Lavender and Tea Tree - Endocryne Disrupters?

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... keep in mind that you're breathing the eo's in as well - and (if I remember Tissarand correctly) that is far more potent.

Excellent point. Anything you can smell is getting into your nasal passages and your lungs, and those moist membranous surfaces are far more absorptive than your skin.

… the integumentary system is designed to expel, not absorb …

I’m not sure that the skin was ‘designed’ for that purpose, although I agree that one function of our skin is to protect against entry into the body by dangerous things. However, the skin does absorb many many things.

Why, otherwise, would big-pharma makes local-application preparations for many anti-inflammatory drugs? Looking through the published literature you will find many examples of skin absorption, including volatile oils of the types that make up many essential oils. Of course there is also the tragic use of the VX nerve agent in Malaysia, not so long ago, to further attest to skin absorption. The skin is less permeable to the more recently used Novichok 5 … if anyone cares about such semantic differences.

Locally-relevant, to me at least, eucalyptus oil (containing lots of 1,8-Cineole) penetrates through the skin … a property than has been relied upon for many millennia … as do many terpenes (ti / tea tree oil) and linalool / linalyl acetate (lavender oil).

… the outside layers of your skin are dead and non functioning! …

The outermost layer of the outermost layer of the outermost layer of our skin contains mostly ‘dead’ cells – that is the outermost layer of the stratum corneum, which is the outermost layer of the epidermis, which is the outermost layer of the skin. The cells that flake off are mostly dead but their living progenitors are not at all far away, 10 – 40µm away varying with the different parts of your body. That’s not a lot when you think that the epidermis, outer layer of the skin, can be 1.5mm thick.

So, yes, some of the outermost 15 – 20 layers of cells in your skin are ‘dead’ but that’s only a very thin layer and below that lies a very alive and very active organ.

Now the other aspect here is that ‘dead’ does not mean non-functioning, far from it. That ‘dead’ layer has, as suggested, some very important protective functions. Those squame cells may have extruded their nuclei and a heap of their other organelles but they’re

When the outermost surface skin cells, or squames, flake-off they are usually ‘dead’. So the outermost of the outer layer of the skin is mostly made up of ‘dead’ cells, linked together in a mostly lipid support matrix and containing a heap of keratin.

The lipid support matrix, important in keeping the squames in place and relatively compact, probably provides a clue as to why many oils seem to be absorbed through the skin … and mostly aqueous substances tend to be expelled.

Are eo's hydrophillic or phobic?

They're oils and as such are not inclined to mix well with water. They prefer their own kind. They're hydrophobic although it's an awkward term to use when you think that molecules can't really fear or love anything.

In the US there's a wave of belief being perpetuated by poor science being spread around the internet that simply states that if it's on your skin it gets absorbed. Period. (one of the many reasons so many people want to make their own chemical free products). This generalization is absolutely not true. Yes, there are some things that do permeate the skin but not nearly as many as people think, nor in the manner they think (instantly hits the bloodstream for example).

Yes, and no. Many things are absorbed by the skin ... and some of them very rapidly (e.g. weaponized VX nerve agent). There is an awful lot of very good science showing, and quantifying, the skin absorption of things. Of course, given the structure of the skin, it should come as no surprise that lipid type stuff tends to be better absorbed through the skin than water type stuff.

If we'd evolved in an environment of lipid-rain I suspect the outer layers of our skin would be evolved to optimally resist lipid penetration.

... drown in the shower.

What a dreadful image. Once I stopped chuckling I found myself agreeing completely. We live in an environment where water is the main liquid, and too much water is a bad thing, so it's no surprise that our integument has evolved with an outer layer that mostly repels water ... with the corollary consequence that drownings do not occur very often in showers.


A complex and 'charged' topic. Just my tuppence worth ... but I am currently planning not to use lavender or tea tree oil in any soaps I make for my sons, at least until I get a chance to read the latest high quality peer-reviewed published evidence.
 
Guess who is holding a free webinar in one week?

Robert Tisserand! :D

Titled "Essential Oil Safety: Cutting through the noise"

Essential Oil Safety with Robert Tisserand
Learn the basic guidelines of essential oil safety from Robert Tisserand, a leading expert in the field for over 40 years.
Cut through the noise of conflicting information, so that you can make educated decisions about what's safe and what isn't.

Registration is required.
 
Excellent point. Anything you can smell is getting into your nasal passages and your lungs, and those moist membranous surfaces are far more absorptive than your skin.



I’m not sure that the skin was ‘designed’ for that purpose, although I agree that one function of our skin is to protect against entry into the body by dangerous things. However, the skin does absorb many many things.

Why, otherwise, would big-pharma makes local-application preparations for many anti-inflammatory drugs? Looking through the published literature you will find many examples of skin absorption, including volatile oils of the types that make up many essential oils. Of course there is also the tragic use of the VX nerve agent in Malaysia, not so long ago, to further attest to skin absorption. The skin is less permeable to the more recently used Novichok 5 … if anyone cares about such semantic differences.

Locally-relevant, to me at least, eucalyptus oil (containing lots of 1,8-Cineole) penetrates through the skin … a property than has been relied upon for many millennia … as do many terpenes (ti / tea tree oil) and linalool / linalyl acetate (lavender oil).



The outermost layer of the outermost layer of the outermost layer of our skin contains mostly ‘dead’ cells – that is the outermost layer of the stratum corneum, which is the outermost layer of the epidermis, which is the outermost layer of the skin. The cells that flake off are mostly dead but their living progenitors are not at all far away, 10 – 40µm away varying with the different parts of your body. That’s not a lot when you think that the epidermis, outer layer of the skin, can be 1.5mm thick.

So, yes, some of the outermost 15 – 20 layers of cells in your skin are ‘dead’ but that’s only a very thin layer and below that lies a very alive and very active organ.

Now the other aspect here is that ‘dead’ does not mean non-functioning, far from it. That ‘dead’ layer has, as suggested, some very important protective functions. Those squame cells may have extruded their nuclei and a heap of their other organelles but they’re

When the outermost surface skin cells, or squames, flake-off they are usually ‘dead’. So the outermost of the outer layer of the skin is mostly made up of ‘dead’ cells, linked together in a mostly lipid support matrix and containing a heap of keratin.

The lipid support matrix, important in keeping the squames in place and relatively compact, probably provides a clue as to why many oils seem to be absorbed through the skin … and mostly aqueous substances tend to be expelled.



They're oils and as such are not inclined to mix well with water. They prefer their own kind. They're hydrophobic although it's an awkward term to use when you think that molecules can't really fear or love anything.



Yes, and no. Many things are absorbed by the skin ... and some of them very rapidly (e.g. weaponized VX nerve agent). There is an awful lot of very good science showing, and quantifying, the skin absorption of things. Of course, given the structure of the skin, it should come as no surprise that lipid type stuff tends to be better absorbed through the skin than water type stuff.

If we'd evolved in an environment of lipid-rain I suspect the outer layers of our skin would be evolved to optimally resist lipid penetration.



What a dreadful image. Once I stopped chuckling I found myself agreeing completely. We live in an environment where water is the main liquid, and too much water is a bad thing, so it's no surprise that our integument has evolved with an outer layer that mostly repels water ... with the corollary consequence that drownings do not occur very often in showers.


A complex and 'charged' topic. Just my tuppence worth ... but I am currently planning not to use lavender or tea tree oil in any soaps I make for my sons, at least until I get a chance to read the latest high quality peer-reviewed published evidence.


Ooohh who are you and how do you know all this? What else do you know?

Real quickly here I want people to confirm/unconfirm; essential oils are not actually oils? It was my understanding they mostly water (steam distillation eo's).

When I said the outer layer of skin was non-functioning, I meant that there was no cell function. I do know know that dead layer has its own important function - first defense line of the immune system.

Can you share any scientifically proven info you might have on what constitutents do pass through the skin?? And any other ingredients we use in soap making for that matter! I know only a few generalizations which aren't specific enough to make me happy: oleoresins of some plant material (like poison ivy), some heavy metals like lead (which is why I don't use clays in soap - we have a kid in the house), acetone and paint thinner.

But there are many things that bloggers and cottage bath product makers claim are absorbed into the body that aren't - and that is my purpose in posting. So many people think EVERYTHING is absorbed. I long to one day have a definitive list of what does and doesn't.

And keep in mind that even while lipids generally are more adsorbable - some aren't due to size of their molecule.
 
Essential Oils are oil.

If you pour an EO into a glass of water, the EO will sit on top.

The distillation works by boiling/steaming the ingredients, containing and cooling the gases, then separating the oils from the hydrsols.

Real quickly here I want people to confirm/unconfirm; essential oils are not actually oils? It was my understanding they mostly water (steam distillation eo's).
 
What else do you know?

Not how to shut-up ... clearly :)

Real quickly here I want people to confirm/unconfirm; essential oils are not actually oils? It was my understanding they mostly water (steam distillation eo's).

They are oils. Steam distillation is just the method used, and it's pretty good for purifying stuff that is not dissolvable in water ... such as oils.

Can you share any scientifically proven info you might have on what constituents do pass through the skin??

If you do a little google searching, and head towards journal publications, and you will find heaps. Even easier is Google Scholar.

So many people think EVERYTHING is absorbed. I long to one day have a definitive list of what does and doesn't.

I think, when I am building stuff that my family will be applying to their skin, I will take a starting position that something is potentially dangerous until / unless I have some decent reason to believe otherwise. Even then I am not gonna be putting Novichok 5 in my soap, no matter how low it's skin permeability is. Call me conservative if you want.
 
Guess who is holding a free webinar in one week?

Robert Tisserand! :D

Titled "Essential Oil Safety: Cutting through the noise"



Registration is required.

Boo Hoo - I have an appointment at the time this is happening. If anyone is able to join the webinar, I hope the information is passed along. Not a subtle hint, but I am very interested so it would be very much appreciated.
 
Essential Oils are oil.

If you pour an EO into a glass of water, the EO will sit on top.

The distillation works by boiling/steaming the ingredients, containing and cooling the gases, then separating the oils from the hydrsols.

This could explain why essential oils spilled straight on skin need to be cleaned off with carrier, not water?
 
Not how to shut-up ... clearly :)



They are oils. Steam distillation is just the method used, and it's pretty good for purifying stuff that is not dissolvable in water ... such as oils.



If you do a little google searching, and head towards journal publications, and you will find heaps. Even easier is Google Scholar.



I think, when I am building stuff that my family will be applying to their skin, I will take a starting position that something is potentially dangerous until / unless I have some decent reason to believe otherwise. Even then I am not gonna be putting Novichok 5 in my soap, no matter how low it's skin permeability is. Call me conservative if you want.

Hey, when someone has something to contribute to the knowledge base here - we don't want them to shut up.

So you are not physiologist or dermatological expert? (sadly, my search continues)

I've done plenty of Googling and found plenty of pubmed and other publications. Many with that ubiquitous line that says "further research is indicated" - among others. All too often I find one study than negates another and many that are just wholly way beyond me. I don't have the knowledge to muddle through all of that so I want to find qualified people who can.

I don't blame you at all for being conservative.
 
Lenarenee, look at how emu oil works (transferring across the skin barrier), and also look at why the short chain of coconut soap can get between the outer layer of skin cells and irritate.
(Skin type/genetic structure makes a difference, which is why coconut soap is irritating to most people, but not everyone).

This could explain why essential oils spilled straight on skin need to be cleaned off with carrier, not water?

I hadn't heard that directly, but yes, plain cold water would just roll off (warm, soapy water works and is better IMHO, if your purpose is to remove the essential oil - wipe and wash).

An example of oil being used as a solvent for essential oils is the use of sweet almond oil as a carrier oil for essential oils in massage therapy.
The sweet almond oil is the solvent for the essential oil in this instance. Carrier oils are solvent oils. In the instance of a massage oil, the solvent oil is chosen for it's use on skin (sweet almond oil is lovely as a massage oil).
For burning, the carrier oil would be an oil that burns well (think olive oil lamps, as one example).
Resins and waxes can also be dissolved in oils, and so you can have polishes with essential oils in them too.
 
some heavy metals like lead (which is why I don't use clays in soap - we have a kid in the house), acetone and paint thinner.
Interesting point that. Does it apply to all clays? Many use kaolin in baby soaps.
 
Is that really what sodium cocoate does? I thought that it just stripped the natural oils from the skin, causing dryness and eventually irritation

..., and also look at why the short chain of coconut soap can get between the outer layer of skin cells and irritate.

Coconut soap (sodium cocoate) is a superb surfactant and will remove natural oils from skin (or strip the oils, as you say) and can dry out and irritate skin.

Sodium laurate (or the sodium salt of the fatty acid "lauric acid", which I referred to as the short chain of coconut soap as it constitutes roughly 1/2 the fatty acid profile of coconut oil) is a C-12 surfactant.

C12 soaps are of a molecular size able to penetrate skin. The depth and impact of skin penetration has a multitude of inputs (exposure time, pH, number of exposures over time, moisture levels in the skin and temperatures are known inputs). I am of the personal belief that genetic skin structure is also an input (to the skin permeability of C-12 surfactants).

I find the older studies uncomfortable reading, but a curious thing I noticed in a 1959 article "When 3 ml quantities quantities of 0.0005 M buffered sodium laurate solutions are held in contact with the normal skin of an individual who has no known clinical reaction to soap, erythema and pruritus develop during the first 6 hours of contact where the pH of the solution is 7.5, but there is no apparent reaction when the solution is pH is 9.5." In these earlier studies, it was believed that the mechanism of skin penetration was entirely lipid based, but even so, this observation on the pH is still intriguing.

Later studies pointed to the skin being able to shift the pH of the penetrating sodium laurate, and lowering it. The mechanisms were studied further, and a lot of studies shifted a few decades ago to another C-12 surfactant.

The whole thing is more complex that I currently have been able to wrap my head around, but this one from 2012 is detailed and relatively easy to read:
"Cleansing Formulations That Respect Skin Barrier Integrity"
It contains useful information on how the molecular size of the surfactant affects skin permeability (albeit in the context of another C-12 surfactant).
 
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Interesting point that. Does it apply to all clays? Many use kaolin in baby soaps.

Saffron, at the time I did my research about 4 years ago, the sources I found stated the all clays will contain heavy metals to at least a small degree, lead being one of them. Since lead and other heavy metals can be absorbed through the skin and our girl was 6 at the time, I just gave up on clay. Lead exposure accumulates in the body over time.
 
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