# Soap for elderly skin



## My Mountain Soaps (Jan 19, 2014)

Hi there, i have been asked to make soap for my husbands grand mother, who is 94 years old. I plan on making a simple hydrating soap with a rose scent. To my knowledge she has no health issues that can be affected by what little essential oils i may use. My question to you is, do you have any tips or things i may consider for making soap for advanced age skin? thanks!


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## Obsidian (Jan 19, 2014)

I have a recipe that I HP and use avocado oil for superfat at 8%-10%. My 86 year grandmother really likes it for her face, says she doesn't have to use lotion. Rice bran oil would also be a good choice for SF.
The recipe isn't anything special but I'm happy to share it. It also used some boiled and pureed potato that really makes the lather nice feeling. 

OO 50%
lard 22%
coconut oil 13%
palm kernel flakes or palm oil 10%
castor 5%


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## CaraBou (Jan 19, 2014)

Puréed potato, that's interesting!  Good luck MMS, and do good. Sounds like a very special recipient.


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## cmzaha (Jan 19, 2014)

Obsidian said:


> I have a recipe that I HP and use avocado oil for superfat at 8%-10%. My 86 year grandmother really likes it for her face, says she doesn't have to use lotion. Rice bran oil would also be a good choice for SF.
> The recipe isn't anything special but I'm happy to share it. It also used some boiled and pureed potato that really makes the lather nice feeling.
> 
> OO 50%
> ...


 
I would certainly go with palm oil and not pko with this recipe. pko will take up the Lauric (11) and Myristic (4) considerable, versus using palm which gives Lauric (6) and Myristic (4).


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## Obsidian (Jan 19, 2014)

The PKO is meant to replace some of the coconut oil for cleansing and lather, not quite sure why you would want to remove it unless you want to lower the cleansing number.


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## pamielynn (Jan 19, 2014)

Palm and PKO are not interchangeable. 

I love lard for older skin, but the high olive will be great also.


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## seven (Jan 19, 2014)

i would add a dash of rosehip oil, which is supposed to be great for mature skin. also, lotsa olive.


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## The Efficacious Gentleman (Jan 19, 2014)

Pine Tar!  Remind her of the good old days...........


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## Ellacho (Jan 19, 2014)

Adding Shea Butter would be good, too. Some people swear that Shea butter does a wonder in soap!


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## My Mountain Soaps (Jan 19, 2014)

CaraBou said:


> Puréed potato, that's interesting!  Good luck MMS, and do good. Sounds like a very special recipient.



i have lost both sets of grandparents already, i was only close to one of the four. So to me, a "Grand" any thing, is cherished. There is so much history, so much to learn from.


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## My Mountain Soaps (Jan 19, 2014)

thank you all for the tips. My normal recipe has a lot of olive oil in it, then coconut. I may spend some time on soapcalc and see what i think may be best for her. Her skin is thin, so i would imagine it may be dried out easily. But, i am going to make note of all the ingredients you have suggested, and see what will yield a conditioning bar. Once again, thanks for teaching this newbie


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## MzMolly65 (Jan 19, 2014)

I'm new to soap so have no advice of my own but I've come across this info in my research.  

Camelina oil http://www.fromnaturewithlove.com/soap/product.asp?product_id=OILCAMIL

Rice Bran oil http://www.soap-making-essentials.com/rice-bran-oil.html


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## My Mountain Soaps (Jan 19, 2014)

thanks mzmolly65, i will look those up! I am building a recipe as we speak 

that camelina oil sounds very nice! i think i will put that "I want it now!" list


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## newbie (Jan 19, 2014)

Evening Primrose oil is supposed to be good for older skin but I don't know if it would add anything substantial in a soap. Some people won't put straight oil on their skin because it feels wrong but I wonder if you made an oil blend for her with jojoba, rosehip oil and evening primrose with a touch of scent, if those types of oils would benefit her skin straight up (or in a lotion), as an addition to the nice conditioning soap you're making.


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## My Mountain Soaps (Jan 19, 2014)

that is a good idea newbie, but as she is in a full care facility, i don't know that the care takers would remember to apply the oil? even though it is a very nice place she is in. But, she AND the staff members would definitely remember to use soap that combo of oils sounds so nice i think i will try it for me! I am an avid user of oils, you get more benefit from oils than soap, when it comes to things other than cleansing. thanks again!


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## Kansas Farm Girl (Jan 19, 2014)

My normal recipe uses less than 15% coconut oil, no PKO, to keep the moisturizing factor up and the drying factor low. I would suggest that you go light on the CO. I like lard or beef tallow and olive in my soaps. I know there are more moisturizing formulas with different ingredients, just play with your calculator until you find something you think will work then I would make a small batch, try it yourself and if you think it's mild give her some and when you find one she likes you have a winner.


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## newbie (Jan 19, 2014)

Yes, I suppose in a care facility, there are too many people involved to remember to use the oil. I use oils too, like you. Other ones that I blend in are Tamanu oil and Sea buckthorn. I like trying different combos. Can't use too much of the Sea Buckthorn in a blend unless you want to look orange, though.


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## My Mountain Soaps (Jan 19, 2014)

ok, here is what i am thinking so far, these are the oils i have. 
50% olive oil
30% rose hip seed oil (Expensive i know, but it is something that i have also wanted to try for myself.)
10% rice bran oil
8% coconut oil (creates a 5 for cleanliness is the only reason it is in here- i hesitate to use more for her skin?)
2% castor oil for creaminess.
sorry EG, i dont have any pine tar


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## newbie (Jan 19, 2014)

Are you making a small batch? I have to admit, I cringed at the thought of so much rose hip oil going into a soap because of the cost but I will be very interested to hear if you think it's makes for a different bar. I don't think 8% CO will be problematic for her skin at that level. I will also be interested to hear what you find to be a minimal cure time with that level of rose hip oil. Post a picture too!


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## My Mountain Soaps (Jan 19, 2014)

yes, it will be a two pound batch, and yes, i cring at that cost too  but, i am liking the percentages that soapcalc is telling me. hardness 19 (acceptable for aging skin and bones) cleansing 5 ( wont be too harsh on her skin), conditioning 77 ( love that number!  ) bubbly 7, and creamy 16. i want to kill two birds with one stone, make a soap that will be good for her, and to experiment with a soap high in rose hip seed oil.


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## Obsidian (Jan 19, 2014)

That does sound nice. If you aren't against lard, you might try dding around 10%. It will help with hardness but is super mild and creamy.
You can use 50% coconut milk for liquid to increase creamy lather and it will boost the SF by 5% or so. My weird facial bar I made has coco milk and its fabulous.


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## My Mountain Soaps (Jan 19, 2014)

i havent experimented with lard, and the two times i used milk it failed horribly. I may leave those for the second go round  thanks though!


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## newbie (Jan 19, 2014)

I have never made a soap with a hardness level that low. I hope you will report on your batch because I will surely be watching for it. Do you think you would be able to post some pictures of the lather too?

I like adding some coconut milk too, although I don't sub it for full water. It's not the same as animal milk, or at least I don't think so, in how the animal milks can burn or give that toasty smell. If you like your recipe you can always consider adding a few additional luxuries the next time around.

Please let us know about how this goes!


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## My Mountain Soaps (Jan 19, 2014)

i still have to order the rose fo oil that i want to use, and cant do that till pay day. but i will definitely try to remember to post pics in a few weeks when it is cured.


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## Kansas Farm Girl (Jan 20, 2014)

The shampoo recipe I have been using for the last yr has a hardness level of 20 and conditioning at 77, the batch I have curing is at 16 and 82. I haven't had any problem with the first one with the low hardness level. Can't wait to try the new batch to see how they compare. If I don't like it as shampoo I can use it as a facial bar


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## cmzaha (Jan 20, 2014)

Obsidian said:


> The PKO is meant to replace some of the coconut oil for cleansing and lather, not quite sure why you would want to remove it unless you want to lower the cleansing number.



Pko as much the same properties as coconut. It adds cleansing and bubbles, but there is just not much point in adding both pko and co. Palm on the other hand does add some nice properties to the soap plus makes a hard bar of soap. For my older skin I use a soap with very low lauric and myristic. I love avocado, sunflower and canola in my mild soaps. I like to control the mildness of my soap with my formulas not with superfatting. I superfat very low other than salt bars



newbie said:


> Evening Primrose oil is supposed to be good for older skin but I don't know if it would add anything substantial in a soap. Some people won't put straight oil on their skin because it feels wrong but I wonder if you made an oil blend for her with jojoba, rosehip oil and evening primrose with a touch of scent, if those types of oils would benefit her skin straight up (or in a lotion), as an addition to the nice conditioning soap you're making.


Evening Primrose is very nice in lotion and balms. I save these type of oils for leave on products



My Mountain Soaps said:


> i havent experimented with lard, and the two times i used milk it failed horribly. I may leave those for the second go round  thanks though!



Lard makes a fantastic soap. I personally would leave out the the rose hip oil in a wash off product. Apricot Kernel oil would be a good replacement for aging skin and is very nice in soap. Lard, canola or sunflower, apricot kernel all make wonder mild soap and avocado with avocado puree is fantastic. Mix you avocado puree with goat's milk and add after adding in the lye solution


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## seven (Jan 24, 2014)

cmzaha said:


> Evening Primrose is very nice in lotion and balms. I save these type of oils for leave on products



I second this. I made a beeswax balm with olive, rosehip, evening primrose and apricot kernel and i'm loving it! I use it for a facial night cream.


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## CherylS (Feb 8, 2014)

cmzaha said:


> I would certainly go with palm oil and not pko with this recipe. pko will take up the Lauric (11) and Myristic (4) considerable, versus using palm which gives Lauric (6) and Myristic (4).


what does it mean take up PKO.   

I use Palm Kernel oils and I don't know what the difference is in flakes and oil in soap.


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## jade-15 (Feb 8, 2014)

Palm oil will give lower lauric and myristic than palm kernel oil.


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## CherylS (Feb 8, 2014)

jade-15 said:


> Palm oil will give lower lauric and myristic than palm kernel oil.



so in what way does this affect the final outcome of a bar of soap?


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## DeeAnna (Feb 8, 2014)

PKO, coconut, babassu -> More lauric and myristic acids = higher cleansing number, higher bubbly number. More stripping of oils from the skin. More water soluble so doesn't last quite so long.

Palm, lard, tallow -> More palmitic and stearic acids = lower cleansing number, higher creamy number. Less water soluble, longer lasting, milder to the skin. Also these three fats, and palm and lard especially, have a good dab of oleic acid which adds conditioning properties to the soap -> less drying.


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## AnnaMarie (Feb 9, 2014)

I recently made a batch of soap with 30% (yes 30) rose hip oil with no apologies.  It is luxurious and rich and I love it.  Have fun experimenting!
Cheers!
Anna Marie


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## My Mountain Soaps (Feb 9, 2014)

Thanks AnnaMarie, i still havent been able to re-stock my supplies, this coming paycheck maybe. a high percentage of Rosehip seed oil is one of my bucket list soaps. i cant wait to make it


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## CherylS (Feb 9, 2014)

DeeAnna said:


> PKO, coconut, babassu -> More lauric and myristic acids = higher cleansing number, higher bubbly number. More stripping of oils from the skin. More water soluble so doesn't last quite so long.
> 
> Palm, lard, tallow -> More palmitic and stearic acids = lower cleansing number, higher creamy number. Less water soluble, longer lasting, milder to the skin. Also these three fats, and palm and lard especially, have a good dab of oleic acid which adds conditioning properties to the soap -> less drying.



thank  you so much for that explanation. you know when you learn to make soap, They don't tell you how or why to use this or that . Just use the soap calculator and experiment but when you don't understand the difference, to the person, it seems okay.. 

thank you. Now i can't wait to get rid of this PKO.   
I do have some lard in there so ... and I thought coconut was more drying then palm kernel that is why I bought such a big batch. 

I thought it was the coconut that would dry the skin out,   Just as bad as using store bought,


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## new12soap (Feb 9, 2014)

I use PKO, usually with coconut to give soap bubbles, just not too much of either one so the soap isn't too drying. The idea (for me, anyway) is to get a nice _blend_ of oils so you get the best properties in the soap. Creamy, conditioning, bubbly etc, it's all about balance.

As the original poster was talking about soap for a very mature grandmother, I think they wanted to keep the bubbly cleansing lower and get as creamy and conditioning and gentle as possible, in which case yes I would opt for more lard or palm and olive and less or no coconut or pko.


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## CherylS (Feb 9, 2014)

I think we all should have that kind of soap. no matter what age.


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## paillo (Feb 9, 2014)

Someone else mentioned a shampoo bar, and I second the suggestion. Low cleansing and very gentle, great for wintertime skin bars, or those with dry skin. I also love French pink clay for sensitive and mature skin, and coconut milk. I also save my really expensive oils for leave-on products, but love the idea of one in soap. Agree with the suggestion of apricot kernel oil, too. I'd use some shea, palm, a higher percentage of castor, skip the PKO. I love an EO blend of rose geranium, frankincense, rosemary and lavender in soaps for sensitive and aging skin, but your rose FO sounds like a lovely idea.


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## CherylS (Feb 9, 2014)

I got the part where your computer was acting up but if you have a recipe with not too many specialty oils I'd love to try it out. being 59. I don't want to have rough skin if I can prevent it, or at least rely the onset of it.. Bad enough my hair if falling out. don't  want to totally look like that little Yoda on Star Wars


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## cmzaha (Feb 16, 2014)

Millersoap.com has a recipe for a Canolive II which is a great recipe. I received one in a soap swap used it off and on for a year as I wanted to see if it would acquire dos. Well it did not and I used it to the last sliver. It is a very gentle soap and of course the percentages can be tweaked on some of the oils as with any recipe


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## CherylS (Feb 17, 2014)

yea, I'm going to get the supplies and make some as my next batch..  thank you.


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## seven (Feb 17, 2014)

cmzaha said:


> Millersoap.com has a recipe for a Canolive II which is a great recipe. I received one in a soap swap used it off and on for a year as I wanted to see if it would acquire dos. Well it did not and I used it to the last sliver. It is a very gentle soap and of course the percentages can be tweaked on some of the oils as with any recipe



i am very curious about that recipe. been meaning to try it, perhaps i should.. soon. also, i noticed how kathy used a lot of soybean and canola in her recipes, but w/o the DOS problems.


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## CherylS (Feb 17, 2014)

I don't understand that either I think a lot of  my old soaps with Canola gave me DOS. .Hate that.


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## My Mountain Soaps (Mar 15, 2014)

Ok, so the ingredients finally came in, and i finally made the soap. Here is the pic, but do you see the liquid beads on top? i have never had that before. I got it on skin and me being a dork, wound up getting it on my lip, where both instantly told me it was lye. burned like a monkey. but i am ok. I have never had lye beads form like this can someone please explain the process? I am thinking i may have my FO ratio off, i forgot and treated it like an EO, and forgot to look at WSP's usage recommendation. This is my first FO to work with. Here is the recipe:
rosehip seed oil 30%
olive oil 50%
castor 2%
rice bran oil 2%
coconut oil 8%
water 8.6 oz
lye 2.88 oz
this recipe was built in soapcalc. then i added .5 oz rose garden FO. Also Should i cut this now, or wait for the lye beads to soak back in and cut tomorrow? or will they even do that?

ps, i figured the soap may get hot during curing being it is an FO in a wood mold, so it was not insulated, and it was left on an open shelf. This morning when i checked it, no lye beads, but this afternoon they had formed.


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## eyeroll (Mar 15, 2014)

I've had this happen before and they ended up soaking back in. I would wait (agonizing, I know).


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## cmzaha (Mar 15, 2014)

I would say it overheated and the beads were oil which would still burn. The rose fo could overheat


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## CherylS (Mar 15, 2014)

you set that up so beautifully.  I hope it works. I think it will. Just let it set up.  Be patient


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## My Mountain Soaps (May 20, 2014)

Thanks so much everyone, the beads did soak back in, but it was still a bit too soft to cut tonight (Sort of like a sponge feeling). I will look again in the morning. WSP rose garden FO is SUPER strong. scent didnt morph either, i hope it wont be so strong when i go to use it. I plan on keeping a bar myself, but i wont if it is still strong. I am not a fan of scent. Anyway, i'll post pics again when cut and then used, ill let you know how it works.

well i forgot to post pics, it wound up curing in block form for another week or so. then cured four weeks additionally. It wound up being a super soft bar, but SUPER luxurious. i love this soap. So did my husbands grandmother. anyway, thanks for reading!


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## Relle (May 20, 2014)

Just reading your recipe - have I missed something or not ? Your percentages don't add up to 100. I only get 92%., which means you were short on your oil.

 rosehip seed oil 30%
olive oil 50%
castor 2%
rice bran oil 2%
coconut oil 8%
water 8.6 oz
lye 2.88 oz


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## My Mountain Soaps (May 20, 2014)

oops, must not have entered it right, or gone back and edited it once i ran it through soap calc. bump the rice bran up to 10% and the others are right. good catch . its super soft. hardness 19, cleansing 5, conditioning 77, bubbly 7, creamy 16, iodine 12, ins 85.


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## seven (May 21, 2014)

wow, lotsa rosehip! this is one expensive soap, i hope the recipient is happy with it


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## My Mountain Soaps (May 21, 2014)

oh yeah it is. This is one i will only make for myself, or his grandmother. Everyone else who requests it will definitely have to cover costs on it. if i actually sold my soaps, i think this one would be sitting on the shelf for a very long time due to its price!!!!  i think the next batch (now that i have this one off my bucket list) will have a little less rose hip oil, and something else added or increased to harden it up a bit, just so the bar will last a little longer.


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## newbie (May 21, 2014)

I've been wondering how this soap was! How was the lather? Do you think it will harden up more with more time with 50% OO? I'm glad you liked it so much, given its precious nature. One to hold back just for you and grandma.


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## My Mountain Soaps (May 23, 2014)

the lather is awesome. extremly cream and smooth. the only downfall aside from cost that is, is that the bar is hard to hold onto! i drop it atleast once each shower  that is a minor issue. i really love this soap. im sure it would harden up over time, but it would have to be a very long time. I think olive oil would be a great next project. thanks for the idea!


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## RiverRose (Jun 9, 2016)

My Mountain Soaps said:


> that is a good idea newbie, but as she is in a full care facility, i don't know that the care takers would remember to apply the oil?!


It depends on the facility. I work at one, and we will make sure everything they want in their daily routine gets done. We will do their makeup for them if that's what they want. But not all places are as awesome as ours


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## Susie (Jun 9, 2016)

RiverRose said:


> It depends on the facility. I work at one, and we will make sure everything they want in their daily routine gets done. We will do their makeup for them if that's what they want. But not all places are as awesome as ours



A facility that allows time for employees to do resident's makeup is by far the exception in my experience.  You do work at an awesome facility!


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## BrightBox (Jun 9, 2016)

My elderly father loves his 100% Olive Oil Castile bar I make him. He has terrible eczema. I have never tried it but I have seen other soapers make a Castile with Calendula infused water.  Very gentle and good for the skin.


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