Soap too soft after a week or two

[Anne121x]

Hi all happy soapers!
Any tips on how to make a harder bar that does not turn into mush in the soap dish after a week of use? My husband always says "why can't you make soap that doesn't turn into a gooey mess?" Cheeky!
I use 50Olive + 30Coconut + 20palm 5%SF..35% water, if I up the coconut to 50% and up SF to 10% to compensate for the extra coconut do you think that might do the trick? SaltedFig gave me some great advice already which would be great if she could share again.

 

[Saponificarian]

For a harder bar, I would reverse the recipe

45-50% Palm
30-35% Olive oil
20% Coconut oil

 

[Anne121x]

Thanks Saponificarian, I will try that, with the sustainable palm oil of course.

 

[BattleGnome]

Your mush is most likely the 50% olive. The oileic acid on the oilive oil gives a distinct slime factor when wet or damp. Adjusting your recipe is a good start.

If you continue to have problems you can add KOH to your lye mix. There are threads on dual lye soaps that explain the hows and why it would work (I don’t remember the science).

That being said, Saponificarian’s advice would be a better start. Especially if you don’t already have KOH on hand

 

[OldHippie]

Any tips on how to make a harder bar that does not turn into mush in the soap dish after a week of use?

The problem may have more to do with how the soap is kept than messing with a proven recipe (although I would add a bit of castor oil). There are always two things going on. The soap is drying out and, if the soap is touching water, it will be absorbing some. The trick is to create an environment where it can dry at least as much as it will absorb. Keeping the soap on a well drained surface is mandatory. Use a soap dish, and choose it carefully. It must be able to drain, not fill up with water, and have minimal contact with the soap. It is said that we should let the soap dry out between uses, which is obvious but often unpractical. As you use the soap, replace it to the soap dish with the wettest side up.

Having said that, the best way to deal with the mushy soap problem is to get another soap dish and another bar of soap. Put that one in a spot that will expedite drying. Now, as you use them, just swap out the wet soap for the dry one periodically before it gets mushy. Problem solved, recipe intact.

 

[Anne121x]

Thanks all. I especially like the idea of putting soap away after a few uses to dry and rotating it with another bar! And you get to have two varieties on the go. A good idea for increasing sales too, get people to buy two instead of just one. Super soft soaps because they are super moisturising of course

 

[earlene]

CO draws water to itself and melts faster than the other hard oils, so increasing it isn't going to help. Using a soap saver/lifter to keep it off the water helps, but even better is keeping the soap outside the shower. I remove my bars of soap from the shower & they completely dry between uses in a soap dish that stays dry. But when I left a bar in the shower before I left on my recent roadtrip, I returned to find it soft and melted quite to about half the size it was when I left. My husband didn't even use it; it was all about the water in the shower.

I also agree with rotating the soap. Since I do remove my soap from the shower between uses, I do also rotate soap because I keep a few bars in a large dish outside the shower, making grabbing one on a whim pretty easy.

If you can purchase stearic acid, you could also add a small percentage into your recipe to give you a harder bar. But you'd have to soap a bit warmer, too.

ETA: I may have put the first sentence incorrectly. My mind is rather distracted by some health related stuff. I hope I didn't mis-state that. A lot of CO in SOAP tends to result in soap that melts away faster that some other oils in soap. But high OO soap also tends to melt away more, too. Does that make it any clearer? Maybe I should quit while I am ahead and concentrate on something else. Aw, yes, Solubility was the word I was looking for. See DeeAnna's post for a clearer answer!

 

[shunt2011]

I personally would increase the palm and lower the OO. I keep my soaps in the shower on a well drained soap dish and never have an issue with it getting mushy. My recipe is a high lard or high palm. My husband keeps his on the ceramic soap dish built into the wall of the shower and his last a long time too. My soaps are hard and long lasting.

 

[DeeAnna]

"...Super soft soaps because they are super moisturising of course..."

While I understand you are trying to be humorous, I'd hate to see newbies latch onto the idea that soft soaps are "super moisturizing." It's crazy how easily some internet myths get started.

Soap doesn't moisturize; it cleans. A soap can be a very mild cleanser or a stronger cleanser; but if a person wants moisturization, don't count on soap to do that job. A leave-on product like a lotion or body butter is the way to go. A super soft soap is simply soft.

A recipe tweak is in order, as Saponificarian and Shari (shunt) have suggested, if you want the soap to not be as soft. Increasing the palm or other high palmitic-stearic fat will not only add physical hardness, but it will add longevity (by reducing the solubility) and increase the mildness.

 

[cmzaha]

I personally would increase the palm and lower the OO. I keep my soaps in the shower on a well drained soap dish and never have an issue with it getting mushy. My recipe is a high lard or high palm. My husband keeps his on the ceramic soap dish built into the wall of the shower and his last a long time too. My soaps are hard and long lasting.

Mine are too. Although I do not go high with lard, I use lard with tallow for my non-vegan soaps and high palm in my vegan safe soaps. I do not remove our soaps from the shower and they last a long time.

 

[lsg]

You could try .5% stearic acid or a little sodium lactate in your soap recipes.

 

[Kiya]

Hi all happy soapers!
Any tips on how to make a harder bar that does not turn into mush in the soap dish after a week of use? My husband always says "why can't you make soap that doesn't turn into a gooey mess?" Cheeky!
I use 50Olive + 30Coconut + 20palm 5%SF..35% water, if I up the coconut to 50% and up SF to 10% to compensate for the extra coconut do you think that might do the trick? SaltedFig gave me some great advice already which would be great if she could share again.

I had similar issues with my first few batches of soap. After some frustration I perchased Sodium Lactate. I have added this to every batch since and I have noticed a big difference in the hardness of my bars. They also seem to last longer.

I perchased the sodium lactate on Brambleberry. I either use the usage suggestions on the brambleberry website:
* add 1 tsp direcetly to the cooled lye water per pound of oils

Or I use the usage suggestions made by www.thesage.com 's lye calculator.

I would also recommend using less olive oil to your recipes.

You can also try using Shea, Mango, or Coco butter to your recipes. They usually result in a harder bar.

 

[penelopejane]

What is 35% water? Is that water as a % of oils?
If you use 31-32% lye concentration your bar wont be as mushy.
You might also need a longer cure of at least 12 weeks to get a harder bar.

High OO soaps get better with age.

 

[Anne121x]

Thanks all. Great tips. Yeah I meant 35% water as a % of oils. So it looks like I need to go much lower on the water % to get
31-32% lye concentration. When do I add the sodium lactate or the stearic acid? After trace?

 

[shunt2011]

I add sodium lactate to my lye water. Stearic you’ll want to add to your hard oils. I would actually melt it separately and then add it to your hard oils. Either way works. The temp needs to be warmer with stearic.

 

[DeeAnna]

...So it looks like I need to go much lower on the water % to get 31-32% lye concentration.

Just set the lye concentration directly to 32% or whatever you want. It's really not necessary to fiddle around with the "water as % of oils" setting at all. You'll get more consistent results if you switch to using lye concentration.

 

[Anne121x]

Wonderful thanks all! Can't wait to make my new super hard soap bars with no ash in sight!

 

[SaltedFig]

Good luck and don't forget to show off your creations