~ Fragrance Oils vs Essential Oils? (drama)

[Lunar]

Long story short-ish, the lady I subcontract under in my non-soap business is an MLM distributor for essential oils. I mentioned in passing that I was excited to get a fragrance oil order come in so I can begin soap making and she immediately began telling me I shouldn’t be using chemical laced fragrance oils and that I should be using EO instead. She started saying we needed to have a talk and if I’m planning on selling I can’t be using chemicals like FO..

She has since antagonized me so much that I’d developing stress headaches and finding my anxiety heightened. She has tried to get me on the Essential oils train before with mentioning that I need oils when I say I’m a bit tired or have a headache but I brush those off but this has been relentless. She‘s even been telling her upline that I’m getting into FO, she mentions how we need to have a talk every time we pass each other and even has gone so far to ask what fragrances I’ve purchased so she can attack them.

Can someone please help me rebutt and make positive claims for Fragrance oils? I have tried telling her that a lot of essential oils burn off in the soaping process but she talked over me

Plus, I have no intentons on making all natural soaps, I love the fun candy looking soap and do not want to use essential oils. I also wouldn‘t want to buy her exoensive MLM oils even if I did use EO but she could kick me out of her building if she ever felt like it so I’m too nervous to tell her to cut the nagging

Please help me make a good case for Fragrance Oils!

 

[Obsidian]

I don't think there is anything you could say about FOs that would get this woman on board with them.
I would simply tell her I like my chemical laced fragrances and have absolutely no interest in EOs.

 

[shunt2011]

I agree with Obsidian. You're not going to get her on board. Some of those MLM gals are psychotic. I've had them confront me at shows in the past. I tell them to do them and I'll do me. Also, just because EO's are "natural" doesn't mean they are safer in many cases. So, just tell her to back off and you'll do what you want to do.

 

[Lunar]

Thanks! At least I know I’m not alone.

i really hope she drops it because it’s making an uncomfortable work environment. I’m also anti-MLM and she’s after distributed for 3 in the past few years, but none to this extent. She honestly thinks EO are the magic cure

i’d also like to note... the hand soap in our washroom that everyone is required to use at the moment does contain parfum and many other chemicals on it’s ingredient list.. it’s equate brand from Walmart

 

[Rsapienza]

I believe that at least 1 of those MLM oil companies do not allow soaps to be sold and advertised with their product (or something along those lines). I've read about it before. Maybe you could look into it further as that would be the perfect rebuttal

 

[Lunar]

I believe that at least 1 of those MLM oil companies do not allow soaps to be sold and advertised with their product (or something along those lines). I've read about it before. Maybe you could look into it further as that would be the perfect rebuttal

I did not know that. I will definitely look into it now. Thanks!

 

[Rsapienza]

I did not know that. I will definitely look into it now. Thanks!

I just looked it up. Apparently, using them as in ingredient in another product goes against their rules. That should chill her out (if it applies).

 

[BattleGnome]

You could also talk about the allergy triggers in certain essential oils. I’m pretty sure there’s been at least one or two people on the forum with significant allergies that choose FO’s due that frivolous reason of wanting to live.

i don’t know what oils you ordered or from where but there are some FO brands that incorporate EO’s. I think BB’s lavender 60/40 is one and possibly some of their citrus stuff but it’s not something I look for so I don’t have a list.

lastly, cost. MLMs are expensive. You can always pull up bulk pricing for fragrances (both EO and FO) and ask if she can do better. If she’s that die hard maybe you can negotiate a raise (but then you may have to buy her stuff).

 

[MGM]

I agree that you need to not engage, esp if your job is one the line. You are NOT going to change her mind because

1. she's brain-washed on the topic and
2. the MLM is her $$$.

If she were just a wheatgrass smoothie fanatic but didn't sell wheatgrass smoothies, she wouldn't care as much what you put in your smoothie. But because you are a potential CLIENT (and in MLMs, you are so much more than a client. You have the potential to recruit new clients for her...), she is super invested.

If you feel you must say something, I'd just say you can't afford to use EOs and leave it at that.

And of course, don't be bringing any soaps around the office.....

 

[AliOop]

I was just going to make the same remark that @Rsapienza made. My understanding is that ALL of the MLMs have that same rule - you can’t name their product as an ingredient in your product.

To add to that, the amount of MLM-based EO that you would need would make most bars cost at least $6 or more -and that is COST, mind you, not the price at which you could make any profit. A lot of people can’t get $6 per bar, but even if you got $10 per bar, that wouldn’t compensate you fairly for your time and investment.

So now you can agree with her that EOs would be nice in theory, but you cannot use them due to prohibitive cost AND bc the MLMs forbid it. And point out that this must be the reason that there is the “chemical-based” soap in the restroom.

If she still goes on, offer to make her some EO-scented liquid soap for the bathroom, using her EOs, and quote her the retail price for that. Keep offering every time she brings up the subject.

 

[The Bubble Fairy]

She clearly doesn't know science. Everything is chemical-based, including water (H2O) and her precious EOs, which are made from chemicals.

 

[Arimara]

She clearly doesn't know science. Everything is chemical-based, including water (H2O) and her precious EOs, which are made from chemicals.

THIS!!! It's really appalling how many people don't consider that. It's basic middle/highschool chemistry that everything is a chemical.

 

[MGM]

THIS!!! It's really appalling how many people don't consider that. It's basic middle/highschool chemistry that everything is a chemical.

Naw, that can be dismissed by who does the "making", labs or "Nature". Nature doesn't make anything bad or dangerous!

 

[artemis]

For a lot of people, "chemical" has come to mean "man-made" or "artificial". Even some of my intelligent, college-educated friends use the word this way. If I correct them, they say, "oh, you know what I mean!"

The thing that gets me is the idea of EOs being less processed or "man-made" than anything else. As if the EO just sort of dripped naturally out of the plant and into a container.

 

[TheGecko]

Can someone please help me rebutt and make positive claims for Fragrance oils?

Could give you quite a few, but to what end? You simply cannot have an intelligent discussion with folks like that. You could hand them a paper done by the best scientific minds in the worlds and they would still discredit it.

What I would do is to tell her to knock it off or you will literally take your business elsewhere AFTER you tell her boss why you are leaving.

 

[IrishLass]

Here's a good discussion on the pros vs cons of using FO's or EO's in soap:

https://www.soapmakingforum.com/threads/f-o-vs-e-o.14378/
Essential oils are pretty much unregulated medicines (at least here in the US). If one is going to use them in soap, one really needs to be educated at least enough to know safe usage rates for skin, because some are not safe to be used on the skin at any strength, while others are safe on the skin, but only if diluted at a certain percentage, etc., etc...... FO's on the other hand, are regulated. The ones we buy for soapmaking from any reputable soap supply vendor (at least in the US) have been tested for skin-safety and they come with safe usage rates.

Things aren't as cut-and-dried with EOs. The thing that really bothers me about these MLMers that sell push EOs is that they know nothing about them except what they are told by their upline, who more than likely also doesn't know much except for the hype told to them by their upline, and so it goes. The reason I know that they know nothing about EOs is because my older sister who I love dearly, bless her heart, got sucked in to the EO MLM madness and became a rep for the one that starts with a 'D'. She became a rep without knowing anything about EOs. She believed everything her friend/rep told her without checking it out on her own, got all excited and signed right up. And they let her! That's downright scary if you ask me. One of the main reasons why I invested a good chunk of my money in buying the giant tome, "Essential Oil Safety" by Tisserand/Young was so I could steer her from potential danger when needed. She knows how I feel about it (we've had words) and there now exists something of a truce between us to where she no longer discusses EOs when I'm present. lol


IrishLass

 

[HeatherS]

I love both EO and FOs, but I am extra sensitive to fragrance oils, and I have found only a few that don't give me an instant headache and nausea, something the essential oils do not. So I stick to essential oils for the most part. I would love to find a delicious plumeria as well as a real-smelling orange blossom scent though and would be willing to suffer the headache for the time it took to make a batch or 2 for myself.

I used to purchase EOs from a MLM company, but have found sources that are much cheaper and equal in quality. There are a couple blends I still buy from the MLM because I haven't been able to duplicate them yet.

Whether or not one makes their soap with essential oils, fragrance oils, or dew gathered under a full moon in springtime is their own business, and no one, I repeat no one should be trying to impose their beliefs on another. If you don't like it, don't buy from them, simple and easy peasy.

I am so sorry you are having to go through this. Especially as you are a sub-contractor and she has some control over you. Any chance of getting out from under her thumb?

 

[DKing]

I love both EO and FOs, but I am extra sensitive to fragrance oils, and I have found only a few that don't give me an instant headache and nausea, something the essential oils do not. So I stick to essential oils for the most part. I would love to find a delicious plumeria as well as a real-smelling orange blossom scent though and would be willing to suffer the headache for the time it took to make a batch or 2 for myself.

I used to purchase EOs from a MLM company, but have found sources that are much cheaper and equal in quality. There are a couple blends I still buy from the MLM because I haven't been able to duplicate them yet.

Whether or not one makes their soap with essential oils, fragrance oils, or dew gathered under a full moon in springtime is their own business, and no one, I repeat no one should be trying to impose their beliefs on another. If you don't like it, don't buy from them, simple and easy peasy.

I am so sorry you are having to go through this. Especially as you are a sub-contractor and she has some control over you. Any chance of getting out from under her thumb?

I am in the same boat, that i react to some fragrance oils, but seem to have no problems so far with essential oils, but that just might be that I have not had a problem so far with the essential oils I have used. I do find that people are pretty darn biased when it comes to a product that they are personally making money from so I tend not to listen to these people. In my personal experience, I have not found a fragrance oil that I have benefited from in a therapeutic perspective but are incredible scents in soap, but I do have a few essential oils that have helped in some therapeutic ways, and some just smell good. I do have some fragrance oils that are wonderful in soaps, and some essential oils that have faded quickly, but each essential oil or fragrance oil is different. There are pros and cons to each in different ways. If anyone is pushing one or another in any way that benefits them financially, I tend to not listen too intently. Go with the ones that you find work best for you. For my purposes, I have ones from each group that I will, and will not, work with for soap making.

 

[JillGat]

This whole "natural = safe and effective/synthetic = bad for you" is wrong-headed and ignorant. Natural products can vary in strength and origin, while lab-produced products are dose-controlled and tested. Because essential oils are very concentrated, they can be even dangerous if used in certain ways. Some cause sun-sensitivity, some are risky for pregnant women, some are not for topical use at all. I love essential oils, but you are right that many of them fade in cold processed soap. She has a right to prefer essential oils, but her health claims are probably mostly bogus. This being said, you will NEVER convince her of any of this. Ever. Folks with this mind-set are very stubborn about it. Add to that her MLM involvement (in some cases, almost a cult mentality) and you're not gonna win. Smile and say that you will agree to disagree and change the subject if she ever brings any of this up again.

Naw, that can be dismissed by who does the "making", labs or "Nature". Nature doesn't make anything bad or dangerous!

Except nature makes arsenic, hemlock, rattlesnake venom, black widow spiders, nightshade, poison ivy, etc. etc. etc. Many plants develop toxins (some in the form of even scents that we like) for the purposes of natural pest control. Some of them can have ill-effects for humans, too.

 

[AliOop]

Except nature makes arsenic, hemlock, rattlesnake venom, black widow spiders, nightshade, poison ivy, etc. etc. etc. Many plants develop toxins (some in the form of even scents that we like) for the purposes of natural pest control. Some of them can have ill-effects for humans, too.

You do know that MGM was being sarcastic, yes?