What are the Benefits From Separating the Fats in Tallow?

[Soaper2024]

Are there any situations where having *only* the saturated OR unsaturated fats from tallow is more desirable than both together? (Edit: As in a specific 'group' of fats, either saturated or unsaturated)

Me: What are the saturated and unsaturated fats in tallow
What are their percentages
What qualities does each group and individual fat bring to soap

ChatGPT4.0:

Tallow, which is rendered beef or mutton fat, is commonly used in soap making due to its unique fat profile and properties. The fat content in tallow consists of both saturated and unsaturated fats, each contributing different qualities to the soap.

Fatty Acid Composition of Tallow​

Tallow typically contains about 50-55% saturated fats and 40-45% unsaturated fats. Here's a breakdown of the key fatty acids in tallow:

Saturated Fats (about 50-55% of tallow):​

1. Palmitic Acid (C16:0) – 20-30%
2. Stearic Acid (C18:0) – 10-20%
3. Myristic Acid (C14:0) – 2-4%
4. Lauric Acid (C12:0) – 0-1%

Unsaturated Fats (about 40-45% of tallow):​

1. Oleic Acid (C18:1) – 40-45% (monounsaturated)
2. Linoleic Acid (C18:2) – 2-4% (polyunsaturated)

Qualities of Saturated vs Unsaturated Fats in Soap​

Saturated Fats (like Palmitic and Stearic Acid):​

• Firmness & Hardness: Saturated fats help produce a hard, long-lasting bar of soap. The high content of palmitic and stearic acids makes the soap firm and gives it a solid structure, which is essential for long-lasting bars.
• Lather Stability: These fats contribute to a stable, dense lather. They are known for enhancing the soap's ability to hold its shape and produce a rich, creamy lather.
• Moisturizing Properties: While saturated fats are generally less moisturizing compared to unsaturated fats, stearic acid can still provide a protective barrier that locks moisture into the skin.
• Cleanliness: Saturated fats are effective at cleansing and help the soap retain its cleaning power even as it hardens.

Unsaturated Fats (like Oleic and Linoleic Acid):​

• Moisturizing & Conditioning: Unsaturated fats, especially oleic acid, are more moisturizing. Oleic acid helps the soap penetrate the skin, providing better hydration and leaving the skin feeling softer. This is why tallow-based soaps often have a nice, smooth feel.
• Lather Quality: Unsaturated fats also contribute to lather formation, though not as strongly as saturated fats. They help the lather to be more emollient and moisturizing, making the soap less drying for the skin.
• Skin Sensitivity: Unsaturated fats are typically gentler on the skin, making the soap more suitable for sensitive skin. Linoleic acid, in particular, has anti-inflammatory properties and can help to soothe the skin.
• Oxidation Stability: While unsaturated fats offer moisturizing benefits, they are more prone to oxidation and rancidity over time, especially if not used in conjunction with antioxidants or preservatives.

Role of Tallow in Soap Making​

• Hardness & Longevity: The high saturated fat content in tallow creates a soap that is hard and long-lasting.
• Rich Lather: A good balance of both saturated and unsaturated fats ensures that tallow soap produces a rich, stable lather while also being moisturizing.
• Moisturizing but Not Oily: Tallow soap cleanses effectively without leaving the skin overly oily, offering a balance between hardness and skin care.
• Skin Benefits: Tallow contains a blend of saturated fats for structure and unsaturated fats for moisture, which makes it ideal for crafting soap that is both nourishing and effective at cleansing.

In summary, tallow soap is valued for its hardness, moisturizing properties, and stable lather, largely due to the balance between the saturated fats (which contribute to the soap's firmness and cleansing properties) and the unsaturated fats (which contribute to its skin-conditioning, moisturizing, and soothing properties).

Are there times being able to add only unsaturated fats (as the superfat perhaps) would be more ideal?
I'm very curious as I've not found any posts discussing the subject.

Edit: Yes, I asked ChatGPT if they had mixed anything up and they swear it's all accurate and that they were correct. lol

 

[bookworm42]

Someone can correct me if I'm wrong but I don't think there is a way to separate out the different fats. I know that different oils have different fatty acid profiles that can get you more saturated vs unsaturated and vice versa. That can affect how your soap feels and acts and there are lots of resources on that.

 

[Soaper2024]

Thank you. I meant to specify 'groups' of fats, so you would be adding only one group or the other and not individual fatty acids. Saturated and Unsaturated have different general properties as a group.

 

[Soaper2024]

Too 'out there' of a question?

You were never interested in adding only the saturated or unsaturated fats of tallow or lard separately?

Here I figured it'd been talked and tested to death already, and yet I'm unable to find any discussions.

 

[squidstings]

Too 'out there' of a question?

You were never interested in adding only the saturated or unsaturated fats of tallow or lard separately?

Here I figured it'd been talked and tested to death already, and yet I'm unable to find any discussions.

It makes sense to me that they would generate different characteristics if separated. Medium Chain Trigliceride Coconut oil does generate higher hardness scores in the calculators. Only makes sense to me that any separated fats would affect the final product. Although I haven't noticed any ingredients listed anywhere that indicate as separated animal fats.

You'd could probably find a chemistry/science specific video about how do DYI it, if there's an at home safe proceedure you're willing to assume the risk/danger for.

I seem to be the only one who's ever tried colloidal silver or gold in soap. Aimed for the moon, landed on Mars. So I'm all for trying something new!

As I'm just starting to render my own tallow, I, for one, would be very interested in anything you discover/learn!

All the best!!

 

[DeeAnna]

@Soaper2024 -- The problem with talking about fats being unsaturated and saturated is that this idea isn't all that accurate. It makes people think one fat molecule is fully saturated and another is fully unsaturated, and that's not the case for most fats that haven't been artificially hydrogenated.

Every triglyceride fat molecule contains 3 fatty acids (FAs) on a glycerin backbone. Looking at any random fat molecule, the fatty acids in that molecule can theoretically be any combination of unsat (U) and sat (S). Also the position of a particular fatty acid can vary -- there are two locations for FAs at the ends and one location in the middle.

If U is an unsaturated FA and S is a saturated FA, then you might see these combinations of FAs on the fat molecule: UUU, SSS, USU, SUS, UUS, SSU.

To complicate matters, you have to consider the individual types of "S" and "U" fatty acids. In tallow, an FA in the "S" (saturated) position could be any one of these five: lauric, myristic, palmitic or stearic. An unsat FA in a tallow molecule could be either oleic or linoleic. That means there are many combinations of fatty acids that can make up tallow fat molecules.

So to think of fat as either unsaturated or saturated is a huge simplification.

That said, some fats such as tallow and palm have historically been (and still are) separated by crystallization into "stearin" and "olein" portions. The stearin is higher in the saturated fatty acids and the olein is higher in the unsaturated FAs. It's not a super precise separation, however, for the reasons I described above.

Historically, tallow stearin was used for candle making and the less desirable (and thus cheaper) tallow olein was often used in soap manufacture.

Try this: Warm a sample of palm, tallow or lard until it is fully melted and visually clear. Then let the blend cool slowly. As time passes, you'll see some of the fat start to solidify while some remains fully liquid. If you separate the solid part from the liquid portion, the solids are the "stearin" and the liquid is the "olein."

 

[squidstings]

Try this: Warm a blend of fats with, say, a lot of palm, tallow or lard and then let the blend cool slowly. As time passes, you'll see some of the fats start to solidify while some remains fully liquid. If you separated the solid fats from the liquid portion, the solids are the "stearin" and the liquid is the "olein."

Curiosity... Starting to render my own tallow.

If I wanted to try the separation, Would using something like MCT oil affect what solidifies? Wouldn't be as simple as seeding the process, like seeding chocolate tempering, with previously separated Olein or Stearin? Would it?

 

[ScentimentallyYours]

You may find the information you seek @Soap2024 by studying the Soap Making Oils, Fatty Acid Profiles, and Fatty Acid Properties charts of oils at Lovin Soap. After that, be sure to always enter your soap recipe into a soap calculator like SoapMakingFriend.com. The Calculator will calculate the correct amount of sodium hydroxide, plus it will provide a graphed analysis (ballpark) of the soap properties for the recipe. This is the graph for my mild Vegan Shea soap, which minimizes coconut oil (sacrifices big bubbles and harsh cleansing) for preferred soap properties.

 

[Soaper2024]

Very helpful, thanks.

So my OP should have been "Who's using Olein and Stearin, and how/why?"

Yes?

Simplistic explanation:
Grind fat fine
Place in filtered basket, placed in covered container
Heat to temps below lowest saturated fat temp melting point
Collect melted (mostly) unsaturated fats
Render (mostly) saturated fat solids left in basket

 

[DeeAnna]

Grind fat fine
Place in filtered basket, placed in covered container
Heat to temps below lowest saturated fat temp melting point
Collect melted (mostly) unsaturated fats
Render (mostly) saturated fat solids left in basket

No, that won't work properly -- you're proposing to combine two processes that are incompatible with each other.

Render first to get the fat purified and consistent. Then separate the stearin from olein.

To separate the stearin from the olein, you have to heat the fat until visually clear -- that will occur at a temp ABOVE the HIGHEST melting point fraction in the fat. Then allow the liquid fat to cool slowly.

It's the slow reduction in temperature of the liquid fat that causes the stearin to solidify out of the still-liquid olein.

 

[Soaper2024]

Interesting...

So what would you guess am I ending up with here? (And thank you for the assistance!)

The separation definitely happens, when using the correct temps anyway. I end up with unmelted and melted fats, separated by filtering.

Extending the cook time does not melt much extra, only higher heat does.

The solid fats left behind render as normal and solidify to a harder tallow. The liquid fats set up very soft, definitely melting at lower temps than regular tallow.

Tempted to make a batch of 'tallow' shave soap with the higher stearic acid content portion. I was hoping for a great shave soap without using pure stearic.

 

[DeeAnna]

...So what would you guess am I ending up with here?...

I'm not standing next to you as you do this, so I have no idea what you're doing exactly, nor what you're ending up with. Word descriptions don't always paint an accurate picture, and I suspect that's happening here to some extent.

If you're happy with the results you're getting, then that's all that's necessary.

 

[Soaper2024]

Yes. Thank you.

 

[Soaper2024]

Further digging reveals crystallization is used in industrial processing for several reasons. However, what I'm doing is definitely separating fats in a crude yet effective fashion. At the right temps, the saturated fats stay in a jelly state. The unsaturated fats not locked in and a liquid are easily filtered.

Be sure to render the liquid also, since it still requires sterilizing heat before use.

 

[Soaper2024]

So now I want to make a 100% tallow soap, with the 5% superfat being the "mostly" unsaturated fats.

So I'll most likely be separating them, then measuring out 5% of the total in unsaturated. Then mixing the rest with the the saturated and lye till light trace.

 

[DeeAnna]

...measuring out 5% of the total in unsaturated. Then mixing the rest with the the saturated and lye till light trace.

So I gather you're doing hot process soap making and adding the reserved fat after the cook? If so, that will work fine.

If you're doing cold process, this approach isn't useful. Lye is still very active at trace. Adding fat at trace doesn't do anything to prevent this added fat from saponifying. Kevin Dunn, author of Scientific Soapmaking, has verified this in an experimental study.