Researching before making soap:)

[Cindy2428]

I have also seen a recent spike in basic questions that with a minimal search effort have been answered here many, many times. I'm contemplating putting together a standardized response post - These types of folks don't read Stickies either. This forum is successful because the great majority here love soap. They enjoy learning and sharing and making themselves the best soapers they can be. Frankly mrsbrightside, I think in general the dedicated base here is very accommodating to the "fly-by-nighters" Not once has one of these types of posts been ignored or answered unkindly. It's pretty obvious to determine the get rich schemers who don't really want to learn.

 

[dixiedragon]

I don't have a problem with people asking us for recipes, because the asker can actually interact with us. There is a LOT Of information out there, but how do you know if it's good? Remember, we had somebody posting articles right here about making edible soap with soapwort and avoiding the evils of lye. Google "soap without lye" and you get all kinds of hits.

I don't think it's necessarily about wanting a "handout" but rather not wanting to do it wrong. And wanting very precise instructions so as not to do it wrong.

 

[TVivian]

I think everyone here is SUPER patient in answering basic questions over, and over, and over. I keep waiting for the day when someone says "USE THE SEARCH BAR!" But no one ever does. The people here are just too polite and sometimes even to those who don't deserve it. I belong to a Disneyland forum. In the beginning, it was ok to ask "is it crowded today?" What time is the five o clock parade?" "Look at this picture of the castle!" And then, after time it just got old and the members lost their patience and you should see the rudeness that ensued.

When I first started wanting to make soap, Google was a great tool. Also the library, or the bookstore. It may have been hard to find good info years ago on basic soap making, but now it's so easy to at least learn the very basics.
I've been around here for awhile and am still impressed by the kindness here. I don't have the patience to tell every person who wants to sell after two batches, not to. Im glad there are people here who do!

 

[kchaystack]

Over on the mead forum I am a member of we have a 'new bee' guide that answers all the FAQ. When someone asks something that is answered in that document, we point them to that and tell them to read it, the answer is in there.

Maybe the guru's on the site can put something together like that. Or at least an actual FAQ post like the acronym post, and then everyone can keep that handy to reply with.

 

[dixiedragon]

I typed "dark spot" unto the search bar. Here are the results:
What's going on with my soap?
OK, I'll bite. Radish soap?
My first batch of soap (by myself)
Alkenet soap
What soapy thing have you done today?
need your help re lye pockets
Wrapped bars cure?
CP Soap Making Virgin! Recipe Help!
Catty Competitors
Is my cat a super genius, or is it just me?

None of these is about gel. There IS a thread about gel towards the end of the list, but I can see how a newbie would get frustrated.

I figure that if I don't feel like answering basic questions, then I don't respond to that post. And honestly, this forum would be pretty darn quiet without newbie questions.

 

[Obsidian]

I have the same issues with the search function on most forums, the results I get are rarely what I need or wanted. I hate being told to use the search function and I won't stick around on a forum where that is the standard answer to basic questions.

 

[TVivian]

I figure that if I don't feel like answering basic questions, then I don't respond to that post. And honestly, this forum would be pretty darn quiet without newbie questions.

I agree! Sometimes I wish there were more going on, more questions being asked, and more pictures being shared.

 

[Dahila]

The search bar is not the best here, it is like most forums. One word is usually the best. When you click forum you have long list of subforum; then click it and find the thread which will answer the question . The only blog that has an excellent search bar is swift monkey blog.
This thread is mine first in over a year, I am here, there was no need to post any, it is enough if you read the posts and make notes.
Before I joined well I found this forum on December 2012 when I was off work) it took me a year to read it and be happy. Pintrest is an evil, facebook is an evil; sending people and teaching bad habbits ....this forum teach the right knowledge.
It just make me upset when someone makes a new thread with ie" white spots on soap" ; there are white spots on the right side of my soap.....that's it no pic no description nothing. Then people post; what is your recepie, did you check soapcalc........and on and on. I love this forum

 

[FlybyStardancer]

I admit, generally when I want to search the forums I'll do a google search targeted at the site instead of using the site's search function. I can post a longer inquiry, and get better results. :shifty:

 

[Seawolfe]

On almost every forum I've ever used, I use the advanced function and set it to search titles. Works for me.

 

[dixiedragon]

I agree! Sometimes I wish there were more going on, more questions being asked, and more pictures being shared.

Just started a thread with lots of pics! "Mica line success"

 

[lenarenee]

While that would be great, the problem is the impact that has in the meantime. Imagine if you wanted to sell but everyone had already tried a bar of soap from someone who was not selling good soap - no one would want to by your product because every product they tried before turned out to be either rubbish or caused them injury.

.

What is the impact? The real impact, not the imagined.

Handmade soap
is usually a luxury item for the average American budget (can't speak for outside my country). It's usually purchased at farmer's markets and speciality shops and the kind of people who purchase it have the money and the motivation that isn't stopped by a couple bars of bad homemade soap. They're savvy shoppers; very aware of the large and varied handmade soap community. Most will buy again. Some won't.

There are thousands and thousands of brands of "stuff" in our grocery stores. When we buy a can of Pringles chips and don't like it; we move on to another brand. It's the American way.

Hopefully EG, your diligent efforts (and those of others) will be heeded when you try to educate new people. There will unfortunately always be those who won't listen, or need to experience defeat in order to learn.

Considering how the handmade soap market has bloomed over the past 20 - 30 years....the results of the "bad" soap makers aren't stopping it!

 

[lenarenee]

I have the same issues with the search function on most forums, the results I get are rarely what I need or wanted. I hate being told to use the search function and I won't stick around on a forum where that is the standard answer to basic questions.

Me too. It's often true that a successful search on a forum requires that you already have some modicum of knowledge before you can ask the right question, interpret responses correctly....or avoid copious hours of reading hundreds of pages. (Except for this forum... because I read it for fun during my free time when I have no paper soap books to read. I'm somewhere in the 500's of SMF!)

 

[not_ally]

I am a compulsive researcher (boy is it fun), so although a newbie, will only ask a question if I have searched and re-searched. Even if I don't get the answer I am looking for, I get others, plus leads on other useful questions, searching is a newbie's best friend.

So two comments, based on that: (1) people who blithely request folks to share the best recipe ever for "x" (or whatever equivalent of that) so they can get a batch ready for the local farmer's market are really annoying, mostly because they have not thought about/do not understand what they are asking to people who sell product. I just ignore them (not that I have the answer, but it is better to not click on the post, best not to encourage them at all.) If you ignore them, I think they will go away.

(2) Some people really are trying to learn and for whatever reason are not researchers. Maybe they are not internet mavens. Maybe they are not academic pinhead types like me. Maybe they are moms with a bunch of kids at home and have 30 secs before making up a bottle. Maybe they are on limited internet plans. I don't know, but I feel if a question s well-intentioned (however ill-researched), it is not such a bad thing. I would just hope they say please and thank you, though, it is remarkable to me how many people fail to do that.

Edited to add: the search function is not good here, or on other boards. That is frustrating.

Also, it would help if people's re: lines were descriptive. Just typing "HELP ME" is not a good way to get people to click on your link.

I think I am going to change my sign on to "Soap Curmudgeon." I might be a bit cranky today, sorry if offensive

 

[navigator9]

I really like the "is my cat a super genius..." Hahaha I bet that one isn't very useful.

Heyyyy....that was my post, and it was in the general chat forum, not about soap, and I think it was pretty helpful for people who think their cats are smarter than anyone elses! LOL

OK, if we're getting things off our chest, let me just vent and then shut up. I don't even mind the repetitive questions, but there is one thing that does get under my skin. When did it become the end all and be all to make rainbow colored, layered, swirled, glittered, etc. soap? I think all of us can appreciate when someone goes through a lot of trouble to make a beautiful bar of soap. But when someone just starting out, is hell bent on making fancy soap before they can make good soap.......that bugs me. What difference does it make how pretty the soap is if it's crappy soap? I always stress the basics with newbies, and I'm sure they're all tired of hearing it over and over again, but the basics really do matter. Really working on your own recipe teaches you many valuable lessons. Just making a recipe over and over and varying the ingredients slightly to see how it affects the outcome is what makes you a soapmaker. Anyone can find a recipe on the internet, and copy it, and make soap, but developing your own formula, something unique, a soap that no one else has but you..... is what makes you a soapmaker, IMHO. And "plain" handmade soap is not PLAIN, it's amazing, just freaking amazing!!!!!!!

OK, I feel better now, I'll shut up.

 

[Susie]

What is the impact? The real impact, not the imagined.

Handmade soap
is usually a luxury item for the average American budget (can't speak for outside my country). It's usually purchased at farmer's markets and speciality shops and the kind of people who purchase it have the money and the motivation that isn't stopped by a couple bars of bad homemade soap. They're savvy shoppers; very aware of the large and varied handmade soap community. Most will buy again. Some won't.

While I can't speak to anyone else's experience, I can certainly speak to mine. I do not sell my soap. I have never tried to sell my soap. My area's farmer's markets and craft shows are saturated with bar soap makers. I am smart enough not to try to turn a profit by competing with them.

However, I have extended family that I make soap for. And ones I have tried to give my soap to, to help them with eczema and other skin issues. They won't even try it. Why? Because they paid, "too much money to get soap that was terrible and melted too fast." Which, I can only guess that it was not cured long enough, and possibly had too much CO.

So, you see, people who sell soap who don't have their recipe and process down pat DO hurt all of us. Even if we don't sell.

 

[pamielynn]

What is the impact? The real impact, not the imagined.

Handmade soap
is usually a luxury item for the average American budget (can't speak for outside my country). It's usually purchased at farmer's markets and speciality shops and the kind of people who purchase it have the money and the motivation that isn't stopped by a couple bars of bad homemade soap. They're savvy shoppers; very aware of the large and varied handmade soap community. Most will buy again. Some won't.

There are thousands and thousands of brands of "stuff" in our grocery stores. When we buy a can of Pringles chips and don't like it; we move on to another brand. It's the American way.

Hopefully EG, your diligent efforts (and those of others) will be heeded when you try to educate new people. There will unfortunately always be those who won't listen, or need to experience defeat in order to learn.

Considering how the handmade soap market has bloomed over the past 20 - 30 years....the results of the "bad" soap makers aren't stopping it!

It does have an impact though. I sell in person in a relatively small circle and have bumped up across many people who will say to me "I don't like handmade soap; it makes my skin feel dry". I've spent a lot of time, breath and free samples gaining customers who've had a bad experience with handmade soap in the past. And, really, just because there are many, many people IN the market, doesn't mean they're all making good soap.

 

[navigator9]

It does have an impact though. I sell in person in a relatively small circle and have bumped up across many people who will say to me "I don't like handmade soap; it makes my skin feel dry". I've spent a lot of time, breath and free samples gaining customers who've had a bad experience with handmade soap in the past. And, really, just because there are many, many people IN the market, doesn't mean they're all making good soap.

Another reason to stress the need to learn to make GOOD soap, before worrying about making PRETTY soap!

 

[dixiedragon]

Heyyyy....that was my post, and it was in the general chat forum, not about soap, and I think it was pretty helpful for people who think their cats are smarter than anyone elses! LOL

When did it become the end all and be all to make rainbow colored, layered, swirled, glittered, etc. soap? I think all of us can appreciate when someone goes through a lot of trouble to make a beautiful bar of soap. But when someone just starting out, is hell bent on making fancy soap before they can make good soap.......that bugs me.
OK, I feel better now, I'll shut up.

The cat thread was helpful, just not if you were searching for while a "dark spot" appeared on your soap. 8)

Books, the internet, etc can only appeal to our sense of sight and our imagination. And I think that people don't know how good soap can be until they try good soap. I have had SO MANY people come up to me raving about how good my soap is. But they buy it the first time b/c it's pretty and/or it smells good.

 

[navigator9]

The cat thread was helpful, just not if you were searching for while a "dark spot" appeared on your soap. 8)

Books, the internet, etc can only appeal to our sense of sight and our imagination. And I think that people don't know how good soap can be until they try good soap. I have had SO MANY people come up to me raving about how good my soap is. But they buy it the first time b/c it's pretty and/or it smells good.

True, but they won't be repeat customers if the soap isn't good. The book I always recommend for beginners is Anne Watson's Smart Soapmaking. It's doesn't have pictures, just drawings, and she doesn't teach about swirls, layers, etc. , just good basic soapmaking technique. I have no problem with pretty soaps, as long as they're good soap. That has to be a priority. If not, all soapmakers end up with a bad name.