I have a few issues...

[rssgnl27]

I'm having a few issues...
1) My soap takes a long time to trace (about 30-45 minutes after mixing oils/lye mix)
2) Some soaps won't peel out of the mold cleanly. I am using rectangle silicone molds.
3) Ideally I'd like a harder bar as the end product.

My recipes are exactly the same EXCEPT for one thing... the essential oils I use. Lavender seems to trace quicker than others. However, I just used Fir Oil, and it took FOREVER to trace and I left it in the molds for a week and they still stuck to them. I normally use Sun Essentials from Amazon.

Here is my process, please tell me what to fix.

Lard- 44oz
Sunflower Oil- 26oz
Coconut Oil- 30oz
Essential Oil- 6.25oz
Lye- 14.45oz
Goats Milk- 38oz

First I measure out the goats milk, which is frozen. It is normally large chunks, so I let them start thawing while measuring the rest of the ingredients.

Then I measure and melt the lard and coconut oil separately. I make sure to take off heat as soon as it is 1/2 melted, and I let it melt very slowly after that. I want the oils to be as cool as possible before adding it to milk/lye mixture. I then set the oils in the refrigerator while I mix the lye and goats milk together.

I slowly add the lye to the goats milk ice. When the last chunk is melted, I then add my oils (this includes the sunflower oil, essential oil and the coconut oil, and lard from the fridge).

I then stick blend until trace. The trace is normally pretty thin, it is never a thin pudding consistency (I'd say the consistency of melted ice cream)

After (semi) trace, I pour into molds that have been just taken out of the freezer. They are individual, silicone, rectangle molds.


Some batches trace, most won't. And the bars are very soft, and most of the time don't come out of the molds without sticking to the bottom.

I'm not sure what I'm doing wrong or if I can try something else. Any advice would be appreciated.

 

[ulrurunaturals]

I'm having a few issues...
1) My soap takes a long time to trace (about 30-45 minutes after mixing oils/lye mix)
2) Some soaps won't peel out of the mold cleanly. I am using rectangle silicone molds.
3) Ideally I'd like a harder bar as the end product.

My recipes are exactly the same EXCEPT for one thing... the essential oils I use. Lavender seems to trace quicker than others. However, I just used Fir Oil, and it took FOREVER to trace and I left it in the molds for a week and they still stuck to them. I normally use Sun Essentials from Amazon.

Here is my process, please tell me what to fix.

Lard- 44oz
Sunflower Oil- 26oz
Coconut Oil- 30oz
Essential Oil- 6.25oz
Lye- 14.45oz
Goats Milk- 38oz

First I measure out the goats milk, which is frozen. It is normally large chunks, so I let them start thawing while measuring the rest of the ingredients.

Then I measure and melt the lard and coconut oil separately. I make sure to take off heat as soon as it is 1/2 melted, and I let it melt very slowly after that. I want the oils to be as cool as possible before adding it to milk/lye mixture. I then set the oils in the refrigerator while I mix the lye and goats milk together.

I slowly add the lye to the goats milk ice. When the last chunk is melted, I then add my oils (this includes the sunflower oil, essential oil and the coconut oil, and lard from the fridge).

I then stick blend until trace. The trace is normally pretty thin, it is never a thin pudding consistency (I'd say the consistency of melted ice cream)

After (semi) trace, I pour into molds that have been just taken out of the freezer. They are individual, silicone, rectangle molds.


Some batches trace, most won't. And the bars are very soft, and most of the time don't come out of the molds without sticking to the bottom.

I'm not sure what I'm doing wrong or if I can try something else. Any advice would be appreciated.

I don't have much experience with goat's milk. but maybe it's slow to trace cause your using 100% of the water as goat's milk I might be wrong. Acctually I have no experience with goat's milk LOL. but maybe got half distilled water half goat's milk.

 

[cmzaha]

With the amount of Lard and the Sunflower you soap will be very slow to trace. It is mostly due to the Lard which is a slow tracer. If you add in some Tallow, Palm or hard butter it will help with a quicker trace. I would personally not use so much CO, but some do

 

[shunt2011]

I agree with Carolyn, High lard and liquid oils takes a some time to trace. Are you using a stickblender? You don't state or are you hand stirring? Also, you should never add your oils to the lye, always add your lye mixture to the oils. Less chance of an accident.
It also looks like you are using full liquid. If you change it to 33% it will trace quicker as well and be harder at the start. I use high lard and my soaps can be taken out of the mold at about 12-18 hours.

 

[dixiedragon]

I think the slow trace is a result of your goats milk + lye being cold and your melted oils being pretty cool as well. I think that might just be the nature of the beast on this one.

And the fact that your soap is cool is also contributing to it being softer in the mold, I think.

 

[Magic7M]

I make goats milk soap regularly. I only use fresh goats milk which I freeze myself and use as 100 % of the water. I add lye to a few cubes of frozen GM and stir until dissolved and alternate between lye and the frozen milk. This prevents it from burning the GM. I have also mixed the oils and lye very cool and have not had a problem with trace. I have even made whipped soap (Nizzys method) with goats milk. Maybe the use of a stick blender brings trace sooner or the high percentage of Lard in the recipe. I have never used that high percentage and that could be a contributing factor.

 

[rssgnl27]

I do use a stick blender. I had thought about it being maybe too cool when I pour.

Does anyone have a better suggestion of oil ratio without changing the ingredients? I really like the lard and the coconut oil, but I'd be willing to change the sunflower oil to another type if t meant a harder bar.

Also- Could you explain the difference between full liquid and 33%, sorry just trying to learn here.

 

[lucycat]

The liquid (water or goatmilk) is really a way to dissolve and distribute the lye. So, the liquid amount can vary. Most people will refer to a lye/water percentage. If you use 1 part lye to 2 parts water then that is a 33% percentage. You are using a 27% lye solution (14.5 divided by (14.5+38). That was common many years ago and is considered full liquid. Many soapmakers today do not use that much liquid. A 33% solution is my normal lye solution and it is easy to calculate.

You haven't said what your temps were. If I were doing this soap I would want goatmilk/lye mixture between 80 and 90 and the oils 100. Cool is the best way to keep the sugars in the milk from browning but too cool and you make it difficult for the chemical reaction to proceed as well as being able to recognize trace.

You haven't asked but if I were making this soap and I didn't have a lot of experience with it I would make a much smaller recipe until I was happy with my results. I think you always learn more when you make a recipe several times. That is a lot easier and cheaper to do with a 16-32 oz recipe rather than a 100 oz recipe.

 

[dixiedragon]

Maybe look into sodium lactate to harden your bars a bit. If you like the end result, you might just want to stick with this recipe and maybe tweak your process a bit. I'm wondering if it might help for you to put your soap batter on the stove on low heat and stick blend there. Maybe that way your milk still won't get burnt, but the heat will help move the chemical reaction along.

 

[rssgnl27]

These are all fantastic tips! I really appreciate everyone’s feedback. I’m going to try a few of these and hope that it makes a harder bar. Thank you all so much

 

[Magic7M]

Another way to harden your bars is by using Beeswax or Stearic Acid. But then run your recipe through the calculator again. This is just another means of making a harder bar of soap.

 

[rssgnl27]

Another way to harden your bars is by using Beeswax or Stearic Acid. But then run your recipe through the calculator again. This is just another means of making a harder bar of soap.

I do have alot of beeswax, I will try that. Thanks for the suggestion!

 

[lenarenee]

These are all fantastic tips! I really appreciate everyone’s feedback. I’m going to try a few of these and hope that it makes a harder bar. Thank you all so much

I highly suggest you don't use Sun Essential products. I think there's a very good chance they are greatly adulterated with either carrier oils, or synthetic fragrance oils. I had difficulty with them in the past......with the same results you've gotten.

I've made your recipe before. You don't need to do anything to change it except add more time and patience. However, I myself wouldn't be happy with that suggestion - so I'll suggest replacing 5% of your soft oil with 5% castor oil and using 33% lye solution as people have suggested. Those changes alone may save you the additional cost of buying sodium lactate.

Using stearic acid or beeswax, especially for a new soap maker, can be problematic.

 

[mx5inpenn]

Is there a reason you need to pour at such a thin trace?? If you don't need to for an intricate design, there's no reason you can't stick blend longer. I use lard at 55% a lot of the time, partially because I want the slow trace. [emoji846]

 

[rssgnl27]

Is there a reason you need to pour at such a thin trace?? If you don't need to for an intricate design, there's no reason you can't stick blend longer. I use lard at 55% a lot of the time, partially because I want the slow trace. [emoji846]

I pour at a thin trace because it's been taking 30-45 minutes to come to trace, and I've tried doing it longer and its burned up two stick blenders. I would rather pour at a thicker trace of course, but you can only stick blend fo so long before you realize there may be a problem.

I highly suggest you don't use Sun Essential products.

I thought about the "cheapness" of the oils that there may be something else involved in them. Seems like I'm having possibly a combination of issues.

I am waiting on a Brambleberry order to come in and I am going to try the 33% lye solution first and see if that makes a difference.

I appreciate everyones input!

 

[penelopejane]

33% lye concentration in any soap calc is what people are referring to.

 

[DeeAnna]

As Penelopejane said, you want to look for lye concentration in your soap recipe calculator and set that to 33%. I'm guessing you normally use 'water as % of oils' and that's not the same thing as lye concentration. Be careful you don't confuse the two.

You're trying to soap at fairly cool temperatures. That slows saponification, which translates in practical terms to the soap being slower to come to trace and slower to firm up in the mold. It's the downside to the style of soap making that you've chosen.

Increasing the lye concentration (in other words, using less water) will help some.
Altering the type of fats in your recipe will help some too.
But in the end, soaping at somewhat warmer temperatures will do a lot to reduce the problems you're having.

If you stick with your soaping method, you really don't need to burn up stick blenders unless you want to. Just stick blend for a short while -- say 30 seconds or so -- and set the stick blender down. Stir by hand every few minutes. After 5 minutes or so, stick blend for another 30 seconds or so. Hand stir for 5 minutes. Repeat until you get to trace. I suspect the soap will trace about as fast with this method as it does for you now.

You can also experiment with adding some grated-up bar soap from a previous batch to help the new soap batter emulsify better. Our own Susie recommends this for liquid soap, but it also works for bar soap. Maybe add 1/2 to 1 ounce (15-30 grams) of old soap per 16 ounces of fats (500 grams of fat). It's an old trick that I'm sure some of our grandmothers used in the days before stick blenders were made.

 

[earlene]

I'd use a higher lye concentration (less liquid) and more heat to bring this soap to trace sooner. Also you don't need to use the SB quite so much, as the soap will come to trace in it's own good time even without a SB. I suggest 2-3 second bursts with the SB then just stir. You can actually leave the batter to sit without stirring at all for a few minutes and then stir again and give a short burst with the SB (2-3 seconds only per burst) and stir by hand in between. I have done Castile soap by leaving it to work on its own and only stirring periodically when I got tired of stirring. It didn't hurt anything doing it that way. And no strain on my SB.

I suspect you are probably using such cool temps so you can keep your soap white and that's nice, of course. But with a higher lye concentration and just a bit more heat, trace will come sooner. You can always refrigerate the molded soap to discourage over-heating once it's in the mold.

I am interested to know if you try any of the suggestions made in this thread and how they work out for you.