Cupuacu and Kokum butters for first lotion bars?

[CreativeWeirdo]

So, I was given some Cupuacu seed butter (left) and Kokum seed butter (right), and thanks to @Zing 's Lotion bar evangelism , I have decided to try making lotion bars for the first time.

Anyone have any suggestions as to oils that would go well? Do I have to worry about rancidity? I was thinking maybe Jojoba and Apricot Kernel. Oh! And how much FO would you add?

The Cupuacu is relatively soft and the Kokum is harder. So, I was thinking of using the basic 1:1:1 beeswax : oils : butters and using equal parts Cupuacu and Kokum as the butters. I've also heard that adding a tiny bit of arrowroot powder will help get rid of greasy feeling on skin (which is what I HATE about moisturizers).

Thanks so much!

 

[dmcgee5034]

So warning I’m only 3 small batches in, but following Zing's recipe, 1% FO/EO and 1% Vitamin E, right @Zing?

 

[Zing]

I've used both butters and really liked them and remember them as being 'non-greasy.' Both jojoba and apricot kernel also absorb quickly. Not sure what your prices are but the price of jojoba here locally just skyrocketed. Other oils I recommend are sweet almond and fractionated coconut.
I follow eocalc.com and most are at 1%. I only use essential oils, can't help with FOs.
I'm not a chemist but my understanding is that 1% vitamin E oil is helpful -- I'm sure others will chime in here.
The good thing, tho', is if it's too greasy or too solid, you can just re-melt and add more beeswax or oil to your preference!

 

[ToniO]

I love Kokum butter! I use it in most of my soaps, lip balms and skin and face creams. You can even use it on its own!
I've never used Cupuacu butter before but just reading about it now, it sounds like a really good one!
I use the anhydrous antimicrobial, PhytoCide Elderberry OS from Lotioncrafter (INCI Sambucus Nigra Fruit extract), to make sure my creams and lip balms stay trouble free but I don't think you'd need to worry about that if you're not selling it and use clean hands!
I've never made a lotion bar, but if you pick the right oils, I don't think it will end up greasy. Jojoba is always a great choice ( I like to infuse mine with chamomile and calendula before I use it) and Apricot Kernel is a lovely oil also. Tamanu, Rosehip, EV Avocado, Babassu and Pumpkin Seed are some others with great benefits for the skin and I like to use some essential oils for skin benefits also, just make sure you stick to correct percentages for e/o's, no more than 1% total in your batch. Lavender is a go to one for many and Geranium is also wonderful for lifting some of the heavy nutty aromas some oils have.
I have too many allergies and make most of my products to be helpful for eczema sufferers, so the FO's don't work for me. If you want to buy tiny quantities to smell (or use for one or two bars)of essential oils, Eden Botanicals sell $2-$3 samples of their e/o's. You're only getting 1 gram but it's a cheap way to not make an expensive mistake on an e/o you hate!

I'd make a tiny batch on a double boiler and play with the consistencies. Dip the tip of a spoon into your mix, pop it in the fridge for a moment and then see how it feels. You can add more of an oil/butter/wax to make it harder or softer. Just wait until the end to add any e/o's so they're not getting heated up too much.
Weigh everything in grams and write down every bit that goes in the pot/bowl. If it turns out fabulous, you'll want to make it again!!
Good luck!

Zing, I just saw your post - I don't know what quantities you buy your Jojoba oil in but Jedwards (bulknaturaloils.com) has some of the cheapest organic Jojoba oil that I've found in the US so far. A gallon is $67 for org golden and $79 for the org clear and on $58 for the non-org golden.
They have good prices on a lot of stuff actually and the quality is nice. Some of their oils come in smaller sizes (especially the expensive ones!) but many start at a gallon size.

 

[johnnyusa]

I'm also researching non-greasy oils to step up my body butter game.
Right now my one recipe works for shaving, post-shaving balm, and sufficient moisturizing whenever I'm a little dry, but it's kinda greasy.

Top of my list are EV Avocado oil, mango butter, sweet almond oil, Jojoba, kokum seed butter, Cupuacu seed butter

Jojoba should be 10% tops or so tops bc its technically almost a liquid wax or smthng, right?

Also going to look into Tamanu, Rosehip, Babassu and Pumpkin Seed, Apricot Kernel oil...

Any others suggestions appreciated.

I'm reading Marie Gale's book '300 Years of Natural Soap & Cosmetic Recipes' right now.

I skipped chapter 4 on 'Creames & Lotions' bc I don't mix oil n water, but enjoyed ch 5 on Balmes & Salves very much and am presently reading ch 6 on 'Oils'.
Random weird recipes from that oil chapter:
For 1) nail gloss, mix orange wax w tamanu oil, coconut + almond. 2) Stretch marks? Camelina oil, wheatgerm & carrot seed eo = active ingredients, 4) Healing Wonder Oil is 4 : 3 : 2 : 0.25 - Rosehip seed oil, emu oil which like musk nobody should ever use bc emus are slaughtered solely to get this oil, neem oil, Sea Buckthorn Berry Extract.

@Zing
Monoi Lotion Bar - pg 71
1 oz beeswax
2.5 oz Monoi de Tahiti
2 oz coconut oil

above recipe looks to need more beeswax & some butter according to Zings 1:1:1 wax butter oils guidance.

I usually use roughly 10% wax & 20% butter. I've never tried forming it into a bar before but it works great in a jar w Everclear & EOs as preservative.

finally procured for myself a couple gallons of organic perfumers alcohol (sugercane) from the Organic Alcohol Company in beautiful Ashland, Oregon that I use in bbutter as a preservative & to close pores post-shave, at a rate of 160g alcohol per 2000g bb

Interesting choice oil for a b.butter-- Monoi Oil

Lotion Bar Recipe For Rich People Only

2 oz beeswax
3 oz cocoa butter
2 oz shea butter
note to self try mixing c&s butters as above bc i read somewhere shea better than cocoa for bb bc less greasy
3 oz almond oil
1 oz mango butter
3 oz Emu oil
.667 cups cornstarch

what's a decent sub for emu oil?

Basic Lotion Bar

2 oz beeswax
2 oz coconut (oil)
1 oz shea butter
1 tbs scent blend

 

[Zing]

There's so many variations and ingredients to experiment with! I routinely use jojoba oil at 33%. I know technically it is a wax but I treat it like an oil. I like it because it makes for a less greasy lotion bar.

Other less greasy oils are fractionated coconut oil, sunflower, grape seed (but it goes bad quick), and mmmmmmeadowfoam seed oil, sweet almond, and apricot kernel.

 

[johnnyusa]

jojoba oil at 33%.

got It

fractionated coconut oil, sunflower, grape seed (but it goes bad quick), and mmmmmmeadowfoam seed oil, sweet almond, and apricot kernel.

always wanted some meadowfoam oil, which reminds me... argan oil !!!

 

[CreativeWeirdo]

Both jojoba and apricot kernel also absorb quickly. Not sure what your prices are but the price of jojoba here locally just skyrocketed.

There's so many variations and ingredients to experiment with! I routinely use jojoba oil at 33%. I know technically it is a wax but I treat it like an oil.

Amazing! Both Jojoba and Apricot Kernel are regulars in my soaps, so I've got PLENTY of those already in stock! Not so much the other oils so this works out great for me!


Thanks EVERYONE so much! I really appreciate all your help!

 

[ToniO]

johnnyusa, have you seen 'Greemu oil blend'?! I have no idea if it acts the same but the reviews on Amazon seem positive! It's a mix of Macadamia nut, palm, shea, sunflower seed and rice bran, ROE and lavender. There's also an emu oil called Emujoy that is supposed to be ethically sourced but I'd still feel weird about using it.

"Tamanu, Rosehip, Babassu and Pumpkin Seed, Apricot Kernel oil"
are all lovely oils. I use most in my face and skin cream.
I recently made an e/o and fragrance free goat milk soap that I finished off with Pumpkin Seed oil and Seabuckthorn Fruit oil. It turned out really nice. The Seabuckthorn was too orange for my face cream but gave a lovely orange stripe in the middle of my soap! The pumpkin seed oil added a little color but it's shaping up to be a creamy moisturizing bar with no strong smells..

Tamanu is wonderfully rich but has a strong toasted nutty smell that goes with it. E/o's can help lift that if you don't like it. I use it and Neem as my mixer oils with e/o's for some soaps. I like how it feels in them also.

Baobab oil is another good one, a light, non-greasy moisturizing oil that works great in skin and face creams. It's got a great blend of fatty acids, vitamins, antioxidants. Nice shelf life also and can help extend the shelf life of other oils that it's mixed with.

I agree w/ Zing that you can increase your jojoba percentage. Those wax esters just suck right into the skin and have a really long shelf life, If you have herbs you like (comfrey and lemon balm - great for healing - I use it in my lip balm soaked in Hibiscus seed oil, or chamomile and calendula - these flowers are just amazing!), you can infuse them in the Jojoba oil ahead of time. My Jojoba infusion at the moment has German Chamomile, Calendula and Helichrysum I. in it

Yep on Meadowfoam also, another great one, for creams and just by itself. Super light with an awesome shelf life.

I also really like illipe butter. It's a lot like Kokum in looks but has a profile more like cocoa butter but better tocopherols and barrier protection. I use both in my skin cream.
If you can get your hands on any unrefined EV avocado oil, it's a totally different beast, it's a dark green thick oil that's rich in vitamin e. You don't need much but it really feeds the skin.

And lastly, another one I always add a small amount of in my skin and face creams, soaps and lip balms is Castor oil. A little goes a long way. It attracts moisture to your skin, helps form a nice barrier and is slow to absorb with a not too greasy feel, so will add to the 'lasting' feel that's good in a skin cream/balm. It's also antibacterial. You could start with 1 or 2% in a balm/water-free cream and see if that's enough for you.

 

[johnnyusa]

johnnyusa, have you seen 'Greemu oil blend'?! I

Dang Alloque, you're an oil genius.
You really gave me a lot to chew on there.
I'm adding much of what you said to my notes for study. Thank you very much for sharing.

Greemu oil, he said...castor oil...Sea Buckthorn fruit oil...

 

[Kiti Williams]

I'm also researching non-greasy oils to step up my body butter game.
Right now my one recipe works for shaving, post-shaving balm, and sufficient moisturizing whenever I'm a little dry, but it's kinda greasy.

Top of my list are EV Avocado oil, mango butter, sweet almond oil, Jojoba, kokum seed butter, Cupuacu seed butter

Jojoba should be 10% tops or so tops bc its technically almost a liquid wax or smthng, right?

Also going to look into Tamanu, Rosehip, Babassu and Pumpkin Seed, Apricot Kernel oil...

Any others suggestions appreciated.

I'm reading Marie Gale's book '300 Years of Natural Soap & Cosmetic Recipes' right now.

I skipped chapter 4 on 'Creames & Lotions' bc I don't mix oil n water, but enjoyed ch 5 on Balmes & Salves very much and am presently reading ch 6 on 'Oils'.
Random weird recipes from that oil chapter:
For 1) nail gloss, mix orange wax w tamanu oil, coconut + almond. 2) Stretch marks? Camelina oil, wheatgerm & carrot seed eo = active ingredients, 4) Healing Wonder Oil is 4 : 3 : 2 : 0.25 - Rosehip seed oil, emu oil which like musk nobody should ever use bc emus are slaughtered solely to get this oil, neem oil, Sea Buckthorn Berry Extract.

@Zing
Monoi Lotion Bar - pg 71
1 oz beeswax
2.5 oz Monoi de Tahiti
2 oz coconut oil

above recipe looks to need more beeswax & some butter according to Zings 1:1:1 wax butter oils guidance.

I usually use roughly 10% wax & 20% butter. I've never tried forming it into a bar before but it works great in a jar w Everclear & EOs as preservative.

finally procured for myself a couple gallons of organic perfumers alcohol (sugercane) from the Organic Alcohol Company in beautiful Ashland, Oregon that I use in bbutter as a preservative & to close pores post-shave, at a rate of 160g alcohol per 2000g bb

Interesting choice oil for a b.butter-- Monoi Oil

Lotion Bar Recipe For Rich People Only

2 oz beeswax
3 oz cocoa butter
2 oz shea butter
note to self try mixing c&s butters as above bc i read somewhere shea better than cocoa for bb bc less greasy
3 oz almond oil
1 oz mango butter
3 oz Emu oil
.667 cups cornstarch

what's a decent sub for emu oil?

Basic Lotion Bar

2 oz beeswax
2 oz coconut (oil)
1 oz shea butter
1 tbs scent blend

You are using soft oils, try Coconut oil or Cocoa butter. I use both in my lotion bars and they are not greasy.

 

[ToniO]

Dang Alloque, you're an oil genius.
You really gave me a lot to chew on there.
I'm adding much of what you said to my notes for study. Thank you very much for sharing.

Greemu oil, he said...castor oil...Sea Buckthorn fruit oil...

Ha! Definitely NOT a genius but a chemical allergy test many years ago found that the source of my eczema was, among other things, many of the chemical preservatives that were in most on-the-shelf products.
So the fun journey of exploration began.
There are so many incredible oils out there - I feel like a kid in a candy shop sometimes...

Greemu oil - 'she' said... he he.

 

[BWt]

One of the best oils & butters information page I have found to date. Lists the absorption rate for each type of oil and butter. Scroll down to the end of the article for the absorption rate chart. Carrier Oils - What are Carrier Oils - Uses & Benefits for Skin & Hair

 

[Savage Daughter]

I posted this in another thread regarding lotion bars already, but I highly recommend Abyssinian oil, which I will be using in my own lotion bars. Soaks into my skin immediately, with zero greasy residue.

 

[user 58006]

There's so many variations and ingredients to experiment with! I routinely use jojoba oil at 33%. I know technically it is a wax but I treat it like an oil. I like it because it makes for a less greasy lotion bar.

Other less greasy oils are fractionated coconut oil, sunflower, grape seed (but it goes bad quick), and mmmmmmeadowfoam seed oil, sweet almond, and apricot kernel.

Ive been reading around from last post . You have me thinking .

 

[jeanemarie]

Fantastic info on oils used - you're rewriting my formulations!
But what about cooling once in the tubes? What are your best practices?

Carrier Oils - What are Carrier Oils - Uses & Benefits for Skin & Hair

Great article! @BWt