In Praise of Water Discounting

[ericllucas]

I've got two whole batches of soap under my belt, so to say. The first was 75% olive oil. The recipe came from an online calculator that has a water:lye ratio of nearly 3:1. I didn't have a stick blender (start giggling now) so I took a paint mixer (round steel thing that goes in a 5 gallon bucket of paint) on a big old drill and really put the horsepower into stirring the raw soap...for three hours with a ten minute break on the hour. No kidding. After three hours I imagined it traced and I poured it in the mold. Three days later, I unmolded it and sliced it. I could probably squeeze it and get drops of water. Last night, I used a different recipe, from a different calculator, where I set the water:lye ratio to 1.8:1. I have been reading, you see. I had everything laid out ready to go in case it traced quickly. I also had a stick blender this time - oh, and my recipe had no olive oil in it. Within 15 minutes, I had the most wonderful gloppy heavy trace and into the mold it went. 14 hours later, its sliced and continuing the curing / drying process. I suspect it will be ready weeks before my first batch.

I love water discounting.

 

[ericllucas]

Ready to mix

(someone said people on this forum love pictures) These are the ingredients in my driveway, seconds before I mix the water:lye mixture (in half-gallon mason jar to minimize splashing) with the 130 ounces of oils and fats. If I make a spill, I can hose it off the driveway.



Here it is coming out of the mold the next morning.

 

[carebear]

we do love pictures - but there isn't one!

please don't mix the lye and water in glass - not even mason jars! we have some discussions about it on the forum~

130 ounces in one batch! that's huge for a beginner! we typically recommend 16-32 ounces at that stage. but hey, whatever works for you!

 

[ericllucas]

we do love pictures - but there isn't one!

I'm frantically trying to figure out how to get a picture in there. Its there, but it has been turned sideways.

I got it figured out...

 

[ericllucas]

please don't mix the lye and water in glass - not even mason jars! we have some discussions about it on the forum~

It took a bit but I found your comment in, um, 2007 I think, about not using glass. Okay, thanks for the tip; it makes sense. I'll go use a Rubbermaid pitcher from Walmart in future (#5 plastic).

I just did a search and found scores of soap-makers who recommend using mason jars. If there is a clear and present danger to using glass, perhaps we might want to create a SAFETY thread on this forum to make such information more readily accessible.

I did see a portion of the forum where people posted their horror stories. One lady posted a picture of the lye-burn on her hand. THAT's compelling.

 

[carebear]

sideways works - I'll lie down on my desk for it.

 

[ericllucas]

130 ounces in one batch! that's huge for a beginner! we typically recommend 16-32 ounces at that stage. but hey, whatever works for you!

I built a mold that holds about 200 ounces. I didn't want to build a beginner mold and a non-beginner mold

The batch size doesn't daunt me. I either have a lot of nice soap or I have a big learning experience. Its all good.

 

[Hazel]

Hi Eric,

Congratulations on your batches!

I didn't have a stick blender (start giggling now) so I took a paint mixer (round steel thing that goes in a 5 gallon bucket of paint) on a big old drill and really put the horsepower into stirring the raw soap...

I'm not laughing. I've heard of people who make very large batches using paint mixers/drills and 5 gal buckets. I thought it was a clever idea.

However, those are quite large batches. Have you considered just lining a shoe box or some type of shallow box to use as a beginner's mold? This way you could try smaller batches until you find a recipe that you really like and want to make a large amount of it. That way it wouldn't be so heart and wallet wrenching if you have to toss a bad batch. Fortunately, I've only had to toss one batch. Even though it was only a 2 lb batch, I was still upset about it. I'd be sick if I had to toss a 12 lb batch.

Although if you're really committed to making large batches, I'd recommend you purchase a stainless steel stock pot. They come in different sizes and you can find them just about at any store. You just want to make sure you get one that's of good quality. You could buy a stainless steel pitcher but I know SS pitchers are expensive.

Welcome to the forum!

 

[ericllucas]

This way you could try smaller batches until you find a recipe that you really like and want to make a large amount of it.

You know, thats a great idea. I haven't integrated any fragrance or color into my soap. I figured I'd make utility-grade soap whilst I learn, you know, for general hand and horse washing. When I am ready to fold in some fragrance and/or color, small batches will be just the thing. Thanks for the idea!

 

[Hazel]

You're welcome. Good luck with future batches. I hope to see more pics. :wink:

 

[Fragola]

It could be that the different recipe (where I am assuming different oil percentages) contributed to a faster trace.

Also, I remember having read on this forum that more water will give you a quicker trace. I don't know if it's true, my recipes trace very quickly no matter what the water discount.

Personally I dissolve the lye in a pyrex cup that's sitting inside a large stainless steel pot. I do feel that a transparent container helps you see more clearly when the lye has completely dissolved.

 

[soapbuddy]

I read about this on another site and think everyone needs to be aware of it! I thought of soapmakers who use pyrex glassware to mix their lye (BAD idea), or heating oils in the microwave, or candlemakers who use pyrex for heating/ pouring wax, not to mention using Pyrex baking dishes, etc. for cooking.

Pyrex can shatter and explode! NEVER use glassware that is chipped, scratched or cracked.

The full article is here.
http://www.consumerreports.org/cro/maga ... /index.htm

The video has some impressive demonstrations. PLEASE do not think that just because your glassware is not subjected to the same stress as in the demonstration that bad stuff won't happen. I had this happen to me with Pyrex (in a sink thank goodness) and I can vouch for how impressive the mess is! This tendency is common to ALL glass, but particularly soda lime glass which is the composition of most canning glass. Pyrex changed their formula from sodium borosilicate (OLD Pyrex) to soda lime and now more reports of accidents are coming in...

P.S. You can tell old Pyrex from the new version by looking at it. The new version has a very light greenish tinge.

 

[ericllucas]

Also, I remember having read on this forum that more water will give you a quicker trace.

I am certain that my fast trace time last night was due to the combination of oils (no Olive oil) and the water discounting.

I gather there are a couple of things that impact trace time (non-newbies jump in here!):

1) The oil you're using - Olive oil is slow to trace, castor oil helps speed up tracing, sunflower is slow to trace. I wonder if the different trace times for oils has anything to do with how much saturated fat they have?

2) The amount of water you're using as a solvent for the lye - More water, more trace time, less water, less trace time;

3) Temperature - more heat (to a point), faster trace, cooler temps (to a point), slower trace;

4) Mechanical agitation - use a hand whisk, slower distribution of lye/water throughout the oils, sloooooow trace time. Use a stick blender, rapid distribution of lye/water throughout the oils, faster trace time.

I'm leaving out the quality of the lye as a factor, since I will assume most (but not all, evidently) people use a standardized store-bought lye product, instead of leaching wood ashes. I am also assuming the use of distilled water, instead of tap or well water.

Someone jump in and correct me, please.

 

[ericllucas]

You're welcome. Good luck with future batches. I hope to see more pics. :wink:

Ask and ye shall receive...

The white soap on top is mostly olive oil, with some castor oil, beef tallow, and coconut oil. It was liquidy when I grew tired of mixing, so I put a plastic bag in the mold and poured it into the bag. It made interesting edge features.

The soap on the bottom was made last night, mostly crisco, some sunflower oil, coconut, and castor oil. I used parchment paper in the mold and it resulted in smooth edges.

 

[strawberryred]

I can vouch that Mason jars are not good! I had seen some people use them, so I thought they were safe and I had a bunch, but I had some in my sink in an ice bath, and the bottom of the jar completely broke off! Luckily it was in my sink and I had rubber gloves on so no issues. Scary though!

 

[Hazel]

Those look great for the first two batches. When I first started to make soap, a BIL called one of my batches "the poop soap". To be fair, that's exactly what it looked like.

I used to use freezer paper to line wooden molds. It works very well but I've been having a harder time finding it. Maybe people don't need freezer paper like they used to years ago. I had the bright idea to try wax paper one time. All I can say is don't use it...just don't. This horrible soaping experience was one of the reasons I switched to using mainly silicone molds.

 

[carebear]

don't assume distilled water. many of us use spring or bottled water. some use even rainwater which, sadly, is NOT the same as distilled.

 

[Soapsugoii]

I wish my first batches had looked that good Jerk.

 

[khermsen]

P.S. You can tell old Pyrex from the new version by looking at it. The new version has a very light greenish tinge.

I noticed the greenish tint to the glass....nice to know.

Thanks.

 

[ericllucas]

I wish my first batches had looked that good

My brother had a Gilbert's Chemistry set growing up. I guess my caution around chemical reactions comes from watching him make, I don't know, random pyrotechnic devices, using that Chemistry set. That was back in the dark ages when they put the good chemicals in the set. Anyway, I've worked with explosives and electricity, so I figured I had the right sense of caution going into soap-making.

Thanks for the compliment!