Need help to find a particular category fragrances

[Rune]

Hi folks!

I have now searched everywhere, almost. I still have to use Google Translate some more and see if I can search in other countries. I have done some countries already, but get a lot of irrelevant hits.

I am in Europe, and it is not so easy here to find anything. You have 1 language only, and only 2 countries for a whole continent and we have thousands of languages and thousands of countries for the same sized continent. It is actually impossible to do a european search for fragrance oils. I have to search in every single country, in their language. So I thought I could ask here instead, since hopefully there are soapers here from around the world.

It is not easy to find a supplier that has something useful, and not only cinnamon buns sprinkled with baby powder candy sugar, deepfried and covered in sticky toffee and candyfloss, or something like that. I am looking for the best scents I know of, and that is arabian perfumes.

I have 10 bottles and 6 samples of them already, but I can't use even a single drop. The bottles are tiny, tiny (4 ml), and relatively expensive regarding the small amount. But they smell like heaven, all of them! So I'm looking for arabian scents in fragrance oils. I really can't find it, except from one or two here and there. Trade Essential Oils in the UK have the best selection. And luckily I found another supplier that carries their oils (White Rose Oils), since they charge 60 gbp ($80) to ship abroad. But I still have to go thru more suppliers.

If some of you know of suppliers catering to the middle eastern market, please let me know. I'm looking for attars, mukhallats and dhen al ouds. Not the real deal, of course, but fragrance oils I can use in soaps.

I have been thinking about buying those cheap perfume oils from Al-Rehab, and use them as fragrance oils. It will be very expensive compared to finding fragrance oils for soaping, but what to do? Have anyone tried?

I have been searching fragrance oils in Europe and America. But I should have searched in the Middle East instead. Arabic is a little difficult, that's why. I have tried Turkey, without much luck.

Maybe there are some souls here from arabic countries, that can lead me to a fragrance oil provider with just what I'm looking for?

Thank you so much in advance

 

[dixiedragon]

maybe try https://www.gracefruit.com/further-information/about

They say UK and Europe.

regarding perfumes - you can't use perfumes in soap because the alcohol in the perfume will cause the soap to seize up and separate.

You may have better luck finding essential oils - the spice ones (clove, cinnamon) are relatively inexpensive. Perhaps you can build your blend from there?

 

[Rune]

Thank you!

They for sure have a lot of nice fragrance oils, so thanks for the link!

I made soap today, and boy did it seize!

I made fluid high temperature countertop stickblender hot process, or what to call it. Everything went smooth. But I let it cool or cook a bit before I added the mixture of cream, yoghurt, honey and oats. To make sure it was all cooked and not too hot for the honey. I also forgot to heat up that mixture. So when I opened the lid and added the mix, it was already becoming hard soap! And my spatula broke, so I took a solid spoon from the kitchen. The soap was already done, so I used a kitchen utensil. I mixed and mixed, but the cream etc would not mix in. So I used my stickblender. I stick blended for ages, and eventually it came sort of together. But it was not fluid, as it was supposed to. More like a regular hot process. But it was much more fluid than before. It was manageable, but not at all runny. Maybe because of the oats.

I forgot to mention that I made the soap with a 46% lye solution (4% safety for evaporation during cooking). And added the rest of the fluid afterwards. It was supposed to be 38% of the oils, but I had to guess a bit, since I put the yoghurt in the mixture without measuring it first. It should originally be yoghurt and cream together at 225 grams. So maybe the almost 50% lye solution was waaay to strong. It did cook like crazy, and was almost done right after it had traced. It did take long to come to trace, I guess since I was using 80% olive and 20% coconut. I volcanoed and kaboom, it was more or less just vaseline straight after.

I had two colors, paprika and turmeric mixed with oil. But that was not enough, so I had to run for some more. It became colored, but not bright. So I had three colors, paprika, turmeric and the natural colour of the soap. I had to just dump everything back into the bowl and do an in-the-bowl swirl. I had lined my new tall and skinny mold with wax cloth. I spooned the soap in, and made some cocoa powdered lines. But it was way too much soap for the mold!

I have some small plastic molds. But the soap was quite solid and not very easy to get into those small molds, so I just dumped everything in the wooden tall and skinny mold. It became a very, very high top. And very rugged. Well, well. But it looked like soap in a mold. And that is a big improvement. Actually the second time I feel it will turn out okey, like the cold process I made a long time ago. It did not look like disaster now. And I have had two disasters already.

This time, I knew that when I put milk products in the soap, it should smell like ammonia. I learned that from Milk Soapmaking by Anne Watson. And it did, but not too much, and it faded quickly. Last time that happened, I threw the soap away. But it also had several other disasters as well.

For scent, I found my essential oils. I hated them all. But I took some benzoin on a paper, and wow! Suddenly it did smell like vanilla! It did smell solvents when I bought it, a long time ago. So something had happened by storing it. I had 50 ml of benzoin in DPG. So I dumped everything in the soap. Not a very strong scent, hardly scented at all. But it is some, and is smells lovely!

And the kitchen was a total disaster zone, a war zone!

I hope this soap turns out okey. But I think I will have to cut off the top, and divide that into soaps for myself. Tall and skinny plus a very high top will be way to high for a soap. It's not practical.

So soapmaking today did not go as smooth as I see it always does on Youtube videos. But it worked out in the end, and I have learned a lot. I can't wait to cut it tomorrow!

And this became a long reply :-D

 

[penelopejane]

If I was you I'd try CP soap again. It's so much easier.

You can work out how much mix will fit in your mold - see the sticky st the top of the page. If you post the whole recipe before you try next time we might be able to help you avoid disasters.

 

[Rune]

Yes, I guess CP is a lot easier, for sure. But I had to do HP to get the soap done before Christmas. I plan on giving away some together with their christmas presents. So we will see after the cut if it is something to give away or if I have to keep it myself. It might look better on the inside.

That is a great idea! Thank you I will post the recipe next time, and hopefully manage to do it right.

I think it went too hard too fast this time because I had a way too strong lye solution/too little water to keep it fluid. When I added my fluids in step two, I had oat flour soaking in them, which is a thickener. And I used whipping cream, which also thickens up.

But I sort of like the hot process, and I am determined to manage it. It really goes very fast, for sure. But the next time, I will post the recipe. And avoid milk and oats in it. I will also add hot fluids, not cold as I did. Soapmaking is just a lot to remember and a lot that can go wrong. Especially with countertop hot process, where you have to do everything in a hurry, if you even have time to do anything, since the volcanoes have to be stirred down constantly. So yes, maybe not the easiest for beginners. But I think I soon will master it.

I actually can or could measure how much that fits in a mold, had just forgotten the procedure. And since I was so eager to make soap, I did not take my time to find the procedure again. The manufacurer wrote that the mold would take 1 kilo of oils plus lye. So I just used 1 kilo of oils and hoped for the best. And it was way to much. So I guess the mold is smaller.

I had some bowl scraping kneaded together to a small bar of soap. I tried it now. It is soap, for sure, and an extreme amount of lather (at least compared to my castile soap). It feels nice, but the lather is yellowish (from the turmeric and paprika). It is completely unscented. It only has a faint ammonia scent from the cream. I hope that goes away. So my 50ml bottle of benzoin was a total waste. It all disappeared completely. But it was not strong in the first place. So I guess I have to make a new soap, since I want it scented. The rich lather makes it a good shower soap, I hope

I found a supplier of fragrance oils that have a huge lot to choose from. And a lot of arabian/oriental scents. The largest selection of that type of scents I have found. It is Scent Perfique in the UK: https://www.scentperfique.com
Their prices are not too bad, but not dirt cheap either. A normal price range, I would say. And that is totally fine.

Of course, they do not write the vanilla content, if it discolors or not and how it performs in soap. Only a few companies provide that basic and very necessary info, and mostly the american ones. Most suppliers I have been looking at, they don't. Some are even worse. Eroma in Australia have a website that is not compatible with Safari for Mac, so I can't find out what they have to offer or not.

Does anybody have experience with Scent Perfique? Are their scents in general nice and rounded or very sharp, synthetic and soapy? Weak, maybe? I hope they are great, because the scents look very, very promising

 

[SunRiseArts]

Not sure how expensive international shipping would be, but Brambleberry, and Natures Garden ships international via UPS. Perhaps other companies do too?

https://www.brambleberry.com/Default.aspx

https://www.naturesgardencandles.com/

 

[penelopejane]

For scent, I found my essential oils. I hated them all. But I took some benzoin on a paper, and wow! Suddenly it did smell like vanilla! It did smell solvents when I bought it, a long time ago. So something had happened by storing it. I had 50 ml of benzoin in DPG. So I dumped everything in the soap. Not a very strong scent, hardly scented at all. But it is some, and is smells lovely!

I found this quote on the following website today:
https://www.modernsoapmaking.com/using-essential-oils-in-soapmaking/

"While I personally do not use these methods, some soapmakers choose to add fixatives to their formulas to help anchor essential oils in soapmaking. Some of the common recommendations I’ve seen are mixing the essential oils into a small amount of arrowroot, cornstarch, clays, benzoin, oatmeal, or orris root powder. I do not recommend using benzoin or orris root as both are skin sensitizers and have potential to induce allergic reactions. If you choose to use either, please label your soap accordingly."

 

[Rune]

Shipping from US can vary a lot, but it is often around 10 times the shipping cost from UK or France and many other european countries. But on the other hand, products are cheaper in the US than in Europe.

I tested Brambleberry just now. Dumped 4 random 8-ounce bottles of fragrance oils in my cart, and calculated shipping. $74 (!) So it is way too high.
Natures-something, took $52 for the same weight (4 8-ounces of fragrance). Still way to high.

So no, America is out of the question. But I remember one that was not so expensive. Aztek something. I can't remember, but I have tested many. Some have reasonable shipping costs, but that is very few.

But 8 ounces of fragrance oils cost less than you have to pay for under 4 ounces (100 ml bottles) in the UK and Europe in general. So american prices are way lower. So I guess it can even out the shipping cost. I will try to search a little bit more in America, and see if I can find something good.

European suppliers in general have some more interesting fragrances, I think. It is very food-related in the US. And I really don't want a deepfried blueberry cheescake soap with maple syrup and cola frosting, or something like that. They have tons of those fragrances here as well, but they have quite a lot of others as well. Varies a lot from supplier to supplier. But since there are so many suppliers in America, I'm sure there are some that have lots of exiting fragrances. I have to find a list with suppliers and go thru each and everyone.

But now I need some fragrances really fast. So I have to place an order with either Scent Perfique or White Rose Oils, both in the UK. They both have what I'm looking for, and shipping from England to Norway is quick, and without problems. I can for sure don't say that about shipping from Spain. Oh my Lord!

I ordered a ultrasonic cavitation machine to slim my beer belly, ordered a used item from a private person. First it was sent to the Netherlands, because the spanish post did not understand Norway. Even though I had it written in both english and spanish - Noruega. It was returned to sender. Then it was shipped again, for free since the spanish post did a mistake, now to Norway (I can see that because it pops up on the parcel tracking from the Norwegian Post). But, it is stucked in Spain, and have been for weeks now. I contacted both the norwegian and the spanish post, since I did not know if it was in Norway or not. But it was in transit, the spanish post told me. So there it is, still. It does not move. So I have learned to never order from Spain again. So what they have there of fragrance oils, I don't know, because I'm not trying to look either. But one page popped up in my search. And they had mostly single scents. And that is interesting. Especially to blend in with already blended fragrance oils to drag them in one or the other direction. But I'm not gonna order anything from them, yet, since I don't trust that they can deliver in a reasonable time.

Thank you for the link!

I have actually read that before, a long time ago, so I did not remember. Anchoring scent, yes, of course! I will find a way to do that.

My benzoin faded I think because it was already so dilluted. It was very runny, and it is supposed to be very thick. So it was weak to begin with.

And thank you for the info about benzoin. I did not know it was a sensitizer. I guess I'm supposed to check such things before I dump them in my soaps.

I will try my other essential oil, maybe they have changed to the better as well with aging. I don't have many, but I will try to blend on cotton balls and see if I can come up with a combination that works. And anchor them with starch. I don't have so many oils that I can make base-, heart- and topnote. And I'm quite sure that I maybe can use one or max two of them. Because I did really hate them, especially the Atlas cedarwood, the patchouli and the cinnamon leaf. I did sort of like the rosewood and the cypress. So I will see if I can make something out of that. Maybe with small amounts of either cedarwood or patchouli.

I have to make a new soap, by the way. I can't give away the soap I made as christmas presents. It is very lathering and has a very creamy, thick and nice lather. So something is very right. But something is very wrong, since the soap is gritty. A scrub soap. And that was NOT what I wanted.

So it either has to be the powders of turmeric or paprika, or the oatmeal. Maybe all of them together. And, the colors pops when the soap gets wet. But they are very dull otherwise. So the paprika and/or the turmeric have to be dispersed in water, not in oil, before adding to the soap. I used oil. Plus dumped in more powder, since the soap was too light. But it gets dark once wet.

So I must make a new, without any gritty elements. So it will be without oats and without spices. But I will otherwise follow the same recipe, because I really like the feel of the soap.

So what to color the soap with then? I'm thinking carrot puree and prune puree for babies. Maybe that will work? I have seen on Youtube people using that baby food carrots.

I'm not sure if I want as much cream as I used. It is that faint ammonia smell from the proteins reacting with alkali. It has not disappeared completely yet. So maybe replace whipping cream with coconut cream can do the trick? I have to come up with something.

I am thinking about doing a CP soap and put it in the oven - CPOP. I have never done that. I sort of like the fast hot process method, but it is too many things that can go wrong for a beginner. For example like hardening up too fast, which I experienced. So I want to do CP since it is easier and you have way more time to think, so that it gets right from the start. But I also want HP because I need it done to christmas. So I wonder if CPOP will be the same as a hot process?

What I don't like about cold process is that you can't choose what is going to be soap and what will be superfat. In my hot process, I used rock hard coconut as superfat, plus the fat from the cream. That did work great, because the lather is very creamy and the bars are hard, even though they have not cured more than a couple of days. With cold process, I will get mostly olive oil as superfat. Maybe it will be just fine, I'm just afraid that the bars will be softer. I would prefer to saponify most of the olive.

Do you have any tips regarding CPOP? Is there something if definately not must do? I hope I can avoid the soap separating or volcanoing in the oven.

 

[SunRiseArts]

oh no! Yes, that shipping is way to expensive. Did not realize it would be so much.