Soap Properties and Soap Calc

[NEASoapWorks]

Question: What's a really good number for a "hard" bar of soap? SoapCalc lists ranges, but what should I aim for? My revised recipe has a hardness "score" of 45. Is that good? Also, my bubbly/creamy scores are close together (25/20), is that good?

 

[Soapmaker Man]

NEA, you will be an awesome soapier sometime! 8) This is a very "energetic" recipe to start with, that is for sure! Just take it easy, and remember, there will be disappointments. :wink: Your doing great! as you have the recipe listed, it is going to be a VERY hard batch, as you have a lot of stearic acid in those butters. I like a combo of Coconut and PKO, as all my soaps have both. These oils add bubbles, cleaning and hardness. I'd cut back to say 16% Coconut and 14 to 15% PKO. That is a great combo and lots of bubbles and great cleaning. I keep my hardness at no lower than 38 to 39, no higher than 44 to 45. I like it around 42, 43 on hardness since I use goat milk. Your Olive is good. Raise your Palm a little, say to 15%. Your Mango is a great butter adds stearic acid for hardness, but a tad much and it's expensive, I'd lower it to no more than 5 to 6%. The Apricot Kernel Oil is another great oil, but I'd lower it a tad too, say 7 to 8%, same with your sweet Almond Oil. Raise the Palm to reach the 100% when you input these numbers in Soap Calc. This is a very luxurious recipe! Let me know what the numbers show at Soap Calc.

Paul.... :wink:

 

[NEASoapWorks]

Okay!

NEA, you will be an awesome soapier sometime! 8) This is a very "energetic" recipe to start with, that is for sure! Just take it easy, and remember, there will be disappointments. :wink: Your doing great! as you have the recipe listed, it is going to be a VERY hard batch, as you have a lot of stearic acid in those butters. I like a combo of Coconut and PKO, as all my soaps have both. These oils add bubbles, cleaning and hardness. I'd cut back to say !6% Coconut and 14 to 15% PKO. That is a great combo and lots of bubbles and great cleaning. I keep my hardness at no lower than 38 to 39, no higher than 44 to 45. I like it around 42, 43 on hardness since I use goat milk. Your Olive is good. Raise your Palm a little, say to 15%. Your Mango is a great butter adds stearic acid for hardness, but a tad much and it's expensive, I'd lower it to no more than 5 to 6%. The Apricot Kernel Oil is another great oil, but I'd lower it a tad too, say 7 to 8%, same with your sweet Almond Oil. Raise the Palm to reach the 100% when you input these numbers in Soap Calc. This is a very luxurious recipe! Let me know what the numbers show at Soap Calc.

Paul.... :wink:

K. I'm off to SoapCalc...I'll be back! Don't go ANYWHERE!!!!

 

[Guest]

Well.. Paul took care of it.. LOL

I was going to say the same thing.. I would cut back on the butters. Both Palms have quiet a bit stearic acid.. Note.. if its melted.. STIR IT GOOD!

Yes, for your first run.. that is going to be an interesting soap.

Good Luck!

 

[NEASoapWorks]

I tried it

Now, the hardness is at 47 and the rest of the numbers are almost indentical, or close to what I had with the first recipe.

I'm confused now.

 

[Soapmaker Man]

Raise your Olive a little say 25 to 28%. OO is considered a "hard" oil, as it takes a while, but does get hard on it's own. EX. castile soap is 100% OO. You need more soft oils, like I said, lower the Mango a tad more. Bring the coconut and PKO to a combo of say 30%. Raise the Sweet Almond a touch. Lets see these numbers.

 

[NEASoapWorks]

Okay

Changes

44 Hardness
25 Cleansing
52 Conditioning
25 Bubbly
19 Creamy
Iodine 53
INS 160

Yes? No? Maybe? Paul, I posted this BEFORE I saw your post.

 

[Soapmaker Man]

Re: Okay

Changes

Sweet Almond 8%
Apricot Kernel 8%
Coconut Oil 24%
Mango Butter 7%
Olive Pomace 25%
Palm Kernal 15%
Palm 13%

44 Hardness
25 Cleansing
52 Conditioning
25 Bubbly
19 Creamy
Iodine 53
INS 160

Yes? No? Maybe? Paul, I posted this BEFORE I saw your post.

Raise the Palm by 7% and lower the Coconut Oil by 7%. Still too much PKO and CO. Thy that, your getting really close now.

Paul.... :wink:

 

[Soapmaker Man]

NEA, here is a simple, but good recipe. It is not mine.

Shortening & Shea Sudsy Soap by MichelleB

Vegetable Shortening = 40%
Coconut Oil = 16%
PKO Flakes = 15%
Castor Oil = 12%
Rice Bran Oil = 10% or sub Olive oil
Shea Butter = 7% (or sub with Mango butter, it's delish!)

The veggie shortning is Crisco. This is a good starting point recipe.

Paul.... :wink:

 

[NEASoapWorks]

Yes?

Hardness 44
Cleansing 21
Conditioning 54
Bubbly 21
Creamy 22
Iodine 56
INS 152

Viola! or still...no way?

 

[Soapmaker Man]

Re: Yes?

Sweet Almond 8%
Apricot Kernel 8%
Coconut Oil 17%
Mango Butter 7%
Olive Pomace 25%
Palm Kernal 15%
Palm 20%

Hardness 44
Cleansing 21
Conditioning 54
Bubbly 21
Creamy 22
Iodine 56
INS 152

Viola! or still...no way?

Now that, my friend, is a great bar of soap. 8) Print it, I say! Those numbers are real close to my best recipe. I'm impressed! It took me a year to get one this good! Try it ASAP!
ETA: What do you think smellitlikeitis? Good, no?!

Paul.... :wink:

 

[NEASoapWorks]

Okay

NEA, here is a simple, but good recipe. It is not mine.

Shortening & Shea Sudsy Soap by MichelleB

Vegetable Shortening = 40%
Coconut Oil = 16%
PKO Flakes = 15%
Castor Oil = 12%
Rice Bran Oil = 10% or sub Olive oil
Shea Butter = 7% (or sub with Mango butter, it's delish!)

The veggie shortning is Crisco. This is a good starting point recipe.

Paul.... :wink:

Okay, Paul...you don't want me to try something "hard", right? I'm going to have fun with this, and if the soap flops, then so be it. It's not the end of the world. I'm learning, and this is SO much fun to me. But you know what? It just may turn out...good!

That's why I brought it to you guys, to help me learn how to judge a good recipe. It's all fun...nothing more, nothing less. I'm learning about how to balance lauric, and stearic, and...whatever. This helps me. This is the way I learn.

 

[NEASoapWorks]

Re: Yes?

Sweet Almond 8%
Apricot Kernel 8%
Coconut Oil 17%
Mango Butter 7%
Olive Pomace 25%
Palm Kernal 15%
Palm 20%

Hardness 44
Cleansing 21
Conditioning 54
Bubbly 21
Creamy 22
Iodine 56
INS 152

Viola! or still...no way?

Now that, my friend, is a great bar of soap. 8) Print it, I say! Those numbers are real close to my best recipe. I'm impressed! It took me a year to get one this good! Try it ASAP!
ETA: What do you think smellitlikeitis? Good, no?!

Paul.... :wink:

Ahh...*bowing to the master*.
Grasshopper has learned from the...master!

As soon as I get one of your molds, it's a wrap!

 

[Soapmaker Man]

Yep, your absolutely right, looks hard, but you can do it! But, let me tell you, that is truly a great recipe you just created, it really is! If this turns out, and I see no reason why it should not, you are on the way to becoming a great soap artisan! Jolly good. As they would say on Star Trek; Make it so, #1! LOL

Paul.... :wink:

 

[NEASoapWorks]

You will get a bar!

Yep, your absolutely right, looks hard, but you can do it! But, let me tell you, that is truly a great recipe you just created, it really is! If this turns out, and I see no reason why it should not, you are on the way to becoming a great soap artisan! Jolly good. As they would say on Star Trek; Make it so, #1! LOL

Paul.... :wink:

I'm going to send you a bar (even if I happen to turn it into a big lump of brick), Obi-Wan, you "Soap Jedi", you! 8)

 

[dantango]

Re: Yes?

Sweet Almond 8%
Apricot Kernel 8%
Coconut Oil 17%
Mango Butter 7%
Olive Pomace 25%
Palm Kernal 15%
Palm 20%

Sounds like a great soap and I'd like to try it, but want some recommendations for substitutions since I have no Apricot Kernal or Mango Butter on hand.

I've got Shea Butter, Mac oil, Babassu oil, Jojoba, bees wax, Avocado butter, and the rest of the oils in the recipe.

Also, why Olive Pomace? I've read that the second grade of OO is better for soap; better than either extra virgin or Pomace, the latter being somewhat unpredictable in reactions to scents and other ingredients

 

[pink-north]

I was reading this thread and my curiosity got the better of me. I have a few questions to ask you all (LOL when don't I have questions). Where did you get the soap calculator you're using and how do you determine hardness. That's always been a problem for me. I recently made a batch of soap with beeswax thinking that would make it hard (turned out well, will post pics), but are there other ways of getting a truly moisturizing, sudsy, HARD, bar of soap.

 

[soapbuddy]

I add sodium lactate to my batches to make a harder bar.

Irena

 

[Soapmaker Man]

I was reading this thread and my curiosity got the better of me. I have a few questions to ask you all (LOL when don't I have questions). Where did you get the soap calculator you're using and how do you determine hardness. That's always been a problem for me. I recently made a batch of soap with beeswax thinking that would make it hard (turned out well, will post pics), but are there other ways of getting a truly moisturizing, sudsy, HARD, bar of soap.

Here is the link to the online Soap Calc.!:

http://www.soapcalc.com/calc/soapcalcWP.asp

I use it along with my Soapmaker Program. For a free web calc., this one IMHO is the best!

Paul...."I'm In The TOG House Now!" :wink:

 

[NEASoapWorks]

Re: Yes?

Sweet Almond 8%
Apricot Kernel 8%
Coconut Oil 17%
Mango Butter 7%
Olive Pomace 25%
Palm Kernal 15%
Palm 20%

Sounds like a great soap and I'd like to try it, but want some recommendations for substitutions since I have no Apricot Kernal or Mango Butter on hand.

I've got Shea Butter, Mac oil, Babassu oil, Jojoba, bees wax, Avocado butter, and the rest of the oils in the recipe.

Also, why Olive Pomace? I've read that the second grade of OO is better for soap; better than either extra virgin or Pomace, the latter being somewhat unpredictable in reactions to scents and other ingredients

Because I don't want to use my extra virgin for soap, AND a few soapmakers I know prefer it for soap. It's cheaper (it's an inferior grade, of course), and since I'm very new, I'm trying out different things. You most definately don't have to use Olive Pomace. Experiment.

If you've got Shea butter, I would plugin the recipe in Soap Calc, substituting the Shea Butter, for the Mango Butter and I'd look at the numbers and work from there. That's how I came up with the intitial recipe, that Paul helped me tweak.

If you run the recipe thru Soap Calc, substituting Shea Butter and Olive Oil, for Mango Butter and Olive Pomace, you get the following numbers:

Hardness 42
Cleansing 21
Conditioning 53
Bubbly 21
Creamy 21
INS 151