# question about selling melt and pour



## katherine72

I used to do melt and pour for myself all the time and would like to sell it but I can't help but feel like it's somehow "cheating". I go to the local craft fairs and farmers markets and there are so many talented people making soap entirely from scratch. When customers ask if you make your melt and pour from scratch what would one say? "uh, sort of?"
Any opinions would be appreciated.


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## Relle

katherine72 said:
			
		

> When customers ask if you make your melt and pour from scratch what would one say? "uh, sort of?"
> Any opinions would be appreciated.



You would have to say no to that question and add that you put in the scent and colour to the soap base.


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## Jamison

Isn't the reason for MP so you don't make it from scratch? If you wanted soap from scratch, you'd use CP, right?

Speaking of... How is MP soap even made? The ingredients are not that far different from CP.


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## katherine72

I guess the real question is if you are attending and event, such as the farmers market, where things that are sold there are handmade/homemade...would melt and pour really qualify?


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## katherine72

as far as I know melt and pour is the same as if you made it yourself. You just have to remelt it.


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## supersoaper3000

I always describe my M&P products as being hand crafted, but display information about my bases and what is in them and how they are made.  The term Melt and Pour has a very broad application, it is used to describe anything from synthetic detergent based bars to all natural soap bases, and everyone seems to have their own expectation.

Anyways, so long as you are adding anything to your Melt and Pour base (color, scent) then you are in fact crafting...with your hands!  Any show or craft fair I have ever attended considers Melt and Pour a craft, not a resale.


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## Genny

Relle9 said:
			
		

> katherine72 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> When customers ask if you make your melt and pour from scratch what would one say? "uh, sort of?"
> Any opinions would be appreciated.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You would have to say no to that question and add that you put in the scent and colour to the soap base.
Click to expand...


I agree with this.  You don't make it from scratch.  
When you bake a cake using a mix, you wouldn't say you made it from scratch.  It's basically the same thing.


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## carebear

katherine72 said:
			
		

> as far as I know melt and pour is the same as if you made it yourself. You just have to remelt it.



Not so.

While it's correct that you remelt the melt and pour, it is absolutely incorrect as if you made it yourself.

soap we make ourselves is NOT melt and pour.  

When asked about MP soap, I state proudly that I started with a "base" and that I customized it for skin, appearance, scent, and texture.  It is very much hand crafted.


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## katherine72

The cake analogy is exactly how I feel about it. Like entering a bake off with a cake mix.


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## rileylite

Both with soap and with the cake analogy, the final product is essentially the same. I just see it as skipping a step. I think it's reasonable for someone to prefer not to be using a harmful chemical like lye in their home. While MP and CP can be very different, you can be successful with both, and both require hard work. If you don't feel okay making MP, leave it at that. Trust me, this subject can really get people worked up.


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## supersoaper3000

This really is an issue of semantics in my mind.  Hand made vs. Hand crafted.  Melt and Pour is a craft, Cold and hot process are hand made.  You can tout the benefits of either until the cows come home.  Anyone who says there is only one true soap is just stating their preference...not that there is anything wrong with that, just saying there is a wide variety of preferences and expectations which would indicate that it is more complicated than just one right answer here.  To each their own


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## katherine72

"Hand made vs. Hand crafted. Melt and Pour is a craft, Cold and hot process are hand made."

Good point. I can accept that thought process.


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## Rebelshope

I have _made_ soap, but what I do with mp is craft it. 

I don't really like a the cake  analogy because a cake mix does do most of the work for you. It is not like most people take a cake mix and change it some how. If you buy a chocolate cake mix, you make chocolate cake.

I think of it more like sewing your own dress. It takes skill to make the dress even though you bought the material and the pattern. In mp you buy the base (material) and molds (pattern) but what you do with them is up to you. There is a lot of room for creativity.


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## Dremma

I don think it's 'cheating.' there are many types of soaps and methods of soap making.

I don't do craft fairs or farmers markets much but have sold HP, CP and MP.

Basically, in my opinion, you just need to answer any question that anyone has about your soaps honestly.   If you do not make soap from scratch but do create new soaps from MP bases then personally I would consider you in the realm of a soap artisan rather than a soap maker...and there is nothing wrong with either.


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## debra102011

I am a true beginner with MP and I feel it is selling a better product using vegetable glycerin VS the Tallow that "store bought" soap has.

Also the great molds I bought to attract the "horse folks" are not found in your big box store so in that way I am making it "home made".

Tomato Tomatoe


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## Genny

A lot of cp & hp soap makers also use tallow in their recipes. I happen to use vegetable oils, only because I'm squeamish when it comes to animal fats.


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## Kleine Teufel

It's entirely up to you, however, be honest with it. I only do CP soap, but I have started to become a little envious of some of the things people do with M&P, lol. The only turn-off with M&P is when people try to be shady about it. If you use M&P, don't deny it or try to weasel around it, just say that you started with a base soap. Don't say "yes, it's handmade", because that can mean anything to anyone. Some people consider M&P handmade, some people don't, so that doesn't answer the question. If people ask me if my stuff is "handmade" I say, "yes, I start out with oils and lye". If I started doing M&P, I'd just say, "well, I start out with a base and add my own creativity to it".


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## debra102011

Thanks for the heads up I am about to place an order so I will make sure my base does not contain tallow.



			
				Genny said:
			
		

> A lot of cp & hp soap makers also use tallow in their recipes. I happen to use vegetable oils, only because I'm squeamish when it comes to animal fats.


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## MyHappyHour

I do see a lot of questions on this when reading soap making forums and what not. People say that melt and pour isn't really doing anything, and a lot of people say it's cheating. Melt and pour though allows you to do a lot of things that cp and hp can't do. I love making HP soap but they will never look as adorable as my melt and pour pieces. I do like the idea of hand crafted vs hand made. When my parents see my melt and pour soaps they tell people it's from scratch though lol, they have seen me make it and they consider that from scratch


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## chokureiseiheki

The reason I prefer M&P is because it allows me to get to what I really enjoy doing most, and that is decorating, decorating, decorating!  I enjoy making pretty soaps.  I personally wouldn't enjoy making the base myself.  (I'm sure others do enoy the process).   I want quick results to get to my main objective, which is to decorate.  
How would I answer the question "Are my soaps home made"?  I would say, "I feel like they are, but I M&P".  Which means I buy a soap base that is prepared, but I do have to melt it, add color, oils and fragrance to get the desired texture and color and shape.  And I do ALL the decorating myself!  :wink:  I don't think most buyers really care one way or another.  And if they do, they can choose my friendly neighbors who do make homemade soap!  My buyers would probably be more girly girls who enjoy pretty soaps.

Just keeping it sudsy and clean,

Rose


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## maxxx39

I started with melt and pour and I still adore it.  It lets me customize colors,scents and shapes even though my plastic molds seem to be giving out on me!!! :x I think in the future I will be buying more silicone molds for their heat tolerance and easy release.

I tell people I use a soap base also to be honest.  M and P has allowed me to customize my most requested Irish Spring type scent in various colors and shapes for certain customers.  I've done good old Irish Spring in not only classic green, but blue and brown,flowered and regular shapes.


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## NinaRey

There are a lot of things that are considered "hand crafted" at farmers markets that aren't made entirely from scratch. People buy pre made flowers and attach them to bows and headbands. People make clothing out of pre-made fabrics. Etc, etc. I know everyone has their own opinions about it, but in the end i I think it's a matter of how you feel about it. Did you put enough creativity and "you" into it to call it your own? If you feel like you are cheating, maybe find something extra to make it more unique so you feel confident saying that you crafted it yourself.


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## vikvik

it is hand made you mould it and shape it you self, if people ask do you make it from scratch ex-plane the different between your soap dont say i melt it and add fragrance say its made from a base but this type of soap holds it fragrance better if your looking for strong smelling soap you would go for soap base, if you want creamy and luxurious soap you would got for c.p. i make both i find people love m&p they go for look and smell first and its not as costly for them to buy


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## new12soap

*Re:*



			
				Rebelshope said:
			
		

> I don't really like a the cake  analogy because a cake mix does do most of the work for you. It is not like most people take a cake mix and change it some how. If you buy a chocolate cake mix, you make chocolate cake.
> 
> I think of it more like sewing your own dress. It takes skill to make the dress even though you bought the material and the pattern. In mp you buy the base (material) and molds (pattern) but what you do with them is up to you. There is a lot of room for creativity.



If you use a goat milk melt and pour base, you are "crafting" a goat milk soap. I can put any flavor or color icing on that chocolate cake and decorate it with sprinkles  or flowers or whatever. M&P is exactly the same. You didn't formulate the soap, I didn't formulate the cake, the rest is just decoration.

You also didn't sew the dress, you bought a dress at a store and accessorized it. Be as creative as you like, and I am NOT saying there is anything wrong with that, I am saying you didn't make it. You melted it, decorated and poured it. Not the same.



			
				chokureiseiheki said:
			
		

> The reason I prefer M&P is because it allows me to get to what I really enjoy doing most, and that is decorating, decorating, decorating!  I enjoy making pretty soaps.  I personally wouldn't enjoy making the base myself.  (I'm sure others do enoy the process).   I want quick results to get to my main objective, which is to decorate.  Rose



That is exactly it. It's like the difference between the contractor that built the house and the decorator that picked out the colors and the furniture. Again, they are not the same.

M&P soaps are not handmade, but they are handcrafted.


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## MegaSoap

Genny said:
			
		

> Relle9 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> katherine72 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> When customers ask if you make your melt and pour from scratch what would one say? "uh, sort of?"
> Any opinions would be appreciated.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You would have to say no to that question and add that you put in the scent and colour to the soap base.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I agree with this.  You don't make it from scratch.
> When you bake a cake using a mix, you wouldn't say you made it from scratch.  It's basically the same thing.
Click to expand...


+1


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## sherrilynn

Interesting thread....  my question....  do customers really ask about MP or HP or CP??????????  I've been on the road selling at all different types of venues for the past 12 years and that question has never been asked.  Gosh, maybe people are too blown away by my great soaps.. huh??  LOL....

Our soaps are MP....we've sent photos in for juries of how we melt and blend our home grown beeswax with our base,  fragrance, pour, mold, decorate and package our soaps and have always been accepted into hand crafted shows.  For the past 5 years we've marketed only at handcrafted juried shows.  

I figure it this way... does a painter make their canvas and paints?  Do those who make dried floral arrangements make their flowers, woods and baskets?   I'm sorta wondering how many soapers make their own lye, cocoa butter, palm waxes, etc.  In some capacity we all purchase a product from someone else to make an end product. Whether that be a base or a raw product and it's great we have this diversity.  It gives our customers many choices of fine products. 

Homemade - made or prepared at home
Hand Crafted - to fashion or make by hand
Hand Made - mady by hand not a machine

According to Websters dictionary,, I'm all three, homemade, hand crafted and hand made.  
Just my two beans in the pot today.... hope you're all having a good one.    
~S~


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## Genny

Sherrlynn ~ I honestly don't think that the average market goer or customer knows the difference between MP or CP/HP.   To them, soap is soap. They don't really know the process behind it.  I think back before I knew how to make soap and I honestly never knew there was a difference between the 2.  

I've had maybe a total of 2 people in 6 years ask me if I make my soap from scratch.  But, each person said "from scratch" and I was doing MP at the time, so I did say no.  Now if they would have asked if they were homemade, then I would have said yes.  Because I did make them in my home.  

I think it's the soapmakers who get their panties all in a bunch over the "homemade", "hand crafted", "hand made" description.  Other people don't care.  

In the crochet/knitting world, I see the same thing.  Knitters that use knitting looms get bashed by other stick knitters for "cheating".


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## WeirdSoap

Sherrlynn, as a professional painter and artist, I disagree with your analogy...

I have nothing against MP soap. MP soap is still art in its own form, is safer to work with children and can be really creative.


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## lisamaliga

Remember that the technical term is either glycerin melt and pour soap or melt and pour glycerin soap. M&P can have up to 25% glycerin which makes it a softer soap. While I love using CP, and am grateful that there are so many talented and creative CP soapers out there, I love being able to stir up a batch of M&P in less than an hour!


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## BulkApothecary

We always recommend our customers be honest with those who ask but focus on the positives.  If you are taking a mp base and adding color, fragrance, herbs, essential oils or anything else and then shaping it and packaging it, you are definitely making a homemade creation.  You are not making that product from scratch but you are creating something that is completely unique.  You are hand crafting a product that takes a lot of time and in many cases skill to get it perfect.  Be proud of your creation and don't focus on the fact that you didn't make it from scratch.  Focus on the fact that you put the time and effort into creating a custom soap by hand that others can enjoy.  Most of our customers tell us that when they take an honest approach like this, the customers at these shows appreciate the hard work they put into their items and really don’t care about the fact that the soap wasn’t made by them from scratch.


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## Pawfect

If I'm using a m&p base that's less than 5% glycerin,  can you still call it a glycerin melt & pour base?


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## Genny

Pawfect said:
			
		

> If I'm using a m&p base that's less than 5% glycerin,  can you still call it a glycerin melt & pour base?



Honestly you can call it anything you want.  If it's got glycerin in it, I don't see any reason why you can't call it glycerin melt and pour.


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## Pawfect

Genny said:
			
		

> Honestly you can call it anything you want.  If it's got glycerin in it, I don't see any reason why you can't call it glycerin melt and pour.



Good! . I don't plan on selling it, (using it for gifts), but would like to label it properly anyway so they know what's in it.


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## Sanctuary

It's not cheating....it's just a different process....each has it's pros and cons....each has it's limitations.  I do both..... I do CP in the spring and summer and MP in the fall and winter....(lol)....they way I figure....why limit yourself.....

Sanctuary


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## pyokochan

*Re:*



			
				Rebelshope said:
			
		

> I think of it more like sewing your own dress. It takes skill to make the dress even though you bought the material and the pattern. In mp you buy the base (material) and molds (pattern) but what you do with them is up to you. There is a lot of room for creativity.



Nice analogy.  I agree with this interpretation.  I know I work dang hard crafting. manipulating and bending this base to my will and imagination!  Yes I start off with a base but the rest is up to me.


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