Bird nest in CP soap

[Oumsofia25]

*Ugh* durian & shrimp paste - terasi, yes? - can't even imagine the stink in that kind of soap There's a reason airlines don't like people bringing durian on planes when travelling

But yum....shrimp paste in sambal & anything else that's good for eating

Maybe try the peel of mangosteen (manggis) fruit as a colorant? That could be interesting. Or the peel of salak? Or soursop (sirsak) fruit in the soap batter. It's nice & acidic, very pulpy, makes a nice facial mask, so would likely be beautiful in soap! Klengkeng as well, maybe. Even the peels of these fruits. I wish I had been making soap while I was still in Indonesia so I could try out some of the fresh fruits from the traditional markets in my soaps

MODERATORS: please don't remove the Indonesian words as I am using them to ensure clarity of the post.

Yessss terasiii.. Great in sambal but I definitely wouldn't want my body to smell like it
I do think about mangosteen peel and also sappanwood (secang, have you ever heard about it?)
Sappanwood gives beautiful vibrant red color but it would turn brown when kept overnight (not in soap, just boiled/infused in water) so I assume it might turn brown too when used in soap. And mangosteen peels also turn brown easily.
Salak peel?? As scrub? It never came across my mind.. have no idea how to use it in soap
Soursop sounds good! All this time I've only tried papaya and now it becomes my current face soap

 

[Savage Daughter]

Yessss terasiii.. Great in sambal but I definitely wouldn't want my body to smell like it

Definitely NOT

I do think about mangosteen peel and also sappanwood (secang, have you ever heard about it?)

Actually, no, I didn't hear about it....my ex husband is Javanese, so I'm surprised he didn't tell me about it. I just now looked it up & want to try it!

Sappanwood gives beautiful vibrant red color but it would turn brown when kept overnight (not in soap, just boiled/infused in water) so I assume it might turn brown too when used in soap. And mangosteen peels also turn brown easily.

Yes, they do turn brown easily, but that's due to oxidation - exposure to oxygen....so I am wondering if the peels might keep their beautiful color if they were put into distilled water with some citric acid....kind of like citric acid will keep avocados, apples etc going brown when exposed to lemon juice or citric acid.

Salak peel?? As scrub? It never came across my mind.. have no idea how to use it in soap

Nooooo, that would really HURT the skin I mean experiment using it as a natural colorant. Dry it, grind it up in a stone, add some hot distilled water & a little bit of citric acid and / or lye, let it sit overnight, covered, and see what happens. Try a little bit of the liquid in a test batch of soap. Or soak the salak peel in your soap batch lye water overnight & just use that. The fruit would be interesting as well as the weird tannins in it are unique....one of my favorite fruits!

Speaking of scrub, I went to Merapi - the side where the parking lot is & where many people gather with friends & family - and saw the people in that area mining pumice from the volcano, carrying it out in huge bags on their backs...reminded me of slaves, which was upsetting to see ...anyways, that pumice, if very finely ground, could be quite nice in soap.

Soursop sounds good! All this time I've only tried papaya and now it becomes my current face soap

Yes, fresh papaya would be beautiful! Pineapple as well! Both would make great facial soaps

 

[Oumsofia25]

Actually, no, I didn't hear about it....my ex husband is Javanese, so I'm surprised he didn't tell me about it. I just now looked it up & want to try it!

Sappanwood commonly used in traditional beverage and for bathing newborn. Whenever I gave birth to my child my MIL would give me a big sack of sappanwood to bathe my child with. Took me around a year to finish the sack as the sappanwood can be boiled multiple times until it's completely lost its color.
It's good for soothing rashes and cleanse baby skin makes it appears brighter.

I want to quote your reply but I don't really understand how it works.. Need to take time to learn about it
Thank you for telling me about the oxidation. You gave me hope Now I want to try sappanwood to color my soap!
I guess now I have a lot of queues in my soap trial list

Haha, I'm so stupid to think of salak peel as scrub! It probably will feel like using cheese grater on skin
Maybe it will work as colorant.. but probably just makes brown/caramel color? I personally not a big fan of such color for soap, as it's quite 'basic', hehe
Never heard about pumice from Merapi, I thought pumice stones were only from beach

 

[Savage Daughter]

Sappanwood commonly used in traditional beverage and for bathing newborn. Whenever I gave birth to my child my MIL would give me a big sack of sappanwood to bathe my child with. Took me around a year to finish the sack as the sappanwood can be boiled multiple times until it's completely lost its color.
It's good for soothing rashes and cleanse baby skin makes it appears brighter.

I lived in your country for 10 years & nobody ever told me about this. 7 years in Java & the rest in Lombok & Bali. I did hear about traditional ceremonies people do after a baby is born, such as where they put the afterbirth & things like this. I am curious now to do more research on this plant because I work with plants for many purposes, including making traditional medicine, salves & other related products.

We have medicinal mushrooms which can be simmered in hot water many times before they lose their color, just like sappanwood.

I just checked & apparently sappanwood is in the same family as Brazilwood, which is nearly extinct, so sappanwood may be a good replacement for Brazilwood. I found this photo of the colors which people can dye cloth using sappanwood. Very beautiful! Since it's very good for babies' skin, this would be a great soap to make & sell there!

From this website: https://botanicalcolors.com/product-category/natural-dyes/specialty-raw-dyes/

I want to quote your reply but I don't really understand how it works.. Need to take time to learn about it

You quoted it fine, no problem

Thank you for telling me about the oxidation. You gave me hope Now I want to try sappanwood to color my soap!
I guess now I have a lot of queues in my soap trial list

Yes, I understand that, for sure. I am doing a couple of test batches every day right now, getting ready for my selling season, using the information I got from customers last year to improve factors which they mentioned & which I feel are reasonable, testing my natural colorants which have been infusing for nearly a year now, getting all of my equipment prepared & so on. Step by step, a little bit every day, otherwise it becomes overwhelming.

Haha, I'm so stupid to think of salak peel as scrub! It probably will feel like using cheese grater on skin

LOL not stupid, but yes, it would feel like a cheese grater hahaha

Maybe it will work as colorant.. but probably just makes brown/caramel color? I personally not a big fan of such color for soap, as it's quite 'basic', hehe

It can be difficult to know until the lye or citric acid reacts with the plant material. A mostly white & very lightly colored mushroom which grows on trees, and which I soaked overnight in citric acid & lye, turned into a very deep reddish-brown. It would depend on the natural chemicals present in the plant.

Never heard about pumice from Merapi, I thought pumice stones were only from beach

It looked like they were taking the pumice out in loose 'sand'-type form at that time. I never saw chunks of pumice in Indonesia, but I did see lots of obsidian in lava flows coming down from volcanos from past eruptions. It looks like beautiful waves of jet black glass....amazingly beautiful

I actually never saw any pumice on the beach there, no matter which island I lived on. Lots of deadly jellyfish though I guess those would be from previous volcanic explosions? Or from under water volcanoes? Just some guesses as I'm not a geologist. It's also been a long time since I was in a classroom as a student

I will be adding some fine pumice to another test batch of soap this week. It's great for people whose hands get dirty a lot.

 

[Oumsofia25]

I lived in your country for 10 years & nobody ever told me about this. 7 years in Java & the rest in Lombok & Bali. I did hear about traditional ceremonies people do after a baby is born, such as where they put the afterbirth & things like this. I am curious now to do more research on this plant because I work with plants for many purposes, including making traditional medicine, salves & other related products.

Well actually I just learned about this sappanwood after I got married. Previously I never heard about it, or probably did heard but didn't care because I wasn't interested in plants back then.
Which part of Java that you stayed in? Sappanwood is probably more popular in Jogja & Solo as it's often used in wedang (kinda like hot drink? I don't know the English word)
Those colored cloth pieces are indeed beautiful. I hope the color will survive through saponification when used in soap.

It can be difficult to know until the lye or citric acid reacts with the plant material. A mostly white & very lightly colored mushroom which grows on trees, and which I soaked overnight in citric acid & lye, turned into a very deep reddish-brown. It would depend on the natural chemicals present in the plant.

Amazing! I always think those fruit flesh or fruit peels would only color the soap just as their original color, or maybe turned brownish due to oxidation. It's good to learn new thing!

I actually never saw any pumice on the beach there, no matter which island I lived on. Lots of deadly jellyfish though I guess those would be from previous volcanic explosions? Or from under water volcanoes? Just some guesses as I'm not a geologist. It's also been a long time since I was in a classroom as a student

Me too actually Last week I found a pumice soap recipe in Elly's Everyday and she talked about collecting pumice from beach. That's why I thought pumice stone can only be found at beach
Yess.. definitely we have lots of jellyfish here

I ended up making my pumice soap with polenta as substitute for pumice, because I don't have any pumice powder, only have one pumice stone for my exfoliating my heels The soap is in curing time so I haven't tested it, I hope the exfoliating ability will be as good as pumice.

 

[Zuleika]

Bird's nest test done and waiting to unmold.
Pic 1. Bird's nest before and after soaking. Of course I forgot to weigh it. Used it in 1kg of soap batter.
Pic 2. Blended up bird's nest. Didn't blend fully so some smaller bits left.
Pic 3. Mixed in with lye water and it turned pale yellow. You can see it floating on top like oil. Smells like typical bird's nest sweet protein smell.
Pic 4. Bird's nest loofah soap and bird's nest blue clay soap.

 

[Oumsofia25]

Bird's nest test done and waiting to unmold.
Pic 1. Bird's nest before and after soaking. Of course I forgot to weigh it. Used it in 1kg of soap batter.
Pic 2. Blended up bird's nest. Didn't blend fully so some smaller bits left.
Pic 3. Mixed in with lye water and it turned pale yellow. You can see it floating on top like oil. Smells like typical bird's nest sweet protein smell.
Pic 4. Bird's nest loofah soap and bird's nest blue clay soap.

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Amazing!! I haven't got mine yet as my MIL needs time to sort it, so I tried making red sappanwood soap instead to test its color. As expected.. it's faded completely and turned into ivory white soap..
Your soaps looks great! Can't wait to see how it looks after unmolded and I wonder how the lather would feel. I wonder how the blue clay one will look like after unmolding, the color combination and the swirls are just too pretty! Please keep us updated!

 

[Savage Daughter]

Well actually I just learned about this sappanwood after I got married. Previously I never heard about it, or probably did heard but didn't care because I wasn't interested in plants back then.
Which part of Java that you stayed in?

I lived in Jakarta, but also spent some time in Semarang, Jogjakarta, travelled through many places on Java by motorbike, train, car, 'travel' etc. My ex-husband is from Semarang, actually. He has family in Solo, Kalimantan, areas around Semarang.

Sappanwood is probably more popular in Jogja & Solo as it's often used in wedang (kinda like hot drink? I don't know the English word)

So I guess more part of Javanese culture if that's the case.

Those colored cloth pieces are indeed beautiful. I hope the color will survive through saponification when used in soap.

It's too bad your soap didn't show the color. I have been playing a lot with indigo lately to see if I could get better, more consistent results, and more of a blue color rather than a blue-grey color. I notice that when I bloom the indigo overnight using some citric acid, a little bit of salt & a tiny bit of lye, my indigo color becomes more intense in my soaps, and more blue, than usual as they cure. Maybe try playing around with the sappanwood.

How did you use your sappanwood in your soap? What type of process did you use?

Have you tried putting some sappanwood into your lye water overnight, then using that lye water in your soap the next day?

Amazing! I always think those fruit flesh or fruit peels would only color the soap just as their original color, or maybe turned brownish due to oxidation. It's good to learn new thing!

It really depends on the plant, or the wood you are using. Yes, learning is always a good thing

Me too actually Last week I found a pumice soap recipe in Elly's Everyday and she talked about collecting pumice from beach. That's why I thought pumice stone can only be found at beach
Yess.. definitely we have lots of jellyfish here

Portuguese Man Of War.... The first time I saw them washed up on the beach, I thought they were little bits of blue plastic attached to a clear balloon...and I almost picked them up Sooooo dangerous....I have been stung by other jellyfish when snorkelling around Gili Trawangan. Use vinegar to neutralize the sting. It feels like fire, but it's better than getting sick, or going into shock & dying, from the stingers.

I ended up making my pumice soap with polenta as substitute for pumice, because I don't have any pumice powder, only have one pumice stone for my exfoliating my heels The soap is in curing time so I haven't tested it, I hope the exfoliating ability will be as good as pumice.

I'm sure you know how people in villages will dry their left over cooked rice in the sun, which makes it super crispy....I wonder if you grind that dried rice up in a stone like the ones used to make sambal, then add it to your soap, how that would feel?

 

[Oumsofia25]

So I guess more part of Javanese culture if that's the case.

Yes I think so. I'm not sure if sappanwood is common in Jakarta

How did you use your sappanwood in your soap? What type of process did you use?

I boiled my wood in demineralized water and then kept overnight in fridge, hoping that it will get darker. Maybe I didn't boil it long enough, mine was bright red, it could turn maroon red if boiled longer. Still maintain the red color when mixed with lye but then turned brown after I mixed it into oils. And I used sodium citrate instead of citric acid.
The soap batter color was dirty brown, I'm relieved that it turned ivory, much better.

Have you tried putting some sappanwood into your lye water overnight, then using that lye water in your soap the next day?

Not yet, I didn't know that it could make difference. I'll write your tips and try it in my next batch of soap.

I'm sure you know how people in villages will dry their left over cooked rice in the sun, which makes it super crispy....I wonder if you grind that dried rice up in a stone like the ones used to make sambal, then ad

Omg! How did you know that??
That village-style rice puff is so yummy. The maid in my MIL's house often make it with the leftover rice, and my children love it.
Haven't tried making any rice soap yet, but I think that grounded dry rice probably just gonna feel the same as using rice flour. Not the regular high-processed rice flour but the organic one that usually used for baby food. The regular rice flour is very fine while the organic one has rough feels.

 

[Savage Daughter]

Yes I think so. I'm not sure if sappanwood is common in Jakarta

I never heard anyone mention it in Jakarta. Maybe Betawi people don't use it like that??

I boiled my wood in demineralized water and then kept overnight in fridge, hoping that it will get darker. Maybe I didn't boil it long enough, mine was bright red, it could turn maroon red if boiled longer. Still maintain the red color when mixed with lye but then turned brown after I mixed it into oils. And I used sodium citrate instead of citric acid.
The soap batter color was dirty brown, I'm relieved that it turned ivory, much better.

Hmmmm....interesting....I have been looking more into the dying of fabrics with plant & mushroom dyes. I'm guessing that some of the answers lie in that area of expertise. I also want to try using potassium hydroxide with some natural colorants vs sodium hydroxide, and maybe even try to use some cream of tartar in my plant colorant mixture to see what happens. I'm not sure if cream of tartar is commonly available in Indonesia yet. When I was there, I never saw it anywhere. It was difficult to get many things, including real cheese, real butter & others.

Not yet, I didn't know that it could make difference. I'll write your tips and try it in my next batch of soap.

I don't know if it will, but we only know if we try

Omg! How did you know that??

Because I spent a lot of time in villages there. Some, my friends were born in. Some were where my husband's family lived, like my husband's nenek. Others, I just visited. I loved the way people put their mattresses & pillows out on their roofs in the sun to freshen them up My family would do that with very thick wool blankets which our grandmothers made for us by hand, but they hung them on clothes lines in the summer to refresh them. Our blankets & pillows always smelled so good

That village-style rice puff is so yummy. The maid in my MIL's house often make it with the leftover rice, and my children love it.

The first time I saw it, I thought 'Those look like Rice Crispies' like the cereal in other countries. People are much more careful with food there than in many Western & European countries where we waste so much food, where our supermarkets throw away billions of pounds of food every year instead of giving it to hungry people. People in countries like Indonesia find a use for even left over food because it became their habit when they grew up with not very much money, similar to my own family.

Haven't tried making any rice soap yet, but I think that grounded dry rice probably just gonna feel the same as using rice flour. Not the regular high-processed rice flour but the organic one that usually used for baby food. The regular rice flour is very fine while the organic one has rough feels.

I think that the organic one might feel very sharp on the skin, but maybe try it in a test batch & see how it feels. I might be wrong. I do know however that when I grind rice myself, the small pieces are very sharp. I know the organic one is better quality than the high processed rice flour, but I think maybe the processed rice flour might work better.

That's one of the fun parts of soap making....experimenting Good luck with your soaps

 

[Zuleika]

Totally thrilled with my soaps! Unmoulded perfectly after 1 day. I'm really glad my batter was thin enough to go around all the loofah bits since I used it dry. The blue clay one had visible ash which I tried to buff off some.

I'm happy that the blue clay mellowed into a lighter blue. I was afraid I had put too much mica in.

Update again when I do get around to using these after March.

 

[Oumsofia25]

I never heard anyone mention it in Jakarta. Maybe Betawi people don't use it like that??

Jakarta is now almost full of non-native, there are only few Betawis left. Betawi people also use this wood for their traditional drink, it's called "bir pletok".

I also want to try using potassium hydroxide with some natural colorants vs sodium hydroxide, and maybe even try to use some cream of tartar in my plant colorant mixture to see what happens. I'm not sure if cream of tartar is commonly available in Indonesia yet. When I was there, I never saw it anywhere. It was difficult to get many things, including real cheese, real butter &

Cream of tartar is available here. You can find it in baking supply store. Maybe it's because you were here years ago when imported goods are not as much as today, same experience as my mom. She is Moroccan and back then she also had hard time trying to find real butter, yogurt, etc. But nowadays you can find almost everything here, which is a good thing for my mom who missed her country a lot.

Because I spent a lot of time in villages there. Some, my friends were born in. Some were where my husband's family lived, like my husband's nenek. Others, I just visited. I loved the way people put their mattresses & pillows out on their roofs in the sun to freshen them up My family would do that with very thick wool blankets which our grandmothers made for us by hand, but they hung them on clothes lines in the summer to refresh them. Our blankets & pillows always smelled so good

Amazing! You travelled a lot while you were here, and that's good! I also sometimes put my mattress out to get some sunshine, but not on the roof, way too impossible for me to climb my roof

I think that the organic one might feel very sharp on the skin, but maybe try it in a test batch & see how it feels. I might be wrong. I do know however that when I grind rice myself, the small pieces are very sharp. I know the organic one is better quality than the high processed rice flour, but I think maybe the processed rice flour might work better.

Rice soap is in my list, but I keep on delaying it because I'm too lazy to make rice milk (I want to add both rice milk and rice flour)
Will try with the organic one, I don't know but I think the processed one would be as soft as cornstarch so it might be not scrubby enough.

People are much more careful with food there than in many Western & European countries where we waste so much food, where our supermarkets throw away billions of pounds of food every year instead of giving it to hungry people. People in countries like Indonesia find a use for even left over food because it became their habit when they grew up with not very much money, similar to my own family.

It's part of their religion teaching (Islam), to not waste food, and sometimes the background story of that kind of food was originated during colonization period, when people are mostly poor so they came up with various ideas to not waste food.

Totally thrilled with my soaps! Unmoulded perfectly after 1 day. I'm really glad my batter was thin enough to go around all the loofah bits since I used it dry. The blue clay one had visible ash which I tried to buff off some.

I'm happy that the blue clay mellowed into a lighter blue. I was afraid I had put too much mica in.

Update again when I do get around to using these after March.

They are all perfect, you did a great job! I'm a beginner so I haven't tried complicated things like using loofahs and even micas, but looking forward to try it soon.
I hope I'll get my nest soon so I can post mine here, too

 

[Zuleika]

Update on the bird's nest soap. I tried the blue clay one and was plesantly surprised by the lather! Bigger bubbles than usual and definitely a silky feel. (Could also be due to RBO in the recipe). Considering my usual recipes have 25% CO/PKO, so I am used to bubbly lather. This was definitely bigger bubbles than normal.

Overall, I wouldn't use it again. For all the steps needed before I can use it plus cost, I don't see the worth using in soaps. Feels to me like a label appeal additive. But, interesting experiment.

 

[Oumsofia25]

Update on the bird's nest soap. I tried the blue clay one and was plesantly surprised by the lather! Bigger bubbles than usual and definitely a silky feel. (Could also be due to RBO in the recipe). Considering my usual recipes have 25% CO/PKO, so I am used to bubbly lather. This was definitely bigger bubbles than normal.

Overall, I wouldn't use it again. For all the steps needed before I can use it plus cost, I don't see the worth using in soaps. Feels to me like a label appeal additive. But, interesting experiment.

Thank you so much for the update! You explained everything in detail and I really appreciate it!