuedo. and then I found out what tripe was. I still love menuedo --- but I hate making it with the tripe. I can eat it, but... I let hubby chop up the tripe. lol

And tongue. I cannot look at, prepare, or eat tongue. that one just squicks me. Not many things do, but that one does.


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## Lin (Mar 7, 2014)

I'd also much prefer to be stuck again than when they move the needle around! 

My veins are weak as a result of my genetic disorder. Once in the ER the nurse blew the vein and my arm started swelling suddenly. She asked me if it had hurt when she was starting the IV, I said yes and she started yelling at me for not telling her it did so she would have known it was blown sooner. Well excuse me, I was barely conscious at the time so sorry I wasn't paying attention to you! What I really hate though is when it starts to leak slowly and the saline gets in the tissues. My arm feels so cold along that side for quite a ways up; I'm not really sure how to describe the sensation but its weird. And then of course takes a long time for my arm to recover after. 

I've got a bunch of bruising right now because I was in the ER wednesday night. I had a migraine that started monday and hadn't gone away. In fact it was starting to get better that afternoon, and then suddenly got very severe again but on the opposite side of my head as before (and opposite side as I usually get migraines.) So I ended up in the ER for medications, rehydration, and a CT scan. When the Dr said how my CT scan was normal and nothing strange was found my boyfriend asked if the normal stuff WAS found and everything there.


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## fuzz-juzz (Mar 7, 2014)

I come from a family that eats everything.   we didn't have a big farm but we had livestock that we used for our consumption. Nothing was wasted. 
Brains are yum and lungs actually make a lovely stew. 
I am actually a trainee nurse and will probably sticking needles endlessly into some poor soul very soon. I am hopeless in finding veins.


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## grayceworks (Mar 7, 2014)

Fuzz-juzz, if in doubt, most people have a pretty decent vein at the outermost part of the inside of the elbow, especially on their dominant arm. Really hard to miss that one. Heh, I think that's probably the one Lin and I have been discussing. And also, it's often helpful to ask patients if they have a preferred vein, especially if they're in for something chronic, they probably have a pretty good idea of what usually works for them, as well as what really really won't.


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## Lin (Mar 7, 2014)

yup, thats the one where I always get blood draws and IVs.


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## fuzz-juzz (Mar 7, 2014)

Thank you girls, I'll keep it mind. 
My placement at the hospital starts in few weeks... eek.


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## Lin (Mar 7, 2014)

Oh, and I second asking the patient. I usually tell them I need the butterfly needle for blood draws that are not coming through an IV. Occasionally they think they know better than I, after all I'm not a medical professional I'm just the patient. Then stick me repeatedly before mumbling that they need the butterfly needle. Really most nurses or phlebotomists ask me "so where do you usually get stuck at"

I do hate IVs there actually though. Because the tubing gets crimped so easily if you bend your elbow slightly. I learned quickly what button to push when the IV starts beeping at you that the line is occluded. Drives me nuts when inpatient and on an IV for a while. But then it also seems to hurt less and get jerked less than the few times I've had IVs in the hand.... So not sure where my preference would be if I had a choice (the veins for it).

Good luck! Just always be honest and tell the patients things straight up. Or at least ask them if they want to know what your doing. I like to be told exactly when the stick is going to be, I want to know exactly what drug you're pushing into my IV right now or if its just a saline flush. Some people may prefer to be surprised. Definitely no lying. Even to kids. That drove me nuts growing up.


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## Susie (Mar 10, 2014)

I am a nurse, and used to be an EMT(I did the nurse part first, then had an acute attack of lack of studying, so fixed it with EMT class.)  I have seen and bandaged....well, I will save the squeamish the descriptions.  And I have a cast iron stomach when it comes to patients and wounds and such.  

But, don't  even mention food when I am dealing with the squicky stuff.  Just don't.  REALLY don't.  Don't ask me why.  I can either deal with patient stuff or food.  Just not both anytime close together.

Oh, and I ALWAYS ask patients where they get the best results for IVs and blood draws.  No use trying the same places others failed.  And, after all, that patient was there for every one of them.


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## Lindy (Mar 10, 2014)

When I was a first responder I was also the trainer so I made a bunch of teaching aids.  To say the least they were gory, but necessary.


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## lpstephy85 (Mar 10, 2014)

So, I love my DH 99% of the time but sometimes I wonder... He likes to Google things on my cell phone and then leave them there for me to open up and see. Well today was a Google for cat poop. When I opened my phone, it opened to this Wikipedia article. Eww: http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kopi_Luwak

I told him in the end if I wanted to see cat poop I would just go peek into the litter boxes. Men...


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## Lin (Mar 11, 2014)

At least he didn't serve it up to you with breakfast.


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## lpstephy85 (Mar 11, 2014)

Lin said:


> At least he didn't serve it up to you with breakfast.




Good call...


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## Derpina Bubbles (Mar 11, 2014)

lpstephy85 said:


> So, I love my DH 99% of the time but sometimes I wonder... He likes to Google things on my cell phone and then leave them there for me to open up and see. Well today was a Google for cat poop. When I opened my phone, it opened to this Wikipedia article. Eww: http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kopi_Luwak
> 
> I told him in the end if I wanted to see cat poop I would just go peek into the litter boxes. Men...



Bwhahaha that's gold! I might start doing that to my hubby's phone.   

 The look on the poor farmers face is killing me.  Every single day, nothing but  caffeinated cat poop.  Even he looks like he's holding the turd mix up and going "seriously?" Must remember the name Kopi Luwak and make sure to never, ever imbibe.


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## FlybyStardancer (Mar 11, 2014)

It's easy to avoid kopi luwak. Most places don't sell it, and those that do charge about $40 per cup...


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## The Efficacious Gentleman (Mar 11, 2014)

I did a bit of hunting in the UK, so have no problems preparing animals for eating.  

I once sorted out a Hare and my house mate asked me where the fillet comes from.  She got rather freaked out when I put her cat on its side on my lap and showed her where the various cuts come from.........................


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## Dennis (Mar 11, 2014)

Lindy said:


> When I was a first responder I was also the trainer so I made a bunch of teaching aids.  To say the least they were gory, but necessary.



This reminds me of medic training when I was in the military.  The first day they showed us movies of bullet wound surgery.  Several didn't make it through that day.  
Injections?  They had us practicing on one another.  Scary.  :shock:
The good ole days.


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## Lindy (Mar 11, 2014)

You should have seen the reactions from the team the first time I pulled them out to train them with.... ROFL


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## The Efficacious Gentleman (Mar 11, 2014)

Hopefully people read the whole thread before seeing Lindy's last post.  Context is very much required


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## Lindy (Mar 12, 2014)

Oh dear!  I meant training aids like fake broken ankles with bones sticking out and more gross things than that.  Sheesh.... ROFLOL


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## houseofwool (Mar 14, 2014)

I am the practice manager for the orthopedic surgeon, and every so often I get curious about procedures that he performs. Note to self, never ever look them up on YouTube.


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## neeners (Mar 14, 2014)

:think:  now I want to look them up......

 speaking of which, I used to watch "Operation" on TLC when that show used to be on.  I remember watching a knee replacement surgery.  I was not grossed out at all.....that should have been a clue that I should have gone to medical school......


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## maya (Mar 15, 2014)

So. Chicken heads no. But chicken EGGS yes? Think about chicken eggs. Eggs. 

Just checking. 

I make no judgements about what others eat. I am Scottish, we have haggis. All cultures and ethnic groups have a variety of interesting food ideas, blutwurst, haggis, hotdogs just to name three. And for me here is the kicker, generally we don't eat dogs (co-evolutionary species and all) but other animals are just fine to eat? I eat meat I know where it comes from and I don't fool myself but it is a hypocrisy of mine.


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## AustinStraight (Mar 15, 2014)

Beaver butt-juice has kind of a nice ring to it...


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## MzMolly65 (Mar 15, 2014)

maya said:


> So. Chicken heads no. But chicken EGGS yes? Think about chicken eggs. Eggs.



Here's my sick logic .. chicken heads are staring back at me and might start talking back at any minute, eggs are cracked open and I eat the part that doesn't touch the delivery chute, LOL!!!  (but I suppose it's the bit inside that you're talking about)

hmmm .. what's odd to eat that's truely Canadian vs brought to Canada by immigrants?  When I was in the far north the Inuit showed me how they eat ... Ummm ... nose and warbles.  I'll leave you all to gag on that thought for a minute.  I don't think it's a distinctly Canadian gross-os-ity, I'm sure other cultures eat them too.

I will proudly admit to having eaten NEITHER of those and don't plan on it either.


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## Dennis (Mar 15, 2014)

Ever clean a flounder?  Both of those eyes staring up at you and the mouth gasping and suddenly WHACK!  OFF WITH HIS HEAD!  Get beyond that and they are yummy with crab stuffing or marinate in milk, garlic and lemon juice for 24 hrs before frying or baking.  Oh my.  Add a few good hush puppies and you'll put that immediate free pass into heaven on hold until you're finished.


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## AnnaMarie (Mar 15, 2014)

maya said:


> So. Chicken heads no. But chicken EGGS yes? Think about chicken eggs. Eggs.
> 
> Just checking.
> 
> I make no judgements about what others eat. I am Scottish, we have haggis. All cultures and ethnic groups have a variety of interesting food ideas, blutwurst, haggis, hotdogs just to name three. And for me here is the kicker, generally we don't eat dogs (co-evolutionary species and all) but other animals are just fine to eat? I eat meat I know where it comes from and I don't fool myself but it is a hypocrisy of mine.



I won't argue with the hypocrisy point- we are all guilty. The truth is I have to NOT think about the meat I am eating, or I would be a vegetarian today- not because of a moral standpoint, but because of the idea of WHAT I am eating. Years ago I tried lamb for the first time. I chewed, and chewed, and chewed, and chewed (you get the point). I couldn't make that bite go down because I kept thinking of Mary had a little lamb and cute little white sheep....
Cheers!
Anna Marie


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## Lindy (Mar 15, 2014)

I'm a hypocrite too.  I am a total animal lover and yet I am a meat eater.  I too cannot think about what I am eating or I too would be a vegetarian but I don't like vegetables enough and I prefer my food to be less processed then tofu... okay I admit that one grosses me out.


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## neeners (Mar 15, 2014)

Lindy, don't think of it that way.  if you find meat that's been raised humanely, the animal has had an amazing life, never been hungry, was able to be outdoors, enjoy the sunshine, and had one bad day to be dinner.  I love animals too, and to me, a good life and quick death is always better than those who weren't ever able to do the things they were made to do (think CAFOs).  anyway.....that's just IMO.


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## Lin (Mar 15, 2014)

Not everyone has that hypocrisy  That hypocrisy is why I became a vegetarian. I didn't feel right picking and choosing what animals I thought were ok to eat, so I decided to stop eating all animals. Most people stare back at me with confusion though after asking why I'm a vegetarian and getting that response.

Oh, and I'm a pro-hunting vegetarian. For reasons like neeners was just saying, they have much better quality of life than factory farmed meat. Not to mention that it also helps the animals in cases like deer where we stole their habitat and they would overpopulate and eat all their food and then dye a much more horrible death (not to mention both deer and human deaths increasing with things like car accidents...) if we didn't. Of course I'd prefer that we didn't continue to steal their habitat


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## MzMolly65 (Mar 15, 2014)

Dennis said:


> Ever clean a flounder?  Both of those eyes staring up at you and the mouth gasping and suddenly WHACK!  OFF WITH HIS HEAD!  Get beyond that and they are yummy with crab stuffing or marinate in milk, garlic and lemon juice for 24 hrs before frying or baking.  Oh my.  Add a few good hush puppies and you'll put that immediate free pass into heaven on hold until you're finished.



I'm coming to your house for dinner!!!!!!!!!


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## MzMolly65 (Mar 15, 2014)

hmm .. I grew up learning to respect the animals that blessed our table.  They were slaughtered in the quickest, most humane manner possible.  On our small farm all the animals were known personally and had names.  It wasn't "what" was for dinner, it was "who" was for dinner.

I still prefer my food that way.  Grocery store meat is a sad reflection of farming and the animals are treated horribly.  I'll pay more to the small farm any day over the grocery store.


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## neeners (Mar 16, 2014)

MzMolly, we're growing our meat for the first time, and though I'm sad to have to say goodbye, I'm also very excited for dinner.  everyone I've talked to (in person and online) who has grown their own meat, has the exact same feeling you do.


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## grayceworks (Mar 16, 2014)

I have never had a problem with eating our own chickens when we raised them. I had neighbors who raised rabbits, and although I had a pet bunny, I made sure never to get to know any of theirs. But when they turned their mule into dinner, I was a bit disturbed... and when my father had our pet turkey slaughtered without telling anyone, a turkey who had been raised by hand AS a pet and faithfully followed us everywhere like a dog -- well, he was the only one who would eat it. Hmph.


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## FlybyStardancer (Mar 16, 2014)

MzMolly65 said:


> I still prefer my food that way.  Grocery store meat is a sad reflection of farming and the animals are treated horribly.  I'll pay more to the small farm any day over the grocery store.



I would love to be able to do this, for all my fruits & veggies as well as meat. Sadly, I don't have the finances to afford that luxury. It's sad when treating well the animals and plants that feed us is a luxury item, rather than common sense.

As an aside: I would love to have a garden. I have tried gardening in the past, and my dirt SUCKS, even after replacing at least half (if not 3/4) of the dirt in my boxes with steer manure. And watering is difficult, because it's a very hot area with no nearby water sources. Add on that this is going to be a bad year for all farms/gardens in CA...


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## neeners (Mar 16, 2014)

FlybyStardancer said:


> As an aside: I would love to have a garden. I have tried gardening in the past, and my dirt SUCKS, even after replacing at least half (if not 3/4) of the dirt in my boxes with steer manure. And watering is difficult, because it's a very hot area with no nearby water sources. Add on that this is going to be a bad year for all farms/gardens in CA...



look up "deep mulch" method of gardening/farming.


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## FlybyStardancer (Mar 16, 2014)

I tried something similar. I couldn't get the plants I wanted to grow thick enough to block out the weeds. These weeds are a royal pain in the butt--much better at dealing with the harsh conditions here than the plants I *want* to grow.


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## neeners (Mar 16, 2014)

hmm....then I dunno.  maybe talk to your local organic nursery or farm and ask how they get about doing it?  I'm terrible at growing things.  my strength is animals....


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## FlybyStardancer (Mar 16, 2014)

The solution is to take out all the dirt, put in some kind of barrier at the bottom of the boxes, and re-fill it with good stuff. And install a better way of watering them. Unfortunately, I don't have the money for it. 

What I want to do is to make some DIY ollas out of terra cotta pots and bury them for water. And I want to figure out how to bury them deeper so that I can lessen the evaporation from them.


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## neeners (Mar 16, 2014)

I'm sorry.  I know how you feel.  the soil we have at our house is CLAY.  sticky, icky, clay.  we didn't have any success growing anything other than sweet basil and bananas for a while.....


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## FlybyStardancer (Mar 16, 2014)

The soil that's in those boxes feels like pure sand, despite all the manure in it. I'm really a bit bitter about it, so I won't go into details.


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## neeners (Mar 16, 2014)

sorry.  *hug*  I know, it's hard,  we have issues too.  what about home composter?


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## FlybyStardancer (Mar 16, 2014)

Have one of those. Can't get it to compost properly--it dries out too quickly. Plus, it doesn't make nearly as much as what I would need.


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## houseofwool (Mar 16, 2014)

I've had better luck with a wire cage that sits directly on the ground. 

In a couple of weeks, I need to turn the existing pile and get the good stuff out from the bottom of the current bin.

I'm thinking of waiting until the tween boy pushes his luck a bit too far and conscripting him...


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## Derpina Bubbles (Mar 16, 2014)

I've missed some interesting stuff this week :shock:.  

 I've never raised any animals for food but I once had an apple tree and I bit into an apple then looked at it and saw half a worm left in it.  I'd already swallowed the other half when I noticed it. Not sure if that counts :think:.


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## AnnaMarie (Mar 16, 2014)

Well, no more apples for me.....:sick:


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## Hazel (Mar 22, 2014)

AustinStraight said:


> Beaver butt-juice has kind of a nice ring to it...



Catchy. And people keep spreading it across the internet without verification because it sounds funny and gross at the same time. I'm wondering who started disseminating this information. 

Let's think about this for a moment. In this day and age, how many companies _*really *_use castoreum as a flavor ingredient? I won't say some don't use it, but it's an awfully expensive ingredient just for a little flavor. I can possibly understand some fragrance manufacturers still using it but again; with concerns about the environment and wildlife plus man-made alternatives, I really don't believe a lot of companies would still consider this a viable ingredient. Comes down to money - which is the ingredient that offers the most profit for the company? I seriously doubt it's the castoreum. But hey...I could be wrong. I'm not an expert on manufacturing fragrances or flavor oils.

eta: AustinStraight - My post isn't directed at you. I just used your comment since it was only one line and it was the last one to make a reference about the scent glands of beavers.


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## Dennis (Mar 23, 2014)

Hazel said:


> Catchy. And people keep spreading it across the internet without verification because it sounds funny and gross at the same time. I'm wondering who started disseminating this information.
> 
> Let's think about this for a moment. In this day and age, how many companies _*really *_use castoreum as a flavor ingredient? I won't say some don't use it, but it's an awfully expensive ingredient just for a little flavor. I can possibly understand some fragrance manufacturers still using it but again; with concerns about the environment and wildlife plus man-made alternatives, I really don't believe a lot of companies would still consider this a viable ingredient. Comes down to money - which is the ingredient that offers the most profit for the company? I seriously doubt it's the castoreum. But hey...I could be wrong. I'm not an expert on manufacturing fragrances or flavor oils.
> 
> eta: AustinStraight - My post isn't directed at you. I just used your comment since it was only one line and it was the last one to make a reference about the scent glands of beavers.



It must be true, it was found on the internet! :lolno:
Beaver butt juice is a rather catchy term and it juked up the curiosity level a bit and I looked around and found it on Snopes.  Interesting reading for those who who will go to any lengths for their flavorings or scents.  Check it out here: http://www.snopes.com/food/ingredient/castoreum.asp  It is recommended that you go beyond the first paragraph for the real info and check out the sources at the bottom of the page.   Good stuff!  The info, not the beaver butt juice.  Yuck.


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## Hazel (Mar 23, 2014)

Thanks Dennis! Those are interesting to read. I browsed a little further and stumbled over a short discussion from last year on straightdope.com. It amused me but I have a twisted sense of humor. The last post made me laugh. Laughing over this demonstrates my hypocrisy because if I'd seen several of these comments on this forum, I would have deleted them as being vulgar and inappropriate. However, I'm more tolerant about what appears on straightdope because of the forum's purpose. 

Do not read the discussion if you're easily offended by risque comments.  I'm sure many of you will be able to have an idea of some of the content.


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