HP curing time & pH safety

[pumita]

I made my HP batches 3 weeks ago and I want to sell them on a local market this weekend.

I already tried them, one in the shower and the others washing my hands.
I didn´t feel that they tried my skin or any stinging.
Doing the tongue test there´s no zaping.

Now, my question: From what I understand HP soap is safe to use right after unmolding because there´s shouldn´t be any unreacted lye. The reason of the curing is because it evaporates some water and gets harder by time and also milder to the skin. Why will it get milder to skin? I thought the pH didn´t change after unmolding it because the saponification process has already finished.

So guys, those of you who make HP soap, how long to you let it cure? I read that most people prefer a longer curing time because the soap gets better. But, could you use it after 2 or 3 weeks curing time? Is it safe to sell?

 

[carebear]

Might I suggest that if you don't already know the answer you probably aren't yet ready to sell...?

The short answer is that soap that doesn't zap is safe, but that soap gets better with time. What constitutes good enough is your call.

 

[IrishLass]

Ditto what carebear said.

I like to let my HP cure for the same amount of time as my CP. Here's why-

All soap, whether CP or HP gets milder during cure. According to Dr. Kevin Dunn on page 79 of his book 'Scientific Soapmaking', three things happen during cure:

1) Soap loses weight as moisture evaporates
2) It hardens
3) Any leftover alkali is neutralized by atmospheric carbon dioxide

and on page 230 of the same book Dr. Dunn talks about how the pH of soap lowers during cure. He says that during cure, the acid carbon dioxide naturally present in the air slowly reacts with the alkalis in the soap, helping to neutralize them, and it is for this reason that aged soap is milder than fresh soap. I should mention that when he uses the word, 'neutralize', Dr. Dunn makes it clear in his book that he does not mean the soap takes on a neutral pH of 7, but that it becomes tongue neutral instead. Soap will always be on the alkaline side of the pH scale, but curing helps it to reduce to the lowest pH it can possibly reach for lye-based soap, which is usually between 9 and 10.5.


IrishLass

 

[shockabooie]

I'm glad you asked cause this is a question i was wondering too.

Irishlass, you are so very helpful!

 

[LisaMarie]

Thanks Irishlass, I learned something new

 

[pumita]

So, although it´s HP soap there´s still alkali left that has to be neutralized during the curing time?
I thought this only happend with CP soap.

And yes, I know that soap gets better by time, but to sell at this market this weekend is a big opportunity to me.
And I also know that selling a soap with a longer curing time means to have a more quality product, but the truth is, that my soap won´t harm nobody because of being a little bit softer as it should be.
I don´t think that my soap isn´t good enough to sell. Actually you hardly get any handmade soap in Argentina that´s not melt&poor, so I don´t feel that I´m defrauding people by selling a HP soap with a 3 weeks curing time instead of (let´s say) 6 weeks curing time.

 

[carebear]

it's not entirely about the cure period.
it's about selling a product you don't know, cannot stand behind, and don't understand.

do whatever you feel is right, but the SMF doesn't condone selling early batches.

 

[AmyW]

There's a good reason for the "one year of soaping under your belt before you sell" guideline: you don't know if that soap will go rancid in 6 months, if it'll get DOS, if any fragrance or color will fade... you need time to test these things and know with little doubt what is going to happen to those soaps if they sit for months or years in someone's drawer before getting used.

 

[Tabitha]

If this is indeed a "big opportunity" for you, I wouldn't think you would want to blow your chance by selling inferior soap. You could end your soapmaking career before it begins.

 

[Sunny]

my main concern would be that the soap goes rancid and starts to smell bad.

considering that you've only been making soap for 3 weeks, you have no idea what the soap will look like in 3 months, or 6.

what if your buyer takes the soap home and puts it in a drawer for 6 months before they use it - and then they find it and it has turned orange and stinks?

if you sell a bad batch, they likely will not be back to buy anymore from you. and will likely not trust any future handmade soap for the same reasons. you have affected your own sales and others as well. plus you have ruined someone's day and wasted their money.

 

[pumita]

Don't exagerate.

By the way, I´m going to move, so I won´t ruin my carreer by selling a soap thats not 100% perfect.

And why should it get rancid??

 

[krissy]

Don't exagerate.

By the way, I´m going to move, so I won´t ruin my carreer by selling a soap thats not 100% perfect.

And why should it get rancid??

there is no exageration there. and just because you intend to move is not a reason to sell an inferior product just because you wont be there to have to deal with unhappy customers if your product goes rancid before they use it.

another reason to not sell is if you dont know how your soap could go rancid, you need to spend more time researching and less time worrying about selling at this time. i am not saying never sell, but 3 week old soap that you have not done the proper research on after it is made is not good business, not good ethics and not nice to anyone who might buy your soap.

you do what you want, but you can not expect support for something so fool hardy from people who have done this for years and have put in the man hours and research to put out a quality bar that will last. you dont even know if you will get DOS or how your soap will hold up while left in a drawer because people like to save things like that.

rather than taking exception to people giving you honest feed back on the topic, read, learn and grow as a soapmaker.

 

[Deda]

Don't exagerate.

By the way, I´m going to move, so I won´t ruin my carreer by selling a soap thats not 100% perfect.

And why should it get rancid??

Well, since you clearly have no idea what you're doing, and no regard for your customers safety, we can only assume that your process is as damaged as your thinking.

Garbage In/Garbage Out.

Sorry, but trolls are not welcome on this forum.