What's this scent??

[emi]

I am new to soap making and am interested in knowing more about combining oils to create new ones. I bought a set of I think it was 10 different essential oils, but I"m a little paralyzed as to what to mix with what. I also am very much wanting to create or mimic the smell of a particular soap, available nation-wide. Trader Joe's Oatmeal Ginger exfoliating soap. I absolutely love this soap and want to re-create it's lather, texture, as well as it's scent. I'm much too much of a beginner to be able to use a bar and know what's in it. I've only made 3 batches so far! If I hadn't seen the ingredients to this Oatmeal ginger soap, I would've thought there was some kind of milk used. When you rub the wet bar across your wet skin, it leaves a luxurious white milky film that rinses easily and leaves my skin soft. The ingredient list says:
“Contains: pure vegetable oils (olive, palm, and coconut oils, oatmeal, fragrances and/or essential oils.” which of course is little to no help, scent-wise anyway.
It doesn't really smell like ginger, but instead has that really clean smell. not flowery, not fruity, not minty, or citrusy. Or maybe some undertone of citrus. and maybe some kind of herbal note, but not anything I know of in particular like lavender or basil. Sometimes soap that say "green tea" on them often has this nice smell I'm referring to of the oatmeal ginger soap. But I always think, how those "green tea" soaps smell nothing like what real Japanese green tea smell like. It's quite nice, but i don't think real green tea smell is anything I'd want in a soap. I just can't tell what it could possibly be. And if anyone might have any insight I'd really appreciate it. On the scent as well as the recipe or properties for the bar!

 

[BattleGnome]

I'd probably start with:
60% olive
20% palm
20% coconut

I don't use palm and can't truly advise you on how it feels but 20% is as reasonable place to start as any. You probably won't want to go over 20% coconut due to the cleansing. You mention a film, that leads me to think the oleic acid in the olive, but I could be wrong.

Your scent description made me think of patchouli rain from Brambleberry. Maybe you are on the right track with a citrus note? For all we know, the source company might share a supplier with Brambleberry and get a similar fragrance. You can look online for a dupe/fragrance recipe. If you like it then there is a chance someone has already done the work.

To use the oils you already have. Put one drop of ginger on one end of a qtip and one drip of citrus/patchouli/whatever on the other. Put that qtip in a plastic sandwich bag and leave it for an hour. When you check it you should have a direction to go on.

 

[WeaversPort]

You could use oat milk for your water, it would give you some of the oat without having to use oatmeal in the beginning.

http://www.lovinsoap.com/2017/02/making-diy-oat-milk-for-handmade-soap/

Also, I did some poking around. You mentioned a scent that reminds you of green tea scented things. Brambleberry has a white tea and ginger fragrance, that talks about a blend of citrus (with Bergamot) and warmer notes. The reviews generally say that it doesn't smell strongly of ginger, but ends up being a light, clean scent.

https://www.brambleberry.com/White-Tea-Ginger-Fragrance-Oil-P3964.aspx

(As an FYI - I haven't smelled either the fragrance oil or the Trader Joe's soap, so can't speak to either with any authority..)

 

[emi]

I'd probably start with:
60% olive
20% palm
20% coconut

I don't use palm and can't truly advise you on how it feels but 20% is as reasonable place to start as any. You probably won't want to go over 20% coconut due to the cleansing. You mention a film, that leads me to think the oleic acid in the olive, but I could be wrong.

Your scent description made me think of patchouli rain from Brambleberry. Maybe you are on the right track with a citrus note? For all we know, the source company might share a supplier with Brambleberry and get a similar fragrance. You can look online for a dupe/fragrance recipe. If you like it then there is a chance someone has already done the work.

To use the oils you already have. Put one drop of ginger on one end of a qtip and one drip of citrus/patchouli/whatever on the other. Put that qtip in a plastic sandwich bag and leave it for an hour. When you check it you should have a direction to go on.

Thanks so much for your reply. That q-tip idea is brilliant! I would've never thought to do that. And what is a dupe/fragrance recipe? I also don't use palm. Although I've heard of sustainable palm. Is there really such a thing? meaning, is it really sustainable? I'm kind of suspicious and stay away from it altogether. I've looked on oil charts to find a good substitute which shows high oleic acid and palmitic acid. The oils that also have high oleic and palmitic are tallow, lard, and coco butter. I also found rice bran oil with high numbers which I haven't used yet. But none of those come close to the high number of palmitic acid that palm oil has. I'm also vegetarian, so I also avoid animal ingredients. So do you think coco butter or rice bran oil is a good substitute for palm oil? Are there other things to pay attention to other than acid content? What do you use? And what do you think of "sustainable" palm oil?

You could use oat milk for your water, it would give you some of the oat without having to use oatmeal in the beginning.

http://www.lovinsoap.com/2017/02/making-diy-oat-milk-for-handmade-soap/

Also, I did some poking around. You mentioned a scent that reminds you of green tea scented things. Brambleberry has a white tea and ginger fragrance, that talks about a blend of citrus (with Bergamot) and warmer notes. The reviews generally say that it doesn't smell strongly of ginger, but ends up being a light, clean scent.

https://www.brambleberry.com/White-Tea-Ginger-Fragrance-Oil-P3964.aspx

(As an FYI - I haven't smelled either the fragrance oil or the Trader Joe's soap, so can't speak to either with any authority..)

Thanks so much for the recommendation! I'll definitely check out that Brambleberry scent. I've noticed that about ginger essential oils too, that they don't really smell like ginger. The soap bar I was talking about doesn't smell like ginger either. And that oatmilk is really smart. Oatmeal has a lot of moisturizing properties which I love. The milk idea is a great way to get more oatmeal in there and not just the bits for exfoliation. Thank you!

And I was wondering about essential oils vs fragrance oils. I've done some reading on it and I understand that essential oils are drawn directly from the thing by extracting its oils. Fragrance oils are synthetically made in a lab, completely artificial to mimic the smells of particular things. Am I correct so far? I had one soap maker tell me that she actually preferred fragrance oils because they are made for these kinds of applications and won't throw off a recipe and has better more concentrated smells that won't fade away. That makes sense, but I somehow still have a hard time accepting that I'm inhaling and enjoying some chemical concoction created in a lab, instead of nature. I almost wish I didn't have an issue with it, because I'm having a hard time finding lemon verbena essential oil that actually smells like lemon verbena, which I used to own a plant of and know what it really smells like. I bought a bottle of Essential Trading Post essential oil of lemon verbena, but it was incredibly week and barely smelled of lemon. It had a more floral smell with a hint of citrus. And it was just generally very weak. Any suggestion on where to get good lemon verbena essential oil, and thoughts on essential vs fragrance?

 

[cmzaha]

Thanks so much for your reply. That q-tip idea is brilliant! I would've never thought to do that. And what is a dupe/fragrance recipe? I also don't use palm. Although I've heard of sustainable palm. Is there really such a thing? meaning, is it really sustainable? I'm kind of suspicious and stay away from it altogether. I've looked on oil charts to find a good substitute which shows high oleic acid and palmitic acid. The oils that also have high oleic and palmitic are tallow, lard, and coco butter. I also found rice bran oil with high numbers which I haven't used yet. But none of those come close to the high number of palmitic acid that palm oil has. I'm also vegetarian, so I also avoid animal ingredients. So do you think coco butter or rice bran oil is a good substitute for palm oil? Are there other things to pay attention to other than acid content? What do you use? And what do you think of "sustainable" palm oil?

Rice Bran Oil is not a substitute for Palm Oil. Our tiny use of Palm Oil is not going to affect anything on the large scope. Cocobutter will help but will cut lather. When I have a customer ask for a vegan soap with no palm I tell them they will not get it at my booth. It just will not make the quality of soap I make and sell. Rice bran oil is a better substitute for Olive Oil.

And I was wondering about essential oils vs fragrance oils. I've done some reading on it and I understand that essential oils are drawn directly from the thing by extracting its oils. Fragrance oils are synthetically made in a lab, completely artificial to mimic the smells of particular things. Am I correct so far? I had one soap maker tell me that she actually preferred fragrance oils because they are made for these kinds of applications and won't throw off a recipe and has better more concentrated smells that won't fade away. That makes sense, but I somehow still have a hard time accepting that I'm inhaling and enjoying some chemical concoction created in a lab, instead of nature. I almost wish I didn't have an issue with it, because I'm having a hard time finding lemon verbena essential oil that actually smells like lemon verbena, which I used to own a plant of and know what it really smells like. I bought a bottle of Essential Trading Post essential oil of lemon verbena, but it was incredibly week and barely smelled of lemon. It had a more floral smell with a hint of citrus. And it was just generally very weak. Any suggestion on where to get good lemon verbena essential oil, and thoughts on essential vs fragrance?

There is really nothing wrong with lab created fragrance oils. Some do actually contain Essential oils and yes they usually stick better than EO's in soap. Essential oils is not the answer for everyone, I for one, am allergic to some essential oils and do better with synthetic. Not everything in nature is safe. Think Belladonna, beautiful, but potentially deadly plants.

As for duplication the fragrance I wish you luck, there are thousands of fragrances and I think you would be incredibly lucky to hit on the scent. The ingredient list notes that it could contain fragrance oil.

The creamy you see on your skin is high olive oil. Olive oil does not make bubbly soap but creamy. Milk in soap does not add lather

 

[emi]

Thanks for your input. It was very helpful.

 

[dixiedragon]

Generally speaking, lard, tallow and palm are considered "interchangeable" by soapers. My local zoo has an exhibit on sustainable palm.

Re: Fragrance - a LOT of folks come here with the idea that they only want to use natural colors and fragrances - then they the see and hear about what can be done with artificial colors and fragrances.

If that soap from TJ had only natural fragrances you can bet your bottom they'd be tooting that horn. The fragrance you are smelling is probably mostly artificial, with just enough natural fragrance so they can put it on the label.

 

[Arimara]

Generally speaking, lard, tallow and palm are considered "interchangeable" by soapers. My local zoo has an exhibit on sustainable palm.

Re: Fragrance - a LOT of folks come here with the idea that they only want to use natural colors and fragrances - then they the see and hear about what can be done with artificial colors and fragrances.

If that soap from TJ had only natural fragrances you can bet your bottom they'd be tooting that horn. The fragrance you are smelling is probably mostly artificial, with just enough natural fragrance so they can put it on the label.

Building: I'm one of the few people you'll notice who will generally avoid colorants. Natural colorants, I admit, I can be pretty lazy about using them. Micas, oxides and the like, I still want to figure out which ones I can safely use without my skin getting itchy and red. It would be expensive to carry out such an experiment but it might be worthwhile. There's only one soap that I've used that did not irritate my skin and the lady uses colorants.

FOs vs EOs, I just took a plunge and found that WHERE you get you scents from truly matters. Nurture, Brambleberry, and Save on Scents are three suppliers I buy FOs from and their scents have not had ill effects on me and mine. If I were to get my scents from a certain supplier in my older haunts, my mother would react to that scent upon my opening the bottle near her.