Soy Wax Users

[MGM]

I don't use animal fat because I think it would be icky to use

Ok, ok - maybe I will try a batch with lard and see how it goes. Tell me - which of the animals fats is the slowest to trace? I want to use that one.

I don't think any of my friends/family will want to use them though. It's very unusual to find animal fat soaps now in NZ. My 'chief soap tester' is vegetarian and she won't touch it with a barge pole! Especially lard - she is very fond of piggies.

Icky to use? I mean, I find taking apart a raw turkey carcass icky, but I can't imagine that scooping out white lard instead of scooping out white coconut oil would faze me one bit. I haven't soaped with animal fats yet, as I've got to get through this darn pail of palm oil that I bought before I knew better, but given that we buy a 1/2 cow every year and live across the street from a butcher's, it would be hard to get more local and sustainably sourced than that for me.

I'm surprised that soap in NZ isn't made with animal fats....aren't pretty much *all* commercial soaps made with tallow? I've never been there, but I figured you'd have Dove and Ivory, perhaps even Irish Spring? ;-)

 

[KimT2au]

I have a friend who is vegitarian and has been for longer than iv even been alive and i mentioned lard soap and he just said well i cant see why i couldnt try it i mean i wear leather shoes its no different to that

@KimT2au my sister had simular problems with my niece and allergies while breast feeding but they were lucky that they were very effective and quick at figuring out what was causing it and has had several allergy tests since to see if she has grown out of it. I agree with you about the people were just put down as being ill. But i also wonder how much the general poor diets of people and the methods used to grow crops ect is to blame for such illnesses and intolerances to certain foods. Look at bse that was brought on if im not mistaken by the diet of the cows that had been infected and ultimatly that diet is even if indirectly introduced into our diet. I dont know if your aware but there was a massive scandle few years ago in the uk where nearly all supermarkets were exposed to having sold food mostly ready meals with horse meat supplied from i have a feeling it was romania how much they were aware of im not sure but someone was fully aware and felt no guilt doing this which brings me back to questioning our general diets and what degree of cause this has. Im glad that ultimately you managed to sort out things with your daughter even if it did take some time and effort to get some action.

I do have one big question for you its why didn't mention that i wrote kitten love in the middle of the sentence? i had to read it a few times to try figure out how on earth that got there and why you didn't question its presence in that sentence?

LOL, I did see the Kitten Love but figured that was an auto correct issue so ignored it I was living in the UK at the time of the BSE incident and can only shake my head at the stupidity of thinking it is OK to feed cows food made from dried fish. Of course it isn't as cows are not meant to eat fish, they eat grasses and grains and such like; no wonder there was a problem. It was a tragedy that it had such dire consequently. I was back in Australia by the time the hose meat scandal occurred but we did see the media coverage. It did make me wonder though as in some countries horse is a delicacy and if we eat cows and sheep, and possibly kangaroo, crocodile, goat, emu and buffalo, then why not horses. My only complaint would be that the products would have been mislabelled.

 

[Chris_S]

LOL, I did see the Kitten Love but figured that was an auto correct issue so ignored it I was living in the UK at the time of the BSE incident and can only shake my head at the stupidity of thinking it is OK to feed cows food made from dried fish. Of course it isn't as cows are not meant to eat fish, they eat grasses and grains and such like; no wonder there was a problem. It was a tragedy that it had such dire consequently. I was back in Australia by the time the hose meat scandal occurred but we did see the media coverage. It did make me wonder though as in some countries horse is a delicacy and if we eat cows and sheep, and possibly kangaroo, crocodile, goat, emu and buffalo, then why not horses. My only complaint would be that the products would have been mislabelled.

Mislabelled and of course because it is not an approved meat also not vet checked or regulated in any kind of way. How do we know that horse wasnt coughing and spluttering till its dying breathe.

I was young when the bse happened byt i remember the effects of it very clearly thats the first and only time in peace time thaat the isle of man tt wasnt held.

I try to avoid ready meals the best i can and try to cook from scratch or at least with frozen veg if i waant a quick thrown together meal

No idea where the kitty love came from coincidently i am getting big kitty hugs.

Where abouts in england did you live?

 

[Alfa_Lazcares]

Icky to use? I mean, I find taking apart a raw turkey carcass icky, but I can't imagine that scooping out white lard instead of scooping out white coconut oil would faze me one bit. I haven't soaped with animal fats yet, as I've got to get through this darn pail of palm oil that I bought before I knew better, but given that we buy a 1/2 cow every year and live across the street from a butcher's,

Lard has a very particular smell I find suuuuuper icky, also, once the soap is made there is some lard smell that lingers and I just don't like it. Having said that, use a few other oils and some strong FO and you are good to go.


I like lard in my soaps, they bring some creamyness you can't find with other oils but be careful not to overheat them so there is no piggy smell.


And yes, lard is hard to trace...

 

[Dean]

I don't want to hijack this thread but thought I might just offer a slight insight into our situation, although be warned there are graphic poop descriptions to follow. My feeling is that gluten intolerance is the latest fad illness. Celiacs disease is a real condition and has been recognised for a number of years. For those that are truly gluten intolerant it is an awful complaint. As for what used to happen to people with intolerances and/or allergies in an earlier time I would say that as babies they did not thrive and may well have had a shorter life span (depending on how far back in history you wish to go.) As adults they would have been constantly ill and would have been considered sickly. Our own situation is a little different in that our 18 year old daughter has multiple food allergies which were diagnosed at 9 months of age by a paediatric allergist. She is allergic to wheat (note, that is wheat and not gluten), potato, barley, dairy, eggs and dogs. The Dr suggested we get rid of our dog but we pointed out we had the dog before we had the baby so that stopped that conversation there. We have found she can eat Spelt and Kamut flour due to their shorter protein chains. Anyway, I digress. From day 1 it was clear DD had a problem as she cried after eating (she was breast fed for 15 months) and developed eczema all over her body. She had to have clean sheets on her cot every day due to the amount of blood on the sheets from where her wounds had broken open and bled while she slept. Her poo (sorry to get graphic here) was something to behold as it was so dense that it was in balls and if they accidentally rolled off of a nappy they actually bounced! Our daughter was being 100% breast fed and our doctor just kept getting us to try cream after cream after cream and we spent an absolute fortune. One day we ended up seeing a different doctor who sent us to a paediatric allergist who changed our lives. He diagnosed DD's allergies and told me to remove those foods from my diet as she was receiving the proteins via the breast milk. I immediately changed my diet and it was like a miracle had happened. Within 24 hours all of the eczema on her body, except for one small patch on an ankle, had disappeared and at 9 months of age she finally smiled for the first time in her life, yep, there had been no smiles to that point which I am guessing is because she was in constant pain. 18 years ago trying to get any sort of food stuffs that fitted with her allergies was impossible but luckily I have always like to cook. I learned very early to read ingredient labels on absolutely everything.

Although DD is now 18 years old, she still has not outgrown her allergies and has them for life. If she eats things she should not she will break out in eczema within a matter of hours.

So, in answer to your question of what happened to people with intolerances and/or allergies (because they aren't the same thing) in an earlier time, I think we can look at my daughter's experience and say they simply did not thrive and, in a more extreme case and an earlier time period, would have died.

Enough of being a negative Nelly and back to the discussion of soap and all things soap related.

Thx for sharing. Spounds like it was tough go pre-diagnosis.

 

[KiwiMoose]

I have a friend who is vegitarian and has been for longer than iv even been alive and i mentioned lard soap and he just said well i cant see why i couldnt try it i mean i wear leather shoes its no different to that

@KimT2au my sister had simular problems with my niece and allergies while breast feeding but they were lucky that they were very effective and quick at figuring out what was causing it and has had several allergy tests since to see if she has grown out of it. I agree with you about the people were just put down as being ill. But i also wonder how much the general poor diets of people and the methods used to grow crops ect is to blame for such illnesses and intolerances to certain foods. Look at bse that was brought on if im not mistaken by the diet of the cows that had been infected and ultimatly that diet is even if indirectly introduced into our diet. I dont know if your aware but there was a massive scandle few years ago in the uk where nearly all supermarkets were exposed to having sold food mostly ready meals with horse meat supplied from i have a feeling it was romania how much they were aware of im not sure but someone was fully aware and felt no guilt doing this which brings me back to questioning our general diets and what degree of cause this has. Im glad that ultimately you managed to sort out things with your daughter even if it did take some time and effort to get some action.

I do have one big question for you its why didnt mention that i wrote kitten love in the middle of the sentence? i had to read it a few times to try figure out how on earth that got there and why you didnt question its presence in that sentence?

Kitten love is SMF code for W..T..F. If your write that, it will be changed to Kitten love.

 

[Dean]

Ok, ok - maybe I will try a batch with lard and see how it goes. Tell me - which of the animals fats is the slowest to trace? I want to use that one.

I’m shocked and appalled!!!

Not really. But if u start soaping with palm...that’s deal breaker.

Im actually amused the SW thread has become the animal fat thread. Oh well!

 

[KiwiMoose]

@KimT2au my son was very similar. At 4 months I knew something was wrong (solely breast-fed) and i asked our GP - is it something I'M eating? She said no, don't be silly, and gave me some hydrocortisone cream for my little baby's skin. Not bloody likely! So I ended up going to a naturopath who told me to stop eating eggs, milk, nuts etc and my son's skin (and smelly poo) cleared up overnight! He also was struggling to put on weight but it was his weepy wet eczema that was the biggest tell-tale sign that something wasn't right.

I’m shocked and appalled!!!

Not really. But if u start soaping with palm...that’s deal breaker.

Im actually amused the SW thread has become the animal fat thread. Oh well!

I'm bringing it back to soy now @Dean, because from what i have read, and what @Alfa_Lazcares has said about piggy smell, I ain't going there.

Icky to use? I mean, I find taking apart a raw turkey carcass icky, but I can't imagine that scooping out white lard instead of scooping out white coconut oil would faze me one bit. I haven't soaped with animal fats yet, as I've got to get through this darn pail of palm oil that I bought before I knew better, but given that we buy a 1/2 cow every year and live across the street from a butcher's, it would be hard to get more local and sustainably sourced than that for me.

I'm surprised that soap in NZ isn't made with animal fats....aren't pretty much *all* commercial soaps made with tallow? I've never been there, but I figured you'd have Dove and Ivory, perhaps even Irish Spring? ;-)

Its more the smell that would be the issue for me.

As for commercial soap, Dove is the only American soap we can get here - most of our commercial soaps are made with palm oil.

Interestingly I priced up lard from the supermarket and it's not that cheap - dearer than olive oil.

 

[penelopejane]

Its more the smell that would be the issue for me.

As for commercial soap, Dove is the only American soap we can get here - most of our commercial soaps are made with palm oil.

Interestingly I priced up lard from the supermarket and it's not that cheap - dearer than olive oil.

A lot of commercial soap has sodium tallowate = tallow (beef fat). Including NZ protex soap, Palmolive Cashmere Bouquet etc.

 

[Dean]

Its more the smell that would be the issue for me.

As for commercial soap, Dove is the only American soap we can get here - most of our commercial soaps are made with palm oil.

Interestingly I priced up lard from the supermarket and it's not that cheap - dearer than olive oil.

Slightly OT...Im traveling so I’ve been using a well known commercial bar at my hosts’ to wash my hands. I havnt used commercial since I started soaping. It was woefully inferior to my SW bars which lathered better and were less drying.

 

[Saponificarian]

Chicken fat is slow to trace and so is goose/Duck fat and no ‘ickyness’. Makes great soaps too. Now, back to soy wax

 

[KiwiMoose]

A lot of commercial soap has sodium tallowate = tallow (beef fat). Including NZ protex soap, Palmolive Cashmere Bouquet etc.

I must pick them up and have a look at them next time I'm in the soap aisle PJ - to be honest I haven't bought any from the supermarket for years. I either buy at markets ( all plant oils) or from Lush.

 

[penelopejane]

I must pick them up and have a look at them next time I'm in the soap aisle PJ - to be honest I haven't bought any from the supermarket for years. I either buy at markets ( all plant oils) or from Lush.

Most of the big name brands have a “naturals” product now too but they are generally palm oil and TD is just about always there as well.

 

[Richard Perrine]

I have been using soy wax (hydrogenated soy) and it is great, BUT GMO! For my friends and family who don't care about GMO, I use it, otherwise, no. I will never use animal products in my food as most of my friends and family are vegetarians and vegans for both health and ethical reasons (objection to use AND consumption of animals). I know vegetarians who don't mind using tallow-ed soap as they simply rationalized that they are not consuming it, so..... but, the ones who have ethical misgivings, animal products is a no-no.

 

[Complexions]

I use the 100% soy wax in my soaps, both HP and CP. I happen to very much like it! My usual rate is 25%

 

[KiwiMoose]

Excellent. Now I see we have a few bods here that use SW, we can start some discussion

My first question is - those who use it for CP, what temperature do you soap at?

 

[KimT2au]

Mislabelled and of course because it is not an approved meat also not vet checked or regulated in any kind of way. How do we know that horse wasnt coughing and spluttering till its dying breathe.

Where abouts in england did you live?

Perhaps I should clarify, I meant that I can see no difference as long as the animals have all been slaughtered in a registered slaughter house and undergone whatever checks / treatments meat normally goes through, not just killed in someone's back yard and thrown in with the rest of the meat.

Until the age of 8 I lived in Hainault, Essex and then my parents moved to Australia. I lived in Australia until I was 21 and then went on a 7 month holiday back to the UK and returned to Australia 11 years later While I lived in England as an adult I was in Romford, Essex. I have been back in Australia since 1996 and can't imagine ever moving back to the UK.

@KimT2au my son was very similar. At 4 months I knew something was wrong (solely breast-fed) and i asked our GP - is it something I'M eating? She said no, don't be silly, and gave me some hydrocortisone cream for my little baby's skin. Not bloody likely! So I ended up going to a naturopath who told me to stop eating eggs, milk, nuts etc and my son's skin (and smelly poo) cleared up overnight! He also was struggling to put on weight but it was his weepy wet eczema that was the biggest tell-tale sign that something wasn't right.

You would not believe how often I have heard stories like yours. It breaks my heart when you hear stories of how babies have struggled with allergies and eczema. Does your son still have allergies, @KiwiMoose , or has he outgrown them?

I'm bringing it back to soy now @Dean, because from what i have read, and what @Alfa_Lazcares has said about piggy smell, I ain't going there.

I find I don't much like the smell while the lard is in liquid form but it does depend on the % of lard the recipe has. For example, I did a recipe months ago that was 50% and I felt downright ill while I was working with the batter, but yesterday I was using a recipe that was only about 20% lard and did not even notice the smell at all. Once the batter has cooled I don't notice any smell at all. The funny thing is that I render my own tallow and lard and have no trouble working with the hot fat; I think it could be the smell of it mixed with the lye perhaps. Either way, once the soap is set up I have not noticed any piggy smell.

I use the 100% soy wax in my soaps, both HP and CP. I happen to very much like it! My usual rate is 25%

What was that soap like, @Complexions ?

Excellent. Now I see we have a few bods here that use SW, we can start some discussion

My first question is - those who use it for CP, what temperature do you soap at?

Sorry about temporarily hijacking your thread, @KiwiMoose , I have told myself off, smacked my own bottom and thoroughly enjoyed it

 

[KiwiMoose]

@KimT2au I used to go to weight watchers in Romford. I lived in Ilford.
My son is still allergic to eggs and nuts. He can now tolerate dairy but does not have a taste for it so he drinks SOY milk.

 

[Richard Perrine]

I soap at whatever temp the soy melts. I almost entirely do not give track of temperatures as they have been irrelevant in my experience. Of course, I don’t unnecessarily overheat my oils. One thing I have found is waiting for oils to cool too much causes the mixture to trace too quickly when adding certain EOs. My mixtures are always greater than 120 degrees.

 

[Dean]

Excellent. Now I see we have a few bods here that use SW, we can start some discussion

My first question is - those who use it for CP, what temperature do you soap at?

A lil above room temp I guess. I melt the hard oils add liquid oils and voila!

As u kno I don’t do fancies like like u. I blieve u said u have fast trace issues somewhere which is y u r asking? Trace is norm for me with high SW but I don’t partake in FO.