Solving my squeaky soap problem.

[Teddy2604]

Hi guys,

I've just made a couple of batches with this recipe:

The bars are generally pretty good, but tend to leave my skin feeling slighting squeaky. From reading other posts in this forum, I think I need to reduce the cleansing value to resolve this. I thought I could do so by reducing coconut oil and upping the olive oil. I prefer not to increase the superfat if possible, as I'm worried about spoilage.

I've decided to try a new batch with the below recipe:

Do you think this might help?

Thanks for all of your help in advance.

 

[KiwiMoose]

That will definitely help - but be prepared for a soap that takes longer to cure with such a high use of OO. However, with a long cure OO makes a nice hard bar of soap. You may find that OO can produce a 'slimy' bar due to the high oleic content of the oil. An alternative is try a version of Zany's No Slime Castile. I make it with 10% CO and 5% castor and real sea water and it's pretty good.
Have you considered including some more oils in your recipe? Rice bran is a staple ingredient for me - and the bonus is that it's cheap. And I find Shea butter to be cheaper than Cocoa Butter too. Castor oil is nice to support a creamy lather.
Maybe consider reducing your lye concentration to 35% which is a good beginner amount.
Try something along these lines:
25% each of CO, RBO, OO
15% Shea butter or Cocoa Butter
5% Castor Oil
5% other oil of choice, or add to OO.
I'm assuming you are making vegan, palm-free soap? Otherwise you would be better to include either palm or lard/tallow to make a more well-rounded soap recipe. I use soy 'wax' to fulfil this purpose in my soap. It's hydrogenated soybean oil to be precise.

 

[Teddy2604]

That will definitely help - but be prepared for a soap that takes longer to cure with such a high use of OO. However, with a long cure OO makes a nice hard bar of soap. You may find that OO can produce a 'slimy' bar due to the high oleic content of the oil. An alternative is try a version of Zany's No Slime Castile. I make it with 10% CO and 5% castor and real sea water and it's pretty good.
Have you considered including some more oils in your recipe? Rice bran is a staple ingredient for me - and the bonus is that it's cheap. And I find Shea butter to be cheaper than Cocoa Butter too. Castor oil is nice to support a creamy lather.
Maybe consider reducing your lye concentration to 35% which is a good beginner amount.
Try something along these lines:
25% each of CO, RBO, OO
15% Shea butter or Cocoa Butter
5% Castor Oil
5% other oil of choice, or add to OO.
I'm assuming you are making vegan, palm-free soap? Otherwise you would be better to include either palm or lard/tallow to make a more well-rounded soap recipe. I use soy 'wax' to fulfil this purpose in my soap. It's hydrogenated soybean oil to be precise.

Thanks so much for this super helpful response.

I haven’t read much about rice bran oil. What kind of quality will it give the soap?
I’ve heard shea butter can give the soap a waxy quality. I used cocoa butter as I’ve heard it leads to a nice hard bar. Will shea do the same?
And yes, I’m trying to make a simple vegan bar, which feels luxurious - but isnt too fussy!
Any tips on adding essential oils? I can’t seem to get this right. Typically I’m finding the smell is very faint. How much essential oil would you include? Or does this differ depending on the fragrance?

Thanks so much for your help!

 

[shunt2011]

Give it a try and see how you like it. It should be better than your first recipe. However, I’m one who finds high OO soap drying to my skin so don’t use it in soap over 20-25%. So it’s a personal choice plus testing different combinations. I like HO sunflower or Safflower or avocado instead of Olive.

 

[AliOop]

Any tips on adding essential oils? I can’t seem to get this right. Typically I’m finding the smell is very faint. How much essential oil would you include? Or does this differ depending on the fragrance?

For guidance using essential oils in soap, go to EOCalc.com. Their calculator shows skin-safe usage rates for about 3 dozen of the most commonly-used EOs. They also suggest some nice blends.

 

[cmzaha]

I personally do not use OO in any soaps and keep CO below 20%. I much prefer HO sunflower, HO Canola, Avo, SAO, or Safflower Oil. In some soaps, I will add in Shea at 9% but it was pretty much for label appeal when I was selling. I retired this year. I do not like my cleansing value to go above 15. Before you ask, it is doable to make a bar that lathers and lasts a long time with a low cleansing number.

 

[Mobjack Bay]

Relative to olive oil, rice bran oil will contribute to a little more hardness due to a higher % of stearic & palmitic fatty acids (FAs). RBO also has more polyunsaturated FAs (linoleic + linolenic) relative to OO. The feel these FAs give to soap is variously described as silky, lubricating, or slippery. My soaps with RBO at 20-25% make bigger bubbles, which then lead to a slightly lighter/less dense lather compared to the same recipe made with OO. I find the oil will bring some color to the soap. If you decide to try it, most suggest keeping the linoleic + linolenic to 15% or less of total FAs

 

[Teddy2604]

Thanks for all of your advice.

Based on all your comments I'm planning to try the below:

I want to get the basis of the soap right as I have a number of soaps I'd like to produce to sell. Any final thoughts on the above?

 

[KiwiMoose]

Sorry I missed this @Teddy2604
Yes I think that would be good to try. Maybe use just 500g of oils in total while you try out your recipe to avoid wasting too many oils if you don't like the soap.
I think if you get the soaping bug you will want to make some improvements to your recipe over time - namely something to contribute to longevity of the soap. Possibly more shea, or cocoa butter (or you could try the soy wax?). The recipe above will probably dissolve quite quickly unless you give it a good long cure before using.

 

[Dawni]

With 4% SF I'd reduce my coconut, if it was me. The amount left you can then split that plus the current shea amount between both cocoa and shea. Both will harden your bar and increase longevity as well. More coconut also increases solubility. Personally I don't go over 20% and my SF is proportionally low.

I'm another who doesn't use olive oil anymore after several batches that also left us squeaky, even despite low coconut oil. It really depends on your skin, this olive oil. If yours like it, go for it. Adding RBO improves it, but I'd be curing this no less than 6-8wks if it was me, but of course, try one at 4 and see if you like it.

 

[KimW]

With 4% SF I'd reduce my coconut, if it was me. The amount left you can then split that plus the current shea amount between both cocoa and shea. Both will harden your bar and increase longevity as well. More coconut also increases solubility. Personally I don't go over 20% and my SF is proportionally low.

I'm another who doesn't use olive oil anymore after several batches that also left us squeaky, even despite low coconut oil. It really depends on your skin, this olive oil. If yours like it, go for it. Adding RBO improves it, but I'd be curing this no less than 6-8wks if it was me, but of course, try one at 4 and see if you like it.

Nooooooooo - don't tell me I need to wait 6-8 weeks+ for my RBO experiment bars!!! LOL Oh, bummer. Well, guess I'd better hide them from myself right now.

 

[Dawni]

Nooooooooo - don't tell me I need to wait 6-8 weeks+ for my RBO experiment bars!!! LOL Oh, bummer. Well, guess I'd better hide them from myself right now.

Lol I did test a high RBO soap and found that one month really wasn't enough. In fact that particular one got better only after 3-4, so even 8 weeks wasn't enough. Lowering the RBO lessened the cure time, but I still won't sell or gift mine before 8wks. Try yours at different times n see

I've gotten so good at hiding soap from myself lol