If you make goat's milk - HELP!!!

[BakingNana]

I know it had to happen sooner or later, but...

Made first batch of goat's milk soap yesterday with full-fat goat's milk as half of the water; used my regular tried-and-true OO,CO,PO,Castor, distilled water recipe. Frozen milk and it didn't scorch at all. Went into mold nice and slightly ivory colored. This morning, loaded with DOS. Since I've never had that happen, I'm perplexed. I've made this recipe several times with cow's cream and never had that happen. Is there a particular oil that doesn't react well with goat's milk? All you goat's milk experts out there....comments? It went through gel, but it never did get very hot. Silicone mold; no insulation.



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[krissy]

i dont think that you can get DOS overnight... i think it takes a while for the oils to go rancid. unless you start with rancid oils, but that is a whole nother kettle of fish

i was thinking maybe those little spots are undisolved lye that is burning the milk around it....? i am not sure though, do they zap?

 

[Jezzy]

I don't think it could be dos either. I think Krissy is on to something and I am interested in hearing what the others think.. I would try a zap test too..

 

[BakingNana]

Ya, how could I get DOS overnight?!? I got excited there thinking maybe that was the case (undissolved lye) because I was using a batch of 50% solution I'd made in the morning. Trouble is....the solution was perfectly clear when I poured it into the HDPE container (same one I always use), the spots don't zap, and I made 2 batches of shea soap right before the goat's milk using the same solution and they're fine. FYI-Amazing Grace tastes better than Baby Sweetheart Roses. Bleccchhhh. Suppose I should just try another batch of GM and see what happens? It was a 2# batch anyway; thankfully not 6#! I can still use the GM spotty soap in house--I'll tell my family it's orange peel. But I want a GM to sell!

 

[Half Caper Farm]

Did you use an FO or EO? It's possible that they weren't blended in quite well enough and that would cause spots (ask me how I know :roll: ).

Other than that, I can't think of any reason for your spots. I use 100% goat's milk, and have never had that problem - except for the poorly blended EO!

 

[IrishLass]

I agree with Half Caper Farm. It sounds like the FO didn't incorporate as well as it should have (ask me how I know, too! :wink: )

IrishLass

 

[BakingNana]

OK, that makes sense! I was probably way too gentle blending it in. It was an FO I've never used before--Amazing Grace, Aroma Haven. Normally, I blend the FO into the oils first, but this time I added it at trace because it was a new one. Thanks, you guys!

 

[Best Natural Soap]

how hot did everything get when you combined the lye/oils? I wonder if the milk fat separated and scorched and caused little spots...
Just a thought- I really have no idea! I make goat's milk soaps, but haven't had that happen.
Did you freeze your milk first? I freeze mine, and that keeps it from burning.

 

[BakingNana]

Yep, the milk was frozen and everything else was RT. I was surprised that it all stayed cool through the whole process. No scorching or curdling. Soap looked terrific at pour. I was happy as a clam until the next morning! I'm betting the FO theory is right. Even now, the soap itself looks great, except for the tiny brown flecks. Been soaping my regular stuff like crazy the past week so haven't had a chance to try it again. Going to do a small batch without any FO just to check my process. This deal really surprised me since I've done cow's cream with no problem several times.

 

[SmellyKat]

I know it had to happen sooner or later, but...

Made first batch of goat's milk soap yesterday with full-fat goat's milk as half of the water; used my regular tried-and-true OO,CO,PO,Castor, distilled water recipe. Frozen milk and it didn't scorch at all. Went into mold nice and slightly ivory colored. This morning, loaded with DOS. Since I've never had that happen, I'm perplexed. I've made this recipe several times with cow's cream and never had that happen. Is there a particular oil that doesn't react well with goat's milk? All you goat's milk experts out there....comments? It went through gel, but it never did get very hot. Silicone mold; no insulation.



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Nana, I would like to try a goats milk recipe. How much of each oil did you use? And you freeze the milk first before it goes in the lye water?

 

[BakingNana]

Boy, you're timing with this post couldn't have been better. I was going to add to the thread today. I'm ready to scream. I'm sorry I'll be writing a book here, but I need help.

I'm still having incredibly frustrating problems with goat's milk. Here's one I made 4 days ago. The one on the left was not chilled or insulated. The one on the right was refrigerated for 2 days right after pour. The left one had caramel like spots within 24 hours. The right one looked fabulous after I took it from the fridge and cut it. It then developed the caramel spots over the next 24 hours. I spent all day yesterday wracking my brain trying to figure it out. These are the 3rd and 4th try. The soap itself is really great. The lather is like whipped cream and the soap is SO non-drying. But how can I sell it with these stupid spots?!?

Here's what I've been doing. First used my regular veggie recipe...22%CO, 14%PO,57%OO,7% castor. The next batches I upped the CO to 24% and the palm to 20%, reducing the OO accordingly to see if too much OO was affecting it. NOT.

Try #1...I used full fat whole fresh goat's milk, frozen. Set the container in a bowl of ice water and added the lye a tiny bit at a time. By the time all the lye was added the milk was still white and cool. Soaped great, looked great at pour. Not insulated. Spots.

Try #2...I thought either all the lye wasn't dissolving or FO was problem, so I let it sit for an hour stirring it occasionally and didn't use FO. Still spots.

Try #3....(left photo) Let the milk mixture get just a touch warm, turning the mixture a little yellow, to see if that would help lye to dissolved. Spots.

Try #4...the chilled batch (right photo).

Next try (not giving up...soap is too good) I'm using 50% lye solution and the remaining liquid as goat's milk, adding the goat's milk after stirring in the lye. No FO; I'll chill that one. I really want to use 100% goat's milk because the soap is incredible, BUT WHAT AM I DOING WRONG?!? YES, I'M SHOUTING HERE!

I've come to the conclusion that the spots are carmalization of some kind. I even thought of having it analyzed in a lab to see what it was. I'm that desperate. Maybe you can't use all whole goat's milk, but I sure love that soap (minus the SPOTS!).

ADVICE?

 

[BakingNana]

See! I'm so PO'd I forgot to post the picture.



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[paddywhite]

Oh BakingNana, I do feel sorry for you, you really have tried so hard to get this GM soap right. I can offer only two suggestions, the first one is that as soon as you have poured your soap, do not cover it and put it straight into the freezer and leave it there for 24 hours. I think that it is overheating when going through gel stage, and this may be causing the pockets of burnt milk. My second suggestion, and this is a little tongue in cheek but will work, is to add calendula petals to your batch and you will enjoy the lovely creamy soap that is milky white, but with a lovely infusion of orange petals through the soap, and then no -one will notice the little orange dots. Keep positive.

 

[LondonsMum]

Are you freezing the soap after you put it into the molds?? That's probably what's causing the spots. I noticed that even after letting my goat milk soap sit out 24 hours and then putting it in the freezer for just 10 minutes to help get it out of the molds caused discoloration/spots along the edges that weren't there before putting the soap in the freezer.


Edited to add:

Also - the only goat milk I add water to is the condensed can version. If it's not condensed goat milk then you might try using it straight without adding water to the recipe.

 

[IrishLass]

I feel your frustration, BakingNana! I really do. I never had good success with mixing lye and milk together. Some soapers are able to do it with great finesse and without any problems, but not me. I gave up on it when I learned there was more than one way to skin the proverbial cat. I make great goat milk soaps now, even 100% goat milk soap, without ever having my lye and milk touch each other until mixed with my oils.

The way I do it is by using the split method (even when making 100% GM soaps). I use fresh, full fat refrigerated goat milk (the carton kind, not canned). I split my liquid portion up into half water, half goat milk. The water gets mixed with the lye and the goat milk gets stickblended into my oils. If I want to make a 100% full fat milk soap, I proceed the same exact way as I do above, but with the exception that I dissolve enough powdered goat milk into my fresh goatmilk to bring the total milk concentration up to 100%. Then I stickblend that into my oils. Works like a charm.

This is just me, but I never freeze my GM soap. I like it to gel fully. I just keep an eye on it in case it overheats, but it hardly ever does so. They come out a nice off-white, creamy color, too (unless I add honey to it). Oh, and no spots!

IrishLass

 

[DebRobinson]

I've been making goat's milk soaps for 10 years. I still don't know what causes the DOS. In some instances I think it's the FO because there are some FO's that are more prone to spot my Honey Almond Oatmeal is one that has the problem every now and then but not always.

The thing about me is that I'm not a perfectionist, and I have a very laid back personality. I box the spotty ones and sell them right along with the unspotty ones. I have never had a customer complain. The spots don't affect the quality of the soap, especially goats milk.

I'm like Irish Lass, I've never had success with adding my milk to the lye, frozen or not. I raise and milk my own goats so my milk is raw so that might make a difference. I can't get passed the ammonia smell and orange color. I split my liquid in half, mix the lye/water and then add the goat milk right before trace and before I add my FO's and extras.

Hope this make ya feel better even though it still doesn't answer the DOS question.

Deb

 

[BakingNana]

Thanks everyone. This is why this forum is so great....I may (MAY IS EMPHASIZED HERE) have come up with the split/pwd/fresh method eventually, but how many batches I'd go through first!

I have a small 2# batch poured and it looks heavenly. I'm glad to hear, Irish Lass, that you gel. I hate trying to prevent gel. You can be sure I'll be hollering from the rooftops tomorrow if I wake up to no spots!

 

[Tabitha]

FYI-Amazing Grace tastes better than Baby Sweetheart Roses.

LOL

FYI- Rose/Lavender EO blend makes your lips numb :wink: .

 

[dubnica]

I am new to this so what do I know but...I made 2 batches of goat milk soap with no problem. I used 50% water to mix the lye in and then I added frozen goat milk to it. I used food grade lye though. I am not sure if that would make any difference....but I thought I mention it.

 

[BakingNana]

I am new to this so what do I know but...I made 2 batches of goat milk soap with no problem. I used 50% water to mix the lye in and then I added frozen goat milk to it. I used food grade lye though. I am not sure if that would make any difference....but I thought I mention it.

I did that and it was OK, but I wanted a 100% goat's milk. I only use food grade lye, too, although I'm tempted at times to save some pennies and get the tech. grade.

[quote="Tabitha"

FYI- Rose/Lavender EO blend makes your lips numb :wink: .

LOL2 I bet clove does, too!

OK, I hope I'm not premature here and jinxing myself, but it looks like I'M SHOUTING FROM THE ROOFTOP! Here's what I woke up to courtesy of Irish Lass.



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Going to wait until tonight to cut it, although it feels like it's probably firm enough now just 16 hours from pour.

I'm buying a cyber round for everyone and a toast to Irish Lass!

Side note: The guy at Whole Foods last night was probably tempted to call the police and have me carted away, since when I finally found the pwd. goat's milk (hidden behind the cans of evaporated) I did a little (loud) happy dance. ops