de-funk de pits

[earlene]

I don't have any rice bran wax, which other wax would you suggest as a substitute? Or could you use 8% cera bellina wax instead?

The only other wax I tried was beeswax and it was too draggy on my skin. So that's all I can say from personal experience. The only reason I combined the two waxes the first time I made this specific recipe was purely accidental. I had planned to use only one of them as a test, but accidentally picked up the wrong one and by the time my reflexes caught up with my brain, I had already poured in part of the 8% I was going to try with just the one. Then instead of just going with that one, I switched & made up the difference with the other to get the 8%. I never did try one vs the other because I was so pleased with my accidental formula that works so perfectly for me, that I just haven't bothered yet. For me, the issue was that with only MgOH & babassu oil, the stick melted in my car when I travel. It worked fine as a deodorant, but it needs to stay solid in my car, hence the added wax.

If you read back through the thread, you will see other additives suggested for creating a deo stick that is less prone to melting in higher temperatures.

 

[SoaperForLife]

Rice bran wax has a melt point of 186.8 degrees F. so you could sub carnauba wax which has a melt point of between 180 - 185 degrees F.

 

[KristaY]

I've never worked with rice bran wax, cera bellina or carnuba wax. Does it add "drag" to the deo like bees wax? I added candellila wax at 1% and it was so draggy I ended up with a horrible rash so could use nothing on my pits for several days. Luckily I didn't have to go out in the world and offend everyone I came within 10 ft of during that time since it's getting quite warm these days!

 

[KristaY]

I was just searching EO's and came across Thieves Blend. I totally forgot about it as it's been several years since I read the interesting history of it. I'm considering using it to scent my deo. My concern is the clove and cinnamon being possible irritants. The recipe I came across is:

40 drops clove
35 drops lemon
20 drops cinnamon
15 drops eucalyptus
10 drops rosemary

Any thoughts or ideas about using it in deo?

Here's a little history lesson for those who haven't read it:

https://myhealthessentials.ca/thieves-oil-history-blend-benefits/

 

[cmzaha]

@earlene I am not sure BTMS 50 is going to replace the Cera Bellina Wax and Rice Bran Wax because of melting points.
Btms50 has a melting point around 140F Cera Bellina has a melting point of 145-163 F and Rice Bran Wax melt point is 167-185F. So I can see why it would not be very melty.

In case anyone is curious here is melting points of some waxes and butters, all are Fahrenheit temps. Sorry I just do not do Celsius
Cocoa Butter 93-101 º
Kokum Butter 100-105 º
Illipe Butter 100-104º
BTMS 50 140º
BTMS 25 140º
Cera Bellina Wax 145-163º
Rice Bran Wax 167-185º
Oliwax 122-131º
Soft & Silky Emulsifier (WSP) 115-131 º
Candelilla Wax 155-162º
Carnauba Wax 180-187º

 

[earlene]

Thank you for the info on melting points. I had not looked those up in over a year when I decided to find a replacement for beeswax.

KristaY, personally, I did not find it anywhere near as draggy as compared to how the beeswax was draggy. But have you tried the plain MgOH with only babassu yet? It works perfectly fine for deodorant without the added wax that I use. I only used it because I needed something that wouldn't melt in my car on roadtrips. Inside my house, the plain deo without any additives remained solid and worked just fine. No additives means no dragginess at all. If you need the a firmer stick, like I did, but want to keep the drag down, you could try a smaller percentage. 8% is working for me, but perhaps you could try something less, like maybe 3 or 4% and see how it works for you.

 

[KristaY]

Thank you for the info on melting points. I had not looked those up in over a year when I decided to find a replacement for beeswax.

KristaY, personally, I did not find it anywhere near as draggy as compared to how the beeswax was draggy. But have you tried the plain MgOH with only babassu yet? It works perfectly fine for deodorant without the added wax that I use. I only used it because I needed something that wouldn't melt in my car on roadtrips. Inside my house, the plain deo without any additives remained solid and worked just fine. No additives means no dragginess at all. If you need the a firmer stick, like I did, but want to keep the drag down, you could try a smaller percentage. 8% is working for me, but perhaps you could try something less, like maybe 3 or 4% and see how it works for you.

I've been using babassu butter/mg hydroxide for over a year, maybe 2 years and I love it. The only other thing I added was lavender and TT EO's. My problem is the babassu oil is WAY to liquid at RT for me and my sis in summer. It's more a paste that needs to be applied with fingers. My sis travels a lot too so needs it to hold up when she's driving around southern AZ this time of year. Since I'm having a hard time finding the higher melt point butter, I want to use up the oil I have on hand. I'm going to give E Wax and cetyl alcohol a try to see if it firms it up any.

Thanks earlene!

 

[lenarenee]

Has anyone tried using stearic acid? (please don't make me re-read 30 page of this!) I have 2 lbs of it to use up.

 

[KristaY]

Has anyone tried using stearic acid? (please don't make me re-read 30 page of this!) I have 2 lbs of it to use up.

That's a very interesting idea, lenarenee. I don't recall anyone mentioning it in the last 30 pages, lol. Hopefully someone brighter than me chimes in on it.

 

[BattleGnome]

The last I used steric acid it didn’t blend well. Probably a method issue but the steric solidified faster than the oil and I’d end up with “steric spots”

 

[lenarenee]

The last I used steric acid it didn’t blend well. Probably a method issue but the steric solidified faster than the oil and I’d end up with “steric spots”

Were the spots problematic?

What would help the two oils mix better - aka can two oils be emulsified together?

 

[madison]

I've never worked with rice bran wax, cera bellina or carnuba wax. Does it add "drag" to the deo like bees wax? I added candellila wax at 1% and it was so draggy I ended up with a horrible rash so could use nothing on my pits for several days. Luckily I didn't have to go out in the world and offend everyone I came within 10 ft of during that time since it's getting quite warm these days!

1 % is too much, I am assuming that you made a small batch. I would start with very small amount like 0.1 gram, then adjust it.

 

[madison]

Has anyone tried using stearic acid? (please don't make me re-read 30 page of this!) I have 2 lbs of it to use up.

I am still playing with it, it's very hot here. I am not up to satisfying results yet. I may give earlene's recipe a try.

 

[BattleGnome]

Were the spots problematic?

My steric acid is in flake form the heating/cooling turned it into very small pastilles. It was like rubbing jojoba beads into my skin, except they didn’t dissolve all the way. If you choose to use steric I’d probably suggest a slow cooling/tempering method to keep things smooth.

 

[SoaperForLife]

Hey Earlene,
Curious as to which babassu oil you are using? The "hard butter" version that New Directions sells or the one that is the consistency of 76 degree coconut or ?

Formula I am using:

49% babassu oil
42% MgOH
5% Rice Bran Wax
3% Cera Bellina Wax
1% FO

 

[earlene]

Hey Earlene,
Curious as to which babassu oil you are using? The "hard butter" version that New Directions sells or the one that is the consistency of 76 degree coconut or ?

The only babassu I have any experience with comes from Soapers Choice. It is harder than 76° CO, which melts inside my house this time of year. Babassu remains solid throughout the summer here. I'd say it looks like lard or tallow in the bottle, but even lard starts to melt sooner. It melts in a hot water bath easily enough, but can take some time if the bottle is full, but even at 80°or more inside my house it remains solid. Not until I touch it to my skin, does it start to melt. So I would say it's melting point is close to my skin surface temperature, which is incidentally 92° currently.

 

[Rembetissa]

Earlene, thank you for posting how you make a stick that doesn't melt. I made it a few days ago, and so far have been really happy with it.

 

[KristaY]

Yesterday I made a new recipe (to me) that I adapted from previous posts on this thread (I'm sorry, I don't recall who posted). I used 12% BTMS 50 and 12% cetyl alcohol. The rest is babassu (low melt point) and mag hydroxide. So far so good but I'm getting a bit of "pilling" at the end of the day, meaning when I wash it off I feel bits of it on my pits. Maybe I need to drop the BTMS and cetyl to 10% or 11%? I'm really happy with the increased melt point though. I put it out on the back patio for about 6 hours and no change in consistency. It was only 90F and not in direct sun but this is a huge improvement over the deo without BTMS and cetyl.

 

[HowieRoll]

Yesterday I made a new recipe (to me) that I adapted from previous posts on this thread (I'm sorry, I don't recall who posted). I used 12% BTMS 50 and 12% cetyl alcohol. The rest is babassu (low melt point) and mag hydroxide. So far so good but I'm getting a bit of "pilling" at the end of the day, meaning when I wash it off I feel bits of it on my pits. Maybe I need to drop the BTMS and cetyl to 10% or 11%? I'm really happy with the increased melt point though. I put it out on the back patio for about 6 hours and no change in consistency. It was only 90F and not in direct sun but this is a huge improvement over the deo without BTMS and cetyl.

My current iteration of this deodorant is:
49% Babassu oil
33% Magnesium Hydroxide
8.5% E-Wax (Mountain Rose Herbs)
9% Cetyl Alcohol
0.5% Fragrance

As you can see, there is no BTMS-50 in the recipe (ewax, instead) and I do not get any of the pilling you mention - do you think it could be the BTMS-50? Of course, I'm also using a lower percentage of "hardeners," so maybe that could play a part, and I would think your idea of testing out a lower percentage of the BTMS-50/Cetyl is on the right track.

 

[KristaY]

Thanks HowieRoll! I chose to use BTMS only because it has a higher melt point than E Wax. For my next trials I'll make a batch with lower BTMS & cetyl, and also a batch replacing the BTMS with E Wax. Hopefully I'll be able to pin down the culprit. I appreciate your input HowieRoll!