Would cocoa butter be considered as drying to the skin?

[srez]

I've never found it drying. I use it in place of shea in my oatmeal, milk and honey bars (apparently it works beautifully for diabetic skin according to my husbands friend).

Thank you @MelissaG

I didn't pick up on dryness either but my wife noticed it after she got out of the shower. She said that her skin felt tighter than the other batches that I made. But because I had used a good amount of cocoa butter in this recipe I figured that I would try to get a general consensus. I guess everyone is different.

 

[Zing]

And today's vocabulary word is gobstopper brought to you by @Mobjack Bay .

 

[Mobjack Bay]

It sounds like you‘ve put a lot of thought into this and are doing everything right to test the soap, which makes it difficult to suggest a solution. Stearic should be more resistant to lathering compared with palmitic, but the recipe you shared above has a fair amount of stearic in it. I agree that the soft water could be a part of the story.

I’ll also add that I use cocoa better at 5-10% in many of my recipes and don’t find it drying. Most of my recipes have 40% oleic and 5% linoleic.

 

[Zing]

I'm gobsmacked.

 

[srez]

It sounds like you‘ve put a lot of thought into this and are doing everything right to test the soap, which makes it difficult to suggest a solution. Stearic should be more resistant to lathering compared with palmitic, but the recipe you shared above has a fair amount of stearic in it. I agree that the soft water could be a part of the story.

I’ll also add that I use cocoa better at 5-10% in many of my recipes and don’t find it drying. Most of my recipes have 40% oleic and 5% linoleic.

Welp.... time to mess around and make more soap! I've never been so clean in my life! Ha!

I'm gobsmacked.

Haha! Good day sir!

 

[penelopejane]

I really can't work with the soap numbers and hardness of soap calculators because I have high olive oils soaps and the number are meaningless because olive oil is considered soft until it hardens like a rock after 6 months.

So if youignore the numbers and go by feel you will find high coconut soaps will disappear in the shower. I was gifted a coconut soap (no salt) and it lasted 5 days in the shower. I don't use a washer just paint myself with soap. Coconut just dissolves in soap.

If it were me I'd increase your olive oil, keep coconut oil less than 10% (and none is good) and wait for 9 weeks or long for a real cure before you test for longevity in the shower.

See DeeAnna's notes for a better explanation of "the numbers". DeeAnna has a much better way to get to real cleansing etc numbers than the calculators.

 

[KiwiMoose]

It could be worth trying Zany's no slime castile? I gave a bar of that to my brother in law ( just used as hand soap) two years ago and he's still rocking it at the handbasin.

My soap is high stearic and it lasts about a week in the shower with both of us using it - and I use a washcloth (actually wrap up the soap in the washcloth - so it gets a bit of a bashing!)

I'm pretty sure if I bought a commercial bar of soap and used it in the shower in the same manner that it would only last week also.

I use soy wax at 20%
CO at 20%
Shea butter at 10%
Cocoa Butter at 5%
Then my liquids which are all high in palmitic ( OO, RBO, Avocado)

Have you tried reducing superfat to 3%?

 

[srez]

I really can't work with the soap numbers and hardness of soap calculators because I have high olive oils soaps and the number are meaningless because olive oil is considered soft until it hardens like a rock after 6 months.

So if youignore the numbers and go by feel you will find high coconut soaps will disappear in the shower. I was gifted a coconut soap (no salt) and it lasted 5 days in the shower. I don't use a washer just paint myself with soap. Coconut just dissolves in soap.

If it were me I'd increase your olive oil, keep coconut oil less than 10% (and none is good) and wait for 9 weeks or long for a real cure before you test for longevity in the shower.

See DeeAnna's notes for a better explanation of "the numbers". DeeAnna has a much better way to get to real cleansing etc numbers than the calculators.

Thanks! @penelopejane
I actually have classicbells as one of my bookmarks. I've been reading that as well as the modern soapmaking site where it goes over favorite FA profiles of soapmakers.
I guess a lot of this is a waiting game like candles. Funny how on the other side of my life that I find hobbies / obsessions that require waiting and testing

It could be worth trying Zany's no slime castile? I gave a bar of that to my brother in law ( just used as hand soap) two years ago and he's still rocking it at the handbasin.

My soap is high stearic and it lasts about a week in the shower with both of us using it - and I use a washcloth (actually wrap up the soap in the washcloth - so it gets a bit of a bashing!)

I'm pretty sure if I bought a commercial bar of soap and used it in the shower in the same manner that it would only last week also.

I use soy wax at 20%
CO at 20%
Shea butter at 10%
Cocoa Butter at 5%
Then my liquids which are all high in palmitic ( OO, RBO, Avocado)

Have you tried reducing superfat to 3%?

Hi @KiwiMoose ZNSC is actually on my list of soaps to try. I have not tried lowering the superfat yet. Is it that noticeable going from 5% to 3%? I'm up for playing around and making a mess

 

[penelopejane]

Thanks! @penelopejane
I actually have classicbells as one of my bookmarks. I've been reading that as well as the modern soapmaking site where it goes over favorite FA profiles of soapmakers.
I guess a lot of this is a waiting game like candles. Funny how on the other side of my life that I find hobbies / obsessions that require waiting and testing

Just wait till you try a high OO soap (or any handmade soap for that matter) in 3 months, 6 months and a year! The difference is amazing and unbelievable.
A friend gave me some hand made soap and I tried it and though it was pathetic as it dissolved really quickly. It was 30% palm, 30% CO, 30% OO and 10% castor. (which is a pretty hard soap from the get go really compared to some but I must have been used to commercial soap). I chucked it all in the back of the linen press in a cardboard box. About a year later I found it again and thought couldn't just throw it out so thought I'd use it up quickly. It was absolutely amazing. Stunning difference over a year. Longevity, bubbles, lather etc.

Since then I've been tweeking recipes until I came up with a few that suit my skin and my family's skin and suit my soaping philosophy (I don't use palm because I'm allergic to it and I only use natural colours).
Great idea to make something now and make something tomorrow. Before you know it you won't mind the wait because you have so many others that are ready to try. Good idea to keep great notes too. Otherwise you will come up with THE soap and not know how to make it again! But you are probably good at that being a candle maker!

DeeAnna has progressed my soapmaking in leaps and bounds. Her advice is scientific, sensible and comprehensive but very easy to understand. She's one of the gurus of this site. I can't thank her enough for all the generous help she gives us all. Her notes are fabulous.

Hi @KiwiMoose ZNSC is actually on my list of soaps to try. I have not tried lowering the superfat yet. Is it that noticeable going from 5% to 3%? I'm up for playing around and making a mess

Yes going from SF 5% to 3% to zero is noticable in any soap but especially high olive oil. But especially with high OO soaps wait for a good cure.

 

[srez]

Just wait till you try a high OO soap (or any handmade soap for that matter) in 3 months, 6 months and a year! The difference is amazing and unbelievable.
A friend gave me some hand made soap and I tried it and though it was pathetic as it dissolved really quickly. It was 30% palm, 30% CO, 30% OO and 10% castor. (which is a pretty hard soap from the get go really compared to some but I must have been used to commercial soap). I chucked it all in the back of the linen press in a cardboard box. About a year later I found it again and thought couldn't just throw it out so thought I'd use it up quickly. It was absolutely amazing. Stunning difference over a year. Longevity, bubbles, lather etc.

Since then I've been tweeking recipes until I came up with a few that suit my skin and my family's skin and suit my soaping philosophy (I don't use palm because I'm allergic to it and I only use natural colours).
Great idea to make something now and make something tomorrow. Before you know it you won't mind the wait because you have so many others that are ready to try. Good idea to keep great notes too. Otherwise you will come up with THE soap and not know how to make it again! But you are probably good at that being a candle maker!

DeeAnna has progressed my soapmaking in leaps and bounds. Her advice is scientific, sensible and comprehensive but very easy to understand. She's one of the gurus of this site. I can't thank her enough for all the generous help she gives us all. Her notes are fabulous.

Thanks! I'm looking forward to see what I can come up with. Everyone here from what I've read is extremely knowledgeable and helpful. Great community here. I know it takes time and testing so I'm down for the challenge!

 

[penelopejane]

Thanks! I'm looking forward to see what I can come up with. Everyone here from what I've read is extremely knowledgeable and helpful. Great community here. I know it takes time and testing so I'm down for the challenge!

This thread is old but it is a fabulous starting point for a really nice soap. NOT as a shampoo bar because it's since been disovered handmade soap isn't good for hair but for your body.

https://www.soapmakingforum.com/threads/shampoo-bar-thanks-lindy.30946/

 

[srez]

This thread is old but it is a fabulous starting point for a really nice soap. NOT as a shampoo bar because it's since been disovered handmade soap isn't good for hair but for your body.

https://www.soapmakingforum.com/threads/shampoo-bar-thanks-lindy.30946/

Thank you!

 

[srez]

Soooo... I apparently I may have been crying wolf. @Marsi @TheGecko @Zing @Mobjack Bay @penelopejane @KiwiMoose @MelissaG @johnnyusa

I weighed some of these "4 ounce" bars that I have been complaining / scratching my head about.... the ones that I poured at the end of August. Looks like after the evaporation.... these bars are somewhere now in the 2.65 - 3 ounce range.

The larger bars that I had poured and cut at the same time, are now weighing in at around 4.5 to 4.65...

So I guess 10 days for a 2.65 - 3 ounce bar isn't that bad.

Boy do I feel like a chooch!

I should have realized this but forgot about it. I was weighing the bars by grams every couple of days after I poured them to see how much water weight it loses.... you know.... research / knowledge etc.... Well, life happened and I forgot about weighing these and for whatever reason, "4 ounces" stuck in my head as the weight not remembering that it continuously loses water weight.

I just wanted to give a big thanks to all of you that took the time address my issue / apparently not really an issue.

 

[MelissaG]

lol, don't worry, we all do it.

 

[TheGecko]

I just wanted to give a big thanks to all of you that took the time address my issue / apparently not really an issue.

You're welcome. And no need to feel like a chooch! It's a process...no matter how much we research ahead of time, it's impossible to know anything until you actually do it. I'll soon be heading into my fourth year...still learning and ten years from now, I have no doubt that I will still be learning.

Yes, soap will continue to lose water weight until it finally turns to dust, but that is a long, long ways down the road. A lot of evaporation occurs within the first couple of months and then it slows down after that.