Taking Cold Process a little too literally

[Something witty]

So this happened before I got approved so I couldn't ask here for advice at the time. I kinda know better now but I thought I'd share just because and maybe for future tips.

So I thought cold process meant stuff had to be room temperature and just that the lye had to be cool enough to be in reasonable difference from the oils. Like room temp water or something. I was adding beeswax to olive oil for a simple soap so I was just stirring those until everything cooled down and I could see that they wouldn't separate.

I wondered why my oils looked like they traced before I even added the lye

Anyway it was hard to mix the lye and I questioned if it even mixed all together completely

Of course I panicked after Googling the temperature to mix at and just treated it like a rebatch the next day even though it was still mostly liquid. Stirring it until it became solid to be sure I didn't make something dangerous.

I don't know if there is a name for what I did or anything or if it would have been fine if I left it but I just didn't want to leave it to chance.

 

[DeeAnna]

Hot process means most of the saponification happens in the soap pot. After saponification, the finished (or nearly finished) soap is put into the mold. Usually the soap batter is heated in the soap pot to encourage saponification to happen faster.

Cold process is a way of making soap in which the soap batter is put into the mold and saponification finishes up in the mold. The soap maker might warm the ingredients, but heat is not usually added to the molded-up soap. The saponification process is usually slower than in hot process.

There are many variations of each method.

The key thing in either method is the soap maker has to keep stirring to keep the fat and lye solution mixed together until the soap batter becomes chemically emulsified and is at a stable emulsion (trace). Only then is it safe to pour into the mold if you're using a cold process method.

I doubt your soap batter was at a stable emulsion, since you say the fats were getting thick even before you added lye solution. That tells me the fats were beginning to solidify and thicken up due to being cool. It's likely the fats would have melted again once the heat from saponification raised the temperature of the batter above the melting point of the fat.

What you did is create a situation called "false trace". It wouldn't have turned into soap if you'd left it alone -- you did the right thing to heat it and use a hot process method to finish the soap. I can't even say I'd call it a rebatch, since I doubt there was much actual soap to rebatch.

 

[Zing]

I, too, was thrown off by the term "cold" when I was heating up oils to melt, and my lye/liquid got so hot!

 

[KimW]

@Zing - I started soaping and continued for many years using what I think is called the "room temperature" method. Just in case I have the wrong term here: I did not pre-melt oils, but used the temperature of the 'fresh" lye solution to melt one oil at a time. I still use this method when I make large batches (large to me=3lbs) . I grew tired of the mess - There's no time to weigh fats between melts, so you pre-measure everything into separate containers. Oy. It's also not conducive to smaller batches, so thankfully I did start pre-melting the oils for experiments and small batches, just as one does when making lotions. Took awhile for me to figure out allowing the lye to cool a bit though! Hot mess - literally. LOL Still, the room temp method is fun because by the time the liquid oils are added you're generally at a nice trace, with no stick blending ever needed. It took me some time lurking on the forum before joining, and lots of web searches, to figure out what people were talking about when they said "cold process" - because, you know.. how is it cold if you melt the oils?! teehee

 

[DeeAnna]

Well, y'all would really have a hard time if you talked to a commercial soap maker from a century ago.

What we call the "hot process" method was usually called the "half boiled" method back in the day, because it wasn't simmered and "grained" out like the usual "boiled" method of the day.

Our "cold process" was called cold process or cold method, so not much change there. The fats and lye were mixed, brought to trace, and then molded up. The soap finished saponifying in the mold with no added heat.

If you looked at the energy cost for each method, less energy is needed for cold process compared to half boiled aka hot process. And half boiled uses a LOT less energy than boiled.

 

[AliOop]

@Zing - I started soaping and continued for many years using what I think is called the "room temperature" method. Just in case I have the wrong term here: I did not pre-melt oils, but used the temperature of the 'fresh" lye solution to melt one oil at a time. I still use this method when I make large batches (large to me=3lbs) . I grew tired of the mess - There's no time to weigh fats between melts, so you pre-measure everything into separate containers. Oy. It's also not conducive to smaller batches, so thankfully I did start pre-melting the oils for experiments and small batches, just as one does when making lotions. Took awhile for me to figure out allowing the lye to cool a bit though! Hot mess - literally. LOL Still, the room temp method is fun because by the time the liquid oils are added you're generally at a nice trace, with no stick blending ever needed. It took me some time lurking on the forum before joining, and lots of web searches, to figure out what people were talking about when they said "cold process" - because, you know.. how is it cold if you melt the oils?! teehee

@KimW "Room temperature" method refers to mixing oils and lye solution that are both at room temperature. Since the lye was hot when you begin mixing it with the oils, that is not the room temperature method as most people use that term.

What you described is actually more like the "heat transfer" method: using the heat of the lye solution to melt all the hard fats in one bowl, then adding the liquid oils to that.

I am not entirely clear on the process you used, but heat xfer does work decently well if you:

1. Melt only the hard fats with the hot lye solution; add the soft oils later bc they don't need melting. This requires only two oil containers since all the hard fats go in one, and all the soft ones go in another.

2. Cut up or grate hard butters and beeswax - no big chunks!

3. Don't use a large percentage of hard fats, or don't use them right out of the fridge.

4. Don't start blending until all the oils are in the pot with the lye solution. Just stir the hot lye solution in the bowl with all the hard fats till they melt, then add all the soft oils, then start blending. Not sure why you blended each one in separately, but perhaps I'm missing something about the theory behind doing that.

ETA: I forgot to add that heat xfer also works better if you use a higher water:lye ratio so there is more hot liquid to melt the oils. If you use a really low water:lye ratio, it can lack the mass needed to get everything melted.

 

[Mobjack Bay]

@Something witty I don’t use beeswax, but based on what I’ve read here on the forum it always sounds like the percentage in the recipe can make a big difference in how the batter behaves.
https://www.soapmakingforum.com/threads/soaping-temperature-using-wax.61940/post-624269

 

[KimW]

@KimW
What you described is actually more like the "heat transfer" method: using the heat of the lye solution to melt all the hard fats in one bowl, then adding the liquid oils to that.

Ah-ha! Thank you, @AliOop ! My new soapy term for the day: Heat Transfer Method
Hmmmm why in separate bowls...I have no answer except that it made sense at the time and I'm pretty sure that's what was instructed in the old magazine article I used for my first NaOH soap. However, reading what you wrote, it sure seems silly now! ☺

 

[AliOop]

Ah-ha! Thank you, @AliOop ! My new soapy term for the day: Heat Transfer Method
Hmmmm why in separate bowls...I have no answer except that it made sense at the time and I'm pretty sure that's what was instructed in the old magazine article I used for my first NaOH soap. However, reading what you wrote, it sure seems silly now! ☺

Yeah, I've had a few soapy adventures based on weird old articles, too. We should write a book.

 

[Something witty]

Hot process means most of the saponification happens in the soap pot. After saponification, the finished (or nearly finished) soap is put into the mold. Usually the soap batter is heated in the soap pot to encourage saponification to happen faster.

Cold process is a way of making soap in which the soap batter is put into the mold and saponification finishes up in the mold. The soap maker might warm the ingredients, but heat is not usually added to the molded-up soap. The saponification process is usually slower than in hot process.

There are many variations of each method.

The key thing in either method is the soap maker has to keep stirring to keep the fat and lye solution mixed together until the soap batter becomes chemically emulsified and is at a stable emulsion (trace). Only then is it safe to pour into the mold if you're using a cold process method.

I doubt your soap batter was at a stable emulsion, since you say the fats were getting thick even before you added lye solution. That tells me the fats were beginning to solidify and thicken up due to being cool. It's likely the fats would have melted again once the heat from saponification raised the temperature of the batter above the melting point of the fat.

What you did is create a situation called "false trace". It wouldn't have turned into soap if you'd left it alone -- you did the right thing to heat it and use a hot process method to finish the soap. I can't even say I'd call it a rebatch, since I doubt there was much actual soap to rebatch.

@Something witty I don’t use beeswax, but based on what I’ve read here on the forum it always sounds like the percentage in the recipe can make a big difference in how the batter behaves.
https://www.soapmakingforum.com/threads/soaping-temperature-using-wax.61940/post-624269

Yay I did the right thing! I figured it wasn't really a rebatch but it just made sense. Glad my intuition was correct.

I only used 8% as per the max recommended amount. From... I can't remember I think soapqueen? They were little beads so I didn't have to cut it.

All the information on different methods for how/when to combine the oils and lye is great. I plan to keep it super simple with olive oil and maybe soy or beeswax respectively due to many allergies and also wanting to be able to wash my dog with the soap too. Does water discounting really speed things up? I kinda don't want to have to wait 6 months.

 

[Mobjack Bay]

I‘ve been doing a series of trials this winter soaping cool with a high lye concentration (40%). The soaps harden up quickly, but as discussed many times on the forum, soaper experience indicates that water loss isn’t the only change that occurs in soap during the curing process. This is consistent with soap science, as discussed here. My older soaps (> 1 yr) typically make a much more robust lather than they did when younger (weeks to months), but a few have barely changed (e.g. 100% OO still makes a very thin lather and 100% lard not impressive either).

 

[Something witty]

I‘ve been doing a series of trials this winter soaping cool with a high lye concentration (40%). The soaps harden up quickly, but as discussed many times on the forum, soaper experience indicates that water loss isn’t the only change that occurs in soap during the curing process. This is consistent with soap science, as discussed here. My older soaps (> 1 yr) typically make a much more robust lather than they did when younger (weeks to months), but a few have barely changed (e.g. 100% OO still makes a very thin lather and 100% lard not impressive either).

Oh of course I just want to find a more time effective minimum for being able to share/sell (in future maybe) with others. Without making other people wait so long