# How to get a better lather out of goat milk soap



## dale_421 (Aug 26, 2009)

Hello,

I'm doing goat milk soap with this recipe:

Milk 52 oz
Vegetable shortening (canola and/or soy on the packaging) 96 oz
Olive Oil 42 oz
Lye 18 oz
Honey 1/4 cup

The problem is that it doesn't lather up much, it smells great but no bubbles.  I read in Casey Makela's book 'Milk-Based Soaps' to add borax to make it lather more.  Any thoughts or other suggestions would be appreciated.

Thanks!

Dale


----------



## LJA (Aug 26, 2009)

Well for starters you dont have any oils in there that make good lather.  You need coconut oil and other oils that are helpful for good lather are castor and babbasu.   Try using Soapcalc to see what oils bump up the lather for you.  Good luck!


----------



## needtosoap (Aug 26, 2009)

Hi Dale - you need to add an oil to your recipe that creates bubbles like: coconut, palm kernal, castor or Babassu. 

The recipe you posted will not have bubbles because none of those oils are "bubbly" Also, keep in mind that your milk has fats in it that aren't figured into the SAP value so you might want to keep your super fat at 5% or under. Too much SF will sometimes reduce your lather in milk soaps.

Have you ever used soapcalc? You might go there and play around with your recipe adding the above oils to see what you get.

Are you using fresh, canned or powdered goats' milk?


----------



## dale_421 (Aug 26, 2009)

Hi Judy,

Thanks for your input, I appreciate it!  To answer your questions, I've used the calculator at thesage.com   

(http://www.thesage.com/calcs/lyecalc2.php) not sure if this is the best one to use or not.   Does the one you are referring to give a 'lather' indicator?  Where do I find it?  

Also, I'm using fresh goat milk.   How would I factor in how much to use to affect the lather?  The sage.com suggests anywhere from 34 to 52 oz of milk with the other ingredients plugged in.

Regarding the oils, I'm trying to avoid palm and coconut oil if at all possible.  

Does the Borax sound like it would make any difference?   Any other natural additive that would kick it up a notch? I've also heard sugar?  


Thanks

Dale


----------



## needtosoap (Aug 26, 2009)

Hi Dale,

Go to soapcalc.net. Yes, it gives you a "bubble" factor for both creamy and bubbly. There is a small learning curve but it's fairly easy. 

As far as amount of liquid/milk soapcalc has a default of 38% but most experienced soapers use less. For now you might want to stick with the default to give you enough time to work with your soap.

All my soaps are made from fresh GM at 100% liquids. I usually keep my SF at 3% but I know some GM soapers that don't SF at all due to the amount of fats already present in the milk. A lot of the milk fat has to do with the breed of dairy goat though so it's helpful to know a bit about the breed of the herd you are getting your milk from to figure your SF.

As far as the oils, you can still use Babassu (but it's a bit pricey) and also Castor oil but if you use too much of the castor you will get a very soft soap. I wouldn't use Borax but that's me. And as far as adding sugar, trust me, you already have more than enough sugar in the milk you are using 

Good Luck!


----------



## artisan soaps (Aug 26, 2009)

..


----------



## Gramma Judy (Aug 26, 2009)

Personally, I would start with a much smaller recipe.  I have been soaping 6 months and yet to do a recipe that large.  Coconut oil will definately give you more bubbles, even though you don't want to use it.  You said you did not want to use palm oil, but how about palm kernal oil?  I think with oils you are using the most you will get is a very creamy lather as opposed to any bubbly. JMO


----------



## Ishbel (Aug 26, 2009)

Also watch out if you use fresh goats milk, mine comes from a local farm and it must have a high fat content so for all my goats milk soaps I dont SF to my usual % probably only about half.


----------



## Guest (Aug 26, 2009)

I have that same book and like the basic recipe overall but have noticed the same lack of latherbubbles.  

I modified the recipe to include coconut oil and castor oil and it lathers so much better.  Next I want to play with the superfat percentage and see what effect a lower percentage has.


----------



## dale_421 (Aug 27, 2009)

thanks to all for the advice, it looks like I've got some figuring out to do!

Dale


----------



## LJA (Aug 27, 2009)

We'd love to see pix when you get it made, dale!


----------



## tincanac (Aug 27, 2009)

I am curious to know whether borax does add lather though?  Anyone know?

How much would you add?


----------



## GoldenSeal (Sep 19, 2009)

Yes, how much would you add per pound?


----------



## Saltysteele (Sep 20, 2009)

yeah, dale!  post pix, if you're able!

we love looking at soap!  looking at soap makes us feel good inside


----------



## Lindy (Sep 20, 2009)

Hi Dale I make Castille Goat's Milk quite often and love the lather I get.  I do add a little bit of Castor Oil to help with the bigger bubbles.  I also do a GM that is a Bastille (OO & CO).

How come you don't want to use CO?  I totally get the Palm Oil issue (I don't use it myself), I wasn't aware of any CO issues.

Cheers
Lindy


----------



## Guest (Sep 20, 2009)

tincanac said:
			
		

> I am curious to know whether borax does add lather though?  Anyone know?
> 
> How much would you add?



I use 1 t borax ppo, but I don't believe it boosts lather since I have
soft water to begin with. It might boost lather in hard-water areas.
I use it as a water softener and for the "skin feel" after using the soap.


----------



## tincanac (Sep 22, 2009)

woops Castorfan - only just read this - Idont know how it escaped my attention.  Thanks for the tip - will be trying soon - I think I should stop trying to boost the lather in my soaps though cos I think if I add one more lather additive - I could have people creating their own foam parties in the shower!

Thanks for always answering my questions and such - you are loved by me for it!


----------



## Sauboon (Sep 25, 2009)

*added tip*

Canola makes a soft bar. Canola should be used in small 
amounts because canola has a short shelf life. Try coconut and castor


----------



## Sauboon (Sep 25, 2009)

Canola used in large amounts will give you a soft bar
Canola should be used in small amounts. It has a short
shelf life and your bar will be prone to rancidity


----------



## honor435 (Sep 25, 2009)

DALE
I just womdered why you dont want to use coc or palm, hard to make good soap without.


----------



## lecheymiel (Sep 25, 2009)

To have a lot of bubbles, first you need coconut oil basicly and palm kernel... but, if you want more bubbles yet, you can try butter powder (1tsbp x 1 kg)... its very good making a very soft bubbles...

 

bibs


----------



## Saltysteele (Sep 25, 2009)

as stated before, CASTOR, CASTOR, CASTOR  

i've decided, unless a special recipe is needed, at least 4% castor will be every one of my recipes.  castor and silk and sugar

man, this place is awesome.  none of my "special ingredients" would be in my soaps, had it not been for this site   :wink:  thanks, to all the experts here who have exponentially decreased the learning curve for maroons like me 

butter powder, eh?  i'll have to look into that


----------

