What do you think of this recipe?

[Mobjack Bay]

In an attempt to get the % CO down relative to my early recipes, I came up with this new recipe:

OO 40%
PO 25%
CO 20%
Safflower Oil HO 5%
Mango seed butter 5%
Castor oil 5%
scented with EO

This produces a shiny soap that seems fairly hard. I like the look of it. I use 33% lye concentration and worked with the batter at about 110 F. I’m a SB minimalist and it was well behaved. It’s the first CP soap recipe I’ve made that did not form ash, which is very exciting if it’s a soap worth making. I’m looking for something that is less cleansing (drying) and more conditioning (relative to 30% CO) without using tallow or lard. The SoapCalc numbers moved in the right directions. I am also very wary of DOS although I haven’t had that problem yet. I would love to know what you think I can expect from soap made with this recipe. I’m planning to make more soap this weekend and would rather not waste oils making soap that doesn’t have redeeming qualities. Thanks!

 

[Obsidian]

I would probably swap the OO and palm amounts around. It will make a harder, longer lasting bar that way. The 5% safflower is so low, you might completely drop it or raise it to 10-15%, just reduce the OO some.

Nothing wrong with the recipe as is, just can improve it bit.
Raising the palm could make it trace a bit faster so be weary of that and maybe soap around 95.

 

[Dawni]

I've never worked with palm so no help there...

I do hope, however, that 20% coconut oil works for you. You didn't mention superfat. It doesn't for me n most of mine so I now use 15-18% which also results in less SF but it works for us. Took months of adjusting to get to that number hehehe

Also, while I have no personal experience to back it up, most suggest 8-10% being the minimum for any fat because there's a chance you won't feel the difference if it's lower than that.

I can't wait to see how this one looks, i enjoy looking at your soaps!

 

[shunt2011]

I agree with Obsidian. I would do the exact same as suggested. I like 20% CO. I generally keep my SF at 5-6.

 

[Mobjack Bay]

Thanks everyone for the tips and to admin for moving this thread to the right place!

To adjust the original recipe I upped the OO the most and the PO a little when I dropped the CO. For the next run, I will switch around the OO and PO percentages. I think I put the Safflower oil in there to up the Linoleic fatty acid for conditioning. In SoapCalc, the hardness of of the recipe above is 38 and the conditioning is 59, compared with 44 and 51 for the original. I was kind of obsessed with the fatty acid profiles when I started making recipes, but from what I’ve read here, it seems that there is more leeway and factors, like curing, that can make a big difference in how a soap turns out.

Superfat is 5% in all of my recipes to date. I have been using soaps with 30% CO and 5% superfat for a month now and they’re not bad, but they are definitely “cleansing.”

 

[Iluminameluna]

You post isn't exactly old but there's been a couple of weeks since the last response (yours). So I'm responding just to leave a comment about CO percentages.
I have super dry and thin skin due to meds I take so my soaps have had to be almost in the single digits on the cleansing scale. My soaps are 5% SF and rarely above 16% CO. I used to add 5% castor oil but there's no significant effect in sudsing if I also add sugar or honey to my recipe.
My favorite recipe is
40% olive
25% palm
20% canola
15% CO
2 tbs salt ppo
2 tbs sugar or honey ppo
My water to lye ratio is, usually, 1.5:1 if I'm using fruit, or 1.7:1 if not.
This keeps my ash away and, because I'm in high humidity, the sweating to a minimum.
I hope this helps.
Edited to add: the canola in my recipe is to lower the olive oil amount. Canola here is MUCH cheaper than even light olive oil!

 

[Mobjack Bay]

Thanks @Iluminameluna! I have been dropping the CO in all of my recipes and I’m down to 15% most of the time now. For whatever reason, most of the recipes I encountered as a newbie had 30% or more CO. It wasn’t until I really started reading deeply here that I discovered that many people find CO > 20% to be very drying. When I started using my earliest soaps I could see why! They bubble nicely but are too cleansing, even for my hands. Castor oil has me a bit baffled. I’ve read that it’s moisturizing and helps lather stability and see some people using more than 10%, but I’ve also read that it can create “tacky” soap and see others avoiding it altogether. Did you decide to leave it out solely on the basis of lather quality? I’m still using it because I have it, but once it’s out, I’m not sure that I will re-order. The one soap I made recently with sugar overheated a little, so I will probably need to change my methods a little if I go that route. Do you have any problems with DOS when you use Canola? I haven’t tried it yet. I have mostly been using 33% lye concentration (2.03:1 lye:water) and sometimes have ash, but sometimes don’t. The one low water recipe I used had not a speck of ash, which was great. I should probably try increasing my lye concentration across the board to see if it makes a difference, but I also like to gel my soaps. I think low water concentration tends to make gelling more difficult. Do you gel your soaps? And what kind of fruit do you use? I haven’t even considered that option yet.

Thanks for sharing your recipe!

 

[earlene]

For me, I ran out of castor oil at one point and just made soap without it for awhile and that got me out of the habit of using it for every soap. I didn't notice enough of a difference (if any) to make it seem essential. Actually I do have castor, because I did eventually buy some again to fill out an order, but still just don't think of adding it into recipes as much as when I was new.

So now it's on my list of oils to use because I have it, not because I find it essential in any way. I have it on my list to use in a Rimmed soap because it's one of the oils suggested to give more pliability to the rim (for rolling the rim without cracking), and I just have not tried it for that purpose yet. Maybe I'll do that today, since I'm floundering right now what soap to make.

I also noticed that so many of the recipes I found online had high CO content and that's what I made. Little did I know that my skin wasn't going to like some of those recipes. And little did I know that the changing seasons were going to affect how my skin was going to react to different soap formulas. It took a lot of time before I noticed that, but I guess that's just the nature of things (and me). I still see a lot of high CO recipes suggested by very experienced soapers and I suppose for them they must be fine, so once in awhile I'll give them a try to see if there is something different about their formula that counteracts the high CO content.

So far, I have only found two recipes with high CO content that don't dry my skin excessively. The first contained egg yolks as an additive (from one of Anne Watson's books) and the other one is so recent I am not done evaluating its effect on my skin over time and seasons. In other words, for the second one I haven't had enough time to complete my analysis.

ETA: No, there are actually 3, but one of those I formulated myself and has 11% SF and 8 oils and Aloe as water replacement. Rather a busy recipe! And I chose to move away from high superfats as I started to consider my household plumbing.

 

[Iluminameluna]

My not using castor oil is partly due to economy. The only presentation available here is 2 oz bottles and they're $2.50 each, with a discount. Otherwise, just one of the bottles alone costs $2.75-2.80. Not worth it if I'm making a batch that's more than a lb. On the other hand, I saved the last of my e.o. by blending the bits in 30g of castor oil. On Friday I used 1 of those, leaving me just 1 bottle. And the one I used was in a recipe of over 1 kg of oils. We'll see.
I have very soft water, which is the other reason I don't use castor oil. Most of this country has very soft water so I know that if I give my soaps to my friends and family, they're going tolather quite well without it. Coconut oil and a sugar work just fine.
As for fruit, I use whatever is in season. My home has an extensive number of fruit trees and fruiting plants: bananas, mangos, avocados, cashew fruit, to name a few. And other fruits are easily available, like sale zapote, watermelon, melons in general, not to mention veggies like cucumber, aloe, tomatoes, etc.
I don't make fruit soaps for properties, just curiosity and novelty of telling my Nanny they have stuff she only thinks as food in them.
The other thing I like doing with my oils is infusing them with teas, chamomile, paprika, turmeric, and annatto. Again, not for properties but for color, and my own curiosity.
Anyway, I think you get my drift. Experimentation, I think is the most fun when it comes to making your own soap. Not, of course, if it's an expensive endeavour. I give up some foodsI like just so I can make soap, because I prefer making it to eating but that's just me.
If there's anything else I can help with, just message me, and I'll do what I can. Just know that I'm not a very experienced soaper generally, just a very curious one!

 

[Mobjack Bay]

I don't make fruit soaps for properties, just curiosity and novelty of telling my Nanny they have stuff she only thinks as food in them.

Your Nanny is lucky and I bet she’s special if you make fun soap for her.

Experimentation, I think is the most fun when it comes to making your own soap.

This is mostly what draws me. But, after a 35+ year career as a scientist, sometimes I have to remind myself that my kitchen isn’t a lab! I’m also drawn in by the “making.” When I’m not making soap, I bake, sew, dye fabric, paint furniture. My friends think I’m a little crazy and most of them don’t even know yet that I’m making soap. I can’t imagine what they’ll say when I give them fruit soap.

 

[KiwiSoap]

I’m also drawn in by the “making.” When I’m not making soap, I bake, sew, dye fabric, paint furniture. My friends think I’m a little crazy and most of them don’t even know yet that I’m making soap. I can’t imagine what they’ll say when I give them fruit soap. [emoji38]

With so many skills, your friends are lucky to have someone like you around! Thank you for sharing your knowledge and experience with us, I really appreciate it.
If your friends don't want your fruit soap, let me give you my address Keep up the great work!

 

[earlene]

Speaking of fruit soap, last fall when I stayed with my brother & SIL, I helped my SIL gather persimmons from their persimmon tree. Then we dried some. While they were gone (I house-sat for another few days before returning home after a funeral), I dried a whole lot more persimmons. The abundance on the tree was incredible. It never occurred to me to try them in soap, but now I'm wishing I still had some of the dried persimmons to add as an experiment. Well, next time.

I am going to be trying black cherries here real soon, though. It'll be in a slow moving recipe because of all the sugar content.

Oh, by the way, I wish I still had some mango butter. I really liked it when I had it.

 

[Nanette]

A true artist, giving up foods to make soap!

 

[Mobjack Bay]

thanks @KiwiSoap! It’s a good thing for the world that there are people who can focus almost 24/7 on their science. That’s just not me! I need time to make soap