# Cream soap ready, now what?



## Obsidian (Aug 13, 2015)

My cream soap is now 6 months old, it still has a fairly sticky consistency and leaves a bit of a waxy feel on the skin. 

I plan on using some for foaming sugar scrub, what are some other products it might be good for?

I was wondering if a little liquid soap whipped in would make it silkier/less sticky? It whipped up nice, better then it has been but I still don't care for it.


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## Obsidian (Aug 13, 2015)

You know what, I think I'm going to toss this. My hands are so icky after using this, they are incredibly dry and feel like they've been dipped in wax then rolled around in dust. 

It took two scrubbings with a scratchy coffee soap to get the residue off my skin. Even with body butter and hand lotion on, they still feel gritty


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## IrishLass (Aug 13, 2015)

LOL 

I did the same thing to my cream soap- I tossed it out on it's ear! It was the only batch I ever made, and to be honest, I've never had the desire to make another....and I'm 100% certain that I don't think I ever will. lol It just wasn't my cup of tea. I'm much more happy with the thick and creamy coco-shea liquid soap that I make via the glycerin method.


IrishLass


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## Obsidian (Aug 13, 2015)

I don't really like liquid soap either. Its not as drying but its way too thin, I like really thick soap. I wonder if I can whip my LS paste into a cream:eh:


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## IrishLass (Aug 13, 2015)

I like really thick liquid soap, too. Actually, that's one of the reasons why I first tried my hand at cream soap- I thought it would give me the kind of really thick creamy liquid soap I craved. But alas- that wasn't to be.  

On a happy note, though, my cocoa-shea soap made via the glycerin method is really thick and is just the thing I was seeking after. I feel that if it were any thicker, it might have trouble dispensing out of my pump nozzle. lol It's superfatted at about 5% to 6% (with PS80 to emulsify)and has become a favorite of the family. I never need to use lotion after washing my hands with it. 


IrishLass


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## DeeAnna (Aug 13, 2015)

Your LS paste probably won't be stable if whipped, Obsidian, but I can appreciate why you want to do that. The one batch of cream soap I've made is not particularly appealing either. The soap has a waxy, stringy texture. Ugh. I have tried mixing the soap to lighten it with or without additives that I hoped might lighten it up, but it invariably returns to this same unappealing texture. The one time I added sugar to it to make a sugar scrub, the scrub also had that same waxy play-do texture, although it lost the stringy-ness. I really liked my emulsified scrub recipe (oils, sugar, emulsifier) far better than the cream soap scrub. The lather of the cream soap is dense and cushiony -- it's a decent shave soap with enough water -- but it feels powdery on my skin and doesn't rinse cleanly. I haven't gotten rid of the soap, but I'm puzzled about what to do with it too.


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## Obsidian (Aug 13, 2015)

Your soap sounds just like mine, I have to wonder if you used Lindy's recipe too? The weird powdery feeling after rinsing is bizarre and awful. I had to give in and use store bought lotion that would leave a thicker barrier then the lotion I make.

I figured the ls paste wouldn't be stable but I bet it would be easier to dilute when I'm ready.


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## Saponista (Aug 13, 2015)

Could you make a beldi type paste instead? I saw a lady on one of the fb pages making something that was like a cross between beldi and cream soap. It was the beldi without the olives and the cream soap without the super cream. She wasn't willing to give up her recipe unfortunately but it looked like a really thick paste but not white like cream soap, more translucent.

She basically said she supercreamed with something different but I can't remember what *goes to try and find it*


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## Obsidian (Aug 13, 2015)

I tried beldi once, the recipe I had was mostly OO so it didn't lather very well. I definitely liked it better then the cream soap though. I could fiddle around with the recipe, see what I could come up with.

this is the recipe I used. Replaced the mustard and camelina with more OO and avocado. I should try again with a bit more CO to boost the lather some. It really was a nice gentle soap.


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## DeeAnna (Aug 13, 2015)

No, it's not Lindys recipe. I was trying to make a shave soap based on an old recipe from 1912. The original was a bar (NaOH) shave soap with 25% coconut, 75% tallow. I tweaked it to use NaOH and KOH and more water plus added glycerin so it would have a cream soap consistency. 

I have to say it would probably be fine with less water and less glycerin so it would be more firm. The use of a brush would help to control the amount of soap used and to fluff and lighten the lather. If i would use this cream soap as a shave soap, I really think a brush would make all the difference.

The soft paste consistency of cream soap makes it easy to use a generous amount and the sticky consistency means it's harder to rinse off. That's why I think you and I are getting that powdery feel ... there really is a residue left on the skin.

Not sure about all of this, but I really do think cream soap is not everyone's cuppa tea. I'm glad I make liquid, bar, and shave soap, but I'm not so sure about cream soap.


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## Obsidian (Aug 14, 2015)

I was wondering if you could make a cream soap with all hard oils and skip the steric all together. 

I did try mine today with a shave brush, it was really easy to over load the brush but I eventually got it right and it gave a good shave. I much prefer my soft tallow based shave soap though, just easier to work with and to make.

I went ahead and whipped my 100% OO ls paste. It took a bit since it was rock hard and I had to break it into tiny chunks and slowly add water until it soaked up enough to get soft and mixable. I had to add a lot more water then I though I would but I ended up with a very fluffy but oddly dry cream. Almost like cold mashed potatoes. I covered it for the night, we'll see how it is tomorrow.

I don't expect it to stay "creamed" but as long as its soft enough I can use it as is, I'll be happy. I'll probably put most of it away, see what it looks like in a month or two.


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## Saponista (Aug 14, 2015)

I'm so annoyed I can't find the post now. Sorry guys


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## DeeAnna (Aug 14, 2015)

I'm glad I'm not the only one with that problem, Saponista!


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## Saponista (Aug 17, 2015)

I found the post, but it's on facebook and I can't for the life of me find out how to copy a link of it or anything. 

Penny Krier
5 August at 19:54
Calendula infused whipped honey facial soap paste....
Ten pounds made and sequestering now.
This had no added scent but smell just like honey.
I make this like a beldi soap .
It accepts additive well and makes a great foaming facial cleanser and sugar scrub .
With mango butter, organic extra virgin coconut, organic sunflower high O, jojoba and castor oils .

Penny Krier - Adelina , it is like a cream soap!
But I don't super cream it , I super gel it.
I whip it after cook to get it all smooth and I sequestered .
What I don't do , is whip in a bunch of air and stearic, so it stays a paste.
But like cream soap versus regular soap paste, I use the dual lye .

Here is a pic of it 
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?...t=pcb.871488042944008&type=1&relevant_count=2

I wonder if the stearic is what makes cream soap feel waxy. I am planning on having a go at something like this as it looks lovely and I want a facial soap.


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## DeeAnna (Aug 17, 2015)

Yes, I really do think the waxy texture comes from the stearic soap (in the soap recipe) and stearic acid (added as the supercream, if used that way). I see this texture in my shave soap that also has a high% of stearic acid. I also think you have to include the % of palmitic acid in the recipe, since it contributes a waxy texture as well. Paradoxically these fatty acids are also the ingredients that make cream soap ... creamy. 

Saponista -- Your quote from Penny is interesting, but it raises as many questions in my mind as it gives answers! The mango will contribute stearic, but how much would depend on the % of mango butter in her recipe. I also don't understand her "supergel" comment -- without any supporting info, the term doesn't mean much to me. Maybe someone else knows what she's talking about?

Anyways, from what I've gathered, if the stearic + palmitic content falls too low, the cream soap will tend to separate out and/or become translucent. The typical cream soap recipes I've looked at have a combined stearic + palmitic from 50% to 70% with about equal parts of both acids. My cream/shave soap is about 25% palmitic and 15% stearic = 40% combined S+P acids, so it's lower in these acids than other recipes, but the cream texture has remained stable over the months I've messed with it. Even with its lower S+P content, I still don't like it.

There are some recipes on Snowdrift Farm website (now defunct, but you can access the website via the Wayback Machine) that are even lower in stearic + palmitic. These recipes have about 30% combined stearic + palmitic, with about 2 parts palmitic to 1 part stearic. A couple of people who tried the Snowdrift recipes report having trouble with the soap separating out into translucent and creamy layers. So there's a lower range where cream soap ain't ~cream~ soap anymore.


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## Saponista (Aug 17, 2015)

I think she doesn't add anything at super cream stage like you would with regular cream soap and just whips it up? Maybe I misunderstood......


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## Obsidian (Aug 17, 2015)

I'm unable to view the photo, it must be in a group I'm not part of. I really sounds like her soap is just a paste like beldi, not sure why she even calls it a cream soap.
The LS paste that I whipped didn't stay creamy, as it rested it went back translucent and resembles beldi now, I haven't tried adding anything to it but I'm sure it would make a fine sugar scrub except its 100% OO which I dislike.

I tried making a shave soap with lard instead of tallow, its lathers just fine but doesn't have the slip needed to be a good shave soap. I wonder if I could add glycerin and a bit of water to it and whip it? It was made with 100% KOH, Palmitic is 14 and Stearic is 42. It was a 8 oz batch, any suggestions on glycerin amounts?


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## cmzaha (Aug 17, 2015)

I make a dead sea salt scrub with cream soap that is quite nice


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## DeeAnna (Aug 18, 2015)

I made a test batch of sugar scrub with my cream soap a couple of months ago. Looked at it again the other day. I'm obviously not formulating it well enough to have a nice texture for use on the skin, Carolyn. It was cream soap, a little glycerin, and enough sugar to form a granular paste. When first made, it has a nice texture, but it firms up when it stands for awhile.

When I last looked at it, the scrub had a firm play-dough consistency that I had to work between my fingers before it was soft enough to spread onto the skin. It wasn't particularly sticky either, so it wanted to fall off the skin rather than stay put. I would rather have it be a thick, rather sticky spreadable paste right out of the jar. Should I be looking at adding an oil vs. the glycerin?


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## cmzaha (Aug 22, 2015)

My salt scrub starts with a cream soap made with 49% stearic 10.5 % palm, 12.8% coconut, castor, shea, avocado, coco butter. I also add in 1% btms (batch weight, optional)  I whip it with LS using as little as possible. Add in my dead sea salt, 5% jojoba oil, again batch weight, about 1% polysorbate 80, LS to loosen it up. After all that I mix up 5% SLSA, a liquid foam booster LS and 3% glycerin with a mixer then stir it into my scrub. :razz: all measurements are approximate for the scrub. Sometimes I tweak a bit :razz: Did I mention that I just do not mix sugar or salt in the cream soap!! Oops forgot to say the water is actually aloe juice and I preserve with gemall plus or phenonip using max recommended use


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