Extra Virgin
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I have been using extra virgin organic. I read somewhere that the pomace makes the soap a green. I know my ev is green before is a soft light green before I rebatch it. Also pomace has a lot of deposits in it because it is the last process done after all the other oils have been extracted.
gemini said:
Unless the oil is cold pressed or extra virgin it will have some deposits because it is chemically extracted. Pomace is no different. As far as the color goes, it is a light green, but so is evoo, it does not impact the color of the soap, admittadly if used as a single oil to soap it will not give you a white bar but nor will evoo.
Why do you rebatch?
For a washaway product like soap, I find pomace olive oil value for money, the more expensive oils I prefer to use in leave on products
cdwinsby
Well-Known Member
Any olive oil will do. It's purely a matter of preference. Each type (and brand) will have subtle differences in the look (color) of the finished product.
I try to buy olive oil that has a golden rather than green color because I like the whiter color of the finished soaps.
Pomace oil will speed up trace considerably and has a large amount of unsaponifiables (olive bits) in it, as Gemini said. It can also have chemicals in it since they are sometimes used to extract the last bit of oil from the olives.
I try to buy olive oil that has a golden rather than green color because I like the whiter color of the finished soaps.
Pomace oil will speed up trace considerably and has a large amount of unsaponifiables (olive bits) in it, as Gemini said. It can also have chemicals in it since they are sometimes used to extract the last bit of oil from the olives.
I probably woulnd't use the pomace because of the risk of unknown chemicals but if you do maybe you could run it through a filter to get out the residue? It is a lot less expensive.
I rebatch for a couple of reasons. First it gives a harder longer lasting soap and as far as additives go you can add a lot less since there is no lye present by the time you add them. Also, I can make a big batch of cp all at once and do a little rebatches of 4 or 5 bars of several different kinds at my leisure. Rebatch is easy I don't have to stand over it while it is melting. It gives me the flexibliity to work on one kind of soap at a time and not have to rush seperating and mixing a bunch of different soaps all at once like you do with traced cp. That would be too messy and confusing for me. I'd end up mixing up all the ingredients and have a batch of mystery bars!
I rebatch for a couple of reasons. First it gives a harder longer lasting soap and as far as additives go you can add a lot less since there is no lye present by the time you add them. Also, I can make a big batch of cp all at once and do a little rebatches of 4 or 5 bars of several different kinds at my leisure. Rebatch is easy I don't have to stand over it while it is melting. It gives me the flexibliity to work on one kind of soap at a time and not have to rush seperating and mixing a bunch of different soaps all at once like you do with traced cp. That would be too messy and confusing for me. I'd end up mixing up all the ingredients and have a batch of mystery bars!
I use EVOO because it has a higher proportion of unsaponifiables (which means they will last through to your finished soap) aka nutrient value.
I also use this because I would not put something on my body i wouldnt eat. and I wouldnt eat any but EVOO because it is not made with chemical extraction. I would either use this or Grade A.
Here is how it goes, at least to my understanding (which I may admit could be wrong but im pretty sure it is accurate)....
EVOO: First pressed, the whole fruits
Grade A: pits are seperated, second pressed, fruits are ground/pressed.
Grade B: The ground fruit is extracted with a solvent (hexane usually)
Grade C (Pomace?): the pits are ground and remaining oils extracted through solvents (again...hexane)
I also use this because I would not put something on my body i wouldnt eat. and I wouldnt eat any but EVOO because it is not made with chemical extraction. I would either use this or Grade A.
Here is how it goes, at least to my understanding (which I may admit could be wrong but im pretty sure it is accurate)....
EVOO: First pressed, the whole fruits
Grade A: pits are seperated, second pressed, fruits are ground/pressed.
Grade B: The ground fruit is extracted with a solvent (hexane usually)
Grade C (Pomace?): the pits are ground and remaining oils extracted through solvents (again...hexane)
do you use coconut oil? it's generally extracted with hexane (and as a friend from the Philippines told me, so is the EVCO in many cases - on the sly, so to speak)
I posted once over at the dish a thread about how most oils are solvent extracted. as in almost all of them.
I posted once over at the dish a thread about how most oils are solvent extracted. as in almost all of them.
I was switching to EVOO from regular OO because I wanted to see if there would be any difference in the yellowing of my olive oil soap. I don't notice it in my other soaps, but as my olive oil soap has aged, it has turned yellowish.
I think it would be the same progression as i posted above for CO as well,
I know that EVCO is extracted by boiling off the meat and such.. (I would LOOOOVE to try making this one time..but have not got a supply of coconuts...)
they give a little explanation on there... apparently the term 'virgin' or 'extra virgin' is unregulated as far as coconut oil goes... crazy stuff... makes me want to keep on making 100% EVOO bars
...
I know that EVCO is extracted by boiling off the meat and such.. (I would LOOOOVE to try making this one time..but have not got a supply of coconuts...)
they give a little explanation on there... apparently the term 'virgin' or 'extra virgin' is unregulated as far as coconut oil goes... crazy stuff... makes me want to keep on making 100% EVOO bars
...actually the olive oil verbiage is more or less unregulated in the US. Basically it has nothing to do with how the oil is extracted (see below)
"International Olive Oil Council (IOOC). Most countries use the IOOC standards. The U.S. is one of the few major markets which has not adopted the IOOC definitions. Instead the USDA has a 1948 classification which uses terms such as "fancy" and "choice". "
http://oliveoilsource.com/definitions.htm
(http://www.ams.usda.gov/AMSv1.0/getfile ... DEV3011889)
§52.1532 Grades of olive oil.
(a) U.S. Grade A or U.S. Fancy is the quality of olive oil that possesses the
typical greenish to light yellow color of olive oil; possesses a free fatty acid
content, calculated as oleic, of not more than 1.4 percent; is free from
defects; and is of such quality with respect to odor and flavor as to score not
less than 90 points when scored in accordance with the scoring system
outlined in this subpart.
(b) U.S. Grade B or U.S. Choice is the quality of olive oil that possesses the
typical greenish to light yellow color of olive oil; possesses a free fatty acid
content, calculated as oleic, of not more than 2.5 percent; is reasonably free
from defects; possesses a reasonably good typical odor; possesses a
reasonably good typical flavor; and scores not less than 80 points when
scored in accordance with the scoring system outlined in this subpart.
(c) U.S. Grade C or U.S. Standard is the quality of olive oil that possesses the
typical greenish to light yellow color of olive oil; possesses a free fatty acid
content, calculated as oleic, of not more than 3.0 percent; is fairly free from
defects; possesses a fairly good typical odor; possesses a fairly good typical
flavor; and scores not less than 70 points when scored in accordance with
the scoring system outlined in this subpart.
(d) U.S. Grade D or Substandard is the quality of olive oil that fails to meet the
requirements of U.S. Grade C or U.S. Standard.
"International Olive Oil Council (IOOC). Most countries use the IOOC standards. The U.S. is one of the few major markets which has not adopted the IOOC definitions. Instead the USDA has a 1948 classification which uses terms such as "fancy" and "choice". "
http://oliveoilsource.com/definitions.htm
(http://www.ams.usda.gov/AMSv1.0/getfile ... DEV3011889)
§52.1532 Grades of olive oil.
(a) U.S. Grade A or U.S. Fancy is the quality of olive oil that possesses the
typical greenish to light yellow color of olive oil; possesses a free fatty acid
content, calculated as oleic, of not more than 1.4 percent; is free from
defects; and is of such quality with respect to odor and flavor as to score not
less than 90 points when scored in accordance with the scoring system
outlined in this subpart.
(b) U.S. Grade B or U.S. Choice is the quality of olive oil that possesses the
typical greenish to light yellow color of olive oil; possesses a free fatty acid
content, calculated as oleic, of not more than 2.5 percent; is reasonably free
from defects; possesses a reasonably good typical odor; possesses a
reasonably good typical flavor; and scores not less than 80 points when
scored in accordance with the scoring system outlined in this subpart.
(c) U.S. Grade C or U.S. Standard is the quality of olive oil that possesses the
typical greenish to light yellow color of olive oil; possesses a free fatty acid
content, calculated as oleic, of not more than 3.0 percent; is fairly free from
defects; possesses a fairly good typical odor; possesses a fairly good typical
flavor; and scores not less than 70 points when scored in accordance with
the scoring system outlined in this subpart.
(d) U.S. Grade D or Substandard is the quality of olive oil that fails to meet the
requirements of U.S. Grade C or U.S. Standard.
seriously!?!?! ... wow so what IS regulated lol... so does that mean if i am buying extra virgin olive oil, it may not be expeller presssed, it may be extracted by alternative means??... thats kind of freaky...
and also what inspires me to make everything myself...wish i had an olive plantation!
and also what inspires me to make everything myself...wish i had an olive plantation!
Life is complicated LOL.
Seriously though - I worked for the USDA back in the day and this is for real!
So in the USA they can use terms like Extra Virgin any way they wish. The only things that are regulated the country of origin and the "Grade"
Seriously though - I worked for the USDA back in the day and this is for real!
So in the USA they can use terms like Extra Virgin any way they wish. The only things that are regulated the country of origin and the "Grade"
I do believe the word organic is regulated. For soapmakers at least, I know you cannot label and sell a product as organic unless you have gone through a certification process. So just making an assumption that there is little risk that the Organic olive oil is extracted with a chemical process. I will stick with buying extra virgin organic olive oil and organic coconut oil using the same reasoning. I will look for cold pressed as that specifically addresses the process used to extract the oil.
Hmm, not sure I'd buy into the organic appellation for an imported product either, especially in a product with a strong history of fraud and adulteration. Granted I think it would have to be such to be properly labeled in the US, but I don't believe the federal government is checking the certifications, or if so not actually ensuring they are correct - kwim?
And as for Cold Press: ""Cold pressed" is an anachronistic and largely unregulated label description for olive oil. " (http://oliveoilsource.com/definitions.htm)
But as you have pretty much said, we all have to simply do the best we can.
And as for Cold Press: ""Cold pressed" is an anachronistic and largely unregulated label description for olive oil. " (http://oliveoilsource.com/definitions.htm)
But as you have pretty much said, we all have to simply do the best we can.
yeahh...thats craziness!!...
my rule of thumb ofr olive oil... Its got to be green.
anything less than that and ill suspect them cutting it with something or that it was solvent-extracted and not the quality i want
my rule of thumb ofr olive oil... Its got to be green.
anything less than that and ill suspect them cutting it with something or that it was solvent-extracted and not the quality i want
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