DOS ? on my original first batch of soap?

[loriag]

So I was inspecting my soaps cutting and ones already cured and I found my very first batch that I made January 31 had two bars each with a small orange spot. Is this is DOS?

I use olive oil from the grocery store. My recipe was OO 55.6, PO 22.2, CO 22.2 with 0% superfat.
Unscented no colour.

I have looked over all my other batches/bars and no spots on any. They are all scented and most have colour.

 

[Cellador]

It looks like DOS, especially if you didn't use any additives which can sometimes be the culprit.
How are you curing your soaps?

 

[loriag]

It looks like DOS, especially if you didn't use any additives which can sometimes be the culprit.
How are you curing your soaps?

I could not find any other spots on any other soaps. I looked very closely at all the next batches I made after this one.

 

[DeeAnna]

I agree; it looks like DOS. Now you know why many of us use a chelator, such as tetrasodium EDTA or citrate, in our soaps to combat these pesky spots.

You may find more spots crop up as time goes on. Or you may see only the two you have now. There doesn't seem to be any rhyme nor reason to it.

 

[loriag]

I agree; it looks like DOS. Now you know why many of us use a chelator, such as tetrasodium EDTA or citrate, in our soaps to combat these pesky spots.

I am still so new, haven' t heard or read about- "chelator, such as tetrasodium EDTA or citrate".

Time to go look these up.

 

[DeeAnna]

Click on "Soapy Stuff" under my name and look down the list for the section on chelators -- there are a few articles that might be helpful.

 

[loriag]

Click on "Soapy Stuff" under my name and look down the list for the section on chelators -- there are a few articles that might be helpful.

Which do you prefer for helping to combat DOS, Sodium Citrate or Tetrasodium EDTA?

 

[DeeAnna]

Based on what people say who have used both, it looks like EDTA is more effective than citrate for controlling DOS and soap scum. It has a bit of an PR problem with the "natural" crowd, so if that is a concern, you'll want to use citrate instead.

I haven't compared the two, so I can't say from personal experience. I have had very good results using EDTA at 0.5% (5 grams EDTA powder per 1000 grams of total batch weight). (edited -- changed "per 1000 grams of fat weight" to "per 1000 grams of total batch weight.)

I make a 50% solution of EDTA in water and use it that way because it's easier to measure. If you go this direction, the dosage would be 10 grams of EDTA 50% solution per 1000 grams of total batch weight. (also edited-- changed "per 1000 grams of fat weight" to "per 1000 grams of total batch weight.)

More info: https://classicbells.com/soap/EDTA.html (edited to add this link)

 

[BrewerGeorge]

Try gouging that orange section out with the tip of a spoon or something. Just to get down to the original color. Sometimes it might be caused by an impurity there or something that it touched and getting rid of the problem area will keep it from spreading. I've tried that a couple of times and had it work, and also had it fail - but you've got nothing to lose by trying.

 

[Kamahido]

Did you use tap water by any chance?

 

[loriag]

Orange spots have been cut out!
I always appreciate the responses.

I will order EDTA and wait to make any more soap until it arrives and I am comfortable with measuring and mixing it. I may be back to ask more questions than. I have checked out my soap suppliers and found 1 out of the 2 carries EDTA. Neither carry Sodium Citrate and I really don't want to try making the stuff. Living northern I doubt I could even find citric acid here.

I really see why it is suggested not to sell soap for a year. I didn't have plans to sell anyway when I started this adventure, but so many have asked or said "do you sell your soap", "you should sell your soap". Bhaa, I have told them I am not selling but they can be my testers. Thank goodness none received the unscented first batch, now here is hoping the others don't get the spots that I have given out. So far it has been all family and a friend.

 

[BrewerGeorge]

FWIW, Amazon carries sodium citrate for cooking purposes. In addition to soap, it's great for cheese sauces.

 

[loriag]

Did you use tap water by any chance?

No, used distilled water.

 

[penelopejane]

No, used distilled water.

Citric acid is available at most supermarkets. It is used in baking and to make jam.

 

[loriag]

OK I am one disappointed lady. I found 3 more batches with DOS. It was on the bottoms. I have been buying 1 litre bottles of OO thinking that they would be fresher as I use them up faster rather than having a large container open longer. I have also been using light OO as it is lighter in colour. Maybe I should wait until I can get to Costco to buy OO (3 weeks away). My soaps tend to have mostly around 55 % OO. I just don't know what else could be causing this. As I am new everything I have bought has been in the last two months.

 

[Sandra@SS]

My understanding
a)(from an olive grower and my research) is that supermarket olive oil is often technically rancid prior to being placed on the shelf.
This is because of storage time, blending (old and new oils), transport, heat ... etc even though the shelf life of olive oil is a few years.
and b) dos is primarily an issue of oxidised (rancid) oils used in the soap making.

Are you able to purchase an olive oil which is labled xxxx season.

October 2017 I bought 10L of a locally produced 2017 season oil at such a reasonable price! I use it in the kitchen too, and I know it is a better quality (freshness) than I can buy from the 'supermarket' and a few dollars less per kg too.

I use 75% olive oil in my soaps

 

[penelopejane]

OK I am one disappointed lady. I found 3 more batches with DOS. It was on the bottoms. I have been buying 1 litre bottles of OO thinking that they would be fresher as I use them up faster rather than having a large container open longer. I have also been using light OO as it is lighter in colour. I just don't know what else could be causing this. As I am new everything I have bought has been in the last two months.

Other causes of DOS are contact with metal or other contaminates from water or from your hands or from any oils, butters, milks or additives used.
Do you put your soap on metal at any time?
Is the DOS appearing where you might have touched the soap?

You also need to cure your soap in a cool room which has airflow and no sun. The soap needs to be on shelves that allow airflow. On really hot days if the room heats up you may need to put a fan on your soap.

CO is also susceptible to rancidity. I once saw Coconut oil that had turned pink in bottles in a shop. The whole shop stank of rancid oil but they were still selling it.

 

[shunt2011]

One of the only times I got DOS was on 100% CO soap. It was a relatively large batch I had made into stain sticks. After about 4-6 weeks I noticed that many of them had developed orangeish pink spot on them. I put several away and watched them, within 3 months they almost all had DOS. So, needless to say I tossed them. Since then I've only had DOS show up on a handful of bars and I think it was mostly caused by contact with my metal shelving. The lining had shifted and I didn't notice. As PJ said it can be caused by many different things. I've not experience it with Olive, Palm or Lard. Thank goodness.

 

[BrewerGeorge]

If you are in the USA, the olive oil you buy should be fine - especially if we're talking about "regular" olive oil typically used for soaping and not EVOO. The shelf life of classic olive oil is 18 months to two years, and suppliers simply are not going to be keeping it in the pipeline long enough for it to go rancid on the shelves. The economics of modern supply chain management strongly discourage the old stock buildup that is feared. On the contrary, I'd bet the vast majority of the Great Value brand olive oil on the shelves at Walmart is definitely from the most recent harvest. (Although the boutique of expensive stuff might not be.) As long as you buy from a reputable source and use good handling practices you shouldn't have rancidity problems with olive oil for at least a year.. The stories about adulterated or spoiled olive oil that you can still see on the 'net are all more than 10 years old now, and the labeling regulations have been corrected.

As for this DOS problem, I'd start looking at your process and equipment. What is your drying rack made of? What are you cutting with? Are you moving soaps around on an aluminum tray? What's the curing environment like?

 

[NsMar42111]

Look at your molds too-do you reline every time or are you using silicone? Look at where it is dos'ing, if it's always the bottom its an environmental issue not an oil issue. If it's the whole bar, then I'd eyeball your oils too. I just went through this myself.... and where do you live? that'll help nail it down (climate)