Crumbly When cutting

[Epicsoap]

Hi Epic Soapers!

I did my latest batch of soap Saturday night.
It is matcha charcoal soap with a Wooded Apple cider fragrance.

I used Olive Green Clay as my colorant. Could this cause the crumbling? I used a lower lye concentration this time as I have found my other batches were accelerating quite fast.
I also used some sodium lactate, and sodium citrate.
I am fnding the bottom half of the soap is crumbling away when cutting, but I am sometimes too hasty taking my soap out of the mould. I have only cut one loaf so far s I will leave the other another day or so to see if that helps to avoid it crumbling away.

I have been tinkering with different formulas and you will find what my recipe attached. Also I used new fragrances, and the recipe is slightly sweating as well, could this be because of the new fragrance?
Wow this is an interesting batch, learning with each one. Done about 15-20 batches now.

 

[shunt2011]

How much clay are you adding and how long do you wait to cut your soap? Is your soap gelling?

 

[Epicsoap]

Nah, it has stopped gelling.

I added 1 tspn per lb of oils.

How much clay are you adding and how long do you wait to cut your soap? Is your soap gelling?

I waited 24 hrs before I cut. Tonight I retried on my second loaf (48 hrs) and it still had the same effect maybe to a slightly lesser extent

 

[kchaystack]

What are you using to cut the soap? That look like shearing from a knife.

 

[shunt2011]

I'm thinking it may be what you are cutting your soap with causing.

 

[DeeAnna]

If soap is on the brittle side due to additives or choice of fats, a knife will cause that kind of breakage due to the knife's triangular shape. Use a bench scraper (dough cutter) or a wire cheese cutter. And cut sooner, rather than later.

If you must cut when the soap is brittle, try warming it in the oven for an hour or so at the coolest setting your oven will allow -- 145 F (63 C) is my oven's lowest limit -- and then try cutting the warmed soap. That may help.

Bench scraper:

 

[dixiedragon]

What Deanna said. Also, wipe the blade of your cutter with some water. It will help it slide through vs tear.

 

[Epicsoap]

Thanks for your replies!
I did use a knife as I can't find my soap cutters and this makes perfect sense.
Sometimes you just learn by making mistakes.
Cheers

 

[KristaY]

I've had that happen using a knife due to the wedging action but I'm also wondering about your clay. Are you hydrating it in water before adding it? You've got plenty of water in your recipe but maybe it needs to be mixed in water before being added to the recipe. When I work with clays I always mix with water several hours (or a couple of days) before I use them in soap. It's pretty amazing how much water they need to make a thin paste.

 

[penelopejane]

Thanks for your replies!
I did use a knife as I can't find my soap cutters and this makes perfect sense.
Sometimes you just learn by making mistakes.
Cheers

I am finding that problems with soap often tend to be a combination of things, so everyone's help here can be valuable. The crumbling soap could be a combination of the blade, timing, the ingredients in the mix and just when you think you have it all perfected the seasonal weather comes along to effect it all yet again. No wonder it takes years to perfect this craft. I don't think they are "mistakes" so much as learning curves - lots of them. :mrgreen:

 

[Epicsoap]

The good thing everyone is so wonderful on this forum to help accelerate us all up that long steep curve.

I did hydrate my clay in water for around an hour while I prepared. I am wondering if I measured too much clay to accommodate for the whole recipe rather than just the amount needed for the green sections.

The worst thing is I dropped my second slab before cutting it, and now it is really compromised and breaking in half. ahaha all you can is laugh.
Might rebatch this one.

 

[soaperwoman]

Crumbly issues

Crumbly bottoms can be common with clay soaps, along with salt. I like to pour clay soaps in individual molds to avoid cutting altogether. I also have a love hate relationship with titanium dioxide. If you added any it can cause crumbling. Most common reason for crumbling clay soaps is waiting too long. Clay soaps harden quickly and there is a point of no return if you cut too late.

 

[Epicsoap]

Okay just an update.
So this is what happened to some of the batch.
Salty type of surface with a PH of 10.
Thoughts>?
Is it potentially too much fragrance?

 

[DeeAnna]

I'm leaning toward a mixing problem. As in the bottom layer has a slightly different composition than the top layer for some reason.

If you soaped cool so the palm wasn't fully melted, it might be a different composition of soap -- more palm in the bottom and less in the top. That's utterly a guess, however.

In any case, if it doesn't zap, it's probably fine. Just an appearance issue.