How do you rebatch failed salt bars?

[Montuckygirl]

I made a very large batch of salt bars which I split in half to make two different scents from a YouTube video recipe and accidentally forgot to allow the frozen aloe/lye mixture heat up to a good temp and my soap never saponified. I am kind of new to soaping, under 20 batches. How can I salvage this soap with salt in it?

 

[DeeAnna]

I'm a little confused why you say the soap never saponified. What basis are you using to say that? Photos? Recipe?

It feels like there's information missing that is critical to understanding your troubles. That may be why your post hasn't gotten any responses until now.

What people normally do is freeze the water-based liquid and then add solid NaOH. Is that what you did?

If so, the heat created by dissolving the NaOH should have thawed the frozen liquid just fine. Even if this lye solution was quite cold, it still should have saponified okay, especially since salt bars are normally very high in coconut oil and heat up pretty fast.

Or are you freezing the lye solution after it's made up?

 

[Montuckygirl]

When I went to test the bars with water, they act just like a hard blob of oil and salt, no suds, just leaves oil on my hands like I was wiping solid fat on my skin. I will follow up with a picture soon. Yes, I know I added the lye. I did freeze the water based liquid and add solid Na OH. I did not freeze the lye solution after it was made up.

 

[artemis]

When I went to test the bars with water, they act just like a hard blob of oil and salt, no suds, just leaves oil on my hands like I was wiping solid fat on my skin. I will follow up with a picture soon. Yes, I know I added the lye. I did freeze the water based liquid and add solid Na OH. I did not freeze the lye solution after it was made up.

Still missing information here. We need the recipe and methods you used. Also, how long did you let the bars cure before using them?

 

[Montuckygirl]

I used Ellen Ruth's recipe: Basic Sea Salt Soap Recipe:48 oz (1361g) Coconut oil, 6 oz (170g) Castor oil, 3 oz (85g) Cocoa butter, 3 oz (85g) Shea butter, 8.2 oz (232.5g) Lye, 20 oz (567g) Aloe Vera juice & Distilled Water, 3 6 oz (1020g) Sea Salt (fine grind). I used pure aloe vera juice and no distilled water however.
I tested for suds after one day, after one week, at four weeks and at 6 weeks. No suds to this day, the salt is just leaching through and turning the soap crusty.
Finally got some pictures to show you. The only difference in these is the fragrances used and a scant bit of mica for color. The recipe was split into two.

 

[Montuckygirl]

I was just thinking the other day. The aloe vera gel I used may not have had enough water in it. I had harvested my own aloe vera leaves, pulverized the pulp, poured it into ice cube trays, froze it, then used that directly with with the lye. Is it possible there just wasn't enough water in the aloe pulp to convert the fats to soap? Again, if I try to rebatch this, would it be worth cutting the soap up and adding some water and trying to rebatch it or will the salt dissolve and mess it all up? Will it even matter if the salt dissolved as I am pouring it into individual molds to reharden?

 

[artemis]

Is it possible there just wasn't enough water in the aloe pulp to convert the fats to soap?

So, it's not the liquid that converts the fats into soap. You do need enough liquid to dissolve the NaOH. But, if you did not have enough liquid, I think you would have noticed, because you would have seen the undissolved lye when you went to mix it with your fats.

I don't know who Ellen Ruth is, but it doesn't look like the usual salt bar recipe. Most are 100% coconut oil (I prefer 80% CO and 20% Avocado oil) and a very high superfat, like in the realm of 25%!The salt interferes with lather, so to compensate you need a fat that makes a very bubbly soap. [Edit: I put the numbers on a calc and it looks like your oil percentages match mine and your superfat is right around 20%. I suspect that the butters are what is interfering with lather.]

As for rebatching, I hate it. I have grated up my salt bars and added them to a fresh batch of soap.

Thankfully, even if soap doesn't lather, it still cleans.

 

[dibbles]

I only added butter to my salt bar recipe one time - it didn't lather well, or at least not like a salt bar without butters added. I have not added butters again. I love salt bars because the big cloud of fluffy lather is so fun to play with

I also hate rebatching and avoid it at all costs. If it were me, I would grate it and add to new soap as @artemis suggested.

 

[Montuckygirl]

I am SO ELATED to hear that I don't have to throw it away or rebatch it, that I can grate it up little by little and add it to new batches. So, then does the stick blender need to be utilized to incorporate it after trace or is the lye water poured over it and then added with the fats?

 

[artemis]

I am SO ELATED to hear that I don't have to throw it away or rebatch it, that I can grate it up little by little and add it to new batches. So, then does the stick blender need to be utilized to incorporate it after trace or is the lye water poured over it and then added with the fats?

There are at least two ways to do this.

Confetti: just stir it into your soap batter. It will look like confetti or sprinkles. Like when you mix sprinkles into your cake batter.

Ciaglia: stick blend it in. The grated soap will be made finer and the soap will look like a granite.

HOWEVER: when I grate salt bars, they get quite powdery. The grated soap will look almost like delicate snowflakes throughout the soap. Sort of a "dappled" effect. At least, that has been my experience. I can't wait to see what your experience will be!

 

[Montuckygirl]

I only added butter to my salt bar recipe one time - it didn't lather well, or at least not like a salt bar without butters added. I have not added butters again. I love salt bars because the big cloud of fluffy lather is so fun to play with

I also hate rebatching and avoid it at all costs. If it were me, I would grate it and add to new soap as @artemis suggested.

Would you be willing to share one of your salt bar recipes with me?

 

[Montuckygirl]

There are at least two ways to do this.

Confetti: just stir it into your soap batter. It will look like confetti or sprinkles. Like when you mix sprinkles into your cake batter.

Ciaglia: stick blend it in. The grated soap will be made finer and the soap will look like a granite.

HOWEVER: when I grate salt bars, they get quite powdery. The grated soap will look almost like delicate snowflakes throughout the soap. Sort of a "dappled" effect. At least, that has been my experience. I can't wait to see what your experience will be!

Thank you for those ideas. I have heard of Ciaglia and Confetti, but had forgotten about them as options.

 

[Tammyfarms]

I recommend keeping a few bars and trying them again at about a year. My salt bars are really unimpressive until they are about a year old. After a year they are awesome.
For recipes, this thread may be helpful.
Thread 'Please tell me about salt bars'
https://www.soapmakingforum.com/threads/please-tell-me-about-salt-bars.93783/

 

[dibbles]

Would you be willing to share one of your salt bar recipes with me?

Sure. It’s the same as many others here use. 80-85% coconut oil, 10-20% liquid oil of choice, 5% castor oil if I use it. For the liquid oil, I like avocado if I have it, otherwise high oleic sunflower or olive oil is what I usually have on hand. I have found that fine sea salt at 50% of the oil weight is what I prefer, and I use 15-20% SF. As @Tammyfarms mentioned, I let my salt bars cure for at least 7 months before using.