True 'Wine' (Transparent) Soap Tests

[SaltedFig]

I think it's the lye that's the problem, not so much the cooking

(I'm enjoying your adventures!)

 

[KimT2au]

Hmmmm...good point, Kim. I don't remember ever having non-alcoholic wine in the past, but very good point. In fact, I decided to change my approach. You've given me another idea.

When I was visiting a friend on the other side of Australia recently (I mention this part as it is too far to go visit again any time soon) she took me to meet a friend of hers that made his own grape juice and it was amazing. He made it every year and some of it was about 16 years old. He was a strict teetotaler so nothing to cause alcoholic fermentation had been added to the juice. I tried some of the 16 year old juice and it was like drinking a gorgeous port, you would not have realised it was not alcoholic, except you could drink it by the tumbler full and still safely drive home I wish I could go get some of that juice now as I would like to experiment.

 

[Richard Perrine]

I think it's the lye that's the problem, not so much the cooking

(I'm enjoying your adventures!)

Absolutely. I am digging into my science background and the art/science of soap making (of what little I know) to wrap my head around this. I love trying out new and 'uncertain' things with soap. Ack, wish I had taken up this hobby years ago.

 

[Richard Perrine]

When I was visiting a friend on the other side of Australia recently (I mention this part as it is too far to go visit again any time soon) she took me to meet a friend of hers that made his own grape juice and it was amazing. He made it every year and some of it was about 16 years old. He was a strict teetotaler so nothing to cause alcoholic fermentation had been added to the juice. I tried some of the 16 year old juice and it was like drinking a gorgeous port, you would not have realised it was not alcoholic, except you could drink it by the tumbler full and still safely drive home I wish I could go get some of that juice now as I would like to experiment.

'Teetotaler?" Wow, how did he store the juice? Anyway, I am currently looking for non or 'de-acoholized' wine. I live in Utah, so it shouldn't be a problem, right? Or local liquor stores simply will scoff at the idea of carrying it...

 

[KimT2au]

'Teetotaler?" Wow, how did he store the juice? Anyway, I am currently looking for non or 'de-acoholized' wine. I live in Utah, so it shouldn't be a problem, right? Or local liquor stores simply will scoff at the idea of carrying it...

He bottles it like they do wine. He has loads of equipment. It really is amazing juice. He had boxes and boxes in his garage. He regularly gives it away to family and friends. I could have brought some home with me, I wish I had thought of it. Our local grocery stores sell non-al wines but you have to go to a bottle shop to purchase regular alcoholic wine.

 

[SaltedFig]

Would Verjuice work, to get the scent of the grapes?

 

[Richard Perrine]

Would Verjuice work, to get the scent of the grapes?

Had to look that up. Can't hurt to try.

 

[Richard Perrine]

I have changed my approach. Instead of using the sweetest wine I could find, I have chosen to work with the dryest and full aroma. My test involved a pinot grigio. Dark, full aroma and DRY (very little to no sugar).

1. Used 50ml of the wine
2. Concentrated it down to ~20ml by carefully microwaving, stirring. Also removed most of the alcohol. The remaining liquid was definitely darker (wine solids) and the aroma intact for the most part. I am still convinced that alcohol also plays a part in our perception of what the wine smells like.
3. Used my newly modified transparent recipe. Added the concentrated wine at about 1-oz per 1-lbs of oils. (15-ml for the two bars). The deep purple immediately turned to a more blue color when it came in contact with the transparent soap slurry in the crock pot. I suspect it has a lot or all to do with the alkaline conditions of the soap.
4. No question to the color. There is a deep purple/blue color that remains in the soap. Also, the concentration of the wine solids creates an opaque soap, barely translucent.
5. I believe it will prove to be a better color than previous test soap. I also feel that the aroma will be 'cleaner' w/o the burnt odor of previous soap test. I will test again using the same wine, but not concentrating as much as I did here. Perhaps only reducing to 65-70% of the volume so that it will create bars that are less opaque. I took a 5mm slice of the soap and it does appear to be transparent (translucent).

I have another idea. I will test soon and share.

 

[KimT2au]

You are a mine of energy, @Richard Perrine . When you reduce the wine, what about filtering the solids out so you get a clearer bar? I can't wait to see the results.

 

[Richard Perrine]

You are a mine of energy, @Richard Perrine . When you reduce the wine, what about filtering the solids out so you get a clearer bar? I can't wait to see the results.

Kim. I just put up a pic of a sliver of the soap. It does seem to be transparent/translucent. I didn't think of doing that as I hoped to utilize the solids for color and fragrance. Naive of me. I believe filtering it out would help! I definitely don't need to worry about retaining the colour of the wine. Now working on ANY aroma I can get.

 

[KimT2au]

I got some wine tonight and I guess I could have experimented on soap but darn it, I drank it instead. The only down side was that I burned dinner, something I have not done in years. My only excuse was that I found out a friend had died suddenly and very unexpectedly overnight and match that with the 3 glasses of wine while preparing dinner lead to burnt offerings. Luckily no one in the family complained.

 

[Richard Perrine]

I got some wine tonight and I guess I could have experimented on soap but darn it, I drank it instead. The only down side was that I burned dinner, something I have not done in years. My only excuse was that I found out a friend had died suddenly and very unexpectedly overnight and match that with the 3 glasses of wine while preparing dinner lead to burnt offerings. Luckily no one in the family complained.

Kim,

I must admit I had mixed emotions. Laughing and condolences. Sorry about your loss. Plenty of wine around to test later. I hope you are well.

 

[Richard Perrine]

Okay. Latest test...

A little bluish, but there is wine fragrance present. I will wait a couple of days to see if it fades. I also have another test to do. I was hoping to find some ingenious way to make ALL natural wine soap, but the final product may not be so ingenious after all.

 

[Richard Perrine]

It has been 3 days and the small sample test of wine soap has definitely retained its wine aroma. Not strong, but clearly present. I placed the small bar into a ziplock bag for a few hours and came back to it greeted by the aroma once opened.

Does anyone know of very dry red, strongly aromatic wines? Something affordable that I can test?

 

[KimT2au]

Does anyone know of very dry red, strongly aromatic wines? Something affordable that I can test?

I'd ask at your local bottle shop and see what they recommend.

 

[Richard Perrine]

I'd ask at your local bottle shop and see what they recommend.

Planning on it today.

 

[Suzy Knight]

Hi all. Kim recently contacted me and it got me thinking about my wine soap tests. I have found that the bar, after a couple of days and testing, does not retain its 'sweet' wine odor. The color also turns a more brownish color, but still transparent. I will be testing the following:

Some recommendations that I will be testing:
1. Add equal volume of water to lye to create the solution. DO not mix wine with lye.
2. Blend the soap to trace and allow to set to allow as much of the lye to react with the oils to saponification
3. Add remaining volume of wine into the slurry after the soap has gone through the stages of HP, but only after the sugar water and glycerin have been mixed and heated.
4. Allow the soap mixture to heat for an additional 15-20 min (?). This will help dissipate much of the alcohol, but still utilize the transparent props it contributes to.

Don't know if this makes sense, but in my head it does. I am simply trying to minimize the contact that the wine solids have with the lye which creates something a lot leas pleasant after a day or two.

"DO not mix wine with lye." I must say I learned that one the hard way! Lol.

 

[Richard Perrine]

"DO not mix wine with lye." I must say I learned that one the hard way! Lol.

Suzy,

Been there, done that and I completely agree. My first wine test involved mixing the wine with the lye and it turned out lovely in terms of colour, but the residual fragrance, or should I say, 'odor', was not so great. My recent tests have been much more pleasant aromatically.

 

[Richard Perrine]

It's been a busy weekend of experimenting. I have found a way to address the fragrance so that there is one, but finding a way to maintain more of it is on-going. I have experimented with changing the pH of the bar to something less alkaline and harsh and closer to that of wine and my initial results are giving me some ideas. Wine is already very acidic (pH 2-3) and so trying to make the base soap closer to that is tricky.

From left to right...the concentration of citric acid has been increased. You can see the elastic nature of the far right bar as the more acidic conditions prevented complete saponification. But, the far left bar especially, is a bar whose pH is close to neutral (at least that's what the pH test indicates). The bars have been coloured with wine and are transparent. I am hoping to modify the pH to help with colour and fragrance issues. Who knows?

 

[Dawni]

I have nothing to add in terms of help lol but I'm curious if old wine will work?

I remember some months back my dad's fridge had a couple of opened bottles that he said isn't drinkable anymore....

I also now wonder about old, homemade wine lol coz yes, we have a whole bucket of that haha