# Natural Deodorant Cause Swollen Lymph Nodes?



## peace-love-and-suds

I have a deodorant recipe that is all organic and aluminum free.  

Coconut Oil
Baking Soda   34.96% of recipe by weight
Arrowroot
Bees Wax
Lavender EO


Two of my customers have been using my deodorant for the last couple of months and have both broken out with swollen lymph nodes in the armpit.  I've never had this happen to any of my other customers.  They both had this experience happen at about the same time using the same batch of deodorant.  I know that swollen lymph nodes are usually a sign that the body is fighting an infection of some type.  I can't imagine this could be coming from my deodorant though there is a seemingly strong correlation.  Some people can be allergic to baking soda (though one of the customers had been using my deodorant for a while now with no issues).  When they stopped using the product, the lymph nodes started to return to normal.  What in the world could be causing this?

I was thinking perhaps a yeast infection but I don't think yeast infections cause swollen lymph nodes (though they are correlated).


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## Dahila

I do think your percentage of baking soda is too high.  When I add 2-3% of baking soda I am ok, otherwise it causes major iritation for me.  Hm lymph nodes do not swell due the deo...


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## peace-love-and-suds

I'm definitely toeing the line with the baking soda but I think it's still within acceptable levels for most people.  Is it possible for that deodorant formula to develop certain strains of bacteria?


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## Obsidian

My lymph nodes swell from store bought deodorant. I did find some info on plugged sweat glands being the culprit, maybe it the beeswax in your recipe.


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## peace-love-and-suds

I don't think it would be the bee's wax as it allows the skin to breathe.  It also creates a barrier of protection against other irritants.


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## cmzaha

I am with Dahlia with the baking soda, I use it at 7%. Beeswax is 22% in my deodorant and has cause no problems that I have be notified of


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## CanaDawn

Do you know for sure it was the lymph nodes and not another cause of localised swelling like sweat glands or sebaceous glands?


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## Susie

Axillary lymph nodes swell for many reasons.  Even nail biting can cause swelling according to one of my nursing textbooks.  If they went to an actual MD and had a diagnosis of swollen lymph nodes(which is the only way I would believe them), then that MD would have taken steps to identify the cause.

Here is a link to a partial list:

http://www.rightdiagnosis.com/symptoms/enlarged_axillary_lymph_nodes/causes.htm

Common Causes: Enlarged axillary lymph nodes

Some of the possible common medical causes of Enlarged axillary lymph nodes may include:

Carcinoma breast
Infection of the arm
Ascending lymphangitis
Infectious mononucleosis
Chicken pox
Herpes zoster
AIDS
Hodgkin's lymphoma
Non-Hodgkin's lymphoma
Cat scratch disease
Other Causes: Enlarged axillary lymph nodes

Some of the less common causes of Enlarged axillary lymph nodes may include:

Lung cancer
Leukaemia
Measeles
Mumps
Sporotrichosis
Typhoid vaccine
Small pox vaccine
Allergic reactions
Iodine
Rubella vaccine
Sulpha drugs

This is probably not the most complete list available, it does serve to give you an idea of the very slim possibility that it could be the deodorant unless they are allergic to something in it.


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## CanaDawn

That it happened to two people with the same batch and for whom removal of the deodorant caused remission of symptoms does suggest the possibility something is connected, however I, too, would want to know for sure it was a lymph node issue before I started to suggest specifically what it could be.  I think a good start to an investigation would be a diagnosis and report.  And keep in mind that all things have SOMEone that won't tolerate them, and it might be coincidental (although that often feels unlikely)


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## Susie

All she has is the verbal complaint from two people of swollen lymph nodes.  No objective proof of said swollen lymph nodes_ whatsoever._ 
The fact that it was more than one person actually makes it* less* likely to be the deodorant.  _Especially_ after looking at her ingredients.  You would be amazed at how easily suggestible people are when one person complains of some symptom.

I am sorry to offend anyone, but my nurse's BS meter is pegged out on this one.


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## CanaDawn

Susie said:


> All she has is the verbal complaint from two people of swollen lymph nodes.  No objective proof of said swollen lymph nodes_ whatsoever._



Which is why I said " I think a good start to an investigation would be a diagnosis and report."

And you have no reason to believe the two customers know about each other's reaction, do you?

As it's a new thing, from the same batch, it is well worth investigating, especially if any of the ingredients were a new bottle/bag/jar...


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## Susie

I refuse to indulge your predilection for sniping at people for having an opinion contrary to yours in order to start a battle.  I am as entitled to state my opinion as you are entitled to state yours.


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## CanaDawn

And now we both have.  

peace-love-and-suds, I hope you find out what's going on, as it must be a bit upsetting to think it could be your product that has caused the problem.  I can't see anything specific in your ingredients that immediately looks like it would cause the symptoms they describe.


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## green soap

I have been experimenting with deodorants and one of my first prototypes had baking soda, a similar % as you are using.  I used this deodorant for a couple of months with no issues, but then I started to react to the baking soda.  It was a while ago, so I don't remember if my lymph nodes felt swollen, but my skin in the underarm area developed a rash and felt badly.  

Just a heads up that it is possible to develop a reaction to baking soda after prolonged use, even if all was fine when one started using it.  Not sure about the medical explanation, but it did happen to me.  I just discontinued use and it went away.

I reformulated completely and now my herbal deodorant works well and feels fine, at least to me.  My baby sister prefers the one with the baking soda though, and she never had any reaction to it.  Effects to different deodorant ingredients are very individual, no one thing works on everybody.  Deodorants are one of the trickiest products IMO.


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## The Efficacious Gentleman

How many other people are using this batch with no reaction?  Just to get an idea of the % we are looking at.  If only these 10 people are using it then it is different than if 100 people are using it.

Has the customer who stopped using it started using it again?  If the symptoms then return, it is again an indicator.


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## Jaccart789

I think it is a reaction to the baking soda. I too am a RN in school to be a nurse practitioner, but its hard to diagnosis when there are few details. You can get a reaction the more you are exposed, so even though they didn't have a problem before and suddenly now leads me to this conclusion, especially since you have not changed your recipe. However, I am no doctor and just a RN in school. The best thing is they go see a physician.


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## Dahila

I know that a lot of people react to baking soda after some time of using.  I have a few kinds of deos to switch in that case. Some of them are free of baking soda and work pretty good. 
If I had swollen glands I would never think about going to store or the seller to complain.  I would call and make an  dr appointment to find out what is going on. 
Does anyone goes to store to return the face cream which caused some irritation ?  I do not think so.  
I am not nurse but would not ignore it either


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## CanaDawn

If I were a vendor, I would be grateful to know of possible reactions to my products, even if it turned out to be something that only a few people encountered.  It might alert me to problems with a new supplier, or a new formulation or some other change, and I could address the customers' concerns directly so they would be less likely to complain to others, and would be satisfied with customer service, etc.


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## LBussy

If the people are not related/came to her independently then it does increase the likelihood it's related.

I wonder if the batch is not infected/spoiled somehow?  It seems more likely the application of an active bacteria would cause this than two people having the same allergy all of a sudden.


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## CanaDawn

yeah, it's odd.  That's why I would want to know...even if it's not bacteria, if something has changed, this would be one possible outcome (reactions where there weren't any before).  These can be super frustrating things to track down (I've had similar mysteries in the lab where an experiment that has worked for years suddenly just....doesn't.  ARgh.....)


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## bodhi

I highly doubt it is a reaction to the baking soda.  So doubtful that i will volunteer to stand on my head and eat my shoes if it is.  A reaction to topically applied baking soda is a topical one.  I would suspect a contaminant in something.  That is if these two people dont know eachother or about the others 'reaction' and if in fact there were any swollen lymph nodes.  As someone else suggested, perhaps plugged glands or pores or maybe a local bug going around and they just happened to stop using the deodorant around the time they were getting it.


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## goji_fries

I gave a friend one of my soaps with tons of skin softening butters and vitamin E but had a fine coffee exfoliant. After grinding the armpits with this soap in this shower, they applied an alcoholy roll-on deodorant afterwards. It was like the surface of the sun. 

@OP, I feel your concern though. I've had similar happen.. I would like to make a deo but it seems very confusing.


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## mushuy

Ok I know this thread is old, but omg I am having this issue! I was just mixing oil with baking soda and using a small amount once or twice a week, kept getting minor swollen lymph nodes. Had no idea what it was from at first. I then mixed baking soda with different oils and it was still happening. Everything was super clean so no bacteria. I made many batches over time. When I stopped using the baking soda it went away. Then I decided to put a lot on for a couple days and holy cow, major irritation and horribly painful swollen lymph nodes. I know the percentage of baking soda was super high, but it does make me wonder how safe baking soda is lol. It was 100% the baking soda!


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## cmzaha

At first mine did not bother me, I now do not make or sell them. I cut to 1% baking and it still bothered me. Went back to store bought. After about 6 months mine started causing irritation


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## Eric W

My wife and I recently switched to Native Deodorant.  Unfortunately we both began getting painful underarm cysts. After my third one we discontinued use of the product and haven't had a problem since.  I'd say that it was a coincidence however since we both started getting them I don't think that it was. I'm 42 years old and I've never had this issue previously.


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## IrishLass

Welcome to the forum, Eric!  Why don't you stop by the Introduction section and tell us more about yourself!


IrishLass


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## Kelly Frizzell

Have these two customers been using your deodorant prior to this batch? Or are they new to your product? Have you or your other customers used this batch without issue? With my honey, I have to keep a sample of each “pull”, labelled with the date, etc. , in case there are issues with it. Do you have a sample that you can take to have tested?


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## cmzaha

This is a 2014 thread so is very old and several of the members including the OP are no longer active in the forum. A new thread would be advised. Opinions about using baking soda in deo sticks has changed considerably


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## Kelly Frizzell

cmzaha said:


> This is a 2014 thread so is very old and several of the members including the OP are no longer active in the forum. A new thread would be advised. Opinions about using baking soda in deo sticks has changed considerably


Oh, I did not think to check when this was originally posted. I was looking at another one this morning and it was for LOWES plans for making your own soap box. It was not until I read the one post that said they could not open the link (I could not either) that the reply stated it was a post from 2014 and so the link was likely no longer available - BUT, they added an updated link that did allow me to get to the LOWES page for making your own soap box. However, when I clicked on the page, it locked up and my server would not access it anymore. Now, I cannot find where I saw that post. I have tried searching for "Lowes...blah, blah" I have tried a number of statements. Can you help me find that post, please? 
Kelly



Kelly Frizzell said:


> Oh, I did not think to check when this was originally posted. I was looking at another one this morning and it was for LOWES plans for making your own soap box. It was not until I read the one post that said they could not open the link (I could not either) that the reply stated it was a post from 2014 and so the link was likely no longer available - BUT, they added an updated link that did allow me to get to the LOWES page for making your own soap box. However, when I clicked on the page, it locked up and my server would not access it anymore. Now, I cannot find where I saw that post. I have tried searching for "Lowes...blah, blah" I have tried a number of statements. Can you help me find that post, please? It may have been inside another post? I do not remember.
> Kelly


Also, are there recipes for deodorant here somewhere? That would be cool to try, too.


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## SoaperForLife

Do you have a control that you can send out for testing or maybe you could have one of the two people send you their deodorant for testing? Sagescript can run microbial testing for cheap.  Cindy also suggests a common usage test which might be just the ticket.  Sorry that you are going through this.  I would be really anxious and concerned if this happened to me!


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## Relle

Kelly Frizzell said:


> Oh, I did not think to check when this was originally posted. I was looking at another one this morning and it was for LOWES plans for making your own soap box. It was not until I read the one post that said they could not open the link (I could not either) that the reply stated it was a post from 2014 and so the link was likely no longer available - BUT, they added an updated link that did allow me to get to the LOWES page for making your own soap box. However, when I clicked on the page, it locked up and my server would not access it anymore. Now, I cannot find where I saw that post. I have tried searching for "Lowes...blah, blah" I have tried a number of statements. Can you help me find that post, please?
> Kelly


Here  https://www.soapmakingforum.com/threads/lowes-plans-for-soap-molds.24055/


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## Kelly Frizzell

Relle said:


> Here  https://www.soapmakingforum.com/threads/lowes-plans-for-soap-molds.24055/


That is it, thank-you. OK, how did you find it? S0, how would I be able to find things on the forum, when I want to get back to them. I am still learning how to navigate in here.


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## dibbles

And here: https://www.soapmakingforum.com/threads/de-funk-de-pits.60682/

It's a long thread, but good information on the deodorant a lot of people here are using.


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## Relle

Kelly Frizzell said:


> That is it, thank-you. OK, how did you find it? S0, how would I be able to find things on the forum, when I want to get back to them. I am still learning how to navigate in here.



So for this one - go to google.
I put in lowes plans for soap moulds/soapmakingforum.com

If looking for something specific, write down exactly what you want, then/soapmakingforum.com every time and it will come up or give you a few threads about the same subject.


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## mmcguyre

This has just happened to me after using an all natural deodorant with the same ingredients. I stopped it and still waiting for nodes to diminish. Still enlarged and painful nodes but less itching today. I'm actually wondering if bees wax clogs the sweat glands. I'm not perspiring under arms either.which is very unusual for me.


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