Bubbles in soap

[Teresa408]

This is kind of hard to search for because I don’t know if I should say they are spots or bubbles, and then bubbles are usually usually referring to a final product, so apologies if this is obvious!

I’m getting bubbles lately, and the two major changes are 1. Sodium citrate and 2. RBO.

I did notice that my RBO had little bubbles when I poured it (I shook the bottle because there was sediment at the bottom I figured ought to be distributed evenly.

Maybe I should have let it sit and settle before proceeding?

I used a LOT of water (28% lye concentration) because I wanted plenty of time to play.

Photos:

1. three types, RBO/cocoa no color, RBO/cocoa with TD, RBO/Shea

2. The bubbliest one

3. Olive oil/CO with a RBO and Shea swirl.

4. Closeup of RBO/Shea swirl.

 

[earlene]

The cocoa butter and shea butter could be contributing to stearic spots. That's what they look like in the darker colored portions. A couple of the photos are a bit too small or blurry for me to see (it could be my monitor).

As far as bubbles in your oil or batter before you pour the soap, yes, letting it settle helps, but you can also spray the surface of the oil with alcohol and some of the bubbles will pop on their own. After pouring, if you see bubbles, you can tap the molded soap on the counter to encourage bubbles to rise to the top, then spray with alcohol and the bubbles will pop.

But to me, those look like stearic spots, which is explained here: https://www.lovinsoap.com/2017/01/white-spots-in-soap/

 

[cmzaha]

You really should not shake your oils, that information came from Soapers Choice several years ago

 

[Teresa408]

Could this have to do with my sodium citrate not dissolving completely in my lye water? I can never seem to get it to completely dissolve. I’m using 3% PPO.

The cocoa butter and shea butter could be contributing to stearic spots. That's what they look like in the darker colored portions. A couple of the photos are a bit too small or blurry for me to see (it could be my monitor).

As far as bubbles in your oil or batter before you pour the soap, yes, letting it settle helps, but you can also spray the surface of the oil with alcohol and some of the bubbles will pop on their own. After pouring, if you see bubbles, you can tap the molded soap on the counter to encourage bubbles to rise to the top, then spray with alcohol and the bubbles will pop.

But to me, those look like stearic spots, which is explained here: https://www.lovinsoap.com/2017/01/white-spots-in-soap/

Thanks for the link. I don’t think it looks like stearic spots, but it’s early to say. I sliced one piece off one of the loaves of soap and didn’t see any sign of trouble at all. It’s a little soft still so I had to stop at one slice. I should have mentioned the soaps were still gelling when I took the picture. I did tap (hard!) the molds on the counter. The bubbles weren’t exactly on the surface, but they were suspended in the batter several millimeters below. I can’t see any signs of them now, but there are some tiny bumps on the surface. Maybe the alcohol would have helped that. I think maybe my batter got too thick for all the bubbles to work their way out.

You really should not shake your oils, that information came from Soapers Choice several years ago

I don’t remember reading anything about shaking liquid oils but my thinking was that if palm oil needed to have all of its parts equally distributed, why not the RBO? The last gallon I bought had kind of a cloudy layer at the bottom and I didn’t want to get inconsistent results or color. Is there some other method like swirling or is it normal practice to just ignore the cloudiness?

 

[Cellador]

I've never noticed a cloudiness in RBO before- it's generally very uniform for me like most other liquid oils.
Could it have slightly overheated? That would be my guess...

 

[lsg]

My ricebran oil sometimes has a little sediment on the bottom.

 

[steffamarie]

I notice a cloudy layer at the bottom of my RBO but it’s worse the colder it is. I think part of it may be semi-solidifying since I store mine in the basement on a metal table. Many liquid oils will solidify or turn gel-like if refrigerated so I’m thinking that’s what’s happening since it’s only affecting the bottom where it touches the cold metal.

 

[DeeAnna]

The photos are only showing the surface of the uncut parts of the soap, not the sides of the cut bars. That means we're not seeing "bubbles" in the soap, we're seeing "bubbles" on the soap. It actually looks a lot like ash to me or signs of slight overheating.

If I saw these spots on the cut surfaces, then I might suspect they're air bubbles or stearic spots, because I've had both happen to me. But if they're not on the cut surfaces, I'm leaning toward ash.

 

[shunt2011]

I too get sediment on the bottom of my RBO. I just leave it there and pour off the top.

 

[Teresa408]

Ok, so looking at the bars once I sliced them, I’m thinking Earlene might be right about the stearic spots. They are crazy tiny, like I can barely see them, so hopefully they don’t become more obvious as the bars cure. Pics of sliced bars attached.

I've never noticed a cloudiness in RBO before- it's generally very uniform for me like most other liquid oils.
Could it have slightly overheated? That would be my guess...

My RBO or the soap? I did CPOP so the soap maybe, I had it on at 170 for a couple minutes twice (when I put each batch in) but the RBO has been hanging out in the hall closet and temps here in my area have maxed out at 80 in the past month.

My ricebran oil sometimes has a little sediment on the bottom.

At least I’m not the only one!

I notice a cloudy layer at the bottom of my RBO but it’s worse the colder it is. I think part of it may be semi-solidifying since I store mine in the basement on a metal table. Many liquid oils will solidify or turn gel-like if refrigerated so I’m thinking that’s what’s happening since it’s only affecting the bottom where it touches the cold metal.

Here in Northern California, no way mine is freezing. I keep it in an indoor coat closet. But when I move my stuff to the garage one day I will know to look out for that.

The photos are only showing the surface of the uncut parts of the soap, not the sides of the cut bars. That means we're not seeing "bubbles" in the soap, we're seeing "bubbles" on the soap. It actually looks a lot like ash to me or signs of slight overheating.

If I saw these spots on the cut surfaces, then I might suspect they're air bubbles or stearic spots, because I've had both happen to me. But if they're not on the cut surfaces, I'm leaning toward ash.

The photos were from gel phase so truly, there were bubbles in the soap. I’m thinking maybe I overdid the CPOP just a tiny bit because I turned it on for about 20 minutes for each batch, meaning the first one got heated twice. I had much cleaner results when I used a heating pad.

I too get sediment on the bottom of my RBO. I just leave it there and pour off the top.

Good to know. As long as it won’t mess anything up I’m happy to skip the step!

 

[cmzaha]

I don’t remember reading anything about shaking liquid oils but my thinking was that if palm oil needed to have all of its parts equally distributed, why not the RBO? The last gallon I bought had kind of a cloudy layer at the bottom and I didn’t want to get inconsistent results or color. Is there some other method like swirling or is it normal practice to just ignore the cloudiness?

You should stir the palm not shake it. I had a problem with some Neem Oil and ended up talking to the owner, I think is was the owner, sorry forget his name but many here will know, and I mentioned having to shake it. He informed me to never shake any oil and it was not just because it would form bubbles, unfortunately I do not remember what he told me. DeeAnna will most likely know why to not shake the oil. I stopped shaking any oils. I really do not worry about any sediment or I stir the oil, and there are several oils that can leave a sediment over time.

 

[DeeAnna]

Oxygen in fat can cause it to go rancid faster because rancidity is an oxidation process. Maybe that is why you got that advice to not shake, Carolyn. Not sure.

 

[Teresa408]

Good to know, thank you!